Philharmonic Audio - Dennis Murphy - Page 29 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 13Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #841 of 4690 Old 03-14-2012, 04:30 PM
AVS Special Member
 
d_m1010's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Northern Exposure Canada
Posts: 1,866
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Liked: 146
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eternal Velocity View Post

Beyond that, the rated 20wpc probably means about 30-35w into 4 ohms if that, which is not a lot of power for a lowish sensitivity speaker like this (87.5dB/2.83v/1M). It puts the typical max SPL around 90db which is rather low. Now for more compressed music this is fine but for classical and anything with lots of percussion, they could sound flat and restrained as SPL demands are normally 5-6db louder in the midrange. I would personally like to have 100db capability out of my amp, whether or not I ever actually use it. For these speakers, to fulful that requirement you'd need around 300w @ 4 ohms (> 150wpc amp). A bit less is normally adequate, but even then you'd still need an amp that can do 150w @ 4 ohms (> 75wpc amp)

Do you prefer the sound of the speakers, or the sound of the tube?

Thanks for your response. I have the Bryston 4B SST2 which is 300wpc into 8ohms for my main amp but I want to use the tube amp I have as well hence the question.
d_m1010 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #842 of 4690 Old 03-14-2012, 04:35 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Eternal Velocity's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,332
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by d_m1010 View Post

Thanks for your response. I have the Bryston 4B SST2 which is 300wpc into 8ohms for my main amp but I want to use the tube amp I have as well hence the question.

The Bryston is a much better fit.

Finding speakers for a 20w tube amp is a tough calling. The watts are okay for a low powered setup, but the output impedance is the real issue. TRUE tube-friendly speakers can be counted on one hand.
Eternal Velocity is offline  
post #843 of 4690 Old 03-14-2012, 04:37 PM
AVS Special Member
 
d_m1010's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Northern Exposure Canada
Posts: 1,866
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Liked: 146
I guess I have to liquidate the tube amp.
d_m1010 is offline  
post #844 of 4690 Old 03-14-2012, 04:54 PM
Member
 
anarkhia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Qc, Canada
Posts: 126
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by d_m1010 View Post

Thank you!

I have a 30 watt per channel Ideal Innovations Elite 80 tube amp. Do you all think they'll drive the phil2s at all?

I'm not qualified enough to answer that... after all I was mostly a projector guy until lately =) Chance are good Dennis can answer to that.

Was wondering the same for my pioneer 1019( 140watt x 7 for 8 ohm... not made for 4 ohm according to them). Guess ill just see on day 1 =)
anarkhia is offline  
post #845 of 4690 Old 03-14-2012, 05:25 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Eternal Velocity's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,332
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by anarkhia View Post

Was wondering the same for my pioneer 1019( 140watt x 7 for 8 ohm... not made for 4 ohm according to them). Guess ill just see on day 1 =)

Just FIY it doesn't have the same output impedance issues as the tubes, and also should have around 5db of relative headroom.

No it won't drive the phils to the loudest levels but it should also suffice for the most part.

It's the difference between an effectively 15w amp and an effectively 60w amp.
Eternal Velocity is offline  
post #846 of 4690 Old 03-14-2012, 07:01 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Nuance's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 11,583
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 58
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eternal Velocity View Post

The Bryston is a much better fit.

Finding speakers for a 20w tube amp is a tough calling. The watts are okay for a low powered setup, but the output impedance is the real issue. TRUE tube-friendly speakers can be counted on one hand.

Agreed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by anarkhia View Post

I'm not qualified enough to answer that... after all I was mostly a projector guy until lately =) Chance are good Dennis can answer to that.

Was wondering the same for my pioneer 1019( 140watt x 7 for 8 ohm... not made for 4 ohm according to them). Guess ill just see on day 1 =)

Pioneer says it won't work with a 4 ohm load? Really?

My journey to find the "perfect" speaker
Dr. Olive's Blog

 

 

No matter what measurements tell us, a loudspeaker isn’t good until it
sounds good. - Dr. Floyd Toole
Nuance is offline  
post #847 of 4690 Old 03-14-2012, 07:47 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Dennis Murphy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,583
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 29 Post(s)
Liked: 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by d_m1010 View Post

I guess I have to liquidate the tube amp.

Hey--plug it in, hook it up, and see what happens. I doubt that the local volunteer fire department will get a call if you don't ram the volume up full tilt. The Phils are an easy load compared with some 3-ways I could mention, but won't on my lawyer's advice.
Dennis Murphy is offline  
post #848 of 4690 Old 03-14-2012, 09:43 PM
Member
 
anarkhia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Qc, Canada
Posts: 126
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Pioneer says it won't work with a 4 ohm load? Really?[/quote]

No they never said it wont work, but i had emailed customer service about 2 week ago. They said ( don't remember exact sentence) that they were not build optimally for it and the entrance lvl pioneer elite would work fine. Something around those lines.
anarkhia is offline  
post #849 of 4690 Old 03-15-2012, 12:34 AM
Advanced Member
 
Twylight's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 555
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I did not find any challenges in driving these off any products. I think a really nice low wattage tube amp would be great.

My rig of the week - sn972 = emotiva xp3 on LCR, surrounds on sn972 - got a big old parasound at the repair shop - Salk ccaow1, another sn 972 downstairs

on the sale bin:
onkyo 905
onkyo 807
emo umc1
emo usp2
2 def tech bp 30
2 def tech bp 20
2 def tech bp 8
def tech clr2500

REW...most expensive freeware ever...

