Official JTR speaker thread - Page 864 - AVS Forum
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post #25891 of 25904 Old Yesterday, 08:50 PM
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Originally Posted by rhed View Post
Yes.. It's only signal. I have my 4 S2 's connected this way. Left LFE out daisy chain for 2. And right LFE out for the other 2.
So are you saying that you don't need a Y to run 2 S2's off of 1 sub output of a processor? You just run the sub out to 1 S2 and then connect the second S2 to the first?

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post #25892 of 25904 Old Yesterday, 09:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Nabs17 View Post
So are you saying that you don't need a Y to run 2 S2's off of 1 sub output of a processor? You just run the sub out to 1 S2 and then connect the second S2 to the first?
Yes.. You can even daisy chain to a OS, Submersive, or a Triax. As many subs you want. That has the same Speaker Power plate amp. It's just sending out the the same lfe signal from the source.
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post #25893 of 25904 Old Yesterday, 09:43 PM
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Originally Posted by newc33 View Post
Hey guys! I have spent the day listening to my new 228s (LCR). I obviously haven't had time to do a full review but I'll give u my initial impressions.

I've had a quiet a few items in the audio department in the last few years. Thanks to this web site and help/advice/ reviews/opinions from members i have been very happy with every purchase I made.

All I can say right off the bat is that this is the first purchase I have made that actually far exceeded my expectations. The 340s from ascend were awesome and I was impressed with them very much. They were everything I expected them to be. The fv15hps from rythmik were also amazing and everything I expected. Again with uxl Marty I made (which I don't believe I have fully dialed in and in exact phase with my fvs) great and everything I wanted it to be.

That is where the 228s are diffrent! Therese were the very first speakers I was just blown away by. They exceeded every expectation I had for them. The sound is Amazing.

When I first got involved with this hobby I had a certain undescibable sound sigtatur of my dream speakers. Let me tell you that I have found em. They absolutely are my favorite part of my system. They are great for music and for movies let me tell you I have never heard a speaker I like more. Simply amazing!
I'm glad your enjoying those 228's. Now, one advice, "STAY AWAY FROM THIS THREAD!" And enjoy!
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post #25894 of 25904 Old Yesterday, 10:00 PM
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Just want to thank Frohlich again for hosting, being such a great host, and lunch. All the people I've met through AVS have been great and Frohlich more than held up that tradition.

So let me start by saying Frohlich has a gorgeous home and his basement and theater room are really, really nice. He calls himself anal and I'm sure many of us have those traits but his attention to detail is exceptional.

From an acoustical stand point, Frohlich's room is a mess. He has some bass traps in 3 corners and a nice diffuser/absorption piece on his wall that looks like a piece of art. But his room is open on the front left and rear left. And his side surrounds (Triple 8s!!!) are in front of his very nice theater seats. And the rear surrounds (also Triple 8s!!!) are too far to the corners and real close to the seats. Of course I would have never brought these things up if his room didn't sound as nice as it does. He wanted some feedback and I simply said I really like the sound of your room. I was surprised it sounded as good as it did with the less than optimal layout. The surround effects were very good for any placement, much less where his surrounds were located. I don't know how much of that had to do with him having big boy Triple 8s as surrounds but the effect was very nice. The end result of his room is one that most of us would be fortunate to have.

We started off just listening to his system with a few movie clips and some music. As I said, I really liked his system. Well balanced with a nice house curve to the bass and good surround effects. Listening to his system reminded me how much I like the upper end and midrange of the 212s...really nice. This was also my first time hearing the JTR S2s and I was quite impressed with them. Quite a bit of output from 4 18" subs and they sounded very nice.

So let's get to some measurements. First we have the infamous sealed vs ported 212 results. These are direct from my RME FireFace UC preamp to his Parasound Halo amp.



And here is the Cat included in the previous measurement.


And then we have an interesting one. I've mentioned that the 215 sounds a little different from the 212 and I'm not sure why. Is it the wooden horn, the larger horn, smooth vs texture, crossover, I don't know? But Frohlich has a custom 228 with a wooden horn and the 212 compression driver. The wooden horn is smaller than the 212 and 215 horn but we thought this would be an interesting measurement none the less. I didn't have time to listen to his center by itself to determine my thoughts on its sound. In normal listening it didn't call attention to itself, it just fit right in with the rest of the sound system.


