Official JTR speaker thread - Page 778 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #23311 of 30452 Old 09-16-2014, 10:55 AM
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Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post
So you are getting that sweep from the center channel? How do the left and right look? If that is the combined 2 ch. response, try doing a solo left and solo right sweep. comb filtering can show up when sweeping multiple speakers the same time.
It was the left & right, individually. I'm using REW & Asio4All. How do you even do left+right sweeps in REW?


I have the center channel sitting on the floor at the moment, so that has its own issues. If I move the Triads out of the way, I can take care of that, and experiment with different L&R placement.
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post #23312 of 30452 Old 09-16-2014, 11:59 AM
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Originally Posted by rcohen View Post
It was the left & right, individually. I'm using REW & Asio4All. How do you even do left+right sweeps in REW?
Since you are using JRiver, you can use the Loopback and run REW through JRiver using JAVA output. Then use the Mix Channels DSP and copy the Left channel output to the Right channel. You can do Left + Sub, Center + Sub, Left + Right, or whatever combination you want.
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post #23313 of 30452 Old 09-16-2014, 12:10 PM
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Good news... I found out the D-Soinc I am getting is actually 2400 Watts X 3 channels @ 4 ohm.

Should be a hell of an amp.
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post #23314 of 30452 Old 09-16-2014, 12:24 PM
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Originally Posted by SOWK View Post
Good news... I found out the D-Soinc I am getting is actually 2400 Watts X 3 channels @ 4 ohm.

Should be a hell of an amp.
Hate to be the one to break it to you but Jeff has said you need a minimum of 2401 watts to wake these things up...as long as your room is less then 11x11 feet...then you should still be fine with only 2400 watts
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post #23315 of 30452 Old 09-16-2014, 12:27 PM
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I used this relay
http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B005T7...&robot_redir=1

Wire the trigger to the low voltage side and switch the hot leg of the outlet on the high voltage side. Done .
Thank you for this information....I will look into it.

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post #23316 of 30452 Old 09-16-2014, 12:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Frohlich View Post
Hate to be the one to break it to you but Jeff has said you need a minimum of 2401 watts to wake these things up...as long as your room is less then 11x11 feet...then you should still be fine with only 2400 watts
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!


HAHA. That would be funny!

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post #23317 of 30452 Old 09-16-2014, 12:46 PM
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We have really similar rooms, although mine is 13 feet wide and Iève got the 215s. You will have no issues at all man, I really dont understand why guys think just because the speaker is big, it needs some giant space to sound its best....
Thats simply not true. You will be rockin out and loving it!
That was something I struggled with prior to making the decision, meaning the room width, but in retrospect I don't know why I did. I did come around to your thought and said I'm gonna do it...my room may be small but it's not too small for 215's....and I feel comfortable with my decision.

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post #23318 of 30452 Old 09-16-2014, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by coolgeek View Post
You sound exactly like me prior to me buying the 212s. I was lurking on these forums literally for 5 years before finally deciding to buy the 212s when it first came up. Every speaker sounded like it was 'the best out there'.. and any decision you make would 'put a huge smile across your face' haha... it was truly hard to make a decision... I had to go thru lots of GTGs and reviews to finally settle on JTRs... they can't be beat in terms of value for money from their Noesis on, in my mind, extremely hard to beat in terms of SQ, and maybe impossible to beat in terms of Efficiency...

I think you're be a happy camper for a long time to come...
Thanks and I think I will be happy as well because I don't even want to consider the alternative...that would suck. But I can't imagine it would be that way and this is a blind buy as I've not attended any GTG's but everyone here can't be wrong....right?????

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post #23319 of 30452 Old 09-16-2014, 01:01 PM
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Originally Posted by rcohen View Post
It was the left & right, individually. I'm using REW & Asio4All. How do you even do left+right sweeps in REW?


I have the center channel sitting on the floor at the moment, so that has its own issues. If I move the Triads out of the way, I can take care of that, and experiment with different L&R placement.
Well, not in REW but you can in OM. I was curious as to why you might think the center is creating the 200hz drop though, but assume you meant sympathetic vibrations there?

