Such thing as high-end on-walls? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 20 Old 11-22-2009, 11:13 PM - Thread Starter
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So, I've got a 50" plasma coming my way to replace my CRT behemoth, and I'm strongly thinking of installing on-wall speakers across the front in order to reduce clutter. However, I'm concerned about sacrificing sound quality.

My electronics are relatively high-end: I use a Krell Showcase pre-pro, a Primare five-channel amp, and a Cambridge Audio CD player. I currently have three Monitor Audio RS1s across the front, and would like a definite step up in terms of sound quality.

I'm just having the damndest time trying to find a relatively small solution with top-notch sound quality. The budget for the L/C/R is about $3k. I was looking at the Artison Masterpieces.

Any suggestions? I have zero familiarity with on-wall speakers...

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post #2 of 20 Old 11-22-2009, 11:27 PM
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Check out the Paradigm Cinema 330's and then Atlantic Technology FS-3200LR.
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post #3 of 20 Old 11-23-2009, 01:55 AM
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Take a look at Triad On Wall Gold Minimonitors and ERA PL 24s.
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post #4 of 20 Old 11-23-2009, 06:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gchanjam View Post

Take a look at Triad On Wall Gold Minimonitors and ERA PL 24s.

Because the Triad OnWall Gold MiniMonitor is $2,150 each, they may kill your budget. The OnWall Bronze LCR is $900 each, more sensitive, and made for use with a subwoofer.

There are quite a few decent onwall fronts, including Artison. The smaller onwalls tend to not have much response under 200 Hz, though, regardless of their claimed spec.

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post #5 of 20 Old 11-23-2009, 07:48 AM
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Vienna Acoustics Waltz Grand and the Webern's are very nice and they will fit your budget. You could also look at Leon Speakers and the Artisons.
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post #6 of 20 Old 11-23-2009, 11:33 AM
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I agree with Vienna Acoustics, but I am not familiar with Webern. Dali is very good, too.

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post #7 of 20 Old 11-23-2009, 11:55 AM
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Paradigm Studio Esprit
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post #8 of 20 Old 11-23-2009, 11:56 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by win200 View Post


I currently have three Monitor Audio RS1s across the front, and would like a definite step up in terms of sound quality.

I'm just having the damndest time trying to find a relatively small solution with top-notch sound quality. The budget for the L/C/R is about $3k. I was looking at the Artison Masterpieces.

Any suggestions? I have zero familiarity with on-wall speakers...

Revel has on-walls. M10, C10, etc.
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post #9 of 20 Old 11-23-2009, 02:28 PM
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post #10 of 20 Old 11-23-2009, 02:30 PM
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Ditto on the Paradigm Studio's
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post #11 of 20 Old 11-23-2009, 02:51 PM
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check out www.sunfire.com and their Cinema Ribbon series of speakers... the 2's will come in well under your budget and the 3's should be right there at it. I've installed a couple of the CRM-2's and they are an amazing speaker for the size... I'm looking to do a system here soon with the CRS-3's...

While I don't currently have a room worthy of these speakers (IMHO) I have been using Sunfire subs for years now... I love the sound, quality of build, etc of their products...
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post #12 of 20 Old 11-23-2009, 03:01 PM
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All great suggestions...Paradigm, Revel, and Totem.

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post #13 of 20 Old 11-23-2009, 03:08 PM
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M&K or MKSound S-150 THX Ultra's or MPS Professional Series, Klipsch THX Ultra.
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post #14 of 20 Old 11-23-2009, 04:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for all the feedback; I frankly wasn't aware that brands as prestigious as Revel, Totem, etc. made on-walls.

A final question... the other option I was consider was to go B&W across the front, with a pair of 805s's and an HTM4s. Would that setup simply blow any of the on-walls out of the water?

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post #15 of 20 Old 11-23-2009, 04:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by win200 View Post

Thanks for all the feedback; I frankly wasn't aware that brands as prestigious as Revel, Totem, etc. made on-walls.

Include in that list Triad and Atlantic Technology, and you have a better list.

Quote:
Originally Posted by win200 View Post

A final question... the other option I was consider was to go B&W across the front, with a pair of 805s's and an HTM4s. Would that setup simply blow any of the on-walls out of the water?

