Philharmonic Audio - Dennis Murphy - Page 158 - AVS Forum
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post #4711 of 4724 Old 09-06-2014, 09:03 AM
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Originally Posted by Dennis Murphy View Post
Just as a factual comment, the Sr's are dead, long live the jr's. I dropped the Sr's because they didn't offer enough extra to justify the price premium over the jr's. I just redid my site to get everything up to date and simplified.

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post #4712 of 4724 Old 09-07-2014, 09:13 AM
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[quote=Dennis Murphy;27177714]
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Originally Posted by ahblaza View Post
Thanks, I am. My room is just about 3400cf with an opening of 8' midway down the left side wall. I think the Jrs would be just fine, custom center and Phil monitors for sides. Although the Srs are equally tempting.[/QUOT

Just as a factual comment, the Sr's are dead, long live the jr's. I dropped the Sr's because they didn't offer enough extra to justify the price premium over the jr's. I just redid my site to get everything up to date and simplified.
The new, cleaned up site looks great!
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post #4713 of 4724 Old 09-08-2014, 08:24 AM
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I am considering using 4 - Phil Jr's in a small home theater install for L-R fronts and L-R surrounds. I have never used or heard open back cabinets for this purpose but have a very high confidence level in Philharmonic products for music reproduction. But in an HT application, what can I expect when using these open (mid) cabinets in these four positions?
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post #4714 of 4724 Old 09-08-2014, 09:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Chucka View Post
I am considering using 4 - Phil Jr's in a small home theater install for L-R fronts and L-R surrounds. I have never used or heard open back cabinets for this purpose but have a very high confidence level in Philharmonic products for music reproduction. But in an HT application, what can I expect when using these open (mid) cabinets in these four positions?
You're better off with Philharmonitors (or other cheaper speakers if it's strictly for HT) and use the money to get a sub and/or a center channel.
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post #4715 of 4724 Old 09-08-2014, 10:20 AM
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Originally Posted by charmerci View Post
You're better off with Philharmonitors (or other cheaper speakers if it's strictly for HT) and use the money to get a sub and/or a center channel.
I do plan on purchasing the new 3-Way center that Dennis is developing to go with the Phil Jr's. As this is a condo and listening levels will be relatively low, I am initially going to try to NOT use subs. What I am asking here is for opinions on the performance of open back design of the Phil Jr's in HT (in L-R front and L-R surround) applications?

Thanks,

Chuck
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post #4716 of 4724 Old 09-08-2014, 11:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Chucka View Post
I do plan on purchasing the new 3-Way center that Dennis is developing to go with the Phil Jr's. As this is a condo and listening levels will be relatively low, I am initially going to try to NOT use subs.
Movies have a lot of dynamic range. What might be a very quiet dialogue level might give you an unexpected explosion. It's the nature of HT and it doesn't matter what speakers you use. You can compress the dynamic range with Blu Ray Dynamic Range Compression but it may never sound right that way. What does this mean?

I means that even if you don't use a sub, I still recommend running your speakers as small during movie-watching so that the little 6" mid is not over-driven. Set them back to large for music-listening.

I also second the use of the more simple Philharmonitor bookshelves for surrounds. Phil Slim Jrs are overkill in that application. Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if the Affordable Accuracy bookshelves suffice. :P

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What I am asking here is for opinions on the performance of open back design of the Phil Jr's in HT (in L-R front and L-R surround) applications?
I think they are very articulate and resolving of dialogue. I've been using my Philharmonic 2s in stereo, but they also handle phantom center duty during movies. I can't complain and I barely have any fill in the back - however my baffles are a good five+ feet away from the back wall.

But as I said, with the dynamic range movies have, you can be listening at a comfortably quiet level, and then be startled by even the sound of a motocycle engine revving. It's just the truth of the recording itself.
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post #4717 of 4724 Old 09-08-2014, 11:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chucka View Post
I do plan on purchasing the new 3-Way center that Dennis is developing to go with the Phil Jr's. As this is a condo and listening levels will be relatively low, I am initially going to try to NOT use subs. What I am asking here is for opinions on the performance of open back design of the Phil Jr's in HT (in L-R front and L-R surround) applications?

Thanks,

Chuck

Although I'm not sure the open-back design would be ideal for a center channel (and I understand you won't be using them for that purpose), I can't see any disadvantage in using them for mains and surrounds, and they might add depth to the presentation. It's really no-risk, however. I supply rear grill inserts that will effectively turn the Slims into a conventional front-radiator if you didn't like the rear wave information, or if you just wanted to experiment.
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post #4718 of 4724 Old 09-08-2014, 11:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Dennis Murphy View Post
Although I'm not sure the open-back design would be ideal for a center channel (and I understand you won't be using them for that purpose), I can't see any disadvantage in using them for mains and surrounds, and they might add depth to the presentation. It's really no-risk, however. I supply rear grill inserts that will effectively turn the Slims into a conventional front-radiator if you didn't like the rear wave information, or if you just wanted to experiment.
Thanks again for your reply Dennis,

Chuck
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post #4719 of 4724 Old 09-13-2014, 09:42 PM
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Hi all,
perhaps a weird question here from a happy Philharmonic 3 listener:
Can I play an instrument through these speakers, or would I risk harming them?

Reason: got me a Kawai MP7 stage piano and looking for good amplification. Want to use it also to simulate Hammond B3, which goes real low.
My 3's are hooked up to a Crown XLS1500 power amp, which should be suited for amplifying instruments.
When I connect the piano to the Crown, the sound seems OK, but none too loud even with all potmeters fully open. I'd like to play louder, especially with a companion on the drums.