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post #23320 of 30452 Old 09-16-2014, 05:44 PM
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Does anybody know where to get the Inuke dsp software. I cannot find it. My denning keeps shutting down with this amp!
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post #23321 of 30452 Old 09-16-2014, 06:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Reefdvr27 View Post
Does anybody know where to get the Inuke dsp software. I cannot find it. My denning keeps shutting down with this amp!
Click on the downloads and scroll down to the editor app software.
http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/NU6000DSP.aspx

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post #23322 of 30452 Old 09-16-2014, 06:51 PM
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Click on the downloads and scroll down to the editor app software.
http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/NU6000DSP.aspx
I got it thanks.

I just got everything hooked up and doing some preliminary testing with the 215's and dear lord do they have bass In my small room they are just insane. However my AVR keeps shutting down going into protect mode. It is shutting down at low volumes. I have no idea where to start as it has never shut down before. No clip lights on the amp, what gives?
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post #23323 of 30452 Old 09-16-2014, 06:54 PM
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I got it thanks.

I just got everything hooked up and doing some preliminary testing with the 215's and dear lord do they have bass In my small room they are just insane. However my AVR keeps shutting down going into protect mode. It is shutting down at low volumes. I have no idea where to start as it has never shut down before. No clip lights on the amp, what gives?
Do you mean no clip light on the Behringer? There's four front LEDS by the gain knobs, those are the clip lights. I'd be very surprised of you could get a inuke 6000 to clip powering the 215's. I have to push my subs to insane levels to get my clip light to flicker.
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post #23324 of 30452 Old 09-16-2014, 07:32 PM
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I'm using a 3000 for now. I just adjusted the watts. I also ran audyssey and fixed the mains to full range. Much better.
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post #23325 of 30452 Old 09-16-2014, 07:52 PM
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so I got the XMC-1 today and was able to hook up the LG10k. Of course I don't have much set up done yet or tuned in but what I can say is the set up has really low noise floor. Even with the LG at 35dB gain (I didn't even try other settings yet) the noise coming out of the 212's can be barely heard even when you ear is right up to the speaker! I think it was totally worth setting the dedicated power line for the amp. I am guessing on that gain setting reference is at about -20dB on the MV. Should be a fun weekend, in about 6hrs of REW work I think I will have it dialed in.

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post #23326 of 30452 Old 09-16-2014, 08:31 PM
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Originally Posted by desertdome View Post
Since you are using JRiver, you can use the Loopback and run REW through JRiver using JAVA output. Then use the Mix Channels DSP and copy the Left channel output to the Right channel. You can do Left + Sub, Center + Sub, Left + Right, or whatever combination you want.
Good to know. Thanks!
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post #23327 of 30452 Old 09-16-2014, 08:36 PM
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Well, not in REW but you can in OM. I was curious as to why you might think the center is creating the 200hz drop though, but assume you meant sympathetic vibrations there?
No, I didn't do much testing with the center.
When I get a chance, I'll run more experiments and grab a bunch of measurements.
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post #23328 of 30452 Old 09-16-2014, 10:45 PM
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Well hooked up the 215s tonight and it was kind of my first official night in my first real audio room and loved it. I sat and fiddled with the Inuke dsp for a while and some things I get and some I don't. One thing I am finding I am having a hard time finding a happy place. I know for sure Audyssey is out, I shut it off early as the 215's IMO do not sound good with Audyssey. It even tried to slip back on tonight. I had noticed that the system sounded awful and sure enough Audyssey reinstated itself.

I am really having a love hate relationship right now with the 215's. I had some music going and they sounded great, then I went back to a bass demo disc and then my center content was hard to hear and I just could not boost it. Then I went back to music and it sounded muffled? My wife came in for a minute and she said it sounded muffled. One thing I noticed is I am getting a really bad hiss from the amp, it is actually worse than hiss, it more like a fuzz. I have to get rid of the hiss, it is really bad. I like what I hear from the 215's, but I really need to find a middle ground. I gotta ways to go to getting this stuff tuned and still have a ton of work to do on the room. Be busy for quite a few more days.
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post #23329 of 30452 Old 09-17-2014, 04:51 AM
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Dumb question probably but wouldn't it far easier to set up a system with the 215RMs and separate subs and still get the same or maybe better audio quality? Would think it would be much easier to implement.
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post #23330 of 30452 Old 09-17-2014, 06:28 AM
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Dumb question probably but wouldn't it far easier to set up a system with the 215RMs and separate subs and still get the same or maybe better audio quality? Would think it would be much easier to implement.
Sure, but the idea of the 215RT is to run full range for music.
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post #23331 of 30452 Old 09-17-2014, 07:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Reefdvr27 View Post
Well hooked up the 215s tonight and it was kind of my first official night in my first real audio room and loved it. I sat and fiddled with the Inuke dsp for a while and some things I get and some I don't. One thing I am finding I am having a hard time finding a happy place. I know for sure Audyssey is out, I shut it off early as the 215's IMO do not sound good with Audyssey. It even tried to slip back on tonight. I had noticed that the system sounded awful and sure enough Audyssey reinstated itself.

