Official JTR speaker thread - Page 754 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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Old 08-29-2014, 09:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carp View Post
I prefer the L6 slope. I tweak all the time (hmmm that doesn't sound good haha) but here is what I am using at the moment:




However, the next album I went to that sounded a little "thick" so I switched to this. Notice I just changed the freq response knob.





Keep in mind, the controls on the left on the screen pics control both left and right speakers, I don't have to do the same to band 2 but I can if I want even more tweakability. I can do something like this where I boost the higher bass more with the left side and the lower bass with the right - remember, both eq's affect both left and right speakers. This is on the BP setting so now I have a Q knob to change the amount of frequencies affected.




Man I love the inuke dsp. It's complete control of the bass sound at an instant.



Before anyone says anything about my inputs being higher than the outputs (happens every time I post a inuke dsp screen shot), it doesn't matter. When I crank it up the output lights still come on before the inputs.
I think I need to use a Dynamic EQ instead. With the new boost it sounds great up to about -10 and then I think I need to bring the boost down 3-4 dbs. I will have to check out the manual to see how that works.
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Old 08-29-2014, 09:49 AM
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Hi
I am in the process of buying Triple 12LF LCRs and I was wondering whether I need to toe in these speakers or not. I currently have Canton Ergo 690 DC L/R and for those I have kept them without any toe in. I am trying to see for the JTRs what would be the ideal set up. Also, I have a 160" 2.37:1 wide AT screen and have the current speakers right at the edge of 16:9 image. Do I do the same with the 12LFs or I would need to keep them further wide. Any help in this is really appreciated.
Thanks
-Sen
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Old 08-29-2014, 10:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raynist View Post
I think I need to use a Dynamic EQ instead. With the new boost it sounds great up to about -10 and then I think I need to bring the boost down 3-4 dbs. I will have to check out the manual to see how that works.
To use the dynamic eq function all you need to do is use the "threshold" knob.




The lower the threshold number the lower the bass will be boosted as you increase the volume.
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Old 08-29-2014, 10:27 AM
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Originally Posted by popalock View Post
I forget, can you hook up the iNuke to your Network?
The one think I don't like about the inuke connection is that you have to connect through usb which would be ok, but you have to close the inuke software program and restart it every time the inuke is turned off and back on. Also, if you are using 2 inukes (which I am since one of them controls the crowson) you have to disconnect one inuke and plug in the other if you want to mess with the dsp in the inuke that isn't currently on the software on the computer.

I've tried going through "devices" and what not on the computer to see if there is any way to have both inukes connected at the same time through usb and easily go back and forth between them to make eq changes but I haven't found a way to do it, I don't think there is one.
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Old 08-29-2014, 10:48 AM
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Hi all! I’ll be putting in an order for 212HT LCRs next month and I’m still trying to figure out what to do about surrounds, I’d really appreciate if some of the experts in this thread could chime in.

First, a little bit about the HT: The 212s are for a carpeted room that measures approx. 20’ x 12’ with 10’ ceilings (around 3000 cu ft.) with one wall open to a hallway, stairs, and the rest of the upstairs area. The HT will be used for about 60% music (all kinds) and 40% movies. The plan is to get dual PSA XV30fse subs (since the room is narrow, I need subs that are more vertical) and eventually, room treatments.

Having read through a large chunk of this thread, I know the usual advice regarding surrounds is to go with Single/Slanted-8s. The main problem is that I’m putting most of my speaker budget into the LCRs, opting for the 212s over the 228s because the compression driver is supposed to be better for music (and while the Single-8 is an outstanding speaker by all accounts, it seems like it’d be a better match to the triple-8 or T-12’s). I’m trying to keep my surrounds budget at or under $500 per speaker. Here are some of the options I’m considering, along with Pros/Cons (please correct my assumptions if any are wrong):
  • Option A: JBL-Pro 8350 ($550)
  • Pros: Uses high-quality compression driver in horn config; super high sensitivity; high power handling; very closely matched to 212s
  • Cons: Huge size for a surround speaker (18” x 18”); pricey; pro-cinema speaker might not sound good in narrow 12’ room; not sure how JBL pros sound with music?
  • Option B: Klipsch RB-81 II ($400)
  • Pros: Smaller cabinet for more versatile placement; super high sensitivity; better WAF
  • Cons: Supposedly harsh highs?; musicality?; lower extension not really needed; not the best bang for the buck
  • Option C: Chane Theater Ten ($350)
  • Pros: Successor to the SHO-10; decent price
  • Cons: Unproven performance; controversy about it being a cheap Chinese PA speaker rebranded as a pro-cinema/audio speaker?
  • Option D: Hsu Research HB-1 MK2 ($200)
  • Pros: Best price; highest WAF; better for music?
  • Cons: Sensitivity 10 DBs lower than the 212s, might not be able to keep up?; too much of mismatch?
  • Option F???

