Official JTR speaker thread - Page 607 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #18181 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 12:35 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Gooddoc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 3,636
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 179 Post(s)
Liked: 218
Ok, I made the executive decision, in consultation with my wife who only said, "What? Whatever", to buy the Danley's from reef for an extended comparo in my room between them and the 212's. Winner stays.

Assuming he hasn't already sold them to a less deserving buyer...smile.gif
Dbuudo07, asoofi1 and countryWV like this.

CHT SHO-10 x 5 powered by Denon 4311 and Lab Gruppen 10000Q amp
JTR S2 x 2
CHT 18.1 x2
Oppo BDP103D bluray player/Sonos/PS3
Gooddoc is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #18182 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 01:06 AM
AVS Special Member
 
jbrown15's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Vancouver B.C.
Posts: 5,736
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 670 Post(s)
Liked: 881
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gooddoc View Post

Ok, I made the executive decision, in consultation with my wife who only said, "What? Whatever", to buy the Danley's from reef for an extended comparo in my room between them and the 212's. Winner stays.

Assuming he hasn't already sold them to a less deserving buyer...smile.gif

Haha I love how you said you made the executive decision but hinted that it was after the okay from the boss (aka wife)....LOL
jbrown15 is online now  
post #18183 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 04:51 AM
AVS Special Member
 
countryWV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Huntington West Virginia
Posts: 1,326
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Liked: 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlpowell84 View Post

So does anyone know of any way to quiet amp hum without getting a new AVR? I really would like to have my Triple 8 center hooked up to my Sherbourn PA 7350 like my Left and Right Triple 8's but the humm/buzz is just too much. I know this is a borderline dead horse topic too but I am willing to try anything that is inexspensive. Maybe a different brand cheater plug or something. Although if we are being honest we know my Denon 3313 can power the speaker just fine. But my listening levels will be increasing with all of my room treatments installed. I have tested a little music and reference in Stereo, which is the loudest preset, is even quieter. I had it at +10 last night and the sound was just fine. Basically the LR mains are tolerable but the center is closer and seems to have a louder buzz than the two HT's...
Check and make sure its not the RCA cables.
Try running an extension chord from another outlet that has nothing else plugged into it. It can be an outlet from another room.
Try other outlets both with and without the cheater plug.
Try grounding the AVR. smile.gif

Chris
countryWV is offline  
post #18184 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 05:18 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Gooddoc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 3,636
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 179 Post(s)
Liked: 218
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbrown15 View Post

Haha I love how you said you made the executive decision but hinted that it was after the okay from the boss (aka wife)....LOL

biggrin.gif. After 19 years of marriage we've developed this thing where I ask out of respect, but she knows when it comes to stuff like this the only correct answer is yes. It also one of the reasons, out of many, that we'll make it to 20 years tongue.gifbiggrin.gif
BrolicBeast likes this.

CHT SHO-10 x 5 powered by Denon 4311 and Lab Gruppen 10000Q amp
JTR S2 x 2
CHT 18.1 x2
Oppo BDP103D bluray player/Sonos/PS3
Gooddoc is offline  
post #18185 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 07:07 AM
AVS Special Member
 
dgage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,324
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 246 Post(s)
Liked: 214
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gooddoc View Post

biggrin.gif. After 19 years of marriage we've developed this thing where I ask out of respect, but she knows when it comes to stuff like this the only correct answer is yes. It also one of the reasons, out of many, that we'll make it to 20 years tongue.gifbiggrin.gif

Two things...

1. yep, my wife is pretty much the same way.

2. Damn you, I was considering the same thing. Well, you'll have my interest if you sell the Noesis. Where are you located Gooddoc (roughly)?
dgage is offline  
post #18186 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 07:21 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Gooddoc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 3,636
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 179 Post(s)
Liked: 218
The (un)great state of NJ

CHT SHO-10 x 5 powered by Denon 4311 and Lab Gruppen 10000Q amp
JTR S2 x 2
CHT 18.1 x2
Oppo BDP103D bluray player/Sonos/PS3
Gooddoc is offline  
post #18187 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 07:26 AM
AVS Special Member
 
dgage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,324
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 246 Post(s)
Liked: 214
Haha. I was in Jersey City last week for work and I stayed in Manhattan (Chelsea). Nice change of pace as I'm usually in DC. Next week I'll be on Long Island. After that I will be back at DC for a while. How long a drive is it to DC for you? (Wondering if it's close enough for me to invite myself up and audition the SM60f's too. smile.gif)
dgage is offline  
post #18188 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 08:08 AM
AVS Special Member
 
coolgeek's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,578
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 63 Post(s)
Liked: 78
I am almost ready to buy my screen now and I have decided to go with the XD as it's the brightest AT screen I could find and after spending hours viewing lots of materials both still images and BluRay movies, both me and my friends that that XD looks the best.

