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Old 03-04-2014, 03:01 PM
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Guys...I'm trying to sound treat my theater and Bryan from GIK is giving me some advice that seems questionable. Wanted to run it by you guys to see what you though.

He says the 120 inch screen is too big for the wall (13.5 ft) and the seating distance is too short (13 ft). He's saying the captivators are going to sound terrible because they are corner loaded and you can't treat the corners behind them.

He's recommending that I build out my stage more to move the caps somewhere else to treat the corners on the projection wall..........

Are corner loaded subs bad? I thought it was okay to corner load a sub. I'm confused. Can't I just treat the corner above the sub?

 


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Old 03-04-2014, 03:02 PM
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To be honest, untreated, the room doesn't sound bad at all to me if you stay seated. The screen works for us personally...doesn't seem too big. I'm not sure this is even going to be worth it.


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Old 03-04-2014, 03:09 PM
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I sit 14 feet from a 200" scope/158" 16:9 CIH screen and wish I could go bigger. I'm not sure how big of a screen would be too big but I haven't reached it yet.
YMMV.
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Old 03-04-2014, 03:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by L0nestar View Post

Guys...I'm trying to sound treat my theater and Bryan from GIK is giving me some advice that seems questionable. Wanted to run it by you guys to see what you though.


He says the 120 inch screen is too big for the wall (13.5 ft) and the seating distance is too short (13 ft). He's saying the captivators are going to sound terrible because they are corner loaded and you can't treat the corners behind them.


He's recommending that I build out my stage more to move the caps somewhere else to treat the corners on the projection wall..........


Are corner loaded subs bad? I thought it was okay to corner load a sub. I'm confused. Can't I just treat the corner above the sub?


 

I wouldn't listen to that either. Corner loading a sub will get you more output that is all. He can't tell you that a sub will sound good or bad anywhere in your room without testing it even if it is the sub crawl method. You can treat the corner the sub is in, but I would measure first to see if you actually need to treat it. You can also make your response worse by treating the room wrong and waste your money at the same time. Place your speakers where you want them and then treat your room.
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Originally Posted by MX48 View Post

I sit 14 feet from a 200" scope/158" 16:9 CIH screen and wish I could go bigger. I'm not sure how big of a screen would be too big but I haven't reached it yet.
YMMV.

WOW! that is crazy big! Show some pics please! eek.gif

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Old 03-04-2014, 03:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by L0nestar View Post

Guys...I'm trying to sound treat my theater and Bryan from GIK is giving me some advice that seems questionable. Wanted to run it by you guys to see what you though.


He says the 120 inch screen is too big for the wall (13.5 ft) and the seating distance is too short (13 ft). He's saying the captivators are going to sound terrible because they are corner loaded and you can't treat the corners behind them.


He's recommending that I build out my stage more to move the caps somewhere else to treat the corners on the projection wall..........


Are corner loaded subs bad? I thought it was okay to corner load a sub. I'm confused. Can't I just treat the corner above the sub?


 

I sit 11ft from a 120" diagonal 16:9 screen and my front wall is 14ft wide, I don't have any issues at all. In fact if anyone takes a look at the pictures of my front wall the screen and speakers aren't centered to the wall either, everything is offset to the right.
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Old 03-04-2014, 03:21 PM
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Originally Posted by jbrown15 View Post

I sit 11ft from a 120" diagonal 16:9 screen and my front wall is 14ft wide, I don't have any issues at all. In fact if anyone takes a look at the pictures of my front wall the screen and speakers aren't centered to the wall either, everything is offset to the right.

Dang, does that not bug the heck out of you. My whole drop ceiling grid is only off by about 3-4 inches and it gets my OCD cookin pretty bad. Especially with my MLP being dead center between the side walls, I always want to look up and be directly under the center rail, but I am off a couple inches to the left. It bugs the crap out of me.....
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Old 03-04-2014, 03:25 PM
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Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

Dang, does that not bug the heck out of you. My whole drop ceiling grid is only off by about 3-4 inches and it gets my OCD cookin pretty bad. Especially with my MLP being dead center between the side walls, I always want to look up and be directly under the center rail, but I am off a couple inches to the left. It bugs the crap out of me.....

