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post #451 of 491 Old 02-14-2014, 05:27 AM
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So I've been reading up quite a bit on the Pioneer speakers and they tend to get really great reviews. Does anyone know whether those speakers would be a "jump up" from the Bic Venturi line? Most of the comparison threads I've read on a few different sites and posts say that the Pioneer line wins hands down, and that they actually are superior to many speakers 3-4x the price. Any thoughts?
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post #452 of 491 Old 02-21-2014, 06:09 AM
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So I've been reading up quite a bit on the Pioneer speakers and they tend to get really great reviews. Does anyone know whether those speakers would be a "jump up" from the Bic Venturi line? Most of the comparison threads I've read on a few different sites and posts say that the Pioneer line wins hands down, and that they actually are superior to many speakers 3-4x the price. Any thoughts?

And sorry for the double post!
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post #453 of 491 Old 03-05-2014, 07:46 AM
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I would say the pioneers are better quality speakers overall. I cant comment on the quality of the components, but they are better balanced speakers. The one area that the BIC's have the advantage is sensitivity. They play much louder with less power, where the pioneers take a bit more power to get loud.

Thats really as much as I can comment.
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post #454 of 491 Old 03-09-2014, 01:18 PM
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Is the narrow-band frequency response (Hz ~100~10,000) of the DV62si analogous to that of the V52?
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post #455 of 491 Old 03-13-2014, 08:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave1027 View Post

Here it is. This is a frequency response comparison of the BIC DV62si. I have three configurations. First is the way it comes stock from BIC. Next is with Ed Frias's mod. Last is my mod. This isn't the exact frequency response of the speaker because it also reflects the response of the microphone I used and my PC sound card. It is however a valid comparison between the three because the exact same conditions apply to all of them. The only thing that changed was the components of the crossover.


Is "dB" the measurement unit of the y-axis of those graphs?

If so, why are the y-axis marker values negative? What are they relative to?
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post #456 of 491 Old 03-13-2014, 08:40 AM
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Looks like I'm the first sucker to jump on the D62-3LCRs.

They look nice...nice low profile. I'll give further impressions once I get the other two in...
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post #457 of 491 Old 03-13-2014, 06:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dom Di Stroia View Post

Is "dB" the measurement unit of the y-axis of those graphs?

If so, why are the y-axis marker values negative? What are they relative to?
It's the way the software I used at the time displayed it. I'd assume the values are relative to each other.

More important is the fact that this measure gif is 4 years old and is not really valid any more because my mod has seen a few revisions since then that make it even better. I also devised an acoustic damping mod for better bass response.
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post #458 of 491 Old 03-15-2014, 03:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Dave1027 View Post

It's the way the software I used at the time displayed it. I'd assume the values are relative to each other.

More important is the fact that this measure gif is 4 years old and is not really valid any more because my mod has seen a few revisions since then that make it even better. I also devised an acoustic damping mod for better bass response.

What type of acoustic damping are you referring to?

Doesn't acoustic damping reduce bass response?
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post #459 of 491 Old 03-15-2014, 08:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dom Di Stroia View Post

What type of acoustic damping are you referring to?

Doesn't acoustic damping reduce bass response?

Proper damping of the cabinet lowers the resonant frequency and increases the effective size of the box. More importantly in this case, it tames the boom. The crossover mod tilts the response toward the bass but the side effect of that was more boom necessitating the damping mod.
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post #460 of 491 Old 03-15-2014, 09:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Dave1027 View Post

Proper damping of the cabinet lowers the resonant frequency and increases the effective size of the box. More importantly in this case, it tames the boom. The crossover mod tilts the response toward the bass but the side effect of that was more boom necessitating the damping mod.

What method/materials are you using to dampen the speaker cabinet?