So that’s where I’m at. I’m leaning most heavily towards option A or B. Can you advise on the best option (possibly one not mentioned here)? Maybe clear up any misconceptions? Thanks!
I saw your post while catching up on the thread....what speakers did you decide on?
I was going to recommend doing 228 for a great 5.x setup, since it's only a few hundred more than the S8. I've heard both 228 and 212...the 228 are great with music...especially considering your space. As everyone tends to realize, 'your ears will give up before they do.'

Here's the numbers (before any discounts):
5.1 = All 5 228HT = $6500
5.1 = LCR 228HT + 2 S8 = $5898
5.1 = LCR 212HT + 2 S8 = $8895

I think the $2400-$3000 you save by going with the 228 option will give you the best value and help in getting a pair of subs....like the Cap 2400. You can always add a pair of S8 for 7 channel setup later on as they do come up for sale...but you won't miss it when you have a solid 5 channel setup.

If music is a huge priority, another option is a pair of 210RT for LR and a 228 for center. I'm sure a pair of these will be great for 2-channel listening and not having to worry about needing any subs during music, and possibly even movies...depending on how much bass you want (you will want more as the itch grows stronger)

---------------------------------------------------------------
current gear: lcr JTR 212HT ~ quad JTR 8LP ~ dual JTR Orbit Shifters LFU ~ Elemental Designs eD6c ~ Marantz SR7008 ~ PT-AE8000U ~ Elite 176" 2.35 ATS

Last edited by asoofi1; 08-29-2014 at 10:52 AM.
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Old 08-29-2014, 10:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carp View Post
The one think I don't like about the inuke connection is that you have to connect through usb which would be ok, but you have to close the inuke software program and restart it every time the inuke is turned off and back on. Also, if you are using 2 inukes (which I am since one of them controls the crowson) you have to disconnect one inuke and plug in the other if you want to mess with the dsp in the inuke that isn't currently on the software on the computer.

I've tried going through "devices" and what not on the computer to see if there is any way to have both inukes connected at the same time through usb and easily go back and forth between them to make eq changes but I haven't found a way to do it, I don't think there is one.
This is definitely a work around but would likely work...you could setup a virtual machine using something like Virtual Box and then you might be able to have both running, one on each of your "machines". Then again, that might be more trouble than just switching the way you have been switching.
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Old 08-29-2014, 10:58 AM
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I thought you went with an Epson 8350? You need up with a BenQ W7000?
It's still not finalized (tonight hopefully!) But I was going through Archaeas's build thread and came across his Panny PJ review that had some not so good things to say about many problems with the 8350. Beast has a W7000 I am gonna pick up from him. He has a few good hrs on it so I know it works great. I wanted to go with the 8350 but after Archaea said him and Carp have had multiple problems it steered me away. Besides I can get the W7000 for a great price with glasses! I have never been a 3d guy but supposedly this one is top notch 3d so it may convert me It will do for awhile and I feel better about having a higher quality PJ.
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Old 08-29-2014, 12:42 PM
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Do we have any 210RT owners yet or anyone hear them that can share impressions?

---------------------------------------------------------------
current gear: lcr JTR 212HT ~ quad JTR 8LP ~ dual JTR Orbit Shifters LFU ~ Elemental Designs eD6c ~ Marantz SR7008 ~ PT-AE8000U ~ Elite 176" 2.35 ATS
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Old 08-29-2014, 01:05 PM
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Originally Posted by asoofi1 View Post
Do we have any 210RT owners yet or anyone hear them that can share impressions?
I'd also like to hear any reports of this model. I simply cannot fit 215s in my living room, and I feel 210's are a better fit for my room over 212's.
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Old 08-29-2014, 01:12 PM
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Hopefully.



Shame this didn't get to happen in your space @Gooddoc .
I could have easily made it happen, I just didn't think it was worth it.