It does and it doesn't, there's nothing that I can really do about it because that's how the basement was designed in the house. It did allow for my to tuck in my AV rack and add a little mini bar and fridge, so it looks pretty good.
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Old 03-04-2014, 03:28 PM
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Yea, me either. I have a bar/rack area inset into what used to be a closet on the right wall and I turned it into a little makeshift bar by busting out the wall to half height and the door. It isn't that spectacular and needs a nice finish carpentry job on it. but it is a nice space to stick all the HT stuff.
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Old 03-04-2014, 03:45 PM
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There may be truth to not corner loading very capable ported subs. (if not applying additional EQ - -- - because it may re-inforce the low end too much)

But without measuring in a room it may be an inaccurate recommendation.

I prefer my captivator pair about 1/3 room width each. Which happens to be on both left and right of my projector screen. I've measured all over my room. Literally spent hours moving the caps around and measuring, and at my seating position - luckily for me --- the cosmetic first choice was just about (but not quite) the best FR I could manage natively (with no EQ applied). The only better native FR was with the ported subs facing towards the outside walls rather than facing forward. But it was a minor difference, and could be EQ'ed out, and I much prefer both the looks, and exceptionally prefer the port wind effect of the subs facing forward.

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Old 03-04-2014, 03:58 PM
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So I'm guessing before I do any room treatment at all....or buy anything else...I need to pic up an omni mic.


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Old 03-04-2014, 04:09 PM
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Originally Posted by L0nestar View Post

So I'm guessing before I do any room treatment at all....or buy anything else...I need to pic up an omni mic.

In medicine that would be considered a class 1a evidence based recommendation. In other words, it's highly recommended. biggrin.gif
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Old 03-04-2014, 04:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

Dang, does that not bug the heck out of you. My whole drop ceiling grid is only off by about 3-4 inches and it gets my OCD cookin pretty bad. Especially with my MLP being dead center between the side walls, I always want to look up and be directly under the center rail, but I am off a couple inches to the left. It bugs the crap out of me.....

I must have a similar HT OCD to Brandon. Symmetry is in my blood. I measure things down to the inch to make sure everything stays symmetrical (screen, speakers,projector,etc..). Might explain why they keep me heavily medicated and under constant adult supervision tongue.gif
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Old 03-04-2014, 05:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by L0nestar View Post

Guys...I'm trying to sound treat my theater and Bryan from GIK is giving me some advice that seems questionable. Wanted to run it by you guys to see what you though.

He says the 120 inch screen is too big for the wall (13.5 ft) and the seating distance is too short (13 ft).
Is that 16:9 or 2.35:1 screen? Is 120" diagonal? The CEDIA recommendation is 43 degrees which is basically 3x screen height for a 2.35 screen. I think THX is a little further back.

I have a 12.5" wide room with a 126" diagonal 16:9 screen. I usually sit around 11' from the screen. I love the immersion.
Quote:
He's saying the captivators are going to sound terrible because they are corner loaded and you can't treat the corners behind them.
He's recommending that I build out my stage more to move the caps somewhere else to treat the corners on the projection wall..........
Are corner loaded subs bad? I thought it was okay to corner load a sub. I'm confused. Can't I just treat the corner above the sub 
I don't think the issue he is addressing is corner loading the subs. The issue is an acoustics one (which Bryan specialized in) because too large of a screen and the subs by the corners prevents one from putting bass traps floor to ceiling in the wall corners. Using floor to ceiling bass traps is the best treatment I've done in my room and greatly improved the bass. I use an AT screen so my subs are still in the corners and my screen is wide. wink.gif However, if you aren't going with an AT screen you have to compromise somewhere. Bryan's advice is looking at it from an audio priority perspective and is the correct advice from that perspective.

I would rather have subs between L/R and center with corner bass traps than have subs in the corners.

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Old 03-04-2014, 05:43 PM
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Originally Posted by desertdome View Post


Is that 16:9 or 2.35:1 screen? Is 120" diagonal? The CEDIA recommendation is 43 degrees which is basically 3x screen height for a 2.35 screen. I think THX is a little further back.