Presumably, the crossovers in my Venturi V52's, manufactured in America circa 1992, are superior to the "foreign" crossovers of today. I use a digital equalizer to lower the bass drop-off (rated at Hz ~55~60), but I may be experiencing some of the "boom" that you are referring to.
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post #461 of 491 Old 03-15-2014, 09:32 AM
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Your V52s are not the same as the DV62si. It's smaller and uses different drivers. Also the DV62si has nice binding posts. The V52 only has push in spring clips.
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post #462 of 491 Old 03-21-2014, 09:13 AM
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Looking for specs for the Venturi V10 passive subwoofer - particularly the RMS and peak input power.

If you have them, could you post or attached the specs in your reply?

Thanks in advance.
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post #463 of 491 Old 03-21-2014, 12:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paxxus View Post

Looking for specs for the Venturi V10 passive subwoofer - particularly the RMS and peak input power.

If you have them, could you post or attached the specs in your reply?

Thanks in advance.

Just to clarify, I assume you are looking for an amp to drive the passive sub, and want to know the max RMS and peak power ratings?
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post #464 of 491 Old 03-21-2014, 03:16 PM
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I actually have the amp. I'm looking to pick up a used BIC Venturi V10 sub and want to be sure my amp has enough output for the sub.

Thanks for checking.
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post #465 of 491 Old 04-07-2014, 10:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ricerocket View Post

Looks like I'm the first sucker to jump on the D62-3LCRs.



They look nice...nice low profile. I'll give further impressions once I get the other two in...

 



How do you like the D62-3LCR speakers???

Anyone else who has or has heard these speakers can also chime in... I'm looking for a comparison between them and the BIC FH6-LCR speakers. Which is preferred for a mainly HT Blu-Ray Movie setup. Looking at doing 7 of either of these speakers with 2 ID subs for a 7.2 setup.

Shawn
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post #466 of 491 Old 04-07-2014, 12:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paxxus View Post

I actually have the amp. I'm looking to pick up a used BIC Venturi V10 sub and want to be sure my amp has enough output for the sub.

Thanks for checking.

I took a quick look and couldnt find much on the V10 sub. Which amp do you have? Also, how much are you looking to spend and where are you located. There may be better options in the price point you are looking at for a powered sub.
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post #467 of 491 Old 04-24-2014, 07:27 AM
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I'm looking to upgrade, and I'm hoping to get some reassurance (or perhaps the opposite) regarding what I've settled on so far. Some background:

I currently have a 7.1 setup using Monoprice's cheaper 5.1 package (minus the sub), a pair of their 8" bookshelf speakers on the floor (angled back a bit with custom wood arches on the front; think poor man's Klipsch Heresy), and a BIC F-12 subwoofer. It's been good enough for how little I paid for it, but I am just not happy with it anymore :-D. My surrounds and center, being tinny 3-inchers, definitely do not reach down to my preferred crossover of 80Hz, and the 8" mains have a big dip in the 90-100Hz range and are generally muddy and overly directional. I'm hoping to upgrade my surrounds and center channel to something that can get down to 80Hz, and I'd like mains that are more even and extend down enough for stereo listening without a sub (but they don't have to have huge bass).

My room is a little odd: it's about 13'x16'x9' (WxDxH), but one of the rear corners is cut into the room like there used to be a fireplace in the corner, and there is a large doorway at the back. Right now, I have my back surrounds and my projector mounted above that doorway, and so I need surrounds that can be mounted high and angled into the listening area. I like what BIC America has to offer, and their prices are right. I love my F-12 sub, and I like the idea of having everything the same brand (though I know it doesn't really matter). I've looked at a lot of brands and models, but I've settled on the following from BIC as perfect for my room:

DV62s for front L/R on 16" stands (so they are up near ear level while still under my pull-down screen)
Adatto DV52s for the 4 surrounds (mounted upside-down about a foot from the ceiling)
DV52 center to match the surrounds (I don't want something as huge as the DV62 center, and I'm trying to be cheap)

What I'd mainly love to hear is whether the Adatto DV52s can play down to 80Hz well enough for me to set that as my crossover. Since they're surrounds, they don't have to have big impact in the low end, but I'd like to know they're reproducing down that far. If anyone who has had these mounted upside down near the ceiling could chime in about how they sound in that configuration, I'd appreciate it. From everything I've found, it seems like this should be a perfect configuration for my room. I can get all these for $350-400, and I'd hate to spend any more than that (I actually can't spend anything at the moment ;-)). I'll be powering them all with a Yamaha RX-V667.