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I would NOT be against that.
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I can do that
Bring it!
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Old 08-29-2014, 02:05 PM
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I could have easily made it happen, I just didn't think it was worth it.
Dyaaam! My curiosity is piqued ever so more.

---------------------------------------------------------------
current gear: lcr JTR 212HT ~ quad JTR 8LP ~ dual JTR Orbit Shifters LFU ~ Elemental Designs eD6c ~ Marantz SR7008 ~ PT-AE8000U ~ Elite 176" 2.35 ATS
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Old 08-29-2014, 02:19 PM
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Originally Posted by asoofi1 View Post
Do we have any 210RT owners yet or anyone hear them that can share impressions?
Jeff showed pictures on Facebook awhile back of someone taking delivery of 210's, but who that was is a mystery
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Old 08-29-2014, 03:21 PM
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Originally Posted by asoofi1 View Post
Dyaaam! My curiosity is piqued ever so more.
Ya, it's called "Master" for a reason.
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Old 08-29-2014, 04:01 PM
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Bring it!
Lets set a date. We bring equipment to you and set up a blind test for you? You feeling lucky?
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Old 08-29-2014, 05:44 PM
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Originally Posted by gskinusa View Post
Hi
I am in the process of buying Triple 12LF LCRs and I was wondering whether I need to toe in these speakers or not. I currently have Canton Ergo 690 DC L/R and for those I have kept them without any toe in. I am trying to see for the JTRs what would be the ideal set up. Also, I have a 160" 2.37:1 wide AT screen and have the current speakers right at the edge of 16:9 image. Do I do the same with the 12LFs or I would need to keep them further wide. Any help in this is really appreciated.
Thanks
-Sen
Hi Sen, that sounds like plenty of separation for the T12's and as far as toe in goes, I ran my T12's both ways and didn't notice much difference. With the coaxial compression driver they have a wide dispersion pattern and so toe in isn't necessary although it may be preferred.

Opinions are not facts.
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Old 08-29-2014, 06:32 PM
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Originally Posted by cmryan821 View Post
I'd also like to hear any reports of this model. I simply cannot fit 215s in my living room, and I feel 210's are a better fit for my room over 212's.
Don't forget about the 215RM as I really like that speaker too.
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Old 08-29-2014, 06:35 PM
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Hi Sen, that sounds like plenty of separation for the T12's and as far as toe in goes, I ran my T12's both ways and didn't notice much difference. With the coaxial compression driver they have a wide dispersion pattern and so toe in isn't necessary although it may be preferred.
Sounds like you have a real nice setup Sen, I haven't heard the T12 so can't speak to that but I concur with RMK! in terms of those coaxials having a wide dispersion, which means (especially if you don't toe-in) that you will likely need a well treated room to tame reflections. Just something to think about but based on your equipment you might already have this covered.
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Old 08-29-2014, 07:24 PM
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Originally Posted by asoofi1 View Post
I saw your post while catching up on the thread....what speakers did you decide on?
I was going to recommend doing 228 for a great 5.x setup, since it's only a few hundred more than the S8. I've heard both 228 and 212...the 228 are great with music...especially considering your space. As everyone tends to realize, 'your ears will give up before they do.'

Here's the numbers (before any discounts):
5.1 = All 5 228HT = $6500
5.1 = LCR 228HT + 2 S8 = $5898
5.1 = LCR 212HT + 2 S8 = $8895

I think the $2400-$3000 you save by going with the 228 option will give you the best value and help in getting a pair of subs....like the Cap 2400. You can always add a pair of S8 for 7 channel setup later on as they do come up for sale...but you won't miss it when you have a solid 5 channel setup.

If music is a huge priority, another option is a pair of 210RT for LR and a 228 for center. I'm sure a pair of these will be great for 2-channel listening and not having to worry about needing any subs during music, and possibly even movies...depending on how much bass you want (you will want more as the itch grows stronger)
I'm leaning towards Reaction Audio CX-10s/8s for surrounds. Still haven't pulled the trigger on anything yet.