Please note that I have not tested any of their Acoustic Properties. We know the specs for the XD pretty well as it's published on the Seymour website (assuming it's accurate). The falcon still needed to be tested. With a tighter weave, I would assume it's going to lose out at least in a small bit in terms of acoustic transparency.. but that's just conjecture at this point.

My review of the screens are as follows:


Falcon:

- Weave is visible to about 8 feet. People with very sharp eyesight might be able to see them at about 10 feet (Note: weave is only visible with bright white scenes and not very visible for regular movie scenes).
- Contrast a bit better than XD (black is slightly blacker, some colors are deeper)
- Brightness level loses to XD but beats EN4K. I would say, from the photos below as you can see yourself, the gain level of the Falcon is right in the middle of the XD and the EN4K. From what we know, it's published by Seymour that their XD is 20% brighter than their EN4K, so I would say the Falson is 10% dimmer than the XD.

Centerstage XD:

- Weave visible to about 10 feet and disappears at about 11-12 feet depending on your eyesight. And this only applies to very bright/white scenes. For amost all movie scenes, I could not see it even at 6-8 feet (or rather would not notice it if i wasn't squinting my eyes and purposely looking for it).
- Contrast slightly less than either the Falcon or EN4K, but it's hardly noticeable in moving pictures. For still images it's noticeable.
- Gain - This has the most gain. And it looks the best to me in terms of the 'pop' factor. Skin tones are the most natural and translucent, compared to the 'duller' EN4K or Falcon.

Summary:

If you're going to be sitting beyond 10 feet, I would really suggest the XD. If you're sitting really close, then the Falson,.. I really couldn't recommend the EN4K because it's just so darn dark... You'll need a light canon of a projector... or, if your screen is really small...

Photos below are shown in such a way:

Left: Falcon
Middle: XD
Right : EN4K

Note: Seymour have published that the EN4K material is 20% dimmer than the XD, and as you can see the Left looks almost exactly in the middle in terms of brightness between the XD and the EN4K, so my initial statement that the Falcon is about 10% dimmer is just about right. Without a proper measurement, I'll say it'll be around that ball-park, give or take a few percentage.

See for yourself:





In these last two scenes, the differences not as much but still visible there. When watching a full movie, the XD will have more pop overall and colors are more vibrant.


RMK!, MarsianMan, svencz and 2 others like this.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
coolgeek is offline  
post #18189 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 09:01 AM
AVS Special Member
 
dgage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,324
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 246 Post(s)
Liked: 214
Great info CoolGeek. Thanks for sharing and please share how you like the screen and company when you get the screen. I'm considering a non-AT retractable with masking from SeymourAV and will likely go with their GlacierGrey screen since my living room will have some ambient light issues when we're not watching movies (ie, kitchen lights will be on in the back of the room when we watch TV such as football games).
dgage is offline  
post #18190 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 09:36 AM
AVS Special Member
 
coolgeek's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,578
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 63 Post(s)
Liked: 78
Sure thing. I should be ordering pretty soon as my house reno is about done. So far Jon and Criss from seymour have been very helpful


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
coolgeek is offline  
post #18191 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 09:41 AM
Señor Member
 
RMK!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: 95608
Posts: 5,866
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 190 Post(s)
Liked: 308
It is funny how the tides swing around here. I think the product comparisons are fun. In the case of the SH50's in Beasts room, he has spent weeks tweaking the SH50's and the Noesis did not have the benefit of careful placement or lengthy EQ'ing. The subjective opinions are based upon how the room and treatments effect each speaker, the EQ'ing that was done and the subjective taste of the listener. Honestly, anyone who says there are big differences in sound quality between the SH50 and the Noesis 212 are IMHO being a bit cheeky. The SH 50 relies on some very good engineering to get a lot out of what is a slightly lower quality, higher distortion driver set (especially the CD). The SH50 is a commercial grade loudspeaker designed for commercial use in very large spaces. The SH50 is wider and deeper (11' wider and 3" deeper) so has a larger foot print than the 215 and the Danley does not come with a base so you must build or buy one to place it at the correct height for HT.. While all JTR speakers have a pro audio lineage, all Noesis speakers were designed for use in the home (preferably a home theater).

At $4K each retail the SH50 is priced $1,750 more than the Noesis 212, $500 higher than the 215RT (standard finish) and about the same as the 215RT (automotive finish). So in many ways, the 215RT is a more comparable product. They are both large speakers with a depth that makes them difficult to place behind an AT screen. The 215 is a true full range speaker and so can be used without subs (trust me) if you so desire. I would think that the power to drive them would be about the same with perhaps a bit more juice needed with the 215's if playing effortlessly to reference and above is your goal


Add all this up and the comparisons are really silly due to the large difference in the designs and styles. I think a lot of folks fall in love with the mystique of the TD designs because the man himself is such an interesting character (I am a big fan of the guy smile.gif), But really, he builds his speakers for churches and gymnasiums/ sports arenas. They can be squeezed into a home theater and work well given time and effort but that was not their intended purpose. Apparently, Tom is working on some true Home Theater Designs and they may be a great option when ready for prime time. I can assure you they will not be cheap as Danley has a dealer distribution model and that ensures a significant margin is added to the cost. If Danley decides to go ID with these HT products that will undercut their commercial product pricing and create problem for them in those markets.

