Official JTR speaker thread - Page 12 - AVS Forum
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post #331 of 22433 Old 09-28-2009, 06:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Tom Bley View Post

What don't you understand? They are a ported speaker but, instead of using a round port they are using a slotted port design in the front of the speaker.

Tom,

Maybe I should have said 'tuned port'. They appear to just be openings in the cabinets.

Louis
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post #332 of 22433 Old 09-28-2009, 07:25 AM
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I wish I had money for the quadruple 8's now wow... would give anything but the timing is just so bad.
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post #333 of 22433 Old 09-28-2009, 07:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Jedirun View Post

The Triple 8's are by far the best speakers I have heard for music. They were originally designed for music use in professional venues. You will not be dissapointed.

Jedirun,

What have you compared the T8s to?

Louis
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post #334 of 22433 Old 09-28-2009, 07:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathelo View Post

Maybe I should have said 'tuned port'. They appear to just be openings in the cabinets.

Those couple of "dry fit" pictures do not have any of the bracing or port pieces installed. The reason for the large slot ports is to minimize port turbulence and compression.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathelo View Post

However, this is a mixed use room meaning that the speakers will also have to serve duty as our primary 2 channel system perhaps 30% of the time. As such, I need it to perform well as a music only system even though its primary use will be HT. I have no reason to believe they won't other than that they are sold as HT speakers, which generally has different requirements. I need to know they will do well in this regard.

For normal listening (99% of us) they are great plus they can play to "11" maybe even "12".
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post #335 of 22433 Old 09-28-2009, 09:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathelo View Post

Jedirun,

What have you compared the T8s to?

Louis

I’ll chime in here, I compared the original Triple 8’s to my Revel Ultima2 Studio mains approx a year ago. At the time, the Revels provided a bit better resolution as would be expected based upon the 10X price. At the same time, the T8’s did a comparable job for HT. The 2010 T8 has a new coax driver that provides a more refined HF sound and is an even more capable music speaker. The Quintuple 8’s look to be that and more but only time will tell.

I have the 2009 Triple 12LF’s and they do an excellent job for music and HT. IMHO, the music performance delta between these speakers and more expensive HiFi name brands would be undetectable by most listeners. For HT, the JTR’s efficiency, power handling and dispersion characteristics make them one of the best speaker choices regardless of price.

HToM

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post #336 of 22433 Old 09-28-2009, 09:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathelo View Post

Jedirun,

What have you compared the T8s to?

Louis

At first I compared them my DIY speakers (Vifa XT-25 ring radiator tweeters and Vifa PL line woofers). Since I got the T8's I have compared them to relatively high end Paradigm and B&W speakers that cost quite a bit more than the T8's with really nice electronics driving them. There is no comparison. Both the Paradigm and B&W speaker sound very good, but they sound like you are listening to a very nice home sound system. The T8's sound like you are at a concert without giving up any of the details from the other brands. At lower volumes the difference is not as noticable, but as you turn the volume up the T8's continue to sound crystal clear, while the others start to sound harsh. You just can not get the big sound that the T8's deliver out of any other speakers I have heard. By the time you get that wall of sound feeling with commercial speakers, everything sounds harsh, loud and uncomfortable. I have been spending a ton of time listening to music since I got the T8's because it is so enjoyable. The other nice thing is that my wife lets me watch movies around -6 when she always used to complain it was too loud when it was around -13 with my old speakers.
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post #337 of 22433 Old 09-28-2009, 07:26 PM
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Thanks for the replies. I've got a couple of weeks to think this over but the Quintuple 8’s are pulling me hard.
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post #338 of 22433 Old 09-29-2009, 09:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedirun View Post

At first I compared them my DIY speakers (Vifa XT-25 ring radiator tweeters and Vifa PL line woofers). Since I got the T8's I have compared them to relatively high end Paradigm and B&W speakers that cost quite a bit more than the T8's with really nice electronics driving them. There is no comparison. Both the Paradigm and B&W speaker sound very good, but they sound like you are listening to a very nice home sound system. The T8's sound like you are at a concert without giving up any of the details from the other brands. At lower volumes the difference is not as noticable, but as you turn the volume up the T8's continue to sound crystal clear, while the others start to sound harsh. You just can not get the big sound that the T8's deliver out of any other speakers I have heard. By the time you get that wall of sound feeling with commercial speakers, everything sounds harsh, loud and uncomfortable. I have been spending a ton of time listening to music since I got the T8's because it is so enjoyable. The other nice thing is that my wife lets me watch movies around -6 when she always used to complain it was too loud when it was around -13 with my old speakers.