Thanks for any feedback!
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post #468 of 491 Old 04-25-2014, 12:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flickhtguru View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by ricerocket View Post

Looks like I'm the first sucker to jump on the D62-3LCRs.



They look nice...nice low profile. I'll give further impressions once I get the other two in...

 



How do you like the D62-3LCR speakers???

Anyone else who has or has heard these speakers can also chime in... I'm looking for a comparison between them and the BIC FH6-LCR speakers. Which is preferred for a mainly HT Blu-Ray Movie setup. Looking at doing 7 of either of these speakers with 2 ID subs for a 7.2 setup.

So I bought three D62-LCRs and the HTD flat panel speakers at the same time so I can do A/B comparisons.

After a week and lots of banana plugging and unplugging, I ended up keeping the HTDs and returning the BICs, even though the BICs are $100 cheaper.

The BICs could extend a little deeper (as they should w/ dual 6.5"s vs dual 4"s), but nothing that I couldn't EQ to bring them on equal footing above 80 Hz (at least at my listening levels), and fill in the rest w/ the sub. They don't go to 49 Hz, maybe like 70 Hz, as the front ports are pathetically small. The main reason I didn't keep them though is sitting off axis hurts performance really bad w/ the BICs while the HTDs were much less sensitive to listening position and filled the space much better. There's something weird going on w/ the crossovers on the BICs I think, and now that I think it further, this is their first 3-way speaker so I shouldn't have been surprised given the "history" w/ the DV62CLR-S. Perhaps it has mod potential, but I don't have the patience for that myself.

If you're using this for movies only, and never sit more than a handful of degrees off-axis, they'd probably be okay after some EQing, but the HTDs could match the BICs there, on axis and off, and also be better musically as well. Perhaps at much high SPLs, the BICs would outperform it due to having much more cone area, but again I don't listen at super high volumes (nor do I have a dedicated amp to push them that hard).
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post #469 of 491 Old 05-08-2014, 06:29 PM
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I just replaced my old receiver with a Yamaha RX-V775. There is much less sibilance and I am much happier with the sound of these speakers (DV64s and DV62 CLRs), especially with music. Still, sometimes the highs are a little harsh. When I had my old receiver, I had no doubt I would be sending off the crossovers to Ed Frias for his mod. Now, I'm a little conflicted. For those that have had the Ed Frias mod done, would you do it again (especially for the DV64s)?

Samsung PN50C7000
Yamaha RX-V775WA
BIC Venturi DV64 Towers
BIC Venturi DV62 CLRs Center

Still building but sounds amazing so far
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post #470 of 491 Old 05-08-2014, 06:45 PM
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Did you run YPAO on the config and try the different profiles available? I have a pair of DV84s, no center, an RX-V673, and it sounds great across the board. I think you might also be able to tweak the YPAO EQ manually, though I haven't tried on mine.
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post #471 of 491 Old 05-08-2014, 06:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rhodesj View Post

Did you run YPAO on the config and try the different profiles available? I have a pair of DV84s, no center, an RX-V673, and it sounds great across the board. I think you might also be able to tweak the YPAO EQ manually, though I haven't tried on mine.

Yes, I ran YPAO. It brought the upper mid range out a little more, but did not really tone down the highs. As for tweaking the EQ, I tried and failed miserably....

I am happy with the towers. There is a nice, raw sound that makes the instruments seem like they are being played in your room. Still, I can't help but be curious how the modified crossovers will make the speakers sound.