And here is one Frohlich wanted. He mentioned he had never had his room measured so I tried to talk him out of it but he insisted seeing the results. So here is his system put back together with Audyssey vs with it turned off. These measurements include the S2s...look at that nice, deep, output.


Again, it was great meeting you Frohlich and thank you very much for being such a great host.

David
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post #25895 of 25904 Old Yesterday, 10:08 PM
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Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post
Did you guys try and boost either the 212 or the 212LP to see if you could compensate for the difference and/or see what you could really get out of them on the bottom end?
No. We didn't have the time. Would have been interesting but either way you look at it, the sealed would be down on output compared to the ported.

But Archaea would be pleased to know I now have the Behringer UltraGraph Pro FBQ3102 equalizer he recommended. We just didn't have time to throw it in the signal chain.
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post #25896 of 25904 Old Yesterday, 10:42 PM
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So it looks like the 212HT has the 6db more of midbass like mentioned.
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post #25897 of 25904 Old Yesterday, 10:47 PM
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I received my 3 rosewood 212HT's today. Until I get an AT screen two of them will be L/R mains in my living room. First off, this are huge and beautiful!!! They were a handful getting into my house, I wish I had help. The boxes were stacked in my van and I tried to take one out and carry it into the house on my shoulder, big mistake!!! Almost dropped it as I didn't have it balanced and pulled a few muscles eying not to drop it. Bear hugged the them in the rest of the way. They are much easier to move out of the boxes.

Anyways, hooked up two of them in my living room and ran audussey on my Denon 4520. It set the L/R to -12, subs to -11 and surrounds to -3 and -7. I am guessing -12 is the lowest it can set them to, how can I get these in range? They are probably only 12 feet from the MLP.

They do sound great!!
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post #25898 of 25904 Old Yesterday, 11:31 PM
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Originally Posted by raynist View Post
I received my 3 rosewood 212HT's today. Until I get an AT screen two of them will be L/R mains in my living room. First off, this are huge and beautiful!!! They were a handful getting into my house, I wish I had help. The boxes were stacked in my van and I tried to take one out and carry it into the house on my shoulder, big mistake!!! Almost dropped it as I didn't have it balanced and pulled a few muscles eying not to drop it. Bear hugged the them in the rest of the way. They are much easier to move out of the boxes.

Anyways, hooked up two of them in my living room and ran audussey on my Denon 4520. It set the L/R to -12, subs to -11 and surrounds to -3 and -7. I am guessing -12 is the lowest it can set them to, how can I get these in range? They are probably only 12 feet from the MLP.

They do sound great!!
Congrats Raynist! Sorry about the muscles. I think I almost had a hernia carrying the denser Cat12s by myself. I don't think there is any airspace in the Cat enclosure, the drivers push against lead.

Here is what I think a lot of people buy, line-level attenuators.
http://www.parts-express.com/harriso...-pair--266-244
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post #25899 of 25904 Old Yesterday, 11:35 PM
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Originally Posted by dgage View Post
Congrats Raynist! Sorry about the muscles. I think I almost had a hernia carrying the denser Cat12s by myself. I don't think there is any airspace in the Cat enclosure, the drivers push against lead.

Here is what I think a lot of people buy, line-level attenuators.
http://www.parts-express.com/harriso...-pair--266-244
I am running off of the Denon 4520 receiver and using the built in amps, can I still use these?
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post #25900 of 25904 Old Today, 03:43 AM
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Originally Posted by dgage View Post
Congrats Raynist! Sorry about the muscles. I think I almost had a hernia carrying the denser Cat12s by myself. I don't think there is any airspace in the Cat enclosure, the drivers push against lead.

Here is what I think a lot of people buy, line-level attenuators.
http://www.parts-express.com/harriso...-pair--266-244
Speaking of line-level attenuators, I've had the best results by using them to do the initial speaker calibration, then remove them, and offsetting the speaker levels to compensate while preserving the channel differences.

I have 10db attenuators.
When I removed them, I had to subtract 10db from my LCR levels to compensate, but I ran in to my pre-amp's -12db floor.
In order to preserve the channel differences, I had to add 6db to all channels.
This means that when my pre-amp volume is set to 0db, it's actually 6db above reference.