Wow... I think I could afford t8's but want the quads so bad and they are out of reach.

Do you think this switch would be an upgrade:

Current rig:
Paradigm - studio 60 v3, cc-690 v4, adp-590 v5
Onkyo 805 (just 130w)

Option 1:
JTR - Triple 8 r/l fronts (Phantom center - fronts are only 4 feet apart, seating is directly in sweet spot)
Side - Emotiva ERM1's
Amp upgrade - Possibly ep2500's bridged - Cautious about the noise.

Option 2:
JTR - Quad 8's (same phantom center)
Sides - SVS SBS-01's
No amp upgrade yet.
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post #339 of 22433 Old 09-29-2009, 10:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RXPorlando View Post

Hey guys has anyone tryed replaceing the insulation padding with acustical foam or any thing else? If so what were your results?

I'm going to give it a try just because I can't get control over this insulation. It seems to have a mind of it's own. I've took the drivers out to tuck the insulation back into place in attemp to get some room between the insulation and the sloted ports. The next day it's right back blocking the ports again and I also have little pieses that break off and get caught up laying in the ports and are a pain to retrive. The insulation is glued to the back of the cabinet but because it's so thick it tends to block off the ports when it exspands back to size.

Any day now I should have the supplys needed to treat the speakers plus my sound card and mic for rew and should arive at the same time I hope. I'm going to test both a treated speaker with acustical foam and a stock speaker with insulation and see if there is a diffrence in performance and sound. This should be cool to see if there are any diffrence in the grafts?

One thing I noticed there is no insulation in the middle of the cabinet behine the coax mid range and tweeter. Is there a reason why this area was not treated jeff? I'm thinking dureing R@D you must of tested it both ways and found it to be better not treated. Pleas post your reasons why I should not treat the middle section please.

The middle section is open to the woofers from top to bottom so it seems it should be treated like the rest of the cabinet to reduce resonace and give better detail highs and midrange and overall sound?

I was only planing on replace the insulation with foam but now I'm thinking of doing the whole cabinet to see if there is any inprovement.

In search of makeing my triple 12s the best they can be. My triple 8s will be next to be treated if the acustical foam sounds good.


Thanks for any feed back Jeff

Scott

If you're putting anything into the cabinet I'd imagine you should be using NoRez.

Verum postulo res.
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post #340 of 22433 Old 09-29-2009, 11:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goonstopher View Post

Wow... I think I could afford t8's but want the quads so bad and they are out of reach.

Do you think this switch would be an upgrade:

Current rig:
Paradigm - studio 60 v3, cc-690 v4, adp-590 v5
Onkyo 805 (just 130w)

Option 1:
JTR - Triple 8 r/l fronts (Phantom center - fronts are only 4 feet apart, seating is directly in sweet spot)
Side - Emotiva ERM1's
Amp upgrade - Possibly ep2500's bridged - Cautious about the noise.

Option 2:
JTR - Quad 8's (same phantom center)
Sides - SVS SBS-01's
No amp upgrade yet.

I think the T8 and the Q8 is pretty close in pricing at the pre-order price if you get the normal finish Q8s instead of the wood finishes.
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post #341 of 22433 Old 09-29-2009, 11:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goonstopher View Post

Wow... I think I could afford t8's but want the quads so bad and they are out of reach.

Do you think this switch would be an upgrade:

Current rig:
Paradigm - studio 60 v3, cc-690 v4, adp-590 v5
Onkyo 805 (just 130w)

Option 1:
JTR - Triple 8 r/l fronts (Phantom center - fronts are only 4 feet apart, seating is directly in sweet spot)
Side - Emotiva ERM1's
Amp upgrade - Possibly ep2500's bridged - Cautious about the noise.

Option 2:
JTR - Quad 8's (same phantom center)
Sides - SVS SBS-01's
No amp upgrade yet.