IMO, that depends more on setup than anything else. Will you be using a subwoofer? If so, will you use Bass Management? Will you have acoustic treatments in the room? Where will you mount the CC?

All of these factors, and others, will affect the final sound quality. A less expensive system, set up properly, can sound better than a more expensive system set up badly. I have no doubt that any of the on-walls from the above named makers can sound every bit as good as the floorstanders from B&W... if they are SET UP PROPERLY. That would entail using a subwoofer, using proper Bass Management, installing proper acoustic treatments and mounting the (identical) CC at the same level as the L/R's, and not in some "entertainment center" 8" off the floor.

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post #16 of 20 Old 11-23-2009, 04:58 PM - Thread Starter
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I do have a subwoofer, but a fairly mediocre 8" one made by Acoustic Energy. I've never thought much of it.

I've never really known what is meant by "bass management"; I use the multi-channel analog outputs from my blu-ray player, and I've configured the speakers to "small" in the player. My Krell pre-pro just passes through the signal to my Primare amp.

If I went with on-walls, the speakers would be mounted directly next to/below the TV. If I went the B&W route, the speakers would sit on a console directly below the television, a couple of feet off the floor.

There will be no treatment panels, for wife-related reasons.

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post #17 of 20 Old 11-23-2009, 05:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by win200 View Post

I do have a subwoofer, but a fairly mediocre 8" one made by Acoustic Energy. I've never thought much of it.

A subwoofer upgrade should be considered before a speaker upgrade, IMO.

Quote:
Originally Posted by win200 View Post

I've never really known what is meant by "bass management"; I use the multi-channel analog outputs from my blu-ray player, and I've configured the speakers to "small" in the player. My Krell pre-pro just passes through the signal to my Primare amp.

Bass Management means re-directing all the bass below the crossover point from all the speakers set to "small" to the subwoofer. All that re-directed bass is combined with the bass in the LFE channel, (the ".1" channel), and sent to the subwoofer output. Get a good subwoofer and Bass Management makes a *lot* of sense.

You didn't list a BluRay player in your OP, just a Cambridge CD player. Does your BD player have more than one crossover point? If the player can do adequate BM, you don't need it in your pre/pro. However, most BD players don't have extensive BM capabilities.

Quote:
Originally Posted by win200 View Post

If I went with on-walls, the speakers would be mounted directly next to/below the TV. If I went the B&W route, the speakers would sit on a console directly below the television, a couple of feet off the floor.

Those B&W speakers are designed to be stand mounted with space around them. Putting them on a "console", will affect their sound. How much I can't predict.

Quote:
Originally Posted by win200 View Post

There will be no treatment panels, for wife-related reasons.

Check out this High WAF Acoutic Treatments thread:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1047573
If you want *real* audiophile sound, acoustic treatments are MANDATORY IMO. Of course, some "audiophiles" spend mega-$$$ on speaker cables, interconnects, power cords and other "snake oil" when what they really need to do is fix the acoustics of their rooms.

Craig

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Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence."

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post #18 of 20 Old 11-24-2009, 09:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by win200 View Post


A final question... the other option I was consider was to go B&W across the front, with a pair of 805s's and an HTM4s. Would that setup simply blow any of the on-walls out of the water?

That depends a lot on your personal taste.

For example you could get a Martin Logan "Passage" wall speaker $800 x 3. It would be more techinically accurate, but not as warm. (cones + esl tweeter)

The B&W's have a slightly bumped mid range with a wider soundstage than any flat panel. You do get an increased bass bump because you are placing it close to the wall.

No matter how you cut it, I would go with a seperate subwoofer. These products really don't cut it below ~100->160 Hz

I'm not familiar how forward, or laid back your primare amps are. So this is really up to you.

Speaker design is rather an art. There is no such thing as the perfect painting. Likewise there is no such thing as a perfect speaker. It's part science and part personal preference.
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post #19 of 20 Old 11-24-2009, 04:41 PM
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Paradigm has in-wall speakers in their high-end Signature line.
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post #20 of 20 Old 11-24-2009, 08:39 PM
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Definitive Mythos 10s are easy on your budget.
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