I am really having a love hate relationship right now with the 215's. I had some music going and they sounded great, then I went back to a bass demo disc and then my center content was hard to hear and I just could not boost it. Then I went back to music and it sounded muffled? My wife came in for a minute and she said it sounded muffled. One thing I noticed is I am getting a really bad hiss from the amp, it is actually worse than hiss, it more like a fuzz. I have to get rid of the hiss, it is really bad. I like what I hear from the 215's, but I really need to find a middle ground. I gotta ways to go to getting this stuff tuned and still have a ton of work to do on the room. Be busy for quite a few more days.
Are you having a love hate with the 215's or parts of your signal chain? Going back to something that sounded good which now sounds awful sounds like some processing glitches. As far as the hiss see my post a couple back. A didcated line may be part of the equation. Its like a weakest link thing. Right now I am finding dedicated line on the LG is dead silent even at very high gain settings.

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post #23332 of 30452 Old 09-17-2014, 07:26 AM
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Good thing I ran 4 dedicated 20 AMP circuits just for my audio when I was building the theater.
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post #23333 of 30452 Old 09-17-2014, 07:38 AM
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with talk of all these 7-10K amps going around, my next theater will have its own power plant

People think I am crazy when I tell them I have 11500 watts in my room. You guys beat me with just one of your amps. Anyone ever calculate what it costs us to watch a movie, electricity wise ?

I used to keep telling myself it was cheaper to watch a movie at home then to goto theaters and pay for all that candy and popcorn. Stupid me, but I do know my feet dont stick to the floor and I never have someone 6'10" sitting in front of me. Still have all the noisy kids always talking during the movie, but as it turns out, they are mine
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post #23334 of 30452 Old 09-17-2014, 07:42 AM
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Originally Posted by lbrown105 View Post
Are you having a love hate with the 215's or parts of your signal chain? Going back to something that sounded good which now sounds awful sounds like some processing glitches. As far as the hiss see my post a couple back. A didcated line may be part of the equation. Its like a weakest link thing. Right now I am finding dedicated line on the LG is dead silent even at very high gain settings.
Yes, and that would be even more evident with the higher efficiency 212's.

I frankly don't understand how just running the 215's full range on an AVR gets it done. Although it's not rocket science, ideally (when using separates) the LFE is mixed into the left and right (or in my case LCR) channels post SSP and before the amp. In addition to the mixers, I'm using multiple LP and HP crossovers and PEQ to get the best results. Desertdome was able to accomplish the same via a rather complicated JRiver setup on my HTPC before SSP, but I found the Rane RPM88 much easier to use and understand due to the graphic display of the config with each of the modules adjustable in realtime.

I know that a discontinued $3K processor is not an ideal long term solution, but since I found mine on ebay for $400 it was a no brainer. I have said all along that the 215RT's are not for everyone but if you are a tweaker and have the tools, the full range results can be amazingly good.


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post #23335 of 30452 Old 09-17-2014, 07:48 AM
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with talk of all these 7-10K amps going around, my next theater will have its own power plant

People think I am crazy when I tell them I have 11500 watts in my room. You guys beat me with just one of your amps. Anyone ever calculate what it costs us to watch a movie, electricity wise ?

I used to keep telling myself it was cheaper to watch a movie at home then to goto theaters and pay for all that candy and popcorn. Stupid me, but I do know my feet dont stick to the floor and I never have someone 6'10" sitting in front of me. Still have all the noisy kids always talking during the movie, but as it turns out, they are mine
I would imagine that the extra power use during a movie with my little LG FP10000Q and the pair of Crowns running the surrounds and the Rane processor would equal approx $.10-.15 per film to run. At idle, it would be more but I shut it all down after each use so really it's pretty green ...

