Official JTR speaker thread - Page 916 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #27451 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 08:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lbrown105 View Post
Has anybody posted impressions of the 2015 212HT vs previous version yet?
Coach and I were surprised by the difference between the 215RM and 212HT-LP on the upper end when we compared the two (crossed at 80). I hope there is little/no difference between the wooden and aluminum horns but I wouldn't automatically assume they are the same with some subtle improvements.
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post #27452 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 08:15 AM
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Originally Posted by newc33 View Post
hey guys sorry for being off topic but you have all been very helpful with so much i tend to ask random things on this thread lol

so i set up and ran audyssey on my new x4100. i really like what it did with the speakers but I'm not happy with the EQ on the LFE channel. i can EQ my subs better myself with spl meter and test tones. is there any way to turn off the sub EQ?

if not would it work to tell audyssey that I'm not using subs then when finish calibration i just switch everything to 80hz x over and EQ my subs from there?

What measurement procedure did you use?

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current gear: lcr JTR 212HT ~ quad JTR 8LP ~ dual JTR Orbit Shifters LFU ~ Elemental Designs eD6c ~ Marantz SR7008 ~ PT-AE8000U ~ Elite 176" 2.35 ATS
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post #27453 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 08:26 AM
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test tones and spl. i only measured lfe.

7.3 w/ denon x4100
JTR noesis 228s LCR
Ascend acoustics cmt 340se side ss.
ascend acoustics cbm170se rear ss
Dual rythmik fv15hps/ 1 LV12r
Verticle Marty/UXL 18 powered with inuke 6kw DSP (and another Marty in the making)
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post #27454 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 08:38 AM
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Originally Posted by newc33 View Post
hey guys sorry for being off topic but you have all been very helpful with so much i tend to ask random things on this thread lol

so i set up and ran audyssey on my new x4100. i really like what it did with the speakers but I'm not happy with the EQ on the LFE channel. i can EQ my subs better myself with spl meter and test tones. is there any way to turn off the sub EQ?

if not would it work to tell audyssey that I'm not using subs then when finish calibration i just switch everything to 80hz x over and EQ my subs from there?
Nope. As soon as you go to engage the subs, the unit will basically force a recalibration if you want to use audyssey. Kinda stink, but is what it is. You would be able to run things fine with audyssey off, but that isn't what you were wanting. Perhaps see what audyssey did to the mains that makes it more pleasing to your ear, and try and recreate that in the graphic EQ. It is much more rudimentary, but might get you close.

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post #27455 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 08:51 AM
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Originally Posted by newc33 View Post
test tones and spl. i only measured lfe.

The Audyssey procedure....how many points of measurement and what were the locations?

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post #27456 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 08:52 AM
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thanks best. well i didn't buy this receiver for the audyssey and with my situation i really didn't expect it to EQ my subs to my liking. i mean 3 subs and only 2 the same. anyway i think its time for me to get some kind of external EQ and learn either REW or buy the calibrated omni mic.

one thing ill say that i didn't expect right off the bat is that my picture i noticeable more clear and detailed. i wonder if the 4k upscaler is more advanced in this. even the colors are better.

im loving the sound everywhere except the LFE and 7 channels is more of an improvement then i ever thought it could be. very immersive.

also if i turn audyssey off do i have to re calibrate the speakers to 75db and will the actual levels change? i ask because when i go to the audyssey screen it tells me all my initial calibration setting but when i just go to speaker setting and tweak things it always stays the same (so the initial ausyssey and current audio settings are different) does that make sense?

7.3 w/ denon x4100
JTR noesis 228s LCR
Ascend acoustics cmt 340se side ss.
ascend acoustics cbm170se rear ss
Dual rythmik fv15hps/ 1 LV12r
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post #27457 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 09:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RMK! View Post
Amen to that brother. The Triple 12's are great speakers and I for one was sad to see them go. The Triple 12's and a good subwoofer system gives you all anyone needs except the most needy amongst us. The grass is always greener.

People who post about big differences ("significant upgrade") with these high efficiency/output designs have an agenda or, are delusional ...