All that said, this is the JTR Speaker Thread and it is by far the most tolerant of any such dedicated product thread in off topic and competitive product discussions, That's why a lot of us hang out here. So in the great tradition of no tradition, I'm just calling it like I see it.

Peace out ... tongue.gif
jbrown15, Dbuudo07, kma100 and 1 others like this.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


"Well, la di fricken da."!
RMK! is online now  
post #18192 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 10:01 AM
AVS Special Member
 
coolgeek's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,578
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 63 Post(s)
Liked: 78
Quote:
Originally Posted by RMK! View Post

It is funny how the tides swing around here. I think the product comparisons are fun. In the case of the SH50's in Beasts room, he has spent weeks tweaking the SH50's and the Noesis did not have the benefit of careful placement or lengthy EQ'ing. The subjective opinions are based upon how the room and treatments effect each speaker, the EQ'ing that was done and the subjective taste of the listener. Honestly, anyone who says there are big differences in sound quality between the SH50 and the Noesis 212 are IMHO being a bit cheeky. The SH 50 relies on some very good engineering to get a lot out of what is a slightly lower quality, higher distortion driver set (especially the CD). The SH50 is a commercial grade loudspeaker designed for commercial use in very large spaces. The SH50 is wider and deeper (11' wider and 3" deeper) so has a larger foot print than the 215 and the Danley does not come with a base so you must build or buy one to place it at the correct height for HT.. While all JTR speakers have a pro audio lineage, all Noesis speakers were designed for use in the home (preferably a home theater).

At $4K each retail the SH50 is priced $1,750 more than the Noesis 212, $500 higher than the 215RT (standard finish) and about the same as the 215RT (automotive finish). So in many ways, the 215RT is a more comparable product. They are both large speakers with a depth that makes them difficult to place behind an AT screen. The 215 is a true full range speaker and so can be used without subs (trust me) if you so desire. I would think that the power to drive them would be about the same with perhaps a bit more juice needed with the 215's if playing effortlessly to reference and above is your goal


Add all this up and the comparisons are really silly due to the large difference in the designs and styles. I think a lot of folks fall in love with the mystique of the TD designs because the man himself is such an interesting character (I am a big fan of the guy smile.gif), But really, he builds his speakers for churches and gymnasiums/ sports arenas. They can be squeezed into a home theater and work well given time and effort but that was not their intended purpose. Apparently, Tom is working on some true Home Theater Designs and they may be a great option when ready for prime time. I can assure you they will not be cheap as Danley has a dealer distribution model and that ensures a significant margin is added to the cost. If Danley decides to go ID with these HT products that will undercut their commercial product pricing and create problem for them in those markets.

All that said, this is the JTR Speaker Thread and it is by far the most tolerant of any such dedicated product thread in off topic and competitive product discussions, That's why a lot of us hang out here. So in the great tradition of no tradition, I'm just calling it like I see it.

Peace out ... tongue.gif

HAHA..

But great points... Fairer comparisons would be speaker around the same price range.. ie, SH50 vs 215s..

I really love the CD in my 212s and I can't imagine going one step down in terms of CD quality.... I believe there's a product in the Danley line that also uses this same CD buy costing about $10K each.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
coolgeek is offline  
post #18193 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 10:21 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Gooddoc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 3,636
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 179 Post(s)
Liked: 218
Quote:
Originally Posted by RMstaff's = 
It is funny how the tides swing around here. I think the product comparisons are fun. In the case of the SH50's in Beasts room, he has spent weeks tweaking the SH50's and the Noesis did not have the benefit of careful placement or lengthy EQ'ing. The subjective opinions are based upon how the room and treatments effect each speaker, the EQ'ing that was done and the subjective taste of the listener. Honestly, anyone who says there are big differences in sound quality between the SH50 and the Noesis 212 are IMHO being a bit cheeky. The SH 50 relies on some very good engineering to get a lot out of what is a slightly lower quality, higher distortion driver set (especially the CD). The SH50 is a commercial grade loudspeaker designed for commercial use in very large spaces. The SH50 is wider and deeper (11' wider and 3" deeper) so has a larger foot print than the 215 and the Danley does not come with a base so you must build or buy one to place it at the correct height for HT.. While all JTR speakers have a pro audio lineage, all Noesis speakers were designed for use in the home (preferably a home theater).

