Klipsch vs Paradigm - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 31 Old 04-27-2010, 09:26 AM - Thread Starter
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I am updating my living space (approx 15'x15' but open to foyer & kitchen & dining room) and will be mounting my TV on the wall; will be moving my big Klipsch (KM-6, KMC, & KG .5) speakers to the basement. To replace my current set-up, I am torn between these speakers (must be wall mountable):

- Klipsch Quintet
- Paradigm Cinema 110
- Cerwin Vega CVHD
- Recommendations???

They will be powered by one of the below - in no particular order (again, always seeking recommendations):
- Onkyo-tx-nr807
- Onkyo-tx-sr707
- Pioneer-vsx-9040txh
- Yamaha-rx-v765

I have about a month to decide...So, you thoughts, comments, suggestions, recommendations, etc. are valued...

Thanks in advance,
Max
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post #2 of 31 Old 04-27-2010, 09:54 AM
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I would change the way the budget is allocated to 70 - 75% towards speakers and 25 - 30% on receiver.
Maybe consider these speakers if you are set on the receivers.
http://www.vanns.com/shop/servlet/it...-Jamo-CSBundle since the sub comes with it the overall price should be a wash.

Regards,
Charlie

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post #3 of 31 Old 04-27-2010, 10:12 AM
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Smallish, more audiophile-approved bookshelf speakers can be wall mounted too, with the right hardware mounting system. That would open up your options considerably. Ascend Acoustics makes a nice model or two in the smallish (for bookshelves, anyway) speaker arena. Omimount makes hardware that can hold them anywhere you want.

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post #4 of 31 Old 04-27-2010, 10:13 AM
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Can you do in wall? I've heard great things about Klipsch's THX in wall speakers.
Subwoofer, there are many great choices. SVS, Velodyne, Rythmik, etc.

Frankly any satellite speakers are going to be far too small for that space, especially since you've had larger speakers in that space before you will hear the difference.
General rule of the thumb, get the largest speakers you can in any space.

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post #5 of 31 Old 04-27-2010, 12:47 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for all the input so far...

Here is a little more info. I will only have 6"-7" on each side of the TV, as the TV is being placed a on a corner angle (above a gas fireplace).

I think book shelf speakers would look out of place in the space, but it is a valued idea, if I had the space on the wall.

I too fear the vastness of the room with smaller speakers, that is the primary reason I posted here - I need solid ideas - my installer recommends the Paradigm Cinema 110s and a Denon 1901 - I do not like the Denon and haven't heard the 110s yet, but have not read anything bad about them.

I am not sold on a receiver yet, I like some of the features on each one, wish I could merge a couple receivers together

Again, thanks for the input and please keep the suggestions coming...
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post #6 of 31 Old 04-27-2010, 01:24 PM - Thread Starter
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In looking for the Klipsch THX in walls, I found the Klipsch Quintet SL, which provides a larger center & L/R speaker with the smaller Quintet for surrounds. I havn't found any reviews on that set up yet, not have I scene it. It actually looks similar to the Paradigm 110s.

Oh, I would love the THX in walls, but they are a bit too much $$$.
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post #7 of 31 Old 04-27-2010, 03:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxjean View Post

In looking for the Klipsch THX in walls, I found the Klipsch Quintet SL, which provides a larger center & L/R speaker with the smaller Quintet for surrounds. I havn't found any reviews on that set up yet, not have I scene it. It actually looks similar to the Paradigm 110s.

Oh, I would love the THX in walls, but they are a bit too much $$$.

I am a Klipsch owner so i might also recommend:

The HD Theater 500 or 1000 the 500 got a great review in home theater magazine.

Also you might want to check out Definitive Technologies ProCinema 600 or 800. I've heard both and was very impressed.
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post #8 of 31 Old 04-27-2010, 03:15 PM
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Also BB is practically giving awat the Martin Logan Encore ATF which is a L/C/R speaker. You could use it all the way around. Very nice sounding speaker as well.
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post #9 of 31 Old 04-27-2010, 03:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tverardi View Post

Also BB is practically giving awat the Martin Logan Encore ATF which is a L/C/R speaker. You could use it all the way around. Very nice sounding speaker as well.