I know I have a dissenting opinion on this BUT I never heard the 12's, just the 888's. I thought the difference when it came to music was worth every penny between the 888's and the 212's. It wasn't that I didn't like the 888's but I wouldn't constantly feel the urge to listen to 2 channel music with them either. Maybe I would have thought the same if it was the 888's vs the triple 12's?
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post #27458 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 09:22 AM
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Just remember the internal test tone on the unit is a PRE audyssey test tone, so using it to calibrate to 75dB if planning to keep audyssey engaged will likely not be accurate if there is significant correction done. You would need an external disc to do accurate spl readings with a post-audyssey tone.

Not sure what you are getting at with the second part. Audyssey stores its distance and level values in the speaker setup menu, so tweaking those will alter the audyssey results. Not a problem really, I do it after every time I run audyssey to get my crossovers right and such.

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post #27459 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 09:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carp View Post
I know I have a dissenting opinion on this BUT I never heard the 12's, just the 888's. I thought the difference when it came to music was worth every penny between the 888's and the 212's. It wasn't that I didn't like the 888's but I wouldn't constantly feel the urge to listen to 2 channel music with them either. Maybe I would have thought the same if it was the 888's vs the triple 12's?
T8 and 212 are completely different speakers while the T12 and 212 share the same cabinet and 2 x 12" woofers. They are identical from 400hz down so that has a lot do with why they sound so similar.

Here is a picture of the 212HT beside the T12
https://onedrive.live.com/redir.aspx...HAFVzYJIUoE6WU

Submersive HP on the left and a commode with the seat up on the right.
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Last edited by countryWV; 02-06-2015 at 10:18 AM.
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post #27460 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 09:34 AM
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okay just for the heck of it i completely disables audyssey for now. the speakers sound great still without the EQ and just manually EQed the the subs with test tones from another source and spl meter.

then i went back and just played the test tones on the receiver and everything is set at 75 and subs 85.

now do i have to go back and re do all my distances? or does that not go away when aud. is off?

sorry for all the questions.. its my first real receiver lol

7.3 w/ denon x4100
JTR noesis 228s LCR
Ascend acoustics cmt 340se side ss.
ascend acoustics cbm170se rear ss
Dual rythmik fv15hps/ 1 LV12r
Verticle Marty/UXL 18 powered with inuke 6kw DSP (and another Marty in the making)
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post #27461 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 09:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by newc33 View Post
okay just for the heck of it i completely disables audyssey for now. the speakers sound great still without the EQ and just manually EQed the the subs with test tones from another source and spl meter.

then i went back and just played the test tones on the receiver and everything is set at 75 and subs 85.

now do i have to go back and re do all my distances? or does that not go away when aud. is off?

sorry for all the questions.. its my first real receiver lol
To properly use Audyssey as it's designed and intended, it needs multiple (8 minimum) points of measurements once you have placed your speakers and each time you move them. Then you can adjust bass hot to your taste.

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current gear: lcr JTR 212HT ~ quad JTR 8LP ~ dual JTR Orbit Shifters LFU ~ Elemental Designs eD6c ~ Marantz SR7008 ~ PT-AE8000U ~ Elite 176" 2.35 ATS
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post #27462 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 10:16 AM
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Originally Posted by rhed View Post
You mean to say you guys couldn't tell any audio difference between the Krell and the Crest? Will he bring he's Krell over to your place for the 215 demo? If so, I'd want to hear your impression on a high end amp vs a pro amp on the 215's.
Yup, they sounded identical as far as we could tell. He won't be bringing his Krells over, they are 100lbs each lol
I've already had 2 X Mac MC601s on the 215's. They are my brother in laws. They sounded the same as my D-Sonic. They are extremely nice amps but sooooo over priced IMO.

