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Old 08-25-2014, 07:44 PM
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Originally Posted by rangers View Post
On that DIY deal....would a pair of 4 cubic ft sealed enclosures with drivers like the UXL-18 and a good amp be similar in output
to my dual SubMersives???
You would out SPL them by ton. Like Jbrown said, likely 1 UXL full powered would be close to a submersive on it's own, maybe not quite but close. 4 would woop up on them from one side to the other. Thats not to say the submersive isn't an awesome sub but DIY will always win in performance for the money.

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Old 08-25-2014, 07:47 PM
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What Brand speakers are these
Those are Dayton UM-18's... sexy drivers eh? lol

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Old 08-25-2014, 07:56 PM
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Originally Posted by N8DOGG View Post
You would out SPL them by ton. Like Jbrown said, likely 1 UXL full powered would be close to a submersive on it's own, maybe not quite but close. 4 would woop up on them from one side to the other. Thats not to say the submersive isn't an awesome sub but DIY will always win in performance for the money.
Yea I was thinking two of JBrowns ported subs would be a decent trade for dual submersives. May not dig as deep but...Oh, they all sound great with JTR speakers

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Old 08-25-2014, 07:56 PM
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So I know quite often guys ask for recommendation for surrounds other then JTR's that will work well with JTR mains. A lot of times JBL 8340 pro stuff is what people recommend, well I think I have found another excellent suggestion for guys to use. Reaction Audio's CX-10 10" coax speakers, they list them as an LCR speaker but it could easily be used as surrounds. I was actually a little shocked to see the components used in this speaker too, after talking with Jeremy from RE I discovered that they are using a compression driver that closely resembles the Radian 475pb http://radianaudio.com/product/745pb/ and the 10" driver is basically the http://www.usspeaker.com/radian%202210-1.htm and has a $150 custom crossover in it, all for only $599ea shipped. This appears to be an excellent price given the components the RE is using.


And to top it off after a few back and forth PM's with Jeremy, he's going to build me a surround speakers using the Radian 5208C 8" coax. http://radianaudio.com/wp/wp-content...2/5208C-e-.jpg which is a very nice coax. He's going to build me a slanted style ported cabinet with a magnetic grill cover in a satin black paint finish like the subs they build. They will be sized right around 13"x13" and at top 9" deep and I've asked for a 20 degree slant. Pricing is basically $500 shipped. Seems very reasonable and I'll have the first pair that they are building.


Like I said just thought I'd let you guys know because I know how many times guys post questions about what surrounds would work well with JTR mains because they can't afford to buy the S8's or Slant 8's like myself.

Last edited by jbrown15; 08-25-2014 at 09:46 PM.
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Old 08-25-2014, 07:59 PM
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Originally Posted by jlpowell84 View Post
Yea I was thinking two of JBrowns ported subs would be a decent trade for dual submersives. May not dig as deep but...Oh, they all sound great with JTR speakers

My subs have very good output all the way down to 10hz. Probably better then what most people have, but they fall off below 10hz obviously do to their port tune. Which is right around 14hz.
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Old 08-25-2014, 09:43 PM
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Originally Posted by jbrown15 View Post
My subs have very good output all the way down to 10hz. Probably better then what most people have, but they fall off below 10hz obviously do to their port tune. Which is right around 14hz.
While I strongly believe two 15" drivers will out perform a single 18" driver, I feel the excursion of a single UXL driver is fully capable of digging as deep or deeper than than a Submersive.........I know, I've measured.

Without a doubt, four UXL drivers will dig deeper and have a lot more SPL than a pair of Submersives.........simple physics ie displacement.

BTW, have always wanted to hear Submersives.........
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Old 08-25-2014, 09:56 PM
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Originally Posted by doublewing11 View Post
While I strongly believe two 15" drivers will out perform a single 18" driver, I feel the excursion of a single UXL driver is fully capable of digging as deep or deeper than than a Submersive.........I know, I've measured.

Without a doubt, four UXL drivers will dig deeper and have a lot more SPL than a pair of Submersives.........simple physics ie displacement.

BTW, have always wanted to hear Submersives.........

I know this isn't an exact science but bare with me here, but take a look at the data-bass measurements on the latest PSA XS15se sub. It basically uses the same driver as a SubM HP and puts up pretty good numbers, but is only powered by a 550watt amp. So if we were to by theory double the wattage to 1100watt that would add +3dB and if you were to say add a second driver also with 1100watts you'd gain about +6dB for a total of +9dB. Which would roughly have the same output as the 2400watt SubM HP. So take a look at the numbers of the XS15se and compare them to the UXL-18 and it's down about 9-10dB's compared to the UXL.