I found that this yielded much better dynamics than leaving the 10db attenuators in-line, but the attenuators were still necessary in order for the auto-calibration to work properly.

My theory is that leaving the attenuators in-line was causing something in my chain to clip or compress.
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post #25901 of 25904 Old Today, 03:51 AM
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Originally Posted by newc33 View Post
Hey guys! I have spent the day listening to my new 228s (LCR). I obviously haven't had time to do a full review but I'll give u my initial impressions.

I've had a quiet a few items in the audio department in the last few years. Thanks to this web site and help/advice/ reviews/opinions from members i have been very happy with every purchase I made.

All I can say right off the bat is that this is the first purchase I have made that actually far exceeded my expectations. The 340s from ascend were awesome and I was impressed with them very much. They were everything I expected them to be. The fv15hps from rythmik were also amazing and everything I expected. Again with uxl Marty I made (which I don't believe I have fully dialed in and in exact phase with my fvs) great and everything I wanted it to be.

That is where the 228s are diffrent! Therese were the very first speakers I was just blown away by. They exceeded every expectation I had for them. The sound is Amazing.

When I first got involved with this hobby I had a certain undescibable sound sigtatur of my dream speakers. Let me tell you that I have found em. They absolutely are my favorite part of my system. They are great for music and for movies let me tell you I have never heard a speaker I like more. Simply amazing!
Congrats and welcome to the club... i love seeing how everyone's got a big smile on their faces when they first hear their JTR speakers. I was literally grinning like a mad monkey when i first heard mine.

BTW: My mom asked me if i had anymore 'Action Packed' movies today. Recently she watched 'Into the Storm' with me at Reference (first time) with my OS turned on. She was really excited and even asked if the storms were real or not. I must say, watching that movie at reference (with JTR speakers) feels like you're really in the tornadoes.

Anyways, tonight we'll be watching Automata.. not sure if it's going to be any good.

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post #25902 of 25904 Old Today, 06:37 AM
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Originally Posted by rcohen View Post
Speaking of line-level attenuators, I've had the best results by using them to do the initial speaker calibration, then remove them, and offsetting the speaker levels to compensate while preserving the channel differences.

I have 10db attenuators.
When I removed them, I had to subtract 10db from my LCR levels to compensate, but I ran in to my pre-amp's -12db floor.
In order to preserve the channel differences, I had to add 6db to all channels.
This means that when my pre-amp volume is set to 0db, it's actually 6db above reference.

I found that this yielded much better dynamics than leaving the 10db attenuators in-line, but the attenuators were still necessary in order for the auto-calibration to work properly.

My theory is that leaving the attenuators in-line was causing something in my chain to clip or compress.
The line attenuators will not work since i am powering these with a receiver though right or am I missing something?
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post #25903 of 25904 Old Today, 06:43 AM
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Originally Posted by raynist View Post
The line attenuators will not work since i am powering these with a receiver though right or am I missing something?
That's right.

You could use a REW or a sound meter (even one in a phone app) to measure and match your levels. Hopefully, the built-in calibration will still work fine for time alignment. It might be a problem for room correction.

Or you could buy an external amp. IMO, that would still have benefits for dynamics, even with the great efficiency of the 212s, but some would find that debatable.
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post #25904 of 25904 Old Today, 06:48 AM
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Anyways, tonight we'll be watching Automata.. not sure if it's going to be any good.
It's so-so. Pretty slow, but good ending.
I liked The Machine better.
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post #25905 of 25904 Old Today, 07:35 AM
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That's right.

You could use a REW or a sound meter (even one in a phone app) to measure and match your levels. Hopefully, the built-in calibration will still work fine for time alignment. It might be a problem for room correction.

Or you could buy an external amp. IMO, that would still have benefits for dynamics, even with the great efficiency of the 212s, but some would find that debatable.
This is only a temp setup until I can move them ink my main theater area in a few months. There they will be run on inukes. I think the problem is they are so efficient and I am sitting only 10 feet from them. I notice in the back of my 4520 receiver that there are ore outs and external in's for every channel. I am wondering if I can use the pre outs into an attenuator and then back in? Maybe a question for the 4520 thread. I am also going to read the manual!!
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