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post #27463 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 10:22 AM
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Originally Posted by asoofi1 View Post
To properly use Audyssey as it's designed and intended, it needs multiple (8 minimum) points of measurements once you have placed your speakers and each time you move them. Then you can adjust bass hot to your taste.
right i understand that. its not that i needed more bass just wasn't happy with how it was EQed (i solved the low bass problem from my earlier posts) it was EQed with a steady 15db slope form 80hz-20hz

7.3 w/ denon x4100
JTR noesis 228s LCR
Ascend acoustics cmt 340se side ss.
ascend acoustics cbm170se rear ss
Dual rythmik fv15hps/ 1 LV12r
Verticle Marty/UXL 18 powered with inuke 6kw DSP (and another Marty in the making)
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post #27464 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 11:08 AM
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Originally Posted by newc33 View Post
okay just for the heck of it i completely disables audyssey for now. the speakers sound great still without the EQ and just manually EQed the the subs with test tones from another source and spl meter.

then i went back and just played the test tones on the receiver and everything is set at 75 and subs 85.

now do i have to go back and re do all my distances? or does that not go away when aud. is off?

sorry for all the questions.. its my first real receiver lol
distances will remain intact. No worries there

(European models do not accept banana plugs.)


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post #27465 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 11:25 AM
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cool thanks beast!

7.3 w/ denon x4100
JTR noesis 228s LCR
Ascend acoustics cmt 340se side ss.
ascend acoustics cbm170se rear ss
Dual rythmik fv15hps/ 1 LV12r
Verticle Marty/UXL 18 powered with inuke 6kw DSP (and another Marty in the making)
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post #27466 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 12:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by newc33 View Post
okay just for the heck of it i completely disables audyssey for now. the speakers sound great still without the EQ and just manually EQed the the subs with test tones from another source and spl meter.

then i went back and just played the test tones on the receiver and everything is set at 75 and subs 85.

now do i have to go back and re do all my distances? or does that not go away when aud. is off?

sorry for all the questions.. its my first real receiver lol
I use to use Audyssey for movies or bypass L/R until I got the 215's. Audyssey just hacks the bass off the 215's. Full range and Audyssey are a bad combination.
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post #27467 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 01:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Reefdvr27 View Post
I use to use Audyssey for movies or bypass L/R until I got the 215's. Audyssey just hacks the bass off the 215's. Full range and Audyssey are a bad combination.
ya I'm just gona leave it off for now and learn REW so i can do my eq myself. everything still sounds great and the subs are now EQed flat with my test tones and spl meter.

7.3 w/ denon x4100
JTR noesis 228s LCR
Ascend acoustics cmt 340se side ss.
ascend acoustics cbm170se rear ss
Dual rythmik fv15hps/ 1 LV12r
Verticle Marty/UXL 18 powered with inuke 6kw DSP (and another Marty in the making)
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post #27468 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 01:35 PM
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If all you didn't like about audyssey was the bass level, simply just boost it. You might have to boost it specific to each input, but that works too... Most people boost the sub after EQ to get back to their happy place.

(European models do not accept banana plugs.)


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post #27469 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 01:47 PM
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I've found that my system sounds better when I EQ myself instead of the speakers. A sip here and a puff there produces much better results then tweaking the subwoofers.
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post #27470 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 02:11 PM
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Who here has moved from Triple 12 to 212HT?
I'm aware of RMK! doing so. Anyone else?
Thoughts?

I'm not in the market - but this is a nice value and having heard the triple 12 before, I know these are worth the asking price. Unfortunately, I never heard the 212HT compared to the Triple 12 side by side.
JTR Triple 12 LCR set

"Without subs it's just background music - with subs it's the main event!"
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post #27471 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 02:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post
If all you didn't like about audyssey was the bass level, simply just boost it. You might have to boost it specific to each input, but that works too... Most people boost the sub after EQ to get back to their happy place.
well i got the level to 85db but after that i just didn't like how it EQed. its s steady slope/rolloff of 15dbs from 80hz to 20.

maybe it has more to do with how my inuke was set while calibrating. i did leave the butter worth 18 on and HPF. but i disabled all EQ

7.3 w/ denon x4100
JTR noesis 228s LCR
Ascend acoustics cmt 340se side ss.
ascend acoustics cbm170se rear ss
Dual rythmik fv15hps/ 1 LV12r
Verticle Marty/UXL 18 powered with inuke 6kw DSP (and another Marty in the making)
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post #27472 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 02:15 PM
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also do i have to use all 8 points when running it? i used 6