Samsung PN50C7000
Yamaha RX-V775WA
BIC Venturi DV64 Towers
BIC Venturi DV62 CLRs Center

Still building but sounds amazing so far
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post #472 of 491 Old 05-12-2014, 08:31 PM
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I keep forgetting that when the sibilance is at its worst, I have some kind of 3D processing engaged (i.e. 7 channel audio with only the front three speakers are hooked up will cause some kind of simulated 7 channel audio through processing) which seems to exaggerate it significantly. Some amount of sibilance is absolutely natural too in every day speaking (and I'm hearing it more now in conversations because I find I am listening for it), and then the recording can make it even more noticeable.

I am extremely impressed by the raw, organic sound coming from this setup and definitely do not want to screw that up. Drums, electric and acoustical guitars, bass guitars, and just about everything sounds pretty much like it should. Almost like you are in the recording studio. Definitely an awesome speaker for an awesome price. I am surprised there aren't more speakers with passive radiators as I think they really help with the definition and volume of the bass.

Samsung PN50C7000
Yamaha RX-V775WA
BIC Venturi DV64 Towers
BIC Venturi DV62 CLRs Center

Still building but sounds amazing so far
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post #473 of 491 Old 06-03-2014, 06:03 PM
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First off I want say I have read through most of this thread and I have learned a lot. I currently have a Pioneer receiver  , cerwin vega 120s for mains, pioneer center and recently added monoprice 4929s for the rears. I need to update the mains because they are rated at 4ohms. I am afraid it will damage the receiver with time. I am looking at the Bic line but I am not sure what to go with because there is no where to go listen to the speakers for a test. So I would like to ask do I go with dv84s or dv64s? I am definitely going to get the DV6CLR-S for the center. The monoprice rear speakers sound awesome and were a great deal.  photo3.JPG 1,428k .JPG file  

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post #474 of 491 Old 06-03-2014, 06:07 PM
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First off I want say I have read through most of this thread and I have learned a lot. I currently have a Pioneer receiver  , cerwin vega 120s for mains, pioneer center and recently added monoprice 4929s for the rears. I need to update the mains because they are rated at 4ohms. I am afraid it will damage the receiver with time. I am looking at the Bic line but I am not sure what to go with because there is no where to go listen to the speakers for a test. So I would like to ask do I go with dv84s or dv64s? I am definitely going to get the DV6CLR-S for the center. The monoprice rear speakers sound awesome and were a great deal.  photo3.JPG 1428k .JPG file  
If you are looking for matching speakers I have the center and bookshelves on Amazon cheap.
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post #475 of 491 Old 06-03-2014, 06:11 PM
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Here is a picture of the tv area. I just recently installed ceiling speakers. A lot of work to fish wires through to the attic but the result turned out awesome.

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post #476 of 491 Old 06-05-2014, 01:07 PM
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For anyone considering buying the DV84S I just ordered a pair of Dv84s from Sears. They are on sale at 137.99 each with free shipping right now. I used some points I had from there rewards program so I got 2 for $271.31 shipped .

 

 

 

 

http://www.sears.com/bic-america-8inch-2-way-250-watt-tower/p-05794628000P?prdNo=1&blockNo=1&blockType=G1

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post #477 of 491 Old 06-19-2014, 02:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ricerocket View Post
Looks like I'm the first sucker to jump on the D62-3LCRs.

They look nice...nice low profile. I'll give further impressions once I get the other two in...
I've been using the D62-3LCR as my center for a little over a month and it's really starting to shine. The midrange helps tremendously and I'm hearing details that I never heard before with my old tSc RC1 center, which all things considered, was a hell of a speaker for $50. I paired mine with DV-64 towers and couldn't be happier.
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post #478 of 491 Old 06-26-2014, 08:43 PM
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Originally Posted by butie120 View Post
So I've been reading up quite a bit on the Pioneer speakers and they tend to get really great reviews. Does anyone know whether those speakers would be a "jump up" from the Bic Venturi line? Most of the comparison threads I've read on a few different sites and posts say that the Pioneer line wins hands down, and that they actually are superior to many speakers 3-4x the price. Any thoughts?

