Longmont Man Indicted On Suspicion of Charity Fraud - Page 19 - AVS Forum
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Speakers > Longmont Man Indicted On Suspicion of Charity Fraud
Chu Gai's Avatar Chu Gai 09:13 AM 03-06-2010
I won't comment on your post Chacruz other than to say, if you, as a supplier of products to Mark Schifter's company are typical of many who have dealt with him in a business capacity, then it is quite likely that you are on the hook for considerable amounts of money. I can offer you my condolences. I can also offer you information which may be of personal use to you in determinnig where you stand. If you PM me, perhaps I can be of assistance and the matter will stay off the public radar. You've got nothing to lose and information to gain. Hope to hear from you.
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goneten's Avatar goneten 09:51 AM 03-06-2010
Apologies to Santiago. The 'mobster' comments were not to be taken literally. Just like the pets roaming around the factory scratching the MFW-15 cabinets, that, too, was not to be taken literally.

Schifter not having the ability to download an anti-virus program, however, is to be taken literally.

Regards,
penngray's Avatar penngray 10:09 AM 03-06-2010
The AV123 sales emails are still being sent....

"ELT 5.0, 7.0 Sale… It’s not too late!"

Not too late for what ??? Im sure they have stock to move still. Im hoping for a serious fire sale at some point.
goneten's Avatar goneten 10:23 AM 03-06-2010
If they sell their A-stock MFW-15's for $99, I might jump at that opportunity. Might.

Regards,
penngray's Avatar penngray 10:33 AM 03-06-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by goneten View Post

If they sell their A-stock MFW-15's for $99, I might jump at that opportunity. Might.

Regards,

hehe....
Heck, I would buy it for $300 shipped!! The amp and woofer alone would be worth that. The box isnt bad either.
goneten's Avatar goneten 10:42 AM 03-06-2010
The only reason why I say $99 for the sub is because the shipping will cost +-$600 when all is said and done. On second thought, I think I'll pass.

Regards,
RMK!'s Avatar RMK! 11:00 AM 03-06-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chu Gai View Post

I won't comment on your post Chacruz other than to say, if you, as a supplier of products to Mark Schifter's company are typical of many who have dealt with him in a business capacity, then it is quite likely that you are on the hook for considerable amounts of money. I can offer you my condolences. I can also offer you information which may be of personal use to you in determinnig where you stand. If you PM me, perhaps I can be of assistance and the matter will stay off the public radar. You've got nothing to lose and information to gain. Hope to hear from you.

What a noble gesture. First, your selfless devotion to truth and justice and now, the helping hand extended to the victims of this horrendous crime spree. When I think of the many hours/days you must have spent in pursuit of MLS with no real vested interest I am both amazed and perplexed. A cynic might say that you are a sad little man with no life who yearns for attention. But I believe that you are the real deal, a comic book like hero who wants only to put evil doers in their place and help make restitution to the wronged.

How freaking noble is that?
goneten's Avatar goneten 11:04 AM 03-06-2010
Hey RMK,

How is your system doing ?

Regards,
Glashub's Avatar Glashub 12:29 PM 03-06-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by chacruz View Post

Hello from Cali, Colombia.
Sad beyond words when reading this, I have to confess.
I've been and will be out of the public discussions related to Mark and AV123 situation.
My only purpose today is to ask you guys a favor: Please have some respect for myself, my family and the tradition of 76 years of hard work.
Two more favors actually:
1.- If some of you are strong believers of the classic stereotype of a Colombian and think that any company here has to be run by a "mobster", it is of course your privilege and there is nothing I can do about it. But please don't use my name even close to those words. You can't imagine how dangerous and potentially harmful is to have your personal name or that of your company associated to those concepts.
2.- I don't have any problem accepting any criticism related to the quality of our products, their performance or their aesthetics. I even enjoy jokes like Gollum causing some scratches. BUT to imply that our factory is full of rodents and that our workers don't have homes is simply not acceptable. I'm going to disclose the name of our company (Uniaudio, the loudspeaker factory, is only a division) just to clarify and demand respect once more:
Our company, founded in 1934, is FUNDICIONES UNIVERSO S.A. ( http://www.fundicionesuniverso.com/eng/ ), a manufacturer of industrial parts, member of the American Chamber of Commerce, exporting to more than 14 countries and with strong associations with other companies around the world in projects to produce ethanol, Sugar and cement.
We have 270 persons working in conditions that are easily considered "first class" if compared with any other company in any country.