At $4K each retail the SH50 is priced $1,750 more than the Noesis 212, $500 higher than the 215RT (standard finish) and about the same as the 215RT (automotive finish). So in many ways, the 215RT is a more comparable product. They are both large speakers with a depth that makes them difficult to place behind an AT screen. The 215 is a true full range speaker and so can be used without subs (trust me) if you so desire. I would think that the power to drive them would be about the same with perhaps a bit more juice needed with the 215's if playing effortlessly to reference and above is your goal


Add all this up and the comparisons are really silly due to the large difference in the designs and styles. I think a lot of folks fall in love with the mystique of the TD designs because the man himself is such an interesting character (I am a big fan of the guy smile.gif), But really, he builds his speakers for churches and gymnasiums/ sports arenas. They can be squeezed into a home theater and work well given time and effort but that was not their intended purpose. Apparently, Tom is working on some true Home Theater Designs and they may be a great option when ready for prime time. I can assure you they will not be cheap as Danley has a dealer distribution model and that ensures a significant margin is added to the cost. If Danley decides to go ID with these HT products that will undercut their commercial product pricing and create problem for them in those markets.

All that said, this is the JTR Speaker Thread and it is by far the most tolerant of any such dedicated product thread in off topic and competitive product discussions, That's why a lot of us hang out here. So in the great tradition of no tradition, I'm just calling it like I see it.

Peace out ... tongue.gif

Well said RMK. I'm giving the sm60f's a fair shake in my room since I preferred them to all others in a blind shootout. Hard to discount that impression. But the differences were not quality or SQ, but that hard to pin down involvement in the music. You know, "getting lost" in the songs. Not sure if the Danley's are going to recreate that for me in my room, but I have to know. Don't get me wrong, I love my 212's smile.gif and if they never left my room I would be a happy camper.

The sm60f is a different speaker than the SH50 with a more extended HF response and I think may be more in line with my taste,, although I've never heard the 50 so it's pure speculation.

There's no doubt that I simply like Danley since it is the ultimate controlled directivity design. Of course, design doesn't always necessarily correlate to better SQ, or more importantly, preference. But in my narrow, reflective room, the Danley design has a shot at an advantage over the lesser pattern control of the 212's.

It should be interesting. As to the non-JTR talk, I think that Jeff benefits from discussion that supports and promotes high end HT designs no matter the brand. JTR is an exceptional world class line of speakers. Any "big" differences are big differences of preference not quality or SQ, and those differences will more times than not favor JTR in my experience.
asoofi1 likes this.

CHT SHO-10 x 5 powered by Denon 4311 and Lab Gruppen 10000Q amp
JTR S2 x 2
CHT 18.1 x2
Oppo BDP103D bluray player/Sonos/PS3
Gooddoc is offline  
post #18194 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 11:23 AM
AVS Special Member
 
rhed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,235
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 112 Post(s)
Liked: 157
Any thoughts these Crown amps? http://www.crownaudio.com/usa/amplifiers/xli-series.html
My DJ friend says these are good too for 4 ohm speakers. And it has RCA inputs too since my AVR doesn't have XLR outs. I don't know.. I just wanna experiment with a pro amp. I did have a Parasound Halo A31 before running to my mains. But sold it after 2 months because I didn't hear any difference with my Elite sc-09tx receiver. And never tried a pro amp. So after I get my speakers, I really want to try one. And I can't get a LG or a QSC after the speaker purchase yet before the wifey will kill me. Anyway I figure try something that's inexpensive for now. Btw, when I do get a pro amp, I'll be racking it in another room next to the HT room. On another 20 amp curcuit which is shared with my PC. Thanks guys..
rhed is offline  
post #18195 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 11:25 AM
AVS Special Member
 
jlpowell84's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Eugene, OR
Posts: 4,084
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 181 Post(s)
Liked: 225
Quote:
Originally Posted by countryWV View Post


Check and make sure its not the RCA cables.
Try running an extension chord from another outlet that has nothing else plugged into it. It can be an outlet from another room.
Try other outlets both with and without the cheater plug.
Try grounding the AVR. smile.gif

Chris

it's like others have posted, I can have the amp entirely disconnected and only plugged in to the wall and the speakers connected and it still has a little hum. I will try those things.

Does anyone have a brand name or link to a specific cheater plug that has been successful for them?

DIY Sound Group Volt 10 surround speaker build

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

My Setup Thread

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
jlpowell84 is offline  
post #18196 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 11:39 AM
AVS Special Member
 
jlpowell84's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Eugene, OR
Posts: 4,084
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 181 Post(s)
Liked: 225
Rob, I am curious. What listening preset are you using for music on those 215RT beasts? Stereo?

DIY Sound Group Volt 10 surround speaker build

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

My Setup Thread

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
jlpowell84 is offline  
post #18197 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 12:12 PM
Señor Member
 
RMK!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: 95608
Posts: 5,866
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 190 Post(s)
Liked: 308
Quote:
Originally Posted by coolgeek View Post

Sure thing. I should be ordering pretty soon as my house reno is about done. So far Jon and Criss from seymour have been very helpful

Thanks for the photos and comments coolgeek. The added brightness of the XD is important to me as I am close to the limit of what my Sony projector can do even using High lamp mode on my 120" Seymour fixed screen. I've been considering a powered 2:35 AT screen and I was thinking of going wider (130") and your test makes the decision easier. cool.gif


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


"Well, la di fricken da."!
RMK! is online now  
post #18198 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 12:27 PM
Señor Member
 
RMK!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: 95608
Posts: 5,866
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 190 Post(s)
Liked: 308
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlpowell84 View Post

Rob, I am curious. What listening preset are you using for music on those 215RT beasts? Stereo?