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post #23336 of 30452 Old 09-17-2014, 07:54 AM
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I still think Jeff is sand bagging with the 101 db sensitivity rating. The 212's measure so much higher than that compared to every speaker I've had in my room including 7 db's louder than the Danley sH50's and 11 db's louder than the 215's.
So true. I wonder what the actual efficiency of the 212s are? I have also compared to multiple speakers and it seems to be so much more efficient than the rated 101dB... if I had to guess, i would say closer to 106 dB

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Thanks and I think I will be happy as well because I don't even want to consider the alternative...that would suck. But I can't imagine it would be that way and this is a blind buy as I've not attended any GTG's but everyone here can't be wrong....right?????
Actually I bought mine blind as well. I just went thru the GTG threads and never actually attended any, though that would have been awesome.

So far, I haven't heard of anyone truly disappointed with their purchase of the 212s yet. Most were blown away...
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post #23337 of 30452 Old 09-17-2014, 08:23 AM
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Are you having a love hate with the 215's or parts of your signal chain? Going back to something that sounded good which now sounds awful sounds like some processing glitches. As far as the hiss see my post a couple back. A didcated line may be part of the equation. Its like a weakest link thing. Right now I am finding dedicated line on the LG is dead silent even at very high gain settings.
The hiss is really bad. This is the first time that I have really used an amp with dsp for mains, so I am learning here. I have 3 dedicated 20amp lines in place. A friend of mine is a licenced electrician. I am going to have him come back and add a couple of more. Had I really planned better, I would have done my entire electric build totally different, live and learn. My next house and build will be a whole different story. Would an good extension cord be OK to use for an amp? I have other 20amp dedicated lines I can reach, but would need a cord to get to them. Would a cord add noise?

As far as the love hate, I meant that as I am having a hard time in the chain getting them to sound really good. I still need treatments done, but still, I cannot get them dialed in at all. They just sound muffled and something is holding them back. Audyssey really made them sound like s***! Once I shut the audy off, they cleaned up really nice. With my 212's, they always sound good and even out of the box. This is a whole different animal. I have a lot to learn.
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I have no idea what would be causing your issues, Dave. The 215's mid an upper section is very similar. True most have said a little more laid back, but definitely not muffled. Perhaps try them out with absolutely ZERO dsp in the inuke and go from there. make sure there are no filters set in place that shouldn't be there. a LPF at 1.2khz can make anything sound pretty muffled

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post #23339 of 30452 Old 09-17-2014, 08:38 AM
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Quote:
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The hiss is really bad. This is the first time that I have really used an amp with dsp for mains, so I am learning here. I have 3 dedicated 20amp lines in place. A friend of mine is a licenced electrician. I am going to have him come back and add a couple of more. Had I really planned better, I would have done my entire electric build totally different, live and learn. My next house and build will be a whole different story. Would an good extension cord be OK to use for an amp? I have other 20amp dedicated lines I can reach, but would need a cord to get to them. Would a cord add noise?

As far as the love hate, I meant that as I am having a hard time in the chain getting them to sound really good. I still need treatments done, but still, I cannot get them dialed in at all. They just sound muffled and something is holding them back. Audyssey really made them sound like s***! Once I shut the audy off, they cleaned up really nice. With my 212's, they always sound good and even out of the box. This is a whole different animal. I have a lot to learn.

I have no hiss with lot's of connections in the signal chain.
Sorry but I can't remember your setup. You're using RCA's out of your AVR as the pre? How high is the gain on the 3000? Check cables and try lowering the gain.

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post #23340 of 30452 Old 09-17-2014, 08:45 AM
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Like others are saying, this doesn't sound like a speaker issue unless one or more drivers are actually damaged. As Beastaudio pointed out, the compression driver is the same so above 400HZ they should sound very similar (realizing it is a different cabinet and horn size). Can you hook up the 212s in that same room temporarlily so you can confirm or not confirm that it is the signal chain and not the speakers.
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215RT , 228ht , captivator , Jtr , Jtr Noesis 212ht 212ht Lp
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