When running at full steam, Uniaudio had 70 people working making cabinets, good or bad, beautiful or ugly, but always in excellent conditions and treated as the wonderful artisans and human beings that they are.
At this point I have to clarify that Mark always demanded from us to have the best possible conditions for the workers.

Well, this is the first and last post that you'll read from myself on this matter. I don't think that I'm asking for any "special treatment" here. Simply please don't assume, don't insult and don't use us as a joke instrument.
As a music lover I'll always be ready, if some of you has the chance to visit the beautiful country that Colombia is, to have you at home, share a drink, listen to some music and enjoy life.

Sorry for this long and boring piece of text, pardon my english (is even worst when I try to speak) and have a great weekend.

Santiago

Thank you for that.
Glashub's Avatar Glashub 12:33 PM 03-06-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chu Gai View Post

I won't comment on your post Chacruz other than to say, if you, as a supplier of products to Mark Schifter's company are typical of many who have dealt with him in a business capacity, then it is quite likely that you are on the hook for considerable amounts of money. I can offer you my condolences. I can also offer you information which may be of personal use to you in determinnig where you stand. If you PM me, perhaps I can be of assistance and the matter will stay off the public radar. You've got nothing to lose and information to gain. Hope to hear from you.

You are making inflammatory assumptions meant to guide people down a path you want them to go down. What are your real motives? His post was that of a man who is at peace with Shifter. It wasn't a heated, over-arching vent. It was not the post of a man who is resentlful of anybody other than the guys who are slandering him. He made a point of complimenting the person in question. Kind of confusing, isn't it to read a post from a vendor who isn't venting. I've read posts here that are sick and scary. I thought a man is inocent until proven guilty in a court of law. But I'm of a different era. Here's the irony for me, people posting anonymously can and will say anything that they wouldn't say to a persons face. This allows many posters to mimic sociopathy...because they don't see the ramifications or the irony of their self rightous hatred. Then again, I suspect this is far too complex for some of you to contemplate when its easier to scream (anonymously) "string him up", "give him life in prison", "leave a bag of flaming poo" on his porch.
penngray's Avatar penngray 01:02 PM 03-06-2010
Quote:
You are making inflammatory assumptions meant to guide people down a path you want them to go down. What are your real motives?

Anyone that knows Chu on this forum knows he is just after the truth. Period!!
gonk's Avatar gonk 01:17 PM 03-06-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by chacruz View Post

Hello from Cali, Colombia.

And hello from Memphis, TN. Glad to see you saying "hi", Santiago. I hope you all doing well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chacruz View Post

Sorry for this long and boring piece of text, pardon my english (is even worst when I try to speak) and have a great weekend.

Santiago

It was neither long nor boring - and the English was perfectly clear. Thanks for offing this information. Whatever happens to Mark and AV123, I hope Uniaudio has continued success. And if you ever happen through the Memphis area, let me know. I'll have to give you a tour of our Metals Museum. I think you'd enjoy it.
cmryan821's Avatar cmryan821 01:36 PM 03-06-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glashub View Post

I thought a man is inocent until proven guilty in a court of law. But I'm of a different era. Here's the irony for me, people posting anonymously can and will say anything that they wouldn't say to a persons face. This allows many posters to mimic sociopathy...because they don't see the ramifications or the irony of their self rightous hatred. Then again, I suspect this is far too complex for some of you to contemplate when its easier to scream (anonymously) "string him up", "give him life in prison", "leave a bag of flaming poo" on his porch.

I just don't understand people getting ticked off at Chu for the work he's done in helping bring to light Schifter's crimes. Guess I should stop trying and do something enjoyable instead.
tonygeno's Avatar tonygeno 02:47 PM 03-06-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glashub View Post

I thought a man is inocent until proven guilty in a court of law.

Whether he is innocent or guilty means nothing to me. He has admitted to "underfunding" raffles and hence not giving promised money to charities. This hurts the people's faith in the "system" and charitable giving in general. Guilty or innocent of violating a law, I could care less. Guilty of violating the community's trust: he's admitted to doing that and for this I cannot forgive him.
goneten's Avatar goneten 03:38 PM 03-06-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glashub View Post

Here's the irony for me, people posting anonymously can and will say anything that they wouldn't say to a persons face. This allows many posters to mimic sociopathy...because they don't see the ramifications or the irony of their self rightous hatred.