I am using the source direct pass through on the Integra processor from the HTPC or the OPPO BDP83. I'm mostly using the HTPC for music on the 215RT's and it sounds incredible. Desertdome did a great job setting up JRiver.

I just had foot surgery (4 hours in the OR) on my right foot and will be laid up for 4-6 weeks. I plan on lots of music listening and movie watching with the 215's. Will also run some more measurements with Omnimic and play with the Rane and JRiver PEQ's to see if flatter really sounds different/better. I'm guessing I won't hear a difference. smile.gif


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


"Well, la di fricken da."!
RMK! is online now  
post #18199 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 01:45 PM
Senior Member
 
LowerFE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 287
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 16 Post(s)
Liked: 38
Hi JTR owners,

What kind of sound signature do the JTR speakers have?

After listening to lots of high end "Hi-Fi" speakers from Paradigm, Totem, Vandersteen, Martin Logan, etc, I find that I prefer the sound signature of a high quality PA system like I've heard at high end clubs and concerts (and surprisingly, at a high school's auditorium). Something with nice, slightly emphasized treble and in your face sound. Paradigm's sound signature came the closest, but I always feel there's something lacking in the midrange of the Paradigms.

I've heard of tons of crappy PA systems, and I definitely don't like the distorted, muffled, shrill sound from those systems, often heard outdoors. I'm talking about the actually good sounding PA systems, usually found indoors,

Do you guys think the JTR speakers would fit that type of sound signature? Note, I like the PA sound, but I couldn't care less about their extreme output capabilities. I've heard of a quality PA system at sane volumes at a high school auditorium, and it sounds absolutely amazing. I wish I asked someone at the school about the equipment they use when I was there.

Thanks
LowerFE is offline  
post #18200 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 01:53 PM
AVS Special Member
 
N8DOGG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Canada
Posts: 5,743
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 148 Post(s)
Liked: 305
Quote:
Originally Posted by LowerFE View Post

Hi JTR owners,

What kind of sound signature do the JTR speakers have?

After listening to lots of high end "Hi-Fi" speakers from Paradigm, Totem, Vandersteen, Martin Logan, etc, I find that I prefer the sound from a high quality PA system like I've heard at high end clubs and concerts (and surprisingly, at a high school's auditorium)

I've heard of tons of crappy PA systems, and I definitely don't like the distorted, muffled, shrill sound from those systems, often heard outdoors. I'm talking about the actually good sounding PA systems, usually found indoors,

Do you guys think the JTR speakers would fit that type of sound signature?

Thanks

I'd say it's in between the 2. It's got the output of the PA stuff but can sound just as good or better than anything from the "hi-fi" guys.... BTW I had a set of Paradigm Sig 8's that I had a head to head vs the JTR T12's. Within the hour, I had my Sig 8's up for sale. The JTR stuff just was better at everything but low end bass.... When my new 215's get here, that will be a thing of the past.

Blasting brown notes for 10 years and counting!

N8DOGG is offline  
post #18201 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 03:07 PM
AVS Special Member
 
jlpowell84's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Eugene, OR
Posts: 4,084
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 181 Post(s)
Liked: 225
Quote:
Originally Posted by LowerFE View Post

Hi JTR owners,

What kind of sound signature do the JTR speakers have?

After listening to lots of high end "Hi-Fi" speakers from Paradigm, Totem, Vandersteen, Martin Logan, etc, I find that I prefer the sound signature of a high quality PA system like I've heard at high end clubs and concerts (and surprisingly, at a high school's auditorium). Something with nice, slightly emphasized treble and in your face sound. Paradigm's sound signature came the closest, but I always feel there's something lacking in the midrange of the Paradigms.

I've heard of tons of crappy PA systems, and I definitely don't like the distorted, muffled, shrill sound from those systems, often heard outdoors. I'm talking about the actually good sounding PA systems, usually found indoors,

Do you guys think the JTR speakers would fit that type of sound signature? Note, I like the PA sound, but I couldn't care less about their extreme output capabilities. I've heard of a quality PA system at sane volumes at a high school auditorium, and it sounds absolutely amazing. I wish I asked someone at the school about the equipment they use when I was there.