I've been seriously considering the 210RT, especially since my room isn't huge and they'd be great for two channel music. I emailed Jeff about using the 228 as a center and he replied, "I'm actually about to introduce a Noesis 210RM (reference monitor) that has the horn in the center and is a perfect match for the Noesis 210RT." So I guess we'll wait and see.
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Old 08-29-2014, 07:26 PM
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Originally Posted by RMK! View Post
Hi Sen, that sounds like plenty of separation for the T12's and as far as toe in goes, I ran my T12's both ways and didn't notice much difference. With the coaxial compression driver they have a wide dispersion pattern and so toe in isn't necessary although it may be preferred.
Thank you for your response. So based on that I am interpreting that it should be ok to place the speakers where the current speakers are. I guess I will test the toe in and out to see what works. I did the calculation based on the JTR's dispersion angle of 70 degrees and as my first row is 11 ft from the speakers and the 2nd row is 17 ft, it came out that a slight toe in of 1.4 in would help to cover both the rows. Anyway calculations are one thing and the room reaction is another so I will test it and see. Thank you for your thoughts.

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Sounds like you have a real nice setup Sen, I haven't heard the T12 so can't speak to that but I concur with RMK! in terms of those coaxials having a wide dispersion, which means (especially if you don't toe-in) that you will likely need a well treated room to tame reflections. Just something to think about but based on your equipment you might already have this covered.
Thank you. I do have all the walls treated including the walls behind the speakers/screen. So it sounds like I should be ok but I will run it as suggested both with toe in and without and see which one works. The pain is that the screen is wall to wall so without someones help I cannot do it on my own . So need to get some help while doing it so can't work on it tonight.

Thanks again for the thoughts. I will report back if I have any problems.

BTW, I notice that the speaker terminals are little different. Can some one tell me to which posts I need to connect the - and + wires. Thanks again for the help.

-Sen
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Old 08-29-2014, 07:37 PM
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Originally Posted by RMK! View Post
Hi Sen, that sounds like plenty of separation for the T12's and as far as toe in goes, I ran my T12's both ways and didn't notice much difference. With the coaxial compression driver they have a wide dispersion pattern and so toe in isn't necessary although it may be preferred.
I have the T8's toed in quite a bit. I felt it was a significant difference compared to not much toe in. But it's all subjective
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Old 08-29-2014, 08:42 PM
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Wonder how the JTR slanted 8 would work as atmos speakers that sit on top of the mains and are angled to fire up and into the room?
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Old 08-29-2014, 08:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carp View Post
I prefer the L6 slope. I tweak all the time (hmmm that doesn't sound good haha) but here is what I am using at the moment:




However, the next album I went to that sounded a little "thick" so I switched to this. Notice I just changed the freq response knob.





Keep in mind, the controls on the left on the screen pics control both left and right speakers, I don't have to do the same to band 2 but I can if I want even more tweakability. I can do something like this where I boost the higher bass more with the left side and the lower bass with the right - remember, both eq's affect both left and right speakers. This is on the BP setting so now I have a Q knob to change the amount of frequencies affected.




Man I love the inuke dsp. It's complete control of the bass sound at an instant.



Before anyone says anything about my inputs being higher than the outputs (happens every time I post a inuke dsp screen shot), it doesn't matter. When I crank it up the output lights still come on before the inputs.

Is there a trick to getting a nice round number for the peq? I tried typing in a number but it doesn't work.

Also not sure what attack and release are. I am guessing the ratio changes the boost applied as volume goes up?

Last edited by raynist; 08-29-2014 at 09:21 PM.
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Old 08-29-2014, 09:32 PM
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Nice! I am looking to do the same with T8's.

Side note for all tonight. Greatest moment we can have in building our systems. Obviously I own a "lesser" system than most here. I would make the top 5 of weakest systems. But after we got our big screen and PJ up we watched Need for Speed tonight and I caught myself 100% immersed in the movie. I was like, "Dang! I didn't think about work tomm, bills, things I need to do, etc." Just totally immersed. I even forgot what day it was briefly with too! Happy days my friends All of this even happened coming from a decent plasma with deep blacks, like no visible letter box blacks. And we certainly had bright ones with this budget PJ.

Will get better with returning the BenQ 1070 and replacing with a BenQ W7000.
you are being humble though. At this level the room tuning means so much and I know you are in to that stuff. What might look slightly lesser from an equipment perspective could be way more with good room tuning. Glad you are enjoying to that level. That's what this is all about!
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Old 08-29-2014, 09:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Gorilla83 View Post
Lets set a date. We bring equipment to you and set up a blind test for you? You feeling lucky?
Haha! I'm not really a lucky guy . I'm all for a blind test though, that's for sure!

