Pioneer's Speaker Genius Hits Low Price Point - Page 207 - AVS | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #6181 of 6196 Old 03-25-2015, 02:12 PM
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Originally Posted by sdurani View Post
But I already signed up for the annual open house.
Hi Sanjay,

You are still welcome to come to our open house. It will just be at a new address.....

Chris
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post #6182 of 6196 Old 03-25-2015, 02:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Walkamo View Post
Hi Sanjay,

You are still welcome to come to our open house. It will just be at a new address.....

Chris
Of course, I was joking. But if you're not, then you just made my day. Good luck on the new venture. Looking forward to launch (and eventual open house).

Sanjay
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post #6183 of 6196 Old 03-25-2015, 02:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post
I hope it is a step up. You both seem like really nice guys.
Looking forward to your future endeavors.
Thanks Bond007...

This new endeavor is a great opportunity for both Andrew and myself.

Chris
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post #6184 of 6196 Old 03-25-2015, 02:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Walkamo View Post
Both Andrew and I have chosen to leave Pioneer Electronics. We are not ready to share the exact details of where are now at, however I can tell you we are working on some cool new stuff.

I will share details once we get closer to launch.
I wish you and Andrew the best.

I am very anxious to see what your next project is!!!

I believe that the AJ 1st and 2nd generation Pioneer speakers represented one of the best values in speakers today.

What I would have given to have access to speakers like that, 30 years ago, when I was much poorer, but still loved Audio!
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post #6185 of 6196 Old 03-25-2015, 02:49 PM
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Originally Posted by BuddTX View Post
I wish you and Andrew the best.

I am very anxious to see what your next project is!!!

I believe that the AJ 1st and 2nd generation Pioneer speakers represented one of the best values in speakers today.

What I would have given to have access to speakers like that, 30 years ago, when I was much poorer, but still loved Audio!
Thanks Budd.

We will update everyone with what we are doing soon.

Chris
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post #6186 of 6196 Old 03-25-2015, 03:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Walkamo View Post
Hi Everyone,

Just read some of the speculation about a 3rd generation of Pioneer speakers by Andrew and thought I would share some information.

Both Andrew and I have chosen to leave Pioneer Electronics. We are not ready to share the exact details of where are now at, however I can tell you we are working on some cool new stuff.

I will share details once we get closer to launch.

Thanks for everyone's support.

Chris Walker
Formerly Pioneer Electronics
Chris, I wish you & AJ great success in your new company.

Having a major A/V mfg represented here has been a great asset to AVS over the years.

I look forward to seeing what products you come out with & where to buy them

All the best!

Steve

Last edited by ss9001; 03-25-2015 at 03:47 PM.
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post #6187 of 6196 Old 03-25-2015, 03:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Walkamo View Post
Hi Everyone,

Just read some of the speculation about a 3rd generation of Pioneer speakers by Andrew and thought I would share some information.

Both Andrew and I have chosen to leave Pioneer Electronics. We are not ready to share the exact details of where are now at, however I can tell you we are working on some cool new stuff.

I will share details once we get closer to launch.

Thanks for everyone's support.

Chris Walker
Formerly Pioneer Electronics
I wish you and Andrew the best in your new venture. In fact, I may hold off with any future speaker purchases to see what you will introduce first. If at all possible, I would love to see your first speakers in my various projects and in my own system.

Chucka

Chuck

Last edited by Chucka; 03-26-2015 at 02:46 PM.
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post #6188 of 6196 Old 03-25-2015, 04:07 PM
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Originally Posted by sdurani View Post
Of course, I was joking. But if you're not, then you just made my day. Good luck on the new venture. Looking forward to launch (and eventual open house).
Hi Sanjay,

I was not kidding. Still in Southern California and will be holding a open house in the near future...

I will start a new thread soon.

Chris
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post #6189 of 6196 Old 03-25-2015, 04:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Walkamo View Post
Still in Southern California...
Understandable, since the west coast has the sunshine and the girls all get so tanned.

Sanjay
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post #6190 of 6196 Old 03-26-2015, 08:49 AM
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Pioneer SP-BS41-LR 2 CH Bookshelf Loudspeakers Pair $69.99. Free shipping and limit 5 per customer, so no 7.1.4 Dolby Atmos in one buy.
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post #6191 of 6196 Old 03-26-2015, 02:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Walkamo View Post
Hi Everyone,

Just read some of the speculation about a 3rd generation of Pioneer speakers by Andrew and thought I would share some information.

Both Andrew and I have chosen to leave Pioneer Electronics. We are not ready to share the exact details of where are now at, however I can tell you we are working on some cool new stuff.

I will share details once we get closer to launch.

Thanks for everyone's support.

Chris Walker
Formerly Pioneer Electronics
Oh wow! Good luck to you and Andrew! Always like to see new ventures and anticipation of new products!

Sounds good!
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post #6192 of 6196 Old Today, 08:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Walkamo View Post
Hi Sanjay,

I was not kidding. Still in Southern California and will be holding a open house in the near future...

I will start a new thread soon.

Chris
Hi Chris,
Does this mean production of the Pioneer AJ 2nd gens will stop/already stopped?

Vijay
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post #6193 of 6196 Old Today, 12:08 PM
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I know I'm not the only one that hates the grills on the Pioneers, and I know that the grills are pretty detrimental to the tweeter performance. So I modded my grills (cut out all the plastic in front of the tweeter) and ran a few sweeps in REW to understand the changes.

http://averagejoeaudiophile.blogspot...and-after.html

The Pioneer BS22's have been one of the most recommended and highly reviewed entry level or budget speakers in recent memory. While very good at the price point they are not perfect.

