Why are new speakers flat? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 26 Old 07-23-2010, 09:34 AM - Thread Starter
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Hi everyone,
I am not a happy owner yet of JBL ES90 speakers, big floorstanders with 8" woofers. My first system to build up.
I use Onkyo 807 with them, don't have other electronics yet and need more cables to make my plasma's audio to play through it.

The only way I was able to play them as of today, is FM radio.

The problem is the bass is so flat, even on max bass set up and different play modes by Onkyo. When it plays, I feel almost no air pressure when put my hand close to the woofers and its "membranes" display no visible motion like I saw on videos. My computer Bose (no pun intended) speakers play deeper bass.

I know they need time to brake in. They have played for days, it looks the same. I checked the polarity of wires. What's wrong? Is it just because of the radio? More time to brake in?

P.S. To make things not better, one of the speakers came a bit dented so I am going to exchange it.
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post #2 of 26 Old 07-23-2010, 09:41 AM
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Do you have your receiver set to having the speakers as "large?" What is the crossover?

You may simply not have the receiver sending the lower frequencies to your speakers, which would be an easy fix.

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post #3 of 26 Old 07-23-2010, 09:48 AM
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Yeah, if the "membranes" aka. "cones", don't move much even though you have it cranked, I think you have some wrong settings in your AVR.

YID DIY
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post #4 of 26 Old 07-23-2010, 09:51 AM
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I'd say you don't have your system set up properly. FM radio isn't the best source either. At least play a CD when you get the chance.

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post #5 of 26 Old 07-23-2010, 09:54 AM - Thread Starter
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To Marlin:

I have not met any "large" word at the settings..

If you mean crossover with a subwoofer, I do not have it. That was the reason to buy speakers with big woofers, to possibly avoid buying a sub as I mostly listen to music.

If you mean crossover by its specs, it is
"500Hz, 3kHz – 24dB/octave; 12kHz – 18dB/octave".
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post #6 of 26 Old 07-23-2010, 09:58 AM
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The crossover in the receiver. Should be able to be moved from as low as 40 hz to as high as 200. If you're not using a subwoofer then when the option comes thru for setting the speaker size in the receiver set them to large and with no subwoofer so the bass is all funneled to your speakers.
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post #7 of 26 Old 07-23-2010, 10:07 AM - Thread Starter
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Ok, it looks like the settings..

I tried all possible modes I could, - stereo, surround, etc..
The deepest audible bass comes from "surr sens mus" mode but with muddy highs, which improve on "stereo" but becomes much less bass.
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post #8 of 26 Old 07-23-2010, 10:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ippa View Post

Ok, it looks like the settings..

I tried all possible modes I could, - stereo, surround, etc..
The deepest audible bass comes from "surr sens mus" mode but with muddy highs, which improve on "stereo" but becomes much less bass.

These settings are the surround settings Or Stereo is turning off Surround and doing 2 Channel only.

When the OP say setting your speakers to LARGE, you need to go into your AVR's Calibration Menu and change the setting from Small to Large and turn the Sub off if it is on.

If you are not sure where this is located or dont have the Manual, my suggestion would be to go to the Amplifier Forum and find your AVR. The thread for your specific receiver will tell you what you need to do, to make this change.

Good Luck!
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post #9 of 26 Old 07-23-2010, 10:15 AM - Thread Starter
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Ohhh...

I didn't want to scare my neighbors so I have never cranked up all the way. I just did and the cones are jumping!!

Now, I can't listen that loud.. I read before that they like to play loud but not to that degree..

So need a sub anyway?

I will check crossover in the receiver.

Thanks everyone.
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post #10 of 26 Old 07-23-2010, 10:20 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eviltwincustoms View Post

These settings are the surround settings Or Stereo is turning off Surround and doing 2 Channel only.

When the OP say setting your speakers to LARGE, you need to go into your AVR's Calibration Menu and change the setting from Small to Large and turn the Sub off if it is on.

If you are not sure where this is located or dont have the Manual, my suggestion would be to go to the Amplifier Forum and find your AVR. The thread for your specific receiver will tell you what you need to do, to make this change.

Good Luck!

Thanks, I have not done "Audyssey MultEQ" if it is the same what you mean by calibration. I do have the manual but haven't got to it yet..
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post #11 of 26 Old 07-23-2010, 10:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ippa View Post

Ohhh...

I didn't want to scare my neighbors so I have never cranked up all the way. I just did and the cones are jumping!!