7.3 w/ denon x4100
JTR noesis 228s LCR
Ascend acoustics cmt 340se side ss.
ascend acoustics cbm170se rear ss
Dual rythmik fv15hps/ 1 LV12r
Verticle Marty/UXL 18 powered with inuke 6kw DSP (and another Marty in the making)
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post #27473 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 03:10 PM
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and what settings should i have my inuke on to start with before audyssey

7.3 w/ denon x4100
JTR noesis 228s LCR
Ascend acoustics cmt 340se side ss.
ascend acoustics cbm170se rear ss
Dual rythmik fv15hps/ 1 LV12r
Verticle Marty/UXL 18 powered with inuke 6kw DSP (and another Marty in the making)
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post #27474 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 03:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archaea View Post
Who here has moved from Triple 12 to 212HT?
I'm aware of RMK! doing so. Anyone else?
Thoughts?

I'm not in the market - but this is a nice value and having heard the triple 12 before, I know these are worth the asking price. Unfortunately, I never heard the 212HT compared to the Triple 12 side by side.
JTR Triple 12 LCR set
I know that Coach did as I bought his T12's when he moved to the 212's. He has told me (and I think posted here) that he couldn't tell a huge difference. I have 888's for side surrounds but listened to them in 2 channel for a bit and the 12's are better at everything. For the $$$ I paid I feel it's one of the biggest bargains I've scored on in this hobby.
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post #27475 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 03:46 PM
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Chris from WV made that switch too - triple 12's to 212's.
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post #27476 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 03:56 PM
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Quote:
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Chris from WV made that switch too - triple 12's to 212's.
I sold my surrounds so I will be getting another 212HT for center and use the T12s as surrounds till I figure out my next move.
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post #27477 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 04:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archaea View Post
Who here has moved from Triple 12 to 212HT?
I'm aware of RMK! doing so. Anyone else?
Thoughts?

I'm not in the market - but this is a nice value and having heard the triple 12 before, I know these are worth the asking price. Unfortunately, I never heard the 212HT compared to the Triple 12 side by side.
JTR Triple 12 LCR set
I cannot say that I understand the sale. He is selling the Triple12's to build the 1099's
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post #27478 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 05:10 PM
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okay guys i made some headway.

first i level matched my subs. fv15hps as one and marty as the other.

then i took all PEQ off of the fvs and started with a completely clear amp for the marty.

after calibration i took measurements and got about the same thing.

i went to the inuke and set the HPF for 20 and butter worth 18. still the same so i started trying other ls6 buterworth 6,12,24, 48.
all of those gave me different frequency response at all different freqs. ultimalty i ended up with butterworth 48. I'm happy to say that i have some of the best response iv ever had. not perfect but really good.

Im now +/-6 from 90-15hz. actually 70db is my low point. 80 is my high. 84db at 80 and 78 at 70. if you take that 70hz out of the equation I'm +/-3.5 from 90-15.

THIS IS WHERE IT GETS WEIRD!!!

for some reason now when i EQ it has completely random effects. for instance the only way for me to boost 70hz 3 db was to take 7 away from 80hz... what the hell?!?! the other thing is that it had no effect on 80hz. FIRST TIME IV EVER SEEN THIS!

anyway if someone could explain whats going on that would be awesome. if i could do a lithe EQ i could have almost perfect response

7.3 w/ denon x4100
JTR noesis 228s LCR
Ascend acoustics cmt 340se side ss.
ascend acoustics cbm170se rear ss
Dual rythmik fv15hps/ 1 LV12r
Verticle Marty/UXL 18 powered with inuke 6kw DSP (and another Marty in the making)
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post #27479 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 06:43 PM
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Possibly phase/distance settings.

"Without subs it's just background music - with subs it's the main event!"
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2011 KC Sub Shootout
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post #27480 of 31063 Old 02-06-2015, 06:50 PM
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I went from the t12s to the 212s. I got the second set of 212s sent out. Nothing to drastic in terms of sq differences.

Blasting brown notes for 10 years and counting!

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