One known issue is how very non-transparent the grills are. I've read some second hand accounts that Andrew Jones designed the speaker with these grills in mind, or at least to be used specifically with the grills on. But after the measurements, I can't see that as anything but marketing hype, the all to common, "it's a feature" excuses.

Pioneer BS22 measurements: Close mic and 1 meter


In the above graphs you have close mic measurements on top (mic at tweeter) and then 1 meter measurements at below. 1/6 octave smoothing used on both.

As you can see, with the grills on there is a pretty large dip at centered at 8.5khz. (in RED), removing the plastic (in GREEN) didn't have all the effect that I had hoped for, but there was some measurable improvement. How well that translates to your ears, I'm not sure. Removing the grills entirely (in BLUE) is still the best option for the flattest frequency response from the tweeter.

Does modding the grill make a huge difference? No, not really. But if you prefer the look of the grills being on or you are trying to protect the tweeter from little fingers; I do think it is a worthy and easy mod to make.

Modded Grill
http://i.imgur.com/UgHVPHS.jpg
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post #6194 of 6196 Old Today, 05:42 PM
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Why not just take the grills off? I do.

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post #6195 of 6196 Old Today, 06:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AverageJoeAudio View Post
I know I'm not the only one that hates the grills on the Pioneers, and I know that the grills are pretty detrimental to the tweeter performance. So I modded my grills (cut out all the plastic in front of the tweeter) and ran a few sweeps in REW to understand the changes.

http://averagejoeaudiophile.blogspot...and-after.html

The Pioneer BS22's have been one of the most recommended and highly reviewed entry level or budget speakers in recent memory. While very good at the price point they are not perfect.

One known issue is how very non-transparent the grills are. I've read some second hand accounts that Andrew Jones designed the speaker with these grills in mind, or at least to be used specifically with the grills on. But after the measurements, I can't see that as anything but marketing hype, the all to common, "it's a feature" excuses.

Pioneer BS22 measurements: Close mic and 1 meter


In the above graphs you have close mic measurements on top (mic at tweeter) and then 1 meter measurements at below. 1/6 octave smoothing used on

As you can see, with the grills on there is a pretty large dip at centered at 8.5khz. (in RED), removing the plastic (in GREEN) didn't have all the effect that I had hoped for, but there was some measurable improvement. How well that translates to your ears, I'm not sure. Removing the grills entirely (in BLUE) is still the best option for the flattest frequency response from the tweeter.

Does modding the grill make a huge difference? No, not really. But if you prefer the look of the grills being on or you are trying to protect the tweeter from little fingers; I do think it is a worthy and easy mod to make.

Modded Grill
http://i.imgur.com/UgHVPHS.jpg
I've worked with perhaps 200 pairs of the 22's, and have listened and measured with and without the grills. Whether nude or with grill, the 22's are good speakers for the money, but lack transparency in the lower treble and upper midrange irrespective of grill implementation. The tweeter itself is the problem, not the grill. I've come to the conclusion that the ear doesn't respond the same way to reflections and cancellations caused by grill frames as it does from inherent irregularities caused by the drivers and/or crossover. Reflections will measure differently depending on your distance from the speakers and mic placement. A hole that looks scary on a 1-meter plot may fill in by the time all of the direct and reflected sound reaches you. A driver resonance, however, will cause ringing and delayed decay that will be audible no matter where you are or where you measure. I remember a rather heated exchange between Stereophile's John Atkinson and Richard Vandersteen concerning Stereophile's measurements of the excellent model 7 loudspeaker. I've heard this speaker on several occasions and was always impressed by the neutrality of the midrange reproduction. The measurements, however, showed a pretty bumpy ride in this area. The Vandy 7 has a cloth grill stretched around 4 posts. Richard said that the ups and downs in the measured response were simply reflections off of the posts, and were benign. John stuck to the measurements. You can conduct your own mind experiment on this issue. Imagine you're listening to a pair of good loudspeakers without grills , and someone places four thin posts around the perimeter of the speaker. The measured response will change significantly. Do you really think you will hear a difference? Of course, if the grill material absorbs high frequencies significantly, you might hear a slight softening in the highs. But that's a different issue than sharp dips or peaks in the response.
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post #6196 of 6196 Old Today, 06:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by [Irishman] View Post
Why not just take the grills off? I do.
That is an option - however, a lot of people will not be able to pick up a difference.
Plus, they are budget-friendly speakers that are good for the price. Looking for or
expecting perfection at their price point is rare.

It someone wants a more balanced speaker for a little more - then get the Murphy
modded AA speakers.

Overall the Pioneer measure better than some of them more expensive speakers,
with the grill on or off.

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Speakers > MB Quart VS05, Boston VS260, Snell K7
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Receiver > Tascam PAR-200, Pioneer VSX-30
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Pioneer Andrew Jones Sp Fs52 Flr Stand Loudspeaker , Pioneer Andrew Jones Designed Bookshelf Loudspeakers Sp Bs22 Lr , Pioneer , Speakers Subwoofers , Speaker Systems , Pioneer Sp Bs41 Lr 130 Watt Rms 2 Way Speaker , Elite Vsx 31 A V Receiver

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