YID DIY
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post #12 of 26 Old 07-23-2010, 12:07 PM
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In your manual, on page 51, it talks about how to change the various speaker settings. Page 85 discusses the different crossover settings for your speakers.

You should set them both to full rangeand turn off the sub as well.

The 807's maunal can be found here too:

http://onkyousa.com/model.cfm?m=TX-N...s=Receiver&p=d

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post #13 of 26 Old 07-23-2010, 02:26 PM - Thread Starter
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Do I look like that kitty?
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post #14 of 26 Old 07-23-2010, 03:03 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marlin29311 View Post

In your manual, on page 51, it talks about how to change the various speaker settings. Page 85 discusses the different crossover settings for your speakers.
class=Receiver&p=d[/url]

Done that. Now fronts are "full band" and sub is "off" as well as others.
Makes difference.
Thank you.
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post #15 of 26 Old 07-23-2010, 06:49 PM
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he is listening to the FM radio, it isn't sending enough low frequencies for the speakers to reproduce

deeper than the deepest ocean
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post #16 of 26 Old 07-23-2010, 06:53 PM
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Now take the time to throw a proper Audyssey room calibration in and you should be good to go with very little adjustment. Depending on the room and the speakers, you may wish to still run the fronts as Large (Full Range) even with a sub. I have tried it both ways with my towers but am learning to like the Small setting with sub but with a lower 40Hz X-over. Give it time and experiment.



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post #17 of 26 Old 07-23-2010, 07:18 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks, still not sure what Large or Small mean. No such words at my Onkyo settings.
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post #18 of 26 Old 07-23-2010, 07:21 PM
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Large means that your speakers can handle the bass. depending on your receiver it will either send a full signal or most of the bass to the speakers and not subwoofer. you have no sub so you need to have it set to full or large. Small means the frequencies below the crossover are sent to the subwoofer only.
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post #19 of 26 Old 07-23-2010, 07:22 PM
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painful

deeper than the deepest ocean
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post #20 of 26 Old 07-23-2010, 07:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bone215 View Post

painful

Agreed, far worse than 'Nails On Chalkboard'

So much media, so little time...

 

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post #21 of 26 Old 07-23-2010, 07:39 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brandonnash View Post

Large means that your speakers can handle the bass. depending on your receiver it will either send a full signal or most of the bass to the speakers and not subwoofer. you have no sub so you need to have it set to full or large. Small means the frequencies below the crossover are sent to the subwoofer only.

That's what I did. "Full band".
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post #22 of 26 Old 07-23-2010, 07:40 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by barryecohen View Post

Agreed, far worse than 'Nails On Chalkboard'

Thanks, appreciate your sense of humor and support.
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post #23 of 26 Old 07-23-2010, 09:21 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ippa View Post

Thanks, appreciate your sense of humor and support.

You are saying that you have your speakers set to full bandwidth and the cones still hardly move? If so what is your master volume level set to? Did you run auto setup?
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post #24 of 26 Old 07-24-2010, 12:00 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by mjg100 View Post

You are saying that you have your speakers set to full bandwidth and the cones still hardly move? If so what is your master volume level set to? Did you run auto setup?

I just did not crank them up enough before posting. When I did, they were moving well. I realized it then.
No, I did not run auto set up yet.
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post #25 of 26 Old 07-24-2010, 04:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ippa View Post

I just did not crank them up enough before posting. When I did, they were moving well. I realized it then.
No, I did not run auto set up yet.

If it's sounding better to you now and you've gotten familiar with changing settings, yoiu should run Audyssey....you will probably find that the sound is even better afterwards. If not, you can always turn it off but there's a reason that running Audyssey is the last step in "First Time Setup"

Afterwards, turning on Dynamic EQ will also help your bass response at lower listening levels.

Mike
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post #26 of 26 Old 07-24-2010, 10:03 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by kmike View Post

If it's sounding better to you now and you've gotten familiar with changing settings, yoiu should run Audyssey....you will probably find that the sound is even better afterwards. If not, you can always turn it off but there's a reason that running Audyssey is the last step in "First Time Setup"

Afterwards, turning on Dynamic EQ will also help your bass response at lower listening levels.

Right, finally did that and it is a total new experience, even on FM radio. All range of frequencies is better, better stereo separation and, most important, it all works on lower listening levels.
Now I think I still need a sub..

Thanks!
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