How politically correct (and self-indulgent) of you to point that out. Your post above would make valid sense if it wasn't ironically self-righteous, which it is. That's irony for you; it works both ways. However, it gets worse for you. One can't fight self-righteousness with self-righteousness; that's a circular argument. My irony meter hasn't lit up in some time so thank you for the laugh.

Regards,
monomer's Avatar monomer 03:49 PM 03-06-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glashub View Post

...I thought a man is inocent until proven guilty in a court of law. But I'm of a different era...

Perhaps you haven't been paying attention... He's already admitted guilt to ripping off some of the donations meant for the charities he supposedly was raising support for (some without their knowledge)... the only things really left to be decided in court is how many other charities total did he actually rip off, the exact amounts he pocketed and the fine and period of his incarceration. In this case, I believe, the actual court proceedings and judgment is a mere technicality but is going to be useful in determining sentencing.
RMK!'s Avatar RMK! 04:26 PM 03-06-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by goneten View Post

Hey RMK,

How is your system doing ?

Regards,

The better for your asking, and yours?
m-fine's Avatar m-fine 05:51 PM 03-06-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glashub View Post

I've read posts here that are sick and scary. I thought a man is inocent until proven guilty in a court of law.

What is sick and scary is how many people have no clue what the purpose of a trial is.

The purpose of the trial is determine if there is enough evidence FOR THE GOVERNMENT to punish a citizen. IT IS NOT ABOUT FINDING THE TRUTH. The rules are heavily biased in favor of the defendant because it is considered better that a guilty man walk than an innocent man get convicted. The court of law does not exist so the government can tell you what to think, you are supposed to be able to think on your own. You have a responsibility to look at the evidence and make up your own decisions in life. Of course, no one seems to think taking responsibility for themselves is necessary anymore.
MKtheater's Avatar MKtheater 06:31 PM 03-06-2010
Glashub,

Your posts come off the wrong way. You keep attacking people who dislike what MLS has done and defend MLS. You feel bad for his family but what about the families of the people deceived? The man from columbia could be mad at MLS, who knows, it does not mean that he should tell us. He showed much better class than that.
django1's Avatar django1 07:03 PM 03-06-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by m-fine View Post

What is sick and scary is how many people have no clue what the purpose of a trial is.

The purpose of the trial is determine if there is enough evidence FOR THE GOVERNMENT to punish a citizen. IT IS NOT ABOUT FINDING THE TRUTH. The rules are heavily biased in favor of the defendant because it is considered better that a guilty man walk than an innocent man get convicted. The court of law does not exist so the government can tell you what to think, you are supposed to be able to think on your own. You have a responsibility to look at the evidence and make up your own decisions in life. Of course, no one seems to think taking responsibility for themselves is necessary anymore.

What he says. You don't get due process in the court of public opinion. I don't understand why people would like to extend the legal process to my thought processes. I have no power to exact punishment on anyone so I can think what I want. As a human being judging another one I try to be fair. I have heard convincing evidence from three first hand witnesses who say that MLS has not handed over the money. My verdict: he's guilty! The result of this is me not buying his product and letting other people know that they might be in harms way if they do business with him.. For the rest I am perfectly happy letting the legal process run it's course.
m-fine's Avatar m-fine 07:34 AM 03-07-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post

The man from columbia could be mad at MLS, who knows, it does not mean that he should tell us. He showed much better class than that.

Exactly! There are a lot of reasons for anyone in the industry to avoid saying too much at this point. I can assure you there are a number of them who lost money to Mark who are not publicly speaking about it.
m-fine's Avatar m-fine 07:38 AM 03-07-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by django1 View Post

I have heard convincing evidence from three first hand witnesses who say that MLS has not handed over the money. My verdict: he's guilty! The result of this is me not buying his product and letting other people know that they might be in harms way if they do business with him.. For the rest I am perfectly happy letting the legal process run it's course.

I goes beyond that. For example, If you read the indictment, and then his website, you can see that he most certainly is guilty of running raffles without being a not-for-profit and meeting the other requirements under Colorado law. You can also read for yourself the names of the charities Mark used, and also see that some of them at least, did not give permission for their name to be used.