Many people think I'd better use studio monitors. Interesting discussion here: http://www.pianoworld.com/forum/ubbt...te_id/1#import

I think the question boils down to: Can a speaker like this "handle high power input levels with little sign of distress"? (Quote from JBL's factsheet of their 4312A).

(sidenote: listening to these speakers really awakened my desire to make music again)
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post #4720 of 4724 Old 09-14-2014, 08:30 AM
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Originally Posted by kezebees View Post
Hi all,
perhaps a weird question here from a happy Philharmonic 3 listener:
Can I play an instrument through these speakers, or would I risk harming them?

Reason: got me a Kawai MP7 stage piano and looking for good amplification. Want to use it also to simulate Hammond B3, which goes real low.
My 3's are hooked up to a Crown XLS1500 power amp, which should be suited for amplifying instruments.
When I connect the piano to the Crown, the sound seems OK, but none too loud even with all potmeters fully open. I'd like to play louder, especially with a companion on the drums.

Many people think I'd better use studio monitors. Interesting discussion here: http://www.pianoworld.com/forum/ubbt...te_id/1#import

I think the question boils down to: Can a speaker like this "handle high power input levels with little sign of distress"? (Quote from JBL's factsheet of their 4312A).

(sidenote: listening to these speakers really awakened my desire to make music again)

Hi. I'm glad to hear you're enjoying the 3's for music. As for your keyboard problems, it sounds to be like the piano just isn't supplying enough gain to the Crown. There's no danger of harm to the 3's--it's the amp-keyboard interface that seems to be off. If the Crown can drive the 3's to high enough output for music, it can do it for the keyboard, assuming the Crown is getting enough signal. If there's no way to boost the output from the Kawai, I guess you would have to use more sensitive or powered monitors. That would be a shame, because they're not going to plumb the depths like the 3's. Maybe someone out there can chime in with some advice on optimizing the keyboard-Crown interface. I just haven't had any experience with that.
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post #4721 of 4724 Old 09-14-2014, 10:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dennis Murphy View Post
Hi. I'm glad to hear you're enjoying the 3's for music. As for your keyboard problems, it sounds to be like the piano just isn't supplying enough gain to the Crown. There's no danger of harm to the 3's--it's the amp-keyboard interface that seems to be off. If the Crown can drive the 3's to high enough output for music, it can do it for the keyboard, assuming the Crown is getting enough signal. If there's no way to boost the output from the Kawai, I guess you would have to use more sensitive or powered monitors. That would be a shame, because they're not going to plumb the depths like the 3's. Maybe someone out there can chime in with some advice on optimizing the keyboard-Crown interface. I just haven't had any experience with that.
I think simply adding a basic pre-amp in line with the system ought to do the trick. The question is then "which one" and i think the folks are sweetwater etc should have some recommendations.
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post #4722 of 4724 Old 09-14-2014, 11:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kezebees View Post
Hi all,
perhaps a weird question here from a happy Philharmonic 3 listener:
Can I play an instrument through these speakers, or would I risk harming them?

Reason: got me a Kawai MP7 stage piano and looking for good amplification. Want to use it also to simulate Hammond B3, which goes real low.
My 3's are hooked up to a Crown XLS1500 power amp, which should be suited for amplifying instruments.
When I connect the piano to the Crown, the sound seems OK, but none too loud even with all potmeters fully open. I'd like to play louder, especially with a companion on the drums.

Many people think I'd better use studio monitors. Interesting discussion here: http://www.pianoworld.com/forum/ubbt...te_id/1#import

I think the question boils down to: Can a speaker like this "handle high power input levels with little sign of distress"? (Quote from JBL's factsheet of their 4312A).

(sidenote: listening to these speakers really awakened my desire to make music again)
I once hooked up an electronic keyboard to my old stereo system and B&W speakers (6.5" mid-woofers). I can't remember if I hooked the keyboard directly to the speakers or through the system but on the low notes those woofers were trying to jump out of the cabinet. Scary stuff! Use caution.
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post #4723 of 4724 Old 09-14-2014, 12:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kezebees View Post
My 3's are hooked up to a Crown XLS1500 power amp, which should be suited for amplifying instruments.
When I connect the piano to the Crown, the sound seems OK, but none too loud even with all potmeters fully open. I'd like to play louder, especially with a companion on the drums.
I looked into it a bit. One of these:

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/CleanBoxPro/

Will actively increase the voltage of the system between your keyboard and amp, allowing the XLS1500 to be driven to full power (which should be... very loud. At least my XLS2000 is)

Quote:
Can I play an instrument through these speakers, or would I risk harming them?
Once you've put the cleanbox in, set the amp gain dials all the way to the bottom, and then work your way up.
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post #4724 of 4724 Old 09-14-2014, 07:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Dennis Murphy View Post
There's no danger of harm to the 3's...
I guess you would have to use more sensitive or powered monitors. That would be a shame, because they're not going to plumb the depths like the 3's.
Thanks Dennis! That's what I needed to know. And indeed, to use the depth of the 3's is what I'm wishing for.

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Originally Posted by charmerci View Post
Scary stuff! Use caution.
Will do!

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Originally Posted by Eternal Velocity View Post
I looked into it a bit. One of these:
http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/CleanBoxPro/
Thanks a lot for the heads up EV! Didn't know this existed. I need to experiment a bit first, I used adapters from 1/4" to RCA coz I didn't have 2 good 1/4" cables at hand, perhaps that was the problem (I didn't send a real 'level' signal perhaps).

Thanks all for your input, and for indulging in a bit of off-topic sidetracking.
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