Quote:
Originally Posted by kgallerie View Post
I would say the pioneers are better quality speakers overall. I cant comment on the quality of the components, but they are better balanced speakers. The one area that the BIC's have the advantage is sensitivity. They play much louder with less power, where the pioneers take a bit more power to get loud.

Thats really as much as I can comment.
I know this is an old post, but I would like to weigh in on the "magic" Pioneer VS BIC debate. This debate is weighed in on quite heavily by people that have not only HAVE NOT heard both speakers........but given "expert" opinion by people that have not heard either speaker! I have critically listened to both, and live with one.

I needed a MTM setup for a very live room and listened to the Pioneer SP-C22 center with every correction, including digital restoration. I could not find a way to make those tweeters sound lively or dynamic. No matter what I did, they seemed to protest with a "compressed" sound. The high frequencies could be boosted, but I was rewarded with louder compressed sound...... Sorry, I just don't have a better way to describe it. It was sort of that classic "audiophile" dead tweeter sound. It did not require A/B testing with anything to know that these speakers would not offer the sparkle or shimmer that I enjoy. The midrange clarity and focus were good (audiophile?). Bass was lacking and sensitivity was fairly low. You will notice that the internet mods offered for these not only address some crossover issues, but also completely replaces the tweeters.

So I went with BIC Venturi DV62CLR-S. The first thing you notice with this speaker is the extremely "lively" yet delicate and quick highs. There IS quite a bit of sibilance and forwardness that is quite easily dealt with with with cut at 10k and some cut at 1k. This is a really good speaker. Exciting to the point of binge listening to all of my old crap and seeking out new genres that I never cared about.

Keep in mind that both speakers were center channel "MTM" designs. The Pioneer was lacking a bit more in the bass department, and would be better suited for a dorm size room. The BIC is better suited to living rooms of an average size.
Both speakers need to be canted toward the listener because of off-axis roll off.
Both speakers are cheesy looking in their own way, yet not offensive. The BIC looks more "manly" despite the odd gray color....but the question in my mind: Why is every speaker a different cabinet design? They don't look like they belong together except for the strange color. Pioneer looks more like they are designed to work as a "system"
Both speakers need foam damping material added to reduce higher frequencies from the ports when placed near a wall. Polyfill won't do here....memory foam works best in the BIC.

So if you are the "more midrange please" audiophile type with a small to medium room, the Pioneer may be your baby. Everything else is BIC territory. The BIC can be tamed to produce a more laid back sound, but the Pioneer cannot be boosted to sound lively or "airy" Both of these speakers perform well in spite of the manufacturing shortcuts. A testament to good driver selection. I don't feel that either of these necessarily punch above their weight class as much as someone is finally giving us our moneys worth!

My final statement is......If you have a large living room or open floorplan, go straight for the BIC FormulaFH6-LCR
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post #479 of 491 Old 06-27-2014, 06:27 AM
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Quote:
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I know this is an old post, but I would like to weigh in on the "magic" Pioneer VS BIC debate. This debate is weighed in on quite heavily by people that have not only HAVE NOT heard both speakers........but given "expert" opinion by people that have not heard either speaker! I have critically listened to both, and live with one.

I needed a MTM setup for a very live room and listened to the Pioneer SP-C22 center with every correction, including digital restoration. I could not find a way to make those tweeters sound lively or dynamic. No matter what I did, they seemed to protest with a "compressed" sound. The high frequencies could be boosted, but I was rewarded with louder compressed sound...... Sorry, I just don't have a better way to describe it. It was sort of that classic "audiophile" dead tweeter sound. It did not require A/B testing with anything to know that these speakers would not offer the sparkle or shimmer that I enjoy. The midrange clarity and focus were good (audiophile?). Bass was lacking and sensitivity was fairly low. You will notice that the internet mods offered for these not only address some crossover issues, but also completely replaces the tweeters.