+1! I didn't see it at BB but amazon and others have it at $199.00!!

Ron
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post #10 of 31 Old 04-27-2010, 03:28 PM
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+1! I didn't see it at BB but amazon and others have it at $199.00!!

Ron

I know it's almost crimminal! LOL
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post #11 of 31 Old 04-27-2010, 06:48 PM - Thread Starter
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Also BB is practically giving awat the Martin Logan Encore ATF which is a L/C/R speaker. You could use it all the way around. Very nice sounding speaker as well.

Thanks for the lead.

My only concern is I have never heard of Martin Logan (please don't egg me); where can I hear them in NorthEast Ohio, anyone? I just briefly searched for a review of them, with no results...I will continue searching tonight.
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post #12 of 31 Old 04-27-2010, 07:03 PM
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Originally Posted by maxjean View Post

Thanks for the lead.

My only concern is I have never heard of Martin Logan (please don't egg me); where can I hear them in NorthEast Ohio, anyone? I just briefly searched for a review of them, with no results...I will continue searching tonight.

Go to martin logans website and look up a local retailer in your area.
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post #13 of 31 Old 04-27-2010, 07:04 PM
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Encore review sort of. not very in depth

http://www.bigpicturebigsound.com/Ma..._for_499.shtml
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post #14 of 31 Old 04-27-2010, 08:09 PM - Thread Starter
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I did a little more research on the Martin Logan speakers. Wow, the have speakers that are $25,000 a pair The ML Encore are very highly recommended as a center, but not much about L/R (other than prefer to have the same L/R/C)

This poses another question - If I were to get an Encore as a center, what would be a good L/R/surrounds? Would the Encores suffice for L/R, do they compare to the Quintet SL or the Paradigm 110s? Or Encores L/R/C, then what surrounds (wife does not like huge surrounds, but I want to hear them...).

I found a Martin Logan Retailer - I will call them tomorrow to see if they have a studio...

Thanks for all the info - I appreciate it - please keep it coming, I am learning a lot...
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post #15 of 31 Old 04-27-2010, 08:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxjean View Post

I did a little more research on the Martin Logan speakers. Wow, the have speakers that are $25,000 a pair The ML Encore are very highly recommended as a center, but not much about L/R (other than prefer to have the same L/R/C)

This poses another question - If I were to get an Encore as a center, what would be a good L/R/surrounds? Would the Encores suffice for L/R, do they compare to the Quintet SL or the Paradigm 110s? Or Encores L/R/C, then what surrounds (wife does not like huge surrounds, but I want to hear them...).

I found a Martin Logan Retailer - I will call them tomorrow to see if they have a studio...

Thanks for all the info - I appreciate it - please keep it coming, I am learning a lot...

Yeah you'll find most well known speaker brands have lines that are in the realm of I'll never be able to afford unless i hit the lottery.

As far as the encore comparing to the other brands it's all subjective.

Klipsch to most are either love them or hate them. I feel Klipsch is a must auddition speaker as the Horn Loaded tweeter is not for everyone. Some say they are too bright. Just remember most movie theaters use horn loaded speakers.

Paradigm I can't comment on as I've never heard them.

I will say I was impressed with the ML's and you will find that they are very well regarded speakers. I think a system with 5 Encore's wall mounted for the price would sound pretty awesome. Just make sure you have a reciever that can handle 4 ohm's.

Also I auditioned the Quintets very nice and I have to say also that I prefer the Klipsch sound over the ML again that's just me. That's why it's a must to audition as many speakers on your list as you can.

I would also bring some CD's you like and even some DVD's and make them play your material so you can hear for yourself.
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post #16 of 31 Old 04-28-2010, 07:56 AM - Thread Starter
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Spoke to the Martin Logan dealer's shop this morning, they do not have the Encores - it is an order product to them. I must say, they were very "snobbish." Nonetheless, I will stop by their shop this afternoon and look, but they carry high-end stuff, way out of my price range - but hey, I may learn something new...

