Official JTR speaker thread - Page 1037 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #31081 of 31104 Old Today, 09:21 AM
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Originally Posted by Brian Fineberg View Post
Imho the worst part of his posting (and it's not isolated it to this thread) and painting style is he now represents he erksine design group. They should have read his posting habits before bringing him on imho because his posting tact would be a big reason I would NOT go with them

I agree. I like what @Dennis Erskine does and the knowledge he has shared on these forums. But if the trolling of @Mfusick is how he wants to represent his company on one of the largest home theater forums, then forget about using that company.
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post #31082 of 31104 Old Today, 09:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Brian Fineberg View Post
Imho the worst part of his posting (and it's not isolated it to this thread) and posting style is he now represents the erksine design group. They should have read his posting habits before bringing him on imho because his posting tact would be a big reason I would NOT go with them
Then this is why he comes off as a JBL plant and an ID company Hater. Thanks for pointing this out. Now his posts make since knowing He has an Agenda.

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post #31083 of 31104 Old Today, 09:41 AM
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Originally Posted by countryWV View Post
Then this is why he comes off as a JBL plant and an ID company Hater. Thanks for pointing this out. Now his posts make since knowing He has an Agenda.
Maybe just ignore his comments like you do with ads that popup.
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post #31084 of 31104 Old Today, 09:41 AM
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Originally Posted by countryWV View Post
@Asoofi
^^^^Full range to 40hz is what the 210RT does. Sounds like Dolby Atmos is going to be expensive.

I'm going to try to work within Dolby's recommendation but 7.1 has already broke me till next year. Maybe by then Jeff will have a semi-affordable option or I'll just have to live with a 80hz XO.
I think if Jeff does shoot to meet the 40hz spec...it could be a bookshelf or close to s8 size...hopefully.
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post #31085 of 31104 Old Today, 09:47 AM
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Originally Posted by countryWV View Post
@Asim
^^^^Full range to 40hz is what the 210RT does. Sounds like Dolby Atmos is going to be expensive.

I'm going to try to work within Dolby's recommendation but 7.1 has already broke me till next year. Maybe by then Jeff will have a semi-affordable option or I'll just have to live with a 80hz XO.

I don't think I'll be able to crack Hoffman's Iron Law. Speakers need to be larger or give up output in order to gain lowend. Personally, I like letting the subwoofers do the heavy lifting. Or mains with a couple 15"s in a 10cu/ft enclosure.
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post #31086 of 31104 Old Today, 09:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Jeff Permanian View Post
I don't think I'll be able to crack Hoffman's Iron Law. Speakers need to be larger or give up output in order to gain lowend. Personally, I like letting the subwoofers do the heavy lifting. Or mains with a couple 15"s in a 10cu/ft enclosure.
Ah Jeff.. I was just about to reply regarding Hoffman and his Iron Law, but you beat me to the punch

4 210rt on the ceiling!!! Now that would be a sight to see.

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post #31087 of 31104 Old Today, 09:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Jeff Permanian View Post
I don't think I'll be able to crack Hoffman's Iron Law. Speakers need to be larger or give up output in order to gain lowend. Personally, I like letting the subwoofers do the heavy lifting. Or mains with a couple 15"s in a 10cu/ft enclosure.
I'm back to the S8 series being the Perfect speaker for surrounds/atmos with any JTR system. 3 different cabinet options is plenty for HT.

Chris
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post #31088 of 31104 Old Today, 09:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Jeff Permanian View Post
I don't think I'll be able to crack Hoffman's Iron Law. Speakers need to be larger or give up output in order to gain lowend. Personally, I like letting the subwoofers do the heavy lifting. Or mains with a couple 15"s in a 10cu/ft enclosure.
That's what confused me about dolby's constant reference to 'full range surrounds'...even in the home theater atmos guide...confusing why dolby keeps using this verbiage when it's not a practical application.

How close to 40hz do you plan to get or when can we expect to hear more details for your overheads?

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post #31089 of 31104 Old Today, 10:05 AM
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Originally Posted by asoofi1 View Post
That's what confused me about dolby's constant reference to 'full range surrounds'...even in the home theater atmos guide...confusing why dolby keeps using this verbiage when it's not a practical application.

How close to 40hz do you plan to get or when can we expect to hear more details for your overheads?
I agree it's a bit confusing. I have the guide open on one tab and will take a read on lunch hr. BTW @asoofi1 how far do you sit from your 150" screen? And you have the Panny ae8000 correct?

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post #31090 of 31104 Old Today, 10:31 AM
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Originally Posted by jlpowell84 View Post
I agree it's a bit confusing. I have the guide open on one tab and will take a read on lunch hr. BTW @asoofi1 how far do you sit from your 150" screen? And you have the Panny ae8000 correct?
Yes, the 8000 panasonic with a 176" 2.35 and 17' feet is first...and only row...until I push back a wall for another row.