So I went with BIC Venturi DV62CLR-S. The first thing you notice with this speaker is the extremely "lively" yet delicate and quick highs. There IS quite a bit of sibilance and forwardness that is quite easily dealt with with with cut at 10k and some cut at 1k. This is a really good speaker. Exciting to the point of binge listening to all of my old crap and seeking out new genres that I never cared about.

Keep in mind that both speakers were center channel "MTM" designs. The Pioneer was lacking a bit more in the bass department, and would be better suited for a dorm size room. The BIC is better suited to living rooms of an average size.
Both speakers need to be canted toward the listener because of off-axis roll off.
Both speakers are cheesy looking in their own way, yet not offensive. The BIC looks more "manly" despite the odd gray color....but the question in my mind: Why is every speaker a different cabinet design? They don't look like they belong together except for the strange color. Pioneer looks more like they are designed to work as a "system"
Both speakers need foam damping material added to reduce higher frequencies from the ports when placed near a wall. Polyfill won't do here....memory foam works best in the BIC.

So if you are the "more midrange please" audiophile type with a small to medium room, the Pioneer may be your baby. Everything else is BIC territory. The BIC can be tamed to produce a more laid back sound, but the Pioneer cannot be boosted to sound lively or "airy" Both of these speakers perform well in spite of the manufacturing shortcuts. A testament to good driver selection. I don't feel that either of these necessarily punch above their weight class as much as someone is finally giving us our moneys worth!

My final statement is......If you have a large living room or open floorplan, go straight for the BIC FormulaFH6-LCR
I ended up going with the Pioneers over the Bics, and I can say it wasn't an easy decision. I did like the Bics. I don't have the option for the A/B testing so it was more of a "hold the speaker wire up to the terminal on one, take a listen, then put it on the other, etc etc...".

What I ended up finding, especially on the towers (FS-52 vs DV-64) is that the Pioneer had better clarity and less muddiness. It was just more clear. I don't need the bass per se considering I cross everything over at 90hz.
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post #480 of 491 Old 06-27-2014, 08:02 AM
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Originally Posted by butie120 View Post
I ended up going with the Pioneers over the Bics, and I can say it wasn't an easy decision. I did like the Bics. I don't have the option for the A/B testing so it was more of a "hold the speaker wire up to the terminal on one, take a listen, then put it on the other, etc etc...".

What I ended up finding, especially on the towers (FS-52 vs DV-64) is that the Pioneer had better clarity and less muddiness. It was just more clear. I don't need the bass per se considering I cross everything over at 90hz.
I completely agree with that call. I had a similar issue with the BIC DV62clr-s. Once I put some real damping material in there it became a whole new speaker. The box resonance could be heard through the driver cones and ports as a "bloom", or "bucket" sound. The BIC seems to be more prone to midbass getting through the venturi (short) ports.

I will state this for clarity of my first hand experience. BIC puts a tiny little piece of fiber sheet in there that is almost insulting....... not even a tiny handful. I cannot imagine what justifies having the extra product and step to install it on a production floor for something that is this ineffective.
Fiberfill and the commercially available eggcrate foam is pretty much a waste of time for this purpose. The softest open cell foam (latex or memory) you can find works wonders. Once this is done, the speaker becomes quite stunning. It is amazing how a speaker this good out of the gate can be improved so much with so little effort.

I cannot say with certainty that this would work as well with the DV-64, but it has the same woofers as mine, so I will extrapolate that mean it is reasonable to expect some improvement.......to some degree(less or more).
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Bic Venturi , Bic Venturi Subwoofer V1020 , Bic Venturi Subwoofer V1220 , Bic Venturi Dv32 Speaker , Awm Bic Venturi Bookshelf Speakers
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