Thanks

I will bite on this a bit. I am certainly on the lower end of experience with high end speakers but I feel I have enough experience and listening enough to tell why JTR's are good! Everyone knows JTR's are known for the high sensitivity ratings and ability to play extremely loud! And with minimal power, minus the 215 210 new models. We see this in Archaea's youtube video of powering two 212 Noesis with 1 single watt each at reference level volume. I think some audio snobs turn away from JTR because they assume all they do is play loud and sound decent doing so. Also the looks may drive some away. But for those looking for good sound I believe JTR's are the answer. Lower listening levels are great too, just ask Goodoc. He has lost sleep over his 212's like others. I spent an entire long day in Seattle at Kris Deerings GTG last year and spent lots of time listening too a set of flagship Paradigm towers downstairs and Legacy Audio sent him a set of 5 Legacy Focus SE model speaker (2 towers, center and two surrounds). They both sounded great and I would be happy with either in my home. But in the real world price is also a factor and even if I took home 10k a month you wouldn't see me buying the Legacies. They were extremely precise, accurate and very nice overall. But to me they just sounded like a set of good sounding speakers that had a tie bit of upper harshness. During this GTG I was offered to stay at Bill's, bsoko2, house. He has a 7 channel JTR system of Triple 8 surrounds x4 and LCR Quintuples. We watched the movie Oblivion the night before and it was great. I swore Tom Cruise was in the room during vocal scenes. I came away from that weekend liking the JTR sound best. THE number one factor I most enjoyed and solidified my future JTR seeking was there was no harshness anywhere! Even right now as I listen to my Triple 8's the cleanness and absolute zero distortion is key. My first system was a 7 channel Definitive Technology system consisting of L&R towers that were $2,000 retail each! That system was better than most american families will ever have but I could only go so loud until it would distort and I would have to turn it down. Right now as I type I am listening to lossless audio files through iTunes as well a a CD at -3 to -6. And it doesn't seem loud. Remember distortion sounds loud and makes one think the volume is too loud when it's just distortion they are hearing. People have claimed that well over reference on JTR's doesn't sound that loud. I have hit +16 over reference with the Dolby music listening preset and like +10 with stereo listening preset and the cleanness is just unreal! But it's not all about loudness I know. But I think the fact that these can play so loud with no distortion means that normal loud and reference are both so distortion free.
asoofi1 likes this.

DIY Sound Group Volt 10 surround speaker build

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

My Setup Thread

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
jlpowell84 is offline  
post #18202 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 03:09 PM
AVS Special Member
 
BrolicBeast's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Charles County, MD
Posts: 2,940
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 187 Post(s)
Liked: 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by coolgeek View Post

I am almost ready to buy my screen now and I have decided to go with the XD as it's the brightest AT screen I could find and after spending hours viewing lots of materials both still images and BluRay movies, both me and my friends that that XD looks the best.

Please note that I have not tested any of their Acoustic Properties. We know the specs for the XD pretty well as it's published on the Seymour website (assuming it's accurate). The falcon still needed to be tested. With a tighter weave, I would assume it's going to lose out at least in a small bit in terms of acoustic transparency.. but that's just conjecture at this point.

My review of the screens are as follows:


Falcon:

- Weave is visible to about 8 feet. People with very sharp eyesight might be able to see them at about 10 feet (Note: weave is only visible with bright white scenes and not very visible for regular movie scenes).
- Contrast a bit better than XD (black is slightly blacker, some colors are deeper)
- Brightness level loses to XD but beats EN4K. I would say, from the photos below as you can see yourself, the gain level of the Falcon is right in the middle of the XD and the EN4K. From what we know, it's published by Seymour that their XD is 20% brighter than their EN4K, so I would say the Falson is 10% dimmer than the XD.

Centerstage XD:

- Weave visible to about 10 feet and disappears at about 11-12 feet depending on your eyesight. And this only applies to very bright/white scenes. For amost all movie scenes, I could not see it even at 6-8 feet (or rather would not notice it if i wasn't squinting my eyes and purposely looking for it).
- Contrast slightly less than either the Falcon or EN4K, but it's hardly noticeable in moving pictures. For still images it's noticeable.
- Gain - This has the most gain. And it looks the best to me in terms of the 'pop' factor. Skin tones are the most natural and translucent, compared to the 'duller' EN4K or Falcon.

Summary:

If you're going to be sitting beyond 10 feet, I would really suggest the XD. If you're sitting really close, then the Falson,.. I really couldn't recommend the EN4K because it's just so darn dark... You'll need a light canon of a projector... or, if your screen is really small...

Photos below are shown in such a way:

Left: Falcon
Middle: XD
Right : EN4K

Note: Seymour have published that the EN4K material is 20% dimmer than the XD, and as you can see the Left looks almost exactly in the middle in terms of brightness between the XD and the EN4K, so my initial statement that the Falcon is about 10% dimmer is just about right. Without a proper measurement, I'll say it'll be around that ball-park, give or take a few percentage.

See for yourself:





In these last two scenes, the differences not as much but still visible there. When watching a full movie, the XD will have more pop overall and colors are more vibrant.


This is one of the reasons I check in on this thread from time-to-time.  I'm not a current or prospective JTR owner, but there are sooooo many useful tidbits on this thread, and I look at it as less of a JTR thread and more of a A/V melting-pot thread.  A little of this, a little of that, and a whole lot of excellence!