I believe in a 1:1 ht seating/screen ratio; width of screen = distance of first row.

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post #31091 of 31104 Old Today, 10:48 AM
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So, just to make sure we are clear. You don't like JTR products, you disagree with anyone that recommends JTR products, you cast poor wording to shine a negative light towards JTR, and yet you don't offer what it is you disagree or don't like about them. So, why do you keep posting in this thread? You said a few pages back this wasn't the thread for you, yet here you are.
This is not accurate at all. I have no serious opinion of JTR in any direction, and generally view them as well designed speakers. I've posted this a bunch of times, even directly to you personally, and even in this thread recently Don't misunderstand me please.

My opinion on accurate speaker measurements being available for speakers and from speaker MFG is universal, and I've said the exact same thing in almost every speaker thread or conversation when the topic came up.

This was the only thread I really ever experienced a serious backlash and was told flat out that measurements don't matter, and it would not matter what they were because some people just like JTR speakers. Which look I can totally respect someone opinion and their right to have it, even if I strongly disagree with it. I never expect my opinion on measurements to somehow manifest and twist into what it has. You guys were talking about cars, movies, all sorts of off topic stuff but when the topic of measurements came up about the actual product everyone quickly shut it down. Doc got flamed out for even suggesting speakers should be accurate, and add nothing, take nothing away, from the original source. I agreed with him disagreed with the others here and I am passionate on the subject of the measurements, but don't misrepresent that part as something else please. I was genuine in my desire to see some measurements and talk about that, the importance of such and I never expected the result that some people don't want them, need them, or care about them. That was honestly shocking to me. I just unsubscribed to this thread, you won't see me here again.

I never posted anything negative about any specific JTR speakers either. My feelings about accurate measurements are universal to all brands without prejudice or change, and I value accurate measurements above subjective opinion or faith. I feel like the first important part of speaker is to be accurate and true to the source and without measurements it's just really hard to even have a strong opinion, negative or positive. I don't at all dislike JTR speakers, I have heard them many times and they sounded good to me. The speaker design of the ones I have seen looks pretty solid (low XO, good directivity attention, high efficiency,) and the parts seem to be very high quality. I think some of you might be putting words in my mouth in this area, because you did not agree with the accurate measurements part. In any case, I am sincerly sorry to cause any offense. I hope you understand my position, and I will respect yours. I have unsubscribed from this thread, so I won't be following or commenting further.

If anyone wants to carry on please start a new thread, link me, or PM me- which ever is most appropriate. Thanks

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post #31092 of 31104 Old Today, 11:02 AM
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Wonder when, not if , someone is going to be first person to run seven 215rt's.
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post #31093 of 31104 Old Today, 11:20 AM
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Originally Posted by asoofi1 View Post
That's what confused me about dolby's constant reference to 'full range surrounds'...even in the home theater atmos guide...confusing why dolby keeps using this verbiage when it's not a practical application.

How close to 40hz do you plan to get or when can we expect to hear more details for your overheads?
I'm with jeff that I don't find it necessarily a good design to shoot for trying to get to 40hz (for surrounds or even more, atmos) vs what he currently has in the s8. When mounting my new radians "IB" in the ceiling, the marantz promptly swept them and set them to 40hz. I changed it back to 80hz, just like usual, but not before a little listening....it wasn't effectually any better IMO. I don't think most people realize how low in the response spectrum 80hz really is. By all accounts, I am just about willing to bet that Dolby themselves would consider something like the s8 "Full range" anyways. I think what you are hearing from Dolby is something along the lines of, "Don't put the @popalock special bose cubes on your ceiling," or "You need good quality speakers to reproduce the intended bandwidth, not some HTIB type stuff that can't even sniff 80hz."

Neither of those describe what an s8, scs8, or 8340a, etc are capable of. For atmos, you need not look any further than what is already available to you.
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post #31094 of 31104 Old Today, 11:31 AM
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Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post
I'm with jeff that I don't find it necessarily a good design to shoot for trying to get to 40hz (for surrounds or even more, atmos) vs what he currently has in the s8. When mounting my new radians "IB" in the ceiling, the marantz promptly swept them and set them to 40hz. I changed it back to 80hz, just like usual, but not before a little listening....it wasn't effectually any better IMO. I don't think most people realize how low in the response spectrum 80hz really is. By all accounts, I am just about willing to bet that Dolby themselves would consider something like the s8 "Full range" anyways. I think what you are hearing from Dolby is something along the lines of, "Don't put the @popalock special bose cubes on your ceiling," or "You need good quality speakers to reproduce the intended bandwidth, not some HTIB type stuff that can't even sniff 80hz."