So I would have to think an UXL-18 would be very close in output to the SubM HP, but again that's just a shot in the dark....lol
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Old 08-25-2014, 10:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doublewing11 View Post
While I strongly believe two 15" drivers will out perform a single 18" driver, I feel the excursion of a single UXL driver is fully capable of digging as deep or deeper than than a Submersive.........I know, I've measured.

Without a doubt, four UXL drivers will dig deeper and have a lot more SPL than a pair of Submersives.........simple physics ie displacement.

BTW, have always wanted to hear Submersives.........
Well if you ever come to Eugene OR let me know

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Old 08-26-2014, 02:01 AM
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PL, size is always the issue.
True. My electromagnetic flux would distort your $hit bro...

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Originally Posted by RMK! View Post
No, it really sounded like ****e. The right surround dominated and I could barely hear the dialog. It may have been better from the front row I don't think so. I was going to stop the movie and check things out but we had already been through my OPPO BDP-83 having issues causing several false starts. I finally changed players and I was a couple of tall margaritas in so I just let the bad sound go.
I would pause the party and try to tweak just to get it sounding better to my ears. Otherwise, I it would literally drive me nuts the entire movie. For some reason random little stuff like that makes my blood boil, but if something big was to go wrong, it wouldn't bug me as much... Kinda weird, I know.

Maybe I just need to drink more...
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Old 08-26-2014, 06:04 AM
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True. My electromagnetic flux would distort your $hit bro...


I would pause the party and try to tweak just to get it sounding better to my ears. Otherwise, I it would literally drive me nuts the entire movie. For some reason random little stuff like that makes my blood boil, but if something big was to go wrong, it wouldn't bug me as much... Kinda weird, I know.

Maybe I just need to drink more...
I agree. We all gathered Sunday night for the AMZSPM2 and I stopped it 10 minutes into it and level matched the LCR as the dialog in the center was killing me. I was getting some dirty looks from the crowd because of the pink noise, but had to be done. Of course I fell asleep 10 minutes later, but it sounded much better for that 10 minutes.
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Old 08-26-2014, 07:16 AM
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Originally Posted by popalock View Post
True. My electromagnetic flux would distort your $hit bro...


I would pause the party and try to tweak just to get it sounding better to my ears. Otherwise, I it would literally drive me nuts the entire movie. For some reason random little stuff like that makes my blood boil, but if something big was to go wrong, it wouldn't bug me as much... Kinda weird, I know.

Maybe I just need to drink more...
Yep, the margaritas were the salve that kept me from diving into the problem. Well, that and that fact that I had already seen the movie 3 times.

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Originally Posted by Reefdvr27 View Post
I agree. We all gathered Sunday night for the AMZSPM2 and I stopped it 10 minutes into it and level matched the LCR as the dialog in the center was killing me. I was getting some dirty looks from the crowd because of the pink noise, but had to be done. Of course I fell asleep 10 minutes later, but it sounded much better for that 10 minutes.
Yes, those damn HT chairs put me to sleep even when the movie doesn't.
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Old 08-26-2014, 07:35 AM
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RMAF 2014 - A little background: Last year I contacted JRiver Media Center and offered to host a room at RMAF 2014. They were interested and said to go for it. Of course a room needs speakers. I contacted Jeff and he was interested in bringing a new speaker design he was working on. As we now know, that turned out to be the 215RT. The rest of the equipment/gear is all stuff that I'm bringing.

I've got the following so far:
  • Amps: 3 Digital Amp Company Cherry Monoblocks and 1 Cherry Jr. stereo amp for a total of 5 channels
  • Power: Torus RM 2.5 Power Isolation Unit
  • DAC: Lynx Aurora 16 Thunderbolt
  • Source: HTPC - I'm building a new Windows one with a motherboard that supports Thunderbolt, Linux NUC
  • Control: Ipad, Android Phone, iPhone, tablet, laptop, and keyboard
  • Monitor: 27" LCD
  • GIK Acoustics Room Treatments: two Tri-Traps, two 244 bass traps, two 242 acoustic panels

I also want a MacBook with Thunderbolt port.