I definitely think the Triple or Quintuple 8's would be an upgrade. However, I do not know if the surround speakers would be any different as I have not heard the Emotiva or SVS speakers for myself.

If you really want the Quintuples, I would recommend taking advantage of the preorder sale and either leaving your current surround speakers in place or moving your current fronts to surround duty. Your current fronts are likely to be a bigger upgrade for your surround speakers than the surrounds from the two companies you mentioned. I do not know if your room layout will allow this.

The Triple 8's I have image very well. I have to check often to make sure I am really just in 2 channel mode and do not have the center speaker going when listening to 2 channel music, but a reasonable choice would be to go with 3 JTR's of either type and wait on everything else.

You will do fine with your Onkyo. I ran my Triple 8's off of my 905 and blasted music and movies at reference level without any issues. It sounded great. These speakers do not need that much power to do well, there is no need for an upgraded amp.
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post #342 of 22433 Old 09-29-2009, 11:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedirun View Post

I definitely think the Triple or Quintuple 8's would be an upgrade. However, I do not know if the surround speakers would be any different as I have not heard the Emotiva or SVS speakers for myself.

If you really want the Quintuples, I would recommend taking advantage of the preorder sale and either leaving your current surround speakers in place or moving your current fronts to surround duty. Your current fronts are likely to be a bigger upgrade for your surround speakers than the surrounds from the two companies you mentioned. I do not know if your room layout will allow this.

The Triple 8's I have image very well. I have to check often to make sure I am really just in 2 channel mode and do not have the center speaker going when listening to 2 channel music, but a reasonable choice would be to go with 3 JTR's of either type and wait on everything else.

You will do fine with your Onkyo. I ran my Triple 8's off of my 905 and blasted music and movies at reference level without any issues. It sounded great. These speakers do not need that much power to do well, there is no need for an upgraded amp.

I need to sell my surrounds and fronts to afford the JTR's so keeping anything is not an option
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post #343 of 22433 Old 09-29-2009, 01:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goonstopher View Post

I need to sell my surrounds and fronts to afford the JTR's so keeping anything is not an option

I missunderstood. In that case I would either go with the 2 Triples or 2 Quintuples.

The price difference between the two is not that much during the presale.

I would get the cheapest surrounds you can find in anticipation of upgrading later and I would just drive them with your 805. You will be extremely pleased with the system.

You might even want to try to talk Jeff into making you some unfinished Quintuples to save money and then stain them yourself.
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post #344 of 22433 Old 09-29-2009, 02:03 PM
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I was interested in the Q8 when I first learned of it but I'm really interested now given the pre-sale offer for the textured black finish. I have a related question for Jeff or anyone else who owns JTRs with the textured black finish. Is this finish truely black in color or dark grey? I've owned "textured black" from another vendor previously, and it appeared more dark grey than true black in color; especially in direct sunlight.

The shade of Q8 black will not be a show stopper for me, but the speeaker will be going in a maple cabinet with a lot of deep black trim so a true black Q8 will integrate better cosmetically. FWIW, I'm aware of the maple option for the Q8, but I prefer black for several reasons I won't bore readers with.

Thanks.

Eric
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post #345 of 22433 Old 09-29-2009, 02:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elockett View Post

I was interested in the Q8 when I first learned of it but I'm really interested now given the pre-sale offer for the textured black finish. I have a related question for Jeff or anyone else who owns JTRs with the textured black finish. Is this finish truely black in color or dark grey? I've owned "textured black" from another vendor previously, and it appeared more dark grey than true black in color; especially in direct sunlight.

The shade of Q8 black will not be a show stopper for me, but the speeaker will be going in a maple cabinet with a lot of deep black trim so a true black Q8 will integrate better cosmetically. FWIW, I'm aware of the maple option for the Q8, but I prefer black for several reasons I won't bore readers with.

Thanks.

Eric

My Triple 8's are truely black.
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post #346 of 22433 Old 09-29-2009, 03:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedirun View Post

My Triple 8's are truely black.

Thanks! That's all I needed to know (though again, I would have likely proceeded with the pre-sale offer anyway). Your feedback (including your other posts-I thank you for them as well) just makes the purchase decision that much easier.