I have a 12.5" wide room with a 126" diagonal 16:9 screen. I usually sit around 11' from the screen. I love the immersion.
I don't think the issue he is addressing is corner loading the subs. The issue is an acoustics one (which Bryan specialized in) because too large of a screen and the subs by the corners prevents one from putting bass traps floor to ceiling in the wall corners. Using floor to ceiling bass traps is the best treatment I've done in my room and greatly improved the bass. I use an AT screen so my subs are still in the corners and my screen is wide. wink.gif However, if you aren't going with an AT screen you have to compromise somewhere. Bryan's advice is looking at it from an audio priority perspective and is the correct advice from that perspective.

I would rather have subs between L/R and center with corner bass traps than have subs in the corners.

It's a 16:9.I'm starting to think that the projection wall needs to get knocked down so I can flush the speakers behind an AT screen.


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Old 03-04-2014, 05:46 PM
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Originally Posted by L0nestar View Post

It's a 16:9.I'm starting to think that the projection wall needs to get knocked down so I can flush the speakers behind an AT screen.
exactly, just like this:



which looks like this with the screen on and the speakers lit up:

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Old 03-04-2014, 07:00 PM
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^ that looks really cool!

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Old 03-04-2014, 08:10 PM
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Yep, ordered this morning. Might be a good music demo for the 215RT GTG. cool.gif

Agreed….excellent DVD. Even better would be this….

http://www.amazon.com/Killers-Live-Royal-Albert-Blu-ray/dp/B002RBZ13Q/ref=sr_1_1?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1393992177&sr=1-1&keywords=killers+live+from+the+royal+albert+hall+bluray.

Recommend playing Dustland Fairytale as loud as your 215's can muster….you and your crowd will be impressed…even if your not a Killers fan.
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Old 03-04-2014, 09:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by L0nestar View Post

Guys...I'm trying to sound treat my theater and Bryan from GIK is giving me some advice that seems questionable. Wanted to run it by you guys to see what you though.


He says the 120 inch screen is too big for the wall (13.5 ft) and the seating distance is too short (13 ft). He's saying the captivators are going to sound terrible because they are corner loaded and you can't treat the corners behind them.


He's recommending that I build out my stage more to move the caps somewhere else to treat the corners on the projection wall..........


Are corner loaded subs bad? I thought it was okay to corner load a sub. I'm confused. Can't I just treat the corner above the sub?


 

I sit 9 feet from a 113" screen and would go bigger if I had the room on the wall.
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Old 03-04-2014, 09:54 PM
 
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Originally Posted by countryWV View Post


Your referring to 2 channel tests. Any high quality avr should be able to do 2 channel with HE/HS speakers just fine. Same goes for a 2 channel amp.

HT is about 5, 7, 9, or 11 speakers being driven. That is when the avr starts to fail. I have T12s for the LCR and Mythos tens for the SS and RS. They are supposedly 93dbs. Watching a highly dynamic movie or concert at reference level results in noticeably more listening fatigue at the end then it does when watching the same show (different day) powered with a 3 channel amp and letting the avr drive the 4 surrounds.

When watching the show at reference powered with the avr I usually cannot wait for it to end so I can turn the volume down. My ears start hurting about a half hour into it. When the amp is added I enjoy the show and do not even think about the volume. This difference is why I own an amp.
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Old 03-05-2014, 05:53 AM
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What's the lead time for making a 228HT?
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Old 03-05-2014, 06:21 AM
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What's the lead time for making a 228HT?

It took 4 weeks to ship from the time I ordered, best bet is to call and ask though.

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Old 03-05-2014, 06:53 AM
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Originally Posted by L0nestar View Post

Guys...I'm trying to sound treat my theater and Bryan from GIK is giving me some advice that seems questionable. Wanted to run it by you guys to see what you though.


He says the 120 inch screen is too big for the wall (13.5 ft) and the seating distance is too short (13 ft). He's saying the captivators are going to sound terrible because they are corner loaded and you can't treat the corners behind them.


He's recommending that I build out my stage more to move the caps somewhere else to treat the corners on the projection wall..........