(I hope I get a different rep then the guy I spoke to on the phone - You now that one comic on the blue collar tour, Ron White, when he tells the joke about his brother-in-law preferring Mercedes Benz, and he puts on the snob voice - that is the guy I talked to...)
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post #17 of 31 Old 04-28-2010, 10:46 AM
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Klipsch RSX-5 speakers would be a great option. They have been discontinued so you can find them for a great deal on places like ebay. 93 db sensitivity, decent bass response, and a sweet horn tweet.
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post #18 of 31 Old 04-28-2010, 12:11 PM - Thread Starter
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The RSX-5 looks nice, and would be better than the Quintet satellites. I could not find any new ones left.
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post #19 of 31 Old 04-28-2010, 12:34 PM
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The RSX-5 looks nice, and would be better than the Quintet satellites. I could not find any new ones left.

Safe and Sound HQ has them for sale. If you keep an eye on ebay you can find them for smoking deals on occasion.
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post #20 of 31 Old 04-28-2010, 12:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Safe and Sound HQ has them for sale. If you keep an eye on ebay you can find them for smoking deals on occasion.

I just checked out SSHQ, and they do not list their prices, I will give them a call tomorrow. Thanks...
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post #21 of 31 Old 04-28-2010, 07:27 PM - Thread Starter
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Spoke to the Martin Logan dealer's shop this morning, they do not have the Encores - it is an order product to them. I must say, they were very "snobbish." Nonetheless, I will stop by their shop this afternoon and look, but they carry high-end stuff, way out of my price range - but hey, I may learn something new...

(I hope I get a different rep then the guy I spoke to on the phone - You now that one comic on the blue collar tour, Ron White, when he tells the joke about his brother-in-law preferring Mercedes Benz, and he puts on the snob voice - that is the guy I talked to...)

I stopped in the shop tonight, like I mentioned, no Encore Tfs. This particular shop pushed only B&W and Martin Logans. I ended up listening to the B&W VM6s, with a ML Dynamo sub. Sounded very nice.

He (the shop) was a fan of Integra receivers too. Overall, I am glad I stopped in, as we spoke for about 1/2 hour and I was educated on some home theater basics.

Although the B&W are the "industry standard" (according to the shop), they are a bit pricey for my budget. That said, I am still pondering the ML Encore TF, as they are on sale. Anyone have the Encore TFs?
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post #22 of 31 Old 04-28-2010, 07:39 PM
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I stopped in the shop tonight, like I mentioned, no Encore Tfs. This particular shop pushed only B&W and Martin Logans. I ended up listening to the B&W VM6s, with a ML Dynamo sub. Sounded very nice.

He (the shop) was a fan of Integra receivers too. Overall, I am glad I stopped in, as we spoke for about 1/2 hour and I was educated on some home theater basics.

Although the B&W are the "industry standard" (according to the shop), they are a bit pricey for my budget. That said, I am still pondering the ML Encore TF, as they are on sale. Anyone have the Encore TFs?

Says who?
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post #23 of 31 Old 04-28-2010, 10:45 PM
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Even the RSX-3s and 4s are better than the Quintets.

Heh, B&W as the industry standard. B&W has a house sound that most North American companies do not (or no longer) use. Paradigm is one of the companies that tries to copy their sound though. I don't know about the new entry level speakers, but I know the v2/v3 Signature line are a departure from Paradigm's traditional sound curves and they've gone for a tonally neutral design. This coincides with their switch from aluminum to beryllium tweeters.
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post #24 of 31 Old 04-28-2010, 10:56 PM
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Even the RSX-3s and 4s are better than the Quintets.

Heh, B&W as the industry standard. B&W has a house sound that most North American companies do not (or no longer) use. Paradigm is one of the companies that tries to copy their sound though. I don't know about the new entry level speakers, but I know the v2/v3 Signature line are a departure from Paradigm's traditional sound curves and they've gone for a tonally neutral design. This coincides with their switch from aluminum to beryllium tweeters.