Eric
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post #347 of 22433 Old 09-29-2009, 03:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RXPorlando View Post

I'm going to give it a try just because I can't get control over this insulation. It seems to have a mind of it's own. I've took the drivers out to tuck the insulation back into place in attemp to get some room between the insulation and the sloted ports. The next day it's right back blocking the ports again and I also have little pieses that break off and get caught up laying in the ports and are a pain to retrive. The insulation is glued to the back of the cabinet but because it's so thick it tends to block off the ports when it exspands back to size.

One thing I noticed there is no insulation in the middle of the cabinet behine the coax mid range and tweeter. Is there a reason why this area was not treated jeff? I'm thinking dureing R@D you must of tested it both ways and found it to be better not treated. Pleas post your reasons why I should not treat the middle section please.

Thanks for any feed back Jeff

Scott

The crossover is directly behind the coaxial putting the acoustic cotton even closer to the ports and would make the crossover run hotter. Tried glueing in strips of the acoustic cotton on either side of the crossover but could get them to stay in place. Sounds like I need to switch adhesives.

The Triple 8's have the acoustic cotton in all three positions and isn't so close to the port.
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post #348 of 22433 Old 09-29-2009, 08:07 PM
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Jeff (or anyone else who may know)

What would be the major difference between the Quintuples and the 2010 T8's or T-12's. After reading a thread on your forums, one of the only performance differences I noticed was that the Q8's would extend your minimun listening distance or position.

Besides asthetics (and two more 8" drivers), what could we look forward to SQ wise that we would not get from the T8's or T12's.

I understand that there are a lot of setup variables that can affect things, but lets just assume all three speakers (Q8, T8, T12) were powered properly. Would the only difference in SQ be output? Or would their be different characteristics of the sound.

I hope I am making sense!!!
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post #349 of 22433 Old 09-29-2009, 08:33 PM
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Sitting just 8/9 feet away MAX (One position is only about 5 feet) are any JTR's even an option?
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post #350 of 22433 Old 09-29-2009, 09:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orcarola25 View Post

Jeff (or anyone else who may know)

What would be the major difference between the Quintuples and the 2010 T8's or T-12's. After reading a thread on your forums, one of the only performance differences I noticed was that the Q8's would extend your minimun listening distance or position.

Besides asthetics (and two more 8" drivers), what could we look forward to SQ wise that we would not get from the T8's or T12's.

I understand that there are a lot of setup variables that can affect things, but lets just assume all three speakers (Q8, T8, T12) were powered properly. Would the only difference in SQ be output? Or would their be different characteristics of the sound.

I hope I am making sense!!!

With the slightly higher level or refinement the Quintuple sounds a little better and with the lower tuning its more flexible crossing over to a subwoofer.


Quote:
Originally Posted by goonstopher View Post

Sitting just 8/9 feet away MAX (One position is only about 5 feet) are any JTR's even an option?

You can get as close as 2 feet away for the Triple 8 and Quintuple is 4-6 feet. Good news is being than close you'll only need about 2 watts.
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post #351 of 22433 Old 09-29-2009, 09:31 PM
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On a super tight budget would t8's be worth it for HT use or should I calm down and prepare for my chronic need to upgrade and wait to save for something bigger?

What do you cross t8's at? 80hz? Also consider I plan to run a phantom center because the fronts are only about 4 feet apart. Would the additional clarity or depth be needed for that installation in order to display with sound of the center accurately?
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post #352 of 22433 Old 09-29-2009, 11:17 PM
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What reccomended frequency should the Q8's be crossed over at?
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post #353 of 22433 Old 09-30-2009, 06:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goonstopher View Post

On a super tight budget would t8's be worth it for HT use or should I calm down and prepare for my chronic need to upgrade and wait to save for something bigger?

Many times with all the "bigger is better" posts you get the wrong idea.

The T8 has 129db capability. This is an earbleeding level and can cause hearing damage. The significance of that number is that the T8 can produce "effortless" peaks at normal to loud listening levels.

If you are listening at 8-9 feet with a "good amp" (and by that I DON'T mean 1500w) your HT experience will be better than most of the best theaters you have ever visited.