The complaint I see most often about rooms at shows is that the acoustics are terrible and no treatments are being used. I hope this room can be treated to let Jeff's speakers sound the best. I may be able to borrow some more GIK Tri-Traps (4) and diffusors (2) from a local friend. Chris Seymour/Seymour AV has offered an AT screen, but then I need to get a projector. The AT screen would fit between the mains, but cover the center speaker.

How would you setup the room?
Anyone want to design a flyer and banner for the JTR Speakers 215RT?

JTR Speakers will be just down the hall from Wilson Speakers and GR Research.

Here is the room size:
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Old 08-26-2014, 08:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbrown15 View Post
I know this isn't an exact science but bare with me here, but take a look at the data-bass measurements on the latest PSA XS15se sub. It basically uses the same driver as a SubM HP and puts up pretty good numbers, but is only powered by a 550watt amp. So if we were to by theory double the wattage to 1100watt that would add +3dB and if you were to say add a second driver also with 1100watts you'd gain about +6dB for a total of +9dB. Which would roughly have the same output as the 2400watt SubM HP. So take a look at the numbers of the XS15se and compare them to the UXL-18 and it's down about 9-10dB's compared to the UXL.


So I would have to think an UXL-18 would be very close in output to the SubM HP, but again that's just a shot in the dark....lol


What theeeeee heck?

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Old 08-27-2014, 05:32 AM
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Originally Posted by desertdome View Post
RMAF 2014 - A little background: Last year I contacted JRiver Media Center and offered to host a room at RMAF 2014. They were interested and said to go for it. Of course a room needs speakers. I contacted Jeff and he was interested in bringing a new speaker design he was working on. As we now know, that turned out to be the 215RT. The rest of the equipment/gear is all stuff that I'm bringing.

I've got the following so far:
  • Amps: 3 Digital Amp Company Cherry Monoblocks and 1 Cherry Jr. stereo amp for a total of 5 channels
  • Power: Torus RM 2.5 Power Isolation Unit
  • DAC: Lynx Aurora 16 Thunderbolt
  • Source: HTPC - I'm building a new Windows one with a motherboard that supports Thunderbolt, Linux NUC
  • Control: Ipad, Android Phone, iPhone, tablet, laptop, and keyboard
  • Monitor: 27" LCD
  • GIK Acoustics Room Treatments: two Tri-Traps, two 244 bass traps, two 242 acoustic panels

I also want a MacBook with Thunderbolt port.

The complaint I see most often about rooms at shows is that the acoustics are terrible and no treatments are being used. I hope this room can be treated to let Jeff's speakers sound the best. I may be able to borrow some more GIK Tri-Traps (4) and diffusors (2) from a local friend. Chris Seymour/Seymour AV has offered an AT screen, but then I need to get a projector. The AT screen would fit between the mains, but cover the center speaker.

How would you setup the room?
Anyone want to design a flyer and banner for the JTR Speakers 215RT?

JTR Speakers will be just down the hall from Wilson Speakers and GR Research.

Here is the room size:
I would like to come just to see the JRiver set up.
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Old 08-27-2014, 12:29 PM
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Originally Posted by jbrown15 View Post
So I know quite often guys ask for recommendation for surrounds other then JTR's that will work well with JTR mains. A lot of times JBL 8340 pro stuff is what people recommend, well I think I have found another excellent suggestion for guys to use. Reaction Audio's CX-10 10" coax speakers, they list them as an LCR speaker but it could easily be used as surrounds. I was actually a little shocked to see the components used in this speaker too, after talking with Jeremy from RE I discovered that they are using a compression driver that closely resembles the Radian 475pb http://radianaudio.com/product/745pb/ and the 10" driver is basically the http://www.usspeaker.com/radian%202210-1.htm and has a $150 custom crossover in it, all for only $599ea shipped. This appears to be an excellent price given the components the RE is using.


And to top it off after a few back and forth PM's with Jeremy, he's going to build me a surround speakers using the Radian 5208C 8" coax. http://radianaudio.com/wp/wp-content...2/5208C-e-.jpg which is a very nice coax. He's going to build me a slanted style ported cabinet with a magnetic grill cover in a satin black paint finish like the subs they build. They will be sized right around 13"x13" and at top 9" deep and I've asked for a 20 degree slant. Pricing is basically $500 shipped. Seems very reasonable and I'll have the first pair that they are building.