 

This was a great screen material comparison.  I'm currently looking at screens, and my choices are down to Falcon (Vision HD), Seymour (Centerstage XD), and Stewart (Ultramatte 150).  Selecting a screen materia, as you most certainly know, is a daunting task.  I love 3D so my hearts wants the Stewart screen with a 1.5 gain that would do well with my projector in 3D, BUT--for the price of the Stewart, I could literally get 4 of the Falcon or Seymour screens.  Difficult decisions.  The difference between the Falcon and the Centerstage is really great to see using the same projected image.

 

The Enlightor 4k is a conundrum to me...but then again, so are all negative gain screens.  You'd need a DPI Titan Reference to get a picture that pops on a large screen.  Not "general public" large (100" diag. or so), but "AVS Community" large, which is at least 120 or 130" diagonal to START.


The Build:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
| The System:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
| The Video Series:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Social:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
BrolicBeast is offline  
post #18203 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 03:46 PM
The Truth Hz
 
beastaudio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Western NC
Posts: 7,432
Mentioned: 10 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 467 Post(s)
Liked: 727
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gooddoc View Post

Ok, I made the executive decision, in consultation with my wife who only said, "What? Whatever", to buy the Danley's from reef for an extended comparo in my room between them and the 212's. Winner stays.

Assuming he hasn't already sold them to a less deserving buyer...smile.gif

OHHHH!?!?!?! Very glad that my little guys are still in the good hands of a fellow I know personally smile.gif Good luck with them and can't wait to hear what you think! Remember, throw some of the conventional "toe-in" wisdom out the door with them to start with. Try very, very aggressive toe, and then work your way out to almost none and decide where you like them best. I learned the most toe-in was a good start and backed them out from there until the center image was decent between seats, but the soundstage effect expanded tremendously.

(European models do not accept banana plugs.)

 

"If you done it, it ain't bragging." ~ Walt Whitman

 


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

beastaudio is offline  
post #18204 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 05:09 PM
AVS Special Member
 
dgage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,324
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 246 Post(s)
Liked: 214
Quote:
Originally Posted by RMK! View Post

It is funny how the tides swing around here. I think the product comparisons are fun. In the case of the SH50's in Beasts room, he has spent weeks tweaking the SH50's and the Noesis did not have the benefit of careful placement or lengthy EQ'ing. The subjective opinions are based upon how the room and treatments effect each speaker, the EQ'ing that was done and the subjective taste of the listener. Honestly, anyone who says there are big differences in sound quality between the SH50 and the Noesis 212 are IMHO being a bit cheeky. The SH 50 relies on some very good engineering to get a lot out of what is a slightly lower quality, higher distortion driver set (especially the CD). The SH50 is a commercial grade loudspeaker designed for commercial use in very large spaces. The SH50 is wider and deeper (11' wider and 3" deeper) so has a larger foot print than the 215 and the Danley does not come with a base so you must build or buy one to place it at the correct height for HT.. While all JTR speakers have a pro audio lineage, all Noesis speakers were designed for use in the home (preferably a home theater).

At $4K each retail the SH50 is priced $1,750 more than the Noesis 212, $500 higher than the 215RT (standard finish) and about the same as the 215RT (automotive finish). So in many ways, the 215RT is a more comparable product. They are both large speakers with a depth that makes them difficult to place behind an AT screen. The 215 is a true full range speaker and so can be used without subs (trust me) if you so desire. I would think that the power to drive them would be about the same with perhaps a bit more juice needed with the 215's if playing effortlessly to reference and above is your goal


Add all this up and the comparisons are really silly due to the large difference in the designs and styles. I think a lot of folks fall in love with the mystique of the TD designs because the man himself is such an interesting character (I am a big fan of the guy smile.gif), But really, he builds his speakers for churches and gymnasiums/ sports arenas. They can be squeezed into a home theater and work well given time and effort but that was not their intended purpose. Apparently, Tom is working on some true Home Theater Designs and they may be a great option when ready for prime time. I can assure you they will not be cheap as Danley has a dealer distribution model and that ensures a significant margin is added to the cost. If Danley decides to go ID with these HT products that will undercut their commercial product pricing and create problem for them in those markets.

All that said, this is the JTR Speaker Thread and it is by far the most tolerant of any such dedicated product thread in off topic and competitive product discussions, That's why a lot of us hang out here. So in the great tradition of no tradition, I'm just calling it like I see it.

Peace out ... tongue.gif

While I don't disagree with your post, I had a ton of fun comparing the different equipment at the GTG and just hanging out. It would be cool to sit and listen to a system and watch movies, concerts, music, etc. but I'm not sure if that might get boring. And with that said, you have to deal with the equipment available. I'm super happy I was able to attend Beast's GTG as it was a great time meeting wonderful people, listening to Beast's phenomenal system, but I also enjoyed A/Bing the different subs and speakers. Of course, if we had your 215s then it would have been nirvana but we have to take what we can get. smile.gif
dgage is offline  
post #18205 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 05:14 PM
AVS Special Member
 
dgage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,324
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 246 Post(s)
Liked: 214
Quote:
Originally Posted by LowerFE View Post

Hi JTR owners,

What kind of sound signature do the JTR speakers have?