Now the bad news is that "upgraditis" has no cure and can strike at any time. If it does, you move the T8 to surround duties and go bigger (hopefully in a room that will support that type of configuration)

Quote:
Originally Posted by goonstopher View Post

What do you cross t8's at? 80hz?

The crossover from the T8's is dependant on a couple elements.

Obviously you will cross at or around the 80hz roll-off of the T8's. The other considerations are your sub and its capabilities in the upper frequencies, and your room and listening position.

In most cases the lowest XO frequency would be 80hz, and that would be the best starting point especially if you are running a single sub. If you run stereo subs, then you can operate them higher if you find it nessessary.

Quote:


Also consider I plan to run a phantom center because the fronts are only about 4 feet apart. Would the additional clarity or depth be needed for that installation in order to display with sound of the center accurately?

The secret to a phantom center is listening position.

The closer to "dead center" (equidistance between speakers) you sit the more precise the center image will be. But with the good dispersion of the JTR this arrangement will have a broader coverage than many other speakers.

At 8-9 feet away, you should have a very cohesive sonic image.

Regards,

John
CENTURY CITY AV
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post #354 of 22433 Old 09-30-2009, 07:07 AM
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Just a thought

Being that speakers are sensitive to placement and acoustics (in room)

Could one even the playing field (to an obvious considerable degree) among the three JTR speaker offerings by going with the smaller speaker.

This would allow one to move the smaller speaker around for better sonics and imaging.

Opposed to going with the biggest speaker that would not allow flexibility in speaker location.

Jeff said the Q8 is slightly better than T8, the slight diffirence, could it be made up by better speaker placement in room with smaller speaker package??????
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post #355 of 22433 Old 09-30-2009, 07:13 AM
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I completely agree with the above post. Another thing to consider is the fact that Jeff has blown away large bars and gymnasiums with a pair of T8's plus some Growlers. You do not need to wait for something bigger.
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post #356 of 22433 Old 09-30-2009, 07:17 AM
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To me it is not about how loud something goes once it can go to a certain range. If speaker A plays 129 dB's and Speaker B plays 125 dB's they both can handle HT reference levels in a normal room quite easily. To me it is about how big of a presentation it presents while doing everything else with ease(dynamics, loud, resolution, etc...) The only reason I went with the JBL's is that huge sound but the speakers are huge. Bigger was better but not for everyone. I always recommend JTR to people when they PM me about JBL, the JBL's are great but would not fit into most rooms. I have a 130 inch screen and they barely fit behind it with then next to each other.
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post #357 of 22433 Old 09-30-2009, 08:34 AM
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You do not need to cross them over at 100hz. Audyssey picked 80 hz for my left and right and 70 hz for my center. I moved that back up to 80 hz and it has been great. They are designed to be crossed over at 80 hz in most rooms.
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post #358 of 22433 Old 09-30-2009, 08:50 AM
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80 hz works great with the T8's.
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post #359 of 22433 Old 10-01-2009, 12:35 PM
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In preparation for some new products arriving next week (dual Captivators)I was doing some setup on the system last night. I re-ran Audyssey and then did some post Audyssey EQ of the LFE channel (Danley TH-SPUD's) with my SMS-1. The in-room response has never looked or sounded better. Actually the entire front row looks this good while the back row is acceptable but not nearly as flat.

I have a QSC DSP30 waiting in the wings as the LFE EQ and plan on using Audyssey again for everything else. I was going to skip the SMS-1 but it sure is nice having such an easy to use device that provides instant feedback. I have the T12LF’s crossed @60hz and the transition at the xover is very good.

Here is the SMS-1 graph all speakers:


Here is just the subs:

HToM

"Well, la di fricken da."!
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post #360 of 22433 Old 10-01-2009, 01:23 PM
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Can you actually pinpont your sub's location at 100hz? Or is this your opinion based on AV commentary?

I ask because personally, I can't locate subs at 100hz (assuming 24 db per octave low pass). I can locate them at 120hz though.

Eric

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Originally Posted by goonstopher View Post

I am getting excited that the triple 8's could work well ha. I just hate the idea of a 100hz crossover, I have been very interested in the idea of directional bass. Maybe down the line I will use a small sub as a speaker stand for them and run them in sequence.

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