Like I said just thought I'd let you guys know because I know how many times guys post questions about what surrounds would work well with JTR mains because they can't afford to buy the S8's or Slant 8's like myself.
Your post got me really excited about this project. I assume that's $500 per speaker. Is he open to doing more after your set? Keep us posted...this maybe my next purchase...can't quite swing the full price of the slant 8's but would like to look for an alternative to my JBL 8340a's.

Thanks very much for sharing this awesome discovery.

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Old 08-27-2014, 12:34 PM
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Your post got me really excited about this project. I assume that's $500 per speaker. Is he open to doing more after your set? Keep us posted...this maybe my next purchase...can't quite swing the full price of the slant 8's but would like to look for an alternative to my JBL 8340a's.

Thanks very much for sharing this awesome discovery.

Yes $500 per speaker and he will be offering this speaker for other people to buy after my set. I know how you feel, I would love nothing more then to buy two pairs of Slant 8's for my room too. But just can't justify spend that much, after all this is a hobby and not my only one I understand why the Slant 8 is priced the way it is though, as it uses a very high quality coax that costs around $500ea and then you figure in a cost of probably a $150 for a custom crossover, speaker cabinet and putting a finish on it. Plus Jeff needs to make money, so certainly not trying to say they aren't worth that. Just that I can't afford it and I think I've found an excellent alternative for guys looking to spend a little less.


I should have a sketch up of it by next week, anyone that's interested can pm me and I can send them some more details.
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Old 08-27-2014, 12:51 PM
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There should be a coax surround speaker shootout.
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Old 08-27-2014, 01:34 PM
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There should be a coax surround speaker shootout.
We kinda did. My slanted 8's. Beastaudio Beastclops and Sibuna's Eminence 8's.
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Old 08-27-2014, 01:38 PM
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We kinda did.
Apologies for my lousy search skills.
Are the results posted somewhere?
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Old 08-27-2014, 01:51 PM
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Apologies for my lousy search skills.
Are the results posted somewhere?
I am not sure. It would be the in the NE GTG Heavy weight GTG results thread if there is anything. Not really a shootout, just opinions. The real show was down stairs.

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Old 08-27-2014, 02:45 PM
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Found this in another thread. Might fit the bill for the JTR crowd



(September 10-13) the miniDSP Home Theater Series of 8-channel HDMI audio processors for home theater with Dirac live digital room correction:
http://www.minidsp.com/ht-series/nanoavr-dl

This is the PRELIMINARY manual (version 0.2 dated tomorrow):
http://www.minidsp.com/images/documents/nanoAVR%20DL%20User%20Manual.pdf

Last edited by Frohlich; 08-27-2014 at 02:50 PM.
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Old 08-27-2014, 02:49 PM
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Found this in another thread. Might fight the bill for the JTR crowd



(September 10-13) the miniDSP Home Theater Series of 8-channel HDMI audio processors for home theater with Dirac live digital room correction:
http://www.minidsp.com/ht-series/nanoavr-dl

This is the PRELIMINARY manual (version 0.2 dated tomorrow):
http://www.minidsp.com/images/documents/nanoAVR%20DL%20User%20Manual.pdf
Yea, slick little unit for sure. I am contemplating getting one of the open DRC's with the dirac stuff to be able to use the EQ for all sources. Dirac by all accounts seems to be one of the most versatile DSP engines out there. Trinnov is another good one but there is no good implementations of it at this time for less that something like $10,000....heh, NOPE.
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Old 08-27-2014, 03:34 PM
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Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post
Yea, slick little unit for sure. I am contemplating getting one of the open DRC's with the dirac stuff to be able to use the EQ for all sources. Dirac by all accounts seems to be one of the most versatile DSP engines out there. Trinnov is another good one but there is no good implementations of it at this time for less that something like $10,000....heh, NOPE.
Do any of the open DRC's eq 8 channels like the HDMI on does?

I looked quickly but I looked like they were only 2 ch.
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Old 08-27-2014, 05:22 PM
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Originally Posted by jbrown15 View Post
Yes $500 per speaker and he will be offering this speaker for other people to buy after my set. I know how you feel, I would love nothing more then to buy two pairs of Slant 8's for my room too. But just can't justify spend that much, after all this is a hobby and not my only one I understand why the Slant 8 is priced the way it is though, as it uses a very high quality coax that costs around $500ea and then you figure in a cost of probably a $150 for a custom crossover, speaker cabinet and putting a finish on it. Plus Jeff needs to make money, so certainly not trying to say they aren't worth that. Just that I can't afford it and I think I've found an excellent alternative for guys looking to spend a little less.