Neither of those describe what an s8, scs8, or 8340a, etc are capable of. For atmos, you need not look any further than what is already available to you.
True true...I agree...any speaker good enough for side surrounds should be good enough for overhead surrounds IMO...would love to get a dolby rep to explain their thinking in suggesting such a spec...even though we can make educated guesses.

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post #31095 of 31104 Old Today, 11:46 AM
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I deleted my last post. I'm not much for forum arguing.
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post #31096 of 31104 Old Today, 12:00 PM
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Originally Posted by asoofi1 View Post
Yes, the 8000 panasonic with a 176" 2.35 and 17' feet is first...and only row...until I push back a wall for another row.

I believe in a 1:1 ht seating/screen ratio; width of screen = distance of first row.
I meant 150" wide Okay that's good to know. I will be sitting at 12ft so I think 140" wide is plenty big and allows for getting 4722's out wide enough and keeping them behind screen. But what's another 10 inches lol! I like 150" wide because it will put Left to Right CD at 12ft apart. 140" screen puts them at 9ft 2 inches. But I guess practicality has to come into play at some point right? What screen do you have? AT?

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post #31097 of 31104 Unread Today, 12:19 PM
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I meant 150" wide Okay that's good to know. I will be sitting at 12ft so I think 140" wide is plenty big and allows for getting 4722's out wide enough and keeping them behind screen. But what's another 10 inches lol! I like 150" wide because it will put Left to Right CD at 12ft apart. 140" screen puts them at 9ft 2 inches. But I guess practicality has to come into play at some point right? What screen do you have? AT?
It's about 167" wide...almost 14'...so a bit more than 1:1 ratio is a good distance for me. If you feel immersed, you're doing good...

Don't worry too much about the LR...just toe them a few inches if space allows...and def get a 2.35 AT screen...and the widest your room allows.

Mine is an AT from Elite called Acousticpro2...link is in my signature. ..got it from Amazon...offers best value for the cost compared to other screens I've used personally...including time spent on a diy option. Best turnkey AT solution IME.

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post #31098 of 31104 Unread Today, 12:23 PM
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Originally Posted by asoofi1 View Post
It's about 167" wide...almost 14'...so a bit more than 1:1 ratio is a good distance for me. If you feel immersed, you're doing good...

Don't worry too much about the LR...just toe them a few inches if space allows...and def get a 2.35 AT screen...and the widest your room allows.

Mine is an AT from Elite called Acousticpro2...link is in my signature. ..got it from Amazon...offers best value for the cost compared to other screens I've used personally...including time spent on a diy option. Best turnkey AT solution IME.
Thanks! I'll check out that screen. I was looking at Falcon screens possibly. Since I was going so big I was thinking it would do better with light loss over spandex DIY. I like he price of yours! But I will need the next size down lol. I'm no video snob so as long as it looks decent and is bright enough I'm in. But several around here I value opinions of praise Falcon screens as a decent step up in picture quality and helping contain light better than DIY options. So I figured it's worth the research and consideration.

150" inch wide 2:35 screen at 12ft seating distance will put me 6 inches over the 1:1 ratio The 4722's HF section horn actually swivels. But I need to design my DIY baffle wall to figure out all that. Either curved or somehow compensate the wall for toed horn sections.

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post #31099 of 31104 Unread Today, 01:09 PM
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I decided to bring 6x Noesis 210RT to RMAF, 4x standard black (lrc and left rear) and then two in Ferrari red for the right, rear, in the walk way into room and one to place right inside the door for people see as they walk by. A pair of Captivator 1400 for sub duty.
What's the point of multi-channel Blu-ray playback at RMAF without a good picture? With JRiver Media Center providing playback and JTR Speakers providing the sound, it only seemed fitting to go with the next company alphabetically. Hmm, how about JVC?

One of JVC's regional managers is bringing two projectors to the JTR room at RMAF. One is the DLA-RS67. I'm not sure on the other projector. Seymour Screen Excellence will be providing the ISF certified Elightor-4K screen. "The only woven material in the world designed and certified for perfect color and 4K resolutions. This is also the only acoustically transparent screen available that has no frequency effect."

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post #31100 of 31104 Unread Today, 01:16 PM
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Originally Posted by asoofi1 View Post
It's about 167" wide...almost 14'...so a bit more than 1:1 ratio is a good distance for me. If you feel immersed, you're doing good...

Don't worry too much about the LR...just toe them a few inches if space allows...and def get a 2.35 AT screen...and the widest your room allows.

Mine is an AT from Elite called Acousticpro2...link is in my signature. ..got it from Amazon...offers best value for the cost compared to other screens I've used personally...including time spent on a diy option. Best turnkey AT solution IME.
I'm slightly bummed, my low ceiling gets really low at the 123" spot from side wall. I have 95" of ceiling height for 123" then the pipes and AC runs cut it to 82". Looks like I'll be cramming a 125" screen in but I think the bottom of the screen will only be about 14" from the floor. Love the idea of the Falcon AT screen but will definitely see what other options are out there. Previously had an Elite Cinetension 2 but it had some serious wave issues. Had it replaced 2x and it was never right.