Remember though, speakers ain't amps

Now I really do want to continue ribbing everyone about the M2's , but I have to wait to get them in my room before I really get going , just in case they don't impress in my room like the demos did. I want to limit any potential backtracking, lol.

What I've heard so far is epic though. The clarity and realism is simply in another class from anything I have personally heard. Lots I haven't heard though, so take that with a grain of salt. And I've yet to hear them in my own room, so toss some more salt over your shoulder.

And that is the real kicker right there. Will they translate to my room? I took the leap because they are probably one of the few speakers out there that are designed to be custom tuned to most any room environment and I have yet to put a speaker in my room that didn't sound "reasonably" close to what I heard in other rooms. So I'm hopeful.
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Old 08-29-2014, 09:36 PM
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lol, it's all good, I know quite a few that have had good experiences as well. I think as far as processors go, I had the UMC-1 when it hit, it was sent back and forth 3 times, never was fixed, I lost out on shipping 3 times to them, almost 300$. My xpa-5 lost a channel, had a local service place fix it (that was actually pretty painless, emo paid for everything) My XPA-2 had the front panel go out and my airmotiv 6's had an amp go out, it never got changed, it went into the garbage. I never did like them lol.
So I've not had the best experience lol. I couldn't say how good or not the XMC-1 is, it's lacking hdmi 2.0 and thats enough of a no-go for me but thats not to say its the same for everyone as I plan on getting 4K everything pretty soon and would need it.
I totally get it. I posted about a new piece and wham my JTR brothers starting killing it! Lol. I have heard many have had bad experience with Emo. I hear even worse horror with Onkyo. I mean oink flap. All good bros just wish
me luck!
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Old 08-29-2014, 10:05 PM
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I hope it's bug free and everything works! They've had 6 years......

Blasting brown notes for 10 years and counting!

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Old 08-29-2014, 10:18 PM
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Old 08-29-2014, 10:24 PM
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Originally Posted by lbrown105 View Post
I totally get it. I posted about a new piece and wham my JTR brothers starting killing it! Lol. I have heard many have had bad experience with Emo. I hear even worse horror with Onkyo. I mean oink flap. All good bros just wish
me luck!
I wish you luck but wish we didn't have to think about needing luck when buying expensive equipment....doesn't seem right to me. But if it works out, it will be a really nice piece of gear...and I truly hope you enjoy it.
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Old 08-29-2014, 10:34 PM
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Haha! I'm not really a lucky guy . I'm all for a blind test though, that's for sure!

Remember though, speakers ain't amps

Now I really do want to continue ribbing everyone about the M2's , but I have to wait to get them in my room before I really get going , just in case they don't impress in my room like the demos did. I want to limit any potential backtracking, lol.
Whoa whoa whoa, went from supreme confidence to "just in case they don't impress in my room." Ha, we will limit your potential backtracking to this.....v
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I could have easily made it happen, I just didn't think it was worth it.
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Ya, it's called "Master" for a reason.
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What I've heard so far is epic though. The clarity and realism is simply in another class from anything I have personally heard. Lots I haven't heard though, so take that with a grain of salt. And I've yet to hear them in my own room, so toss some more salt over your shoulder.

And that is the real kicker right there. Will they translate to my room? I took the leap because they are probably one of the few speakers out there that are designed to be custom tuned to most any room environment and I have yet to put a speaker in my room that didn't sound "reasonably" close to what I heard in other rooms. So I'm hopeful.
Blind test is going to be a cool experience regardless. I actually think it's a great idea to blind test in your room vs. Andrews. We all remember what happened last time Andrew hosted a blind test... *Cough*Danley's*Cough*Cough*
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Old 08-29-2014, 10:47 PM
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Whoa whoa whoa, went from supreme confidence to "just in case they don't impress in my room." Ha, we will limit your potential backtracking to this.....v
Hehe, yes. I have more to answer for in PM's though



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Originally Posted by popalock View Post
Blind test is going to be a cool experience regardless. I actually think it's a great idea to blind test in your room vs. Andrews. We all remember what happened last time Andrew hosted a blind test... *Cough*Danley's*Cough*Cough*
Yep, liked the Danley's more than my beloved 212's! And that never changed when I got them in my own room .

But yes, a confirmation or denial of my impressions once they're in my room will be very cool. No better way than a blind test. But going to be very difficult in my room since I don't have a screen to hide them. I guess actual blindfolds will be on the menu.
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