I should have a sketch up of it by next week, anyone that's interested can pm me and I can send them some more details.
I was one of those guys asking about cheaper options for surrounds (considering the JBL 8350s). So I really appreciate the heads up regarding the CX-10s. And I know this is the JTR thread, but I think it's important to throw those alternatives out there for folks like me, who want to put as much of their budget as possible into JTR LCRs. And I might just bite the bullet and end up getting S-8s for surrounds. But I'm definitely going to reach out to Jeremy and see what the CX-10 has to offer.

jbrown, please keep in the loop regarding how your custom CX-10s pan out and thanks again.
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Old 08-27-2014, 05:31 PM
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I was one of those guys asking about cheaper options for surrounds (considering the JBL 8350s). So I really appreciate the heads up regarding the CX-10s. And I know this is the JTR thread, but I think it's important to throw those alternatives out there for folks like me, who want to put as much of their budget as possible into JTR LCRs. And I might just bite the bullet and end up getting S-8s for surrounds. But I'm definitely going to reach out to Jeremy and see what the CX-10 has to offer.

jbrown, please keep in the loop regarding how your custom CX-10s pan out and thanks again.

I started a Reaction Audio thread in the speaker section, just out of respect for Jeff and my awesome JTR's I'll try to keep all of the chat over there. I'll post details of my surrounds over there, right now I'm just waiting to get the sketches from Jeremy on them.


Oh and my surrounds won't be based on the CX-10, that speaker uses a Radian 5210 coax, the speaker I'm going to get will use the 8" coax 5208C.
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Old 08-27-2014, 05:51 PM
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I started a Reaction Audio thread in the speaker section, just out of respect for Jeff and my awesome JTR's I'll try to keep all of the chat over there. I'll post details of my surrounds over there, right now I'm just waiting to get the sketches from Jeremy on them.


Oh and my surrounds won't be based on the CX-10, that speaker uses a Radian 5210 coax, the speaker I'm going to get will use the 8" coax 5208C.
Good to know a thread was started. I'd previously only seen the Reaction Audio subwoofer thread. Thanks!
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Old 08-27-2014, 06:15 PM
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Apologies for my lousy search skills.
Are the results posted somewhere?
Hey no worries There are no "self elected thread police" here Sometimes it's just easier to ask then search for several minutes. I ask away in other threads. If someone wants to get grumpy because they have seen the same question asked many times, and sigh when they see it again, then perhaps they need a break from AVS anyway!

What CD's are in Sibuna's surround speakers there in that pick? Those Volt's?
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Old 08-27-2014, 06:18 PM
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Do any of the open DRC's eq 8 channels like the HDMI on does?

I looked quickly but I looked like they were only 2 ch.
Yea, just two...I have one for my dual submersives. Recently remembered how it takes the noise out. I am thinking about adding a nanoavr in addition so I can EQ my speakers. I want to try and experiment with pulling the 2-4k region down a little and a little mid bass bump. Try and get a nice response like Brandon has. Can you post your graph again Beast? I want to save it for a target model. I would do a simple image search but I don't know how on the new AVS and have asked elsewhere only to get the silence treatment :/

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Old 08-27-2014, 06:28 PM
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Hey no worries There are no "self elected thread police" here Sometimes it's just easier to ask then search for several minutes. I ask away in other threads. If someone wants to get grumpy because they have seen the same question asked many times, and sigh when they see it again, then perhaps they need a break from AVS anyway!

What CD's are in Sibuna's surround speakers there in that pick? Those Volt's?
I don't know the specs on them, but he has tweaked them and they sound better. I seen them a few weeks ago. He put a nice stained finish on them. He was running them outside later in the evening with a T amp and cell phone for music. A little background music while the fellas were finishing up sub cutouts with the CNC.
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Old 08-27-2014, 07:32 PM
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Hey no worries There are no "self elected thread police" here Sometimes it's just easier to ask then search for several minutes. I ask away in other threads. If someone wants to get grumpy because they have seen the same question asked many times, and sigh when they see it again, then perhaps they need a break from AVS anyway!

What CD's are in Sibuna's surround speakers there in that pick? Those Volt's?
It is funny how different parts of AVS have such different personalities.
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