It'll probably be the JBL 4722 for LCR with 2 CHT 18.2 placed vertically to the L and R of the center speaker. That'll be 4 18" subs behind the AT.

It's gonna be a tight fit for sure.
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post #31101 of 31104 Unread Today, 01:43 PM
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Maybe just ignore his comments like you do with ads that popup.
I did, but folks keep quoting him ...

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post #31102 of 31104 Unread Today, 02:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Jeff Permanian View Post
I don't think I'll be able to crack Hoffman's Iron Law. Speakers need to be larger or give up output in order to gain lowend. Personally, I like letting the subwoofers do the heavy lifting. Or mains with a couple 15"s in a 10cu/ft enclosure.
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I'm back to the S8 series being the Perfect speaker for surrounds/atmos with any JTR system. 3 different cabinet options is plenty for HT.
Count me in this camp as well because if S8's are good enough for surrounds, why aren't the good enough for overheads? In reading the whitepaper, I think it's more important to timbre match the speakers as best as possible and ensure the overheads have a wide dispersion pattern. From the white paper....


Characteristics




Dolby Atmos audio is mixed using discrete, full-range audio objects that may move around anywhere in three-dimensional space. With this in mind, overhead speakers should complement the frequency response, output, and power-handling capabilities of the listener-level speakers. Choose overhead speakers that are timbre matched as closely as possible to the primary listener-level speakers. Overhead speakers with a wide dispersion pattern are desirable for use in a Dolby Atmos system. This will ensure the closest replication of the cinematic environment, where overhead speakers are placed high above the listeners.


I think any of the S8's fit these characteristics and is my plan when I make the move to Atmos next year and if it's not right....then I'm going to be wrong and be happy.

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post #31103 of 31104 Unread Today, 02:38 PM
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This post may seam like it came out of left field but I've been trading PMs and it got me thinking.

I've come to the conclusion that ignorance is a Bliss and my West Virginia a$$ must be easily impressed b/c I love my 212s. The only proof I have is a big smile on my face and a wife that no longer bitches at me over my speaker choice since she likes them too. I pretty much set at work all day thinking about my speakers (and subs) and cant wait to get off work so I can go listen to them.

Football is so much more entertaining and the thought of going out to see a movie never crosses my mind. I even gave up my bar downstairs to get the 212s b/c my wife knew that with the combination of an awesome sound system and a bar I would never have a reason to leave the downstairs. I tried to build an argument on drinking and driving but since she's always the DD it did no good. Public intoxication? She said she bail me out.

Oh well the 212s are worth it. So in lieu of measurements and 3rd party testing, an alcoholic who quit drinking has to count for something. I'm joking, I'm joking I still drink whiskey b/c that is state law around here.

JTR speakers are not for everyone but for me & mine they are everything I enjoy in audio. Slayer never sounded sooo Goood!!!

Cheers... I mean Enjoy the sound!!!

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post #31104 of 31104 Unread Today, 02:51 PM
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Originally Posted by countryWV View Post
This post may seam like it came out of left field but I've been trading PMs and it got me thinking.

I've come to the conclusion that ignorance is a Bliss and my West Virginia a$$ must be easily impressed b/c I love my 212s. The only proof I have is a big smile on my face and a wife that no longer bitches at me over my speaker choice since she likes them too. I pretty much set at work all day thinking about my speakers (and subs) and cant wait to get off work so I can go listen to them.

Football is so much more entertaining and the thought of going out to see a movie never crosses my mind. I even gave up my bar downstairs to get the 212s b/c my wife knew that with the combination of an awesome sound system and a bar I would never have a reason to leave the downstairs. I tried to build an argument on drinking and driving but since she's always the DD it did no good. Public intoxication? She said she bail me out.

Oh well the 212s are worth it. So in lieu of measurements and 3rd party testing, an alcoholic who quit drinking has to count for something. I'm joking, I'm joking I still drink whiskey b/c that is state law around here.

JTR speakers are not for everyone but for me & mine they are everything I enjoy in audio. Slayer never sounded sooo Goood!!!

Cheers... I mean Enjoy the sound!!!
I don't drink but I enjoy the sound just as you do and every Sunday I can be found in my room with 4 screens going and enjoying football all day. I also enjoy gaming in there as well and I truly believe the S8's are fantastic as surround speakers....I hear sounds coming from everywhere behind/around and even over me. So I'm with you...the few measurements I've taken look good enough to me and if they don't to others...so be it....I love them and would do it all over again.

Nabs17
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215RT , 228ht , captivator , Jtr , Jtr Noesis 212ht 212ht Lp
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