Some of the facts are not well known, but there is plenty out there for someone to make a very solid judgment on some of the charges.
Randy Bessinger's Avatar Randy Bessinger 04:20 PM 03-07-2010
I don't see how you can justify the charity fraud no matter what you think of MLS. He has even admitted to some of it but he just followed it up with the usual BS. He should of at least made an effort. I find the amount actually really large and really more important than any of the rest of his transgressions. I hope they give him more than a slap on the wrist. That would not deter him or others that may be contemplating the same thing. It would also slap the charities in the face. It seems some here would stand up for MLS's rights (and "innocent till proven guilty" even though he has already admitted to some guilt) and not give a tinker's damn about the charities not getting money's meant for them. You know "it's just not that much money". Amazing to me.

A question....how have the supporters of MLS been able to rationalize the knowledge that he "underfunded" the raffles and not immediately changed their judgement of the man? That was acknowledged by him quite awhile ago. I just don't understand that. To say we don't know all the facts is in my opinion not even rational. The fact is he didn't pay over monies that were supposed to go over to charities (by his own admission). Even if it was a family member that I loved, I could not get past that without a serious change of attitude toward their actions. I certainly would not consider it business as usual. I just keep thinking it is a desire to be "right" about someone even though the facts point in a completely different direction. An ego that doesn't allow someone to say, "you know I was totally wrong about that guy and he IS an assh*l*".
Grandarf's Avatar Grandarf 04:25 PM 03-07-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Randy Bessinger View Post

I don't see how you can justify the charity fraud no matter what you think of MLS. He has even admitted to some of it but he just followed it up with the usual BS. He should of at least made an effort. I find the amount actually really large and really more important than any of the rest of his transgressions. I hope they give him more than a slap on the wrist. That would not deter him or others that may be contemplating the same thing.

A question....how have the supporters of MLS been able to rationalize the knowledge that he "underfunded" the raffles and not immediately changed their judgement of the man. That has been acknowleded by him quite awhile ago. I just don't understand that. Even if it was a family member that I loved, I could not get past that without a serious change of attitude toward their actions. I certainly would not consider it business as usual.

"No one every said the guy was perfect! He did have issues to work out..."


huskerpat's Avatar huskerpat 04:52 PM 03-07-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by cneely8 View Post

This is the saddest thing I've seen in this thread so far...

sorry, dude...

Thanks. With a toddler and another one on the way, I relented...until the next house which will hopefully happen next year.
floridapoolboy's Avatar floridapoolboy 05:14 PM 03-07-2010
If he is found guilty the judge sentencing MLS should offer him a choice. He could either serve 5 years, or take a chance on a "challenge". He would have to pull 20 MFWs at random from his warehouse, and each would be examined and tested. Every time an MFW had a problem, like hum, loose/missing hardware, veneer issues, etc. one year would be added to his sentence. I wonder which option he would choose....?
crOwcaine's Avatar crOwcaine 05:30 PM 03-07-2010
He would get 19 years.
Chu Gai's Avatar Chu Gai 06:09 PM 03-07-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by m-fine View Post

I goes beyond that. For example, If you read the indictment, and then his website, you can see that he most certainly is guilty of running raffles without being a not-for-profit and meeting the other requirements under Colorado law. You can also read for yourself the names of the charities Mark used, and also see that some of them at least, did not give permission for their name to be used.

Quite so. I'm just going to pick one of the charities - Dana Farber Cancer Institute/Jimmy Fund. They have guidelines for organizations or people who are looking to raise money on their behalf. These are methods that they find acceptable. They don't like raffles and strongly discourage that particular method of fund raising as the possibility of error and fraud is more prevalent than other means. Gee, who'd have guessed! Further, in the particular raffle that was run on the AV451 website, Schifter had mentioned in response to a question from a forum member about that particular raffle that he would have to check with their local DFCI representative. Think he did?

Quote:


Some of the facts are not well known, but there is plenty out there for someone to make a very solid judgment on some of the charges.

The only real roadblock I came across were the raffles for the orphans in Khabarovsk, Russia. The language and geographical barriers were simply too much to overcome.
pelcodan's Avatar pelcodan 07:40 PM 03-07-2010
MLS steals thousands from donors and will get several years in prison.

The executives of Bank of America, Citigroup, Goldman Sachs and many more steal trillions form taxpayers and give themselves million dollar bonuses.

Not to defend or excuse any of MLS' actions, but if we exhibited the same anger toward all theft, especially by degree, there would be revolutions instead of elections.
s44's Avatar s44 08:40 PM 03-07-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by pelcodan View Post

Not to defend or excuse any of MLS' actions

Baloney.
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