Originally Posted by coolgeek
Chris. I completely understand what you are saying. I already knew that the cd in the 212 is two in one. All I am saying is that its still superior
. Thats it. I amnot saying the cheaper one is of lower value just that it doesn't perform as well.
And I have heard the s8 which is essentially a coaxial but did not think its anywhere near the quality of the 212s.
Why? You have absolutely zero ability to make that call. You cannot dump that compression driver, into a coax even like the s8 and state which performs better, or even speculate
for that matter. There is way more at play here. The horn the CD is in, the speaker's voicing, etc.
So, superior from a design standpoint? Perhaps. It takes a little more R&D to get something like a 2 way CD.
Superior from a "sound" standpoint? I would argue the separation of the drivers to dedicated midranges surrounding the horn and limiting the CD's passband more makes the overall design superior, not the other way around. Point of fact, the sm60f uses a coaxial CD, and has more extension up top comparable to the Noesis. Here are measurements of the 60f in my space, and in Rilla's space. Excellent extension, two different calibrated mics as well.
Originally Posted by coolgeek
Remember, I was merely speculating about distortion after hearing from Goodoc's reviews of them.. he said the Danleys gives him brain fatigue and the 212s did not..
So, as far as i know, given the following premises:
A - One set of speaker gives fatigue whereas the other doesn't.
B- Distortion causes brain fatigue (I know not of any other variables that causes that in the AB comparison here).
So, logically speaking, one of the speakers MUST be distorting...
Again, it's all speculation because Goodoc's report may be inaccurate, or, there are other unknown variables involved...
So, these are all just speculative.. I am not making any strong stance on any conclusion... Feel free to think of other variables...
Unless some around here has fibromyalgia, brain fatigue shouldn't be an issue.
We should stop speculating. While hard to do and fun to spitball ideas sometimes, this is a "Science" forum, not AVIG (I Guess) Forums. I suffer from this at times too, but bottom line we have several things at play that need to be debunked with this comparo.
1) It's not distortion, period, on either speaker.
2) Gooddoc doesn't have fibromyalgia, or brain fatigue
3) The Crossover designer(s) and voicing of the speaker is paramount. This is the largest variable with any of the speakers the quality we are discussing.
4) More than likely this 20-25khz area is blamed for a speaker being bright, when all too often, (agreed it is age-dependent) this has nothing to do with it. A slight bump at 2khz could be the culprit, even just a 2-3dB move in the speaker's response that far down can make the speaker sound "forward" or "bright," even harsh at times.
I am not trying to play fanboy here by any means, I just see some wild speculation getting thrown around and want to bring some things into focus here. I respect Tom and Jeff immensely, but each of their
voicings and ideas of a perfect sounding speaker are going to be different, this will come through into their finished product. I have found my ear sees eye to eye more with Tom than Jeff, and there is absolutely nothing wrong with that, as many people see it differently than I and I have no issue there. I know for a fact now though that my personal idea of a great sounding speaker and Tom's is closer than mine and Jeff's. Plain and simple. Both designs are top fraction of a percent in the industry, so calling it anything less than "preference" at this point is difficult in the first place.