Interesting, IMO Paradigm and B&W sound very different, I prefer B&W but they are both excellent speakers.

Ron
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post #25 of 31 Old 04-28-2010, 11:00 PM
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An FR sweep definitely won't tell you everything about the speakers, and there are huge differences...but Paradigm's house sound has been very similar to the B&W FR curve (a bit of midbass and treble boost) up until 2006 with their new beryllium tweeters.
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post #26 of 31 Old 04-29-2010, 05:37 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the info (although it is a little above my head).

On the value side of the coin, this combination has presented itself (thanks to y'all):

3 - Martin Logan Encore TFs [L/R/C]
2 - Jamo Concert Series (C400SUR) [Surround]

for around $680 (retail = $1900). Then I would just have to add a Sub.

My predicament is this, I have never heard either speaker. The analogy I use; it is like taking Colt McCoy in the third round - a value pick. It may be great, I may not like it. Anyone have the aforementioned speakers, would the MLs sound good with the Jamos?
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post #27 of 31 Old 04-29-2010, 05:45 AM - Thread Starter
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[quote=maxjean;18556008]I stopped in the shop tonight, like I mentioned, no Encore Tfs. This particular shop pushed only B&W and Martin Logans. I ended up listening to the B&W VM6s, with a ML Dynamo sub. Sounded very nice.

He (the shop) was a fan of Integra receivers too. Overall, I am glad I stopped in, as we spoke for about 1/2 hour and I was educated on some home theater basics.
[quote]

The other thing I did get to experience is the difference between the small satellites (like the Quintets) vs. the VM6 type speaker (long and thin). First I listened to the small satellites, then he switched to the VM6s- a difference, but not huge. But then...

As we chatted in the shop the VM6s were playing the whole time, then after 15-20 minutes the sales rep switched back to the smaller speaker - that was an eye opener. If the small ones would have stayed on the entire time, I would have been like, sure they sound good. But once you hear the comparison - there was just so much more sound coming from the long and thin speaker.

So, I think that definitely rule out the Quintets, but not he Quintet SLs. It was worth the time to stop and chat with the high end shop.
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post #28 of 31 Old 04-29-2010, 06:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxjean View Post

Spoke to the Martin Logan dealer's shop this morning, they do not have the Encores - it is an order product to them. I must say, they were very "snobbish." Nonetheless, I will stop by their shop this afternoon and look, but they carry high-end stuff, way out of my price range - but hey, I may learn something new...

(I hope I get a different rep then the guy I spoke to on the phone - You now that one comic on the blue collar tour, Ron White, when he tells the joke about his brother-in-law preferring Mercedes Benz, and he puts on the snob voice - that is the guy I talked to...)

I had a similar expeience in a high end audio place here in CT. I think if your not going to shop at a place like that and drop major dollars they kinda give you the cold shoulder. The guy actually said that they don't usually cater to customers like me.

We wound up talking for a bit but still felt like I was second rate in his eyes.
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post #29 of 31 Old 04-29-2010, 07:35 PM - Thread Starter
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Well, I pulled the trigger on the Martin Logan Encore Tf x3 (L/R/C).
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post #30 of 31 Old 04-29-2010, 08:24 PM
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Well, I pulled the trigger on the Martin Logan Encore Tf x3 (L/R/C).

Congrats on that purchase. I think for the money you got an awesome speaker that is also really nice looking as well.

I've been following your thread in the Amp's forum and I guess I would ask what is your budget again for an AVR?

I feel if you get away with just buying a really nice AVR thats the way to go.
I have a Pioneer Elite SC-25 and it is fairly large. Most of the AMP's I've seen are really big and bulky again I don't know much about separate amps.

So, do you have the room or desire to had the extra equipment? Also why not call Martin Logan and see what they have to say. I heard there customer services is top notch. I'm sure they could give you some recommendations.
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