After listening to lots of high end "Hi-Fi" speakers from Paradigm, Totem, Vandersteen, Martin Logan, etc, I find that I prefer the sound signature of a high quality PA system like I've heard at high end clubs and concerts (and surprisingly, at a high school's auditorium). Something with nice, slightly emphasized treble and in your face sound. Paradigm's sound signature came the closest, but I always feel there's something lacking in the midrange of the Paradigms.

I've heard of tons of crappy PA systems, and I definitely don't like the distorted, muffled, shrill sound from those systems, often heard outdoors. I'm talking about the actually good sounding PA systems, usually found indoors,

Do you guys think the JTR speakers would fit that type of sound signature? Note, I like the PA sound, but I couldn't care less about their extreme output capabilities. I've heard of a quality PA system at sane volumes at a high school auditorium, and it sounds absolutely amazing. I wish I asked someone at the school about the equipment they use when I was there.

Thanks

What's you percentage use of the system between music and theater? What's your budget on speakers? What's your budget on subs or if you already have subs, what are they?

I haven't heard enough good PA systems to have an opinion but take a look at JTR's facebook page and take a look at the sheer number of pictures with the speakers and subs at large and outdoor venues. And then listen to us gush about how damned detailed these dynamic speakers are.

If you are primarily a 2 channel music listener then I'd say you should try to listen to the JTRs. If you are a movie watcher, I'd tell you to pick your budget and call Jeff on Monday to order the appropriate JTR speaker. smile.gif Seriously, other than the Danley's, I haven't heard a better speaker for home theater than the JTR. But then again, you came to the JTR thread. smile.gif
dgage is offline  
post #18206 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 05:14 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Gooddoc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 3,636
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 179 Post(s)
Liked: 218
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

OHHHH!?!?!?! Very glad that my little guys are still in the good hands of a fellow I know personally smile.gif Good luck with them and can't wait to hear what you think! Remember, throw some of the conventional "toe-in" wisdom out the door with them to start with. Try very, very aggressive toe, and then work your way out to almost none and decide where you like them best. I learned the most toe-in was a good start and backed them out from there until the center image was decent between seats, but the soundstage effect expanded tremendously.

Thanks for the tips beast. I have a rather narrow and long room, so I'm going to start with them on the side walls across the the opposite seats and go from there.

I was supposed to pick them up this afternoon and got stuck fixing a plumbing problem at my in-laws. I felt like telling them I had other important business to take care of and I'd come back tomorrow to get their water back on...

CHT SHO-10 x 5 powered by Denon 4311 and Lab Gruppen 10000Q amp
JTR S2 x 2
CHT 18.1 x2
Oppo BDP103D bluray player/Sonos/PS3
Gooddoc is offline  
post #18207 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 05:26 PM
AVS Special Member
 
jlpowell84's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Eugene, OR
Posts: 4,084
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 181 Post(s)
Liked: 225
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=724587924230021&set=vb.160675990621220&type=2&theater

turn it up!!!

DIY Sound Group Volt 10 surround speaker build

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

My Setup Thread

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
jlpowell84 is offline  
post #18208 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 05:38 PM
The Truth Hz
 
beastaudio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Western NC
Posts: 7,432
Mentioned: 10 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 467 Post(s)
Liked: 727
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gooddoc View Post

Thanks for the tips beast. I have a rather narrow and long room, so I'm going to start with them on the side walls across the the opposite seats and go from there.

I was supposed to pick them up this afternoon and got stuck fixing a plumbing problem at my in-laws. I felt like telling them I had other important business to take care of and I'd come back tomorrow to get their water back on...

Sounds like an excellent space for them actually. My room is 12x29 and they did fantastic with the space (obviously). biggrin.gif

(European models do not accept banana plugs.)

 

"If you done it, it ain't bragging." ~ Walt Whitman

 


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

beastaudio is offline  
post #18209 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 05:39 PM
AVS Special Member
 
dlbeck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Des Moines, IA
Posts: 1,080
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 77 Post(s)
Liked: 161
JTR speaker porn

Frohlich, dgage, RMK! and 6 others like this.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
dlbeck is offline  
post #18210 of 23530 Old 04-12-2014, 06:18 PM
AVS Special Member
 
sdg4vfx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Southern CA
Posts: 1,322
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Liked: 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by dlbeck View Post

JTR speaker porn


Pretty sure that's still illegal in a couple Midwestern states.
Dbuudo07 likes this.
sdg4vfx is offline  
Reply Speakers

Tags
228ht , captivator , Jtr , Jtr Noesis 212ht 212ht Lp
Gear in this thread - 228ht by PriceGrabber.com

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off