Are corner loaded subs bad? I thought it was okay to corner load a sub. I'm confused. Can't I just treat the corner above the sub?


 

Remember, Brian is selling product and his services are (or at least used to be) free. I suggest you read up on room acoustics a bit before purchasing or building panels.

Regarding screen size, I started with a 106" diag from 11ft. then a 126" and now have a 138' diag screen from the 11' front row viewing distance. I was happy with the 126" but needed the additional width of the 138" for the 215RT speakers. I have watched several movies on the 138" and have no problems with that size. My wife didn't even notice the difference but then she is pretty much oblivious to anything I do in the HT room. Very supportive, but oblivious ... It doesn't get any better than that! tongue.gifwink.gif
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Old 03-05-2014, 06:57 AM
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What projector are you using? Plenty bright?
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Old 03-05-2014, 07:12 AM
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I'm using an epson 5030ub. Its a great projector.

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Old 03-05-2014, 07:19 AM
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What projector are you using? Plenty bright?

I have a Sony VPL-HW50ES and by the Projector Central calculator I am fine in a light controlled room. I have the throw distance right, run it in high power mode and it looks very good to me. smile.gif

I had a $10K projector once and feel I get an as good, if not better image from the Sony. The 3D isn't quite up to my brightness level preference but I don't watch much 3D. Apparently the format is loosing it's draw anyway now that 4K mania is gaining momentum. smile.gif

Video is too technologically volatile. I prefer to put my money in speakers and amps. cool.gif

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Old 03-05-2014, 07:25 AM
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I have a Sony VPL-HW50ES and by the Projector Central calculator I am fine in a light controlled room. I have the throw distance right, run it in high power mode and it looks very good to me. smile.gif)

Do you have a scope screen or 16:9? How far away is the projector from the screen? I have a bit before doing so but the wish is to have a scope screen that is 130" wide or potentially larger.
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Old 03-05-2014, 07:26 AM
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I'm using an epson 5030ub. Its a great projector.

Great projector. Just verify the throw, zoom, and focus on the largest image you can get from placement distance. This is 16:9 so maximize the size because 2.35-2.40 will be relatively smaller anyway.
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Old 03-05-2014, 08:06 AM
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Do you have a scope screen or 16:9? How far away is the projector from the screen? I have a bit before doing so but the wish is to have a scope screen that is 130" wide or potentially larger.

It's a 16:9 and the projector is a little close now (14') as I had to move the screen 1' farther off of the front wall to accommodate the new speakers. That shortened my viewing distance from 12.5' to 11.5' and the throw from 15' to 14'. It seems to work but I am debating moving the projector back 2' to get to the recommended throw. It means an hour (at least) of attic time that I don't look forward to. smile.gif

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Old 03-05-2014, 08:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Nyal Mellor View Post

exactly, just like this:



which looks like this with the screen on and the speakers lit up:


I have seen this picture on Jeff's FB site - looks awesome. I am in the early stages of designing my frontstage and would love to know more about this specific build - is there a build thread? I am going with a Seymour AV Center Stage XD AT 16 X 9 Screen (thanks RMK!) (126" diagonal 110" width) on a 14' wall. I have JTR T12s LCR that will go behind the screen and perhaps both of my Seaton HP subs. Only one corner as the left side is open (with draw curtains planned for light control). I can tear down the current wall and rebuild as it is not load bearing or just build out 20" or so. I will be sitting about 12' at MLP. No treatments yet, but would like to add some to the front perhaps just like this picture and then add some corner bass traps and small number of wall treatments to side and back.

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Old 03-05-2014, 09:40 AM
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Originally Posted by RMK! View Post

My wife didn't even notice the difference but then she is pretty much oblivious to anything I do in the HT room. Very supportive, but oblivious ... It doesn't get any better than that! tongue.gifwink.gif

LOL.... that sounds exactly like my wife! She still hasn't even noticed that I bought a Sherbourn PA 7-350 amp. Hell I've been buying a new dirt bike every other year trading in the old one for like the past 6 years and my wife still hasn't noticed because I stayed with the same brand and color!..lol
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