Twylight is offline  
post #850 of 4690 Old 03-15-2012, 04:36 AM
AVS Special Member
 
d_m1010's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Northern Exposure Canada
Posts: 1,866
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Liked: 146
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dennis Murphy View Post

Hey--plug it in, hook it up, and see what happens. I doubt that the local volunteer fire department will get a call if you don't ram the volume up full tilt. The Phils are an easy load compared with some 3-ways I could mention, but won't on my lawyer's advice.

lol thanks dude.
d_m1010 is offline  
post #851 of 4690 Old 03-15-2012, 05:44 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Nuance's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 11,583
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 58
Quote:
Originally Posted by anarkhia View Post


No they never said it wont work, but i had emailed customer service about 2 week ago. They said ( don't remember exact sentence) that they were not build optimally for it and the entrance lvl pioneer elite would work fine. Something around those lines.

It sounds like they were pitching a sale to you. Regardless, I suppose it would worry me a bit, as it is considering an entry level receiver (no offense). I just looked at pics of it and see no preouts either. Bummer.

My journey to find the "perfect" speaker
Dr. Olive's Blog

 

 

No matter what measurements tell us, a loudspeaker isn’t good until it
sounds good. - Dr. Floyd Toole
Nuance is offline  
post #852 of 4690 Old 03-15-2012, 09:14 AM
Senior Member
 
fuzz092888's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: The woods
Posts: 488
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

No they never said it wont work, but i had emailed customer service about 2 week ago. They said ( don't remember exact sentence) that they were not build optimally for it and the entrance lvl pioneer elite would work fine. Something around those lines.

It sounds like they were pitching a sale to you. Regardless, I suppose it would worry me a bit, as it is considering an entry level receiver (no offense). I just looked at pics of it and see no preouts either. Bummer.[/quote]

Funny thing is I just emailed pioneer about a week ago to ask about the elite Sc-57 and if it supported a 4 ohm load and they said no. I still have the email somewhere, but I believe they said the receiver will only handle 6-16 ohms. Conflicting information much?
fuzz092888 is offline  
post #853 of 4690 Old 03-15-2012, 11:43 AM
Member
 
anarkhia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Qc, Canada
Posts: 126
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by fuzz092888 View Post

It sounds like they were pitching a sale to you. Regardless, I suppose it would worry me a bit, as it is considering an entry level receiver (no offense). I just looked at pics of it and see no preouts either. Bummer.

Funny thing is I just emailed pioneer about a week ago to ask about the elite Sc-57 and if it supported a 4 ohm load and they said no. I still have the email somewhere, but I believe they said the receiver will only handle 6-16 ohms. Conflicting information much?[/quote]

Wow...isnt that their flagship like 2.5 k amp???, would be surprised if it doesnt handle 4 ohm speaker.
anarkhia is offline  
post #854 of 4690 Old 03-15-2012, 05:02 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Saturn94's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 4,150
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18 Post(s)
Liked: 364
Quote:
Originally Posted by anarkhia View Post

Funny thing is I just emailed pioneer about a week ago to ask about the elite Sc-57 and if it supported a 4 ohm load and they said no. I still have the email somewhere, but I believe they said the receiver will only handle 6-16 ohms. Conflicting information much?

Quote:


Wow...isnt that their flagship like 2.5 k amp???, would be surprised if it doesnt handle 4 ohm speaker.

If Pioneer is handling their "flagship" receivers like they are their "flagship" BD players, then it wouldn't surprise me.

Saturn94 is offline  
post #855 of 4690 Old 03-15-2012, 06:05 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Eternal Velocity's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,332
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by anarkhia View Post

Funny thing is I just emailed pioneer about a week ago to ask about the elite Sc-57 and if it supported a 4 ohm load and they said no. I still have the email somewhere, but I believe they said the receiver will only handle 6-16 ohms. Conflicting information much?

Wow...isnt that their flagship like 2.5 k amp???, would be surprised if it doesnt handle 4 ohm speaker.[/quote]

You have to realize that most speakers which claim to be 4 ohm, may very well be 2.5 ohm with difficult phase angles.

In comparision, even though they're almost entirely 4 ohm, most companies would pass the philharmonics off as 6 ohm!
Eternal Velocity is offline  
post #856 of 4690 Old 03-15-2012, 06:29 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Dennis Murphy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,583
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 29 Post(s)
Liked: 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eternal Velocity View Post

Wow...isnt that their flagship like 2.5 k amp???, would be surprised if it doesnt handle 4 ohm speaker.

You have to realize that most speakers which claim to be 4 ohm, may very well be 2.5 ohm with difficult phase angles.

In comparision, even though they're almost entirely 4 ohm, most companies would pass the philharmonics off as 6 ohm![/quote]

Right. But amps are boring. Back to speakers--I just packed these up and will send them Oklahoma-way tomorrow.
LL
LL
Dennis Murphy is offline  
post #857 of 4690 Old 03-15-2012, 06:32 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Monkish54's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: LA
Posts: 1,306
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dennis Murphy View Post


Right. But amps are boring. Back to speakers--I just packed these up and will send them Oklahoma-way tomorrow.

LMAO!

Those look gorgeous!! Who are those going to, Dennis?

HAVE:

Receiver: Marantz SR6004
Speakers: Philharmonic 2; TagMclaren Calliope; Pioneer BS-22
Sub: W15GTI MKII (Tuned to 20hz; 300 liter enclosure) X 2
Monkish54 is offline  
post #858 of 4690 Old 03-15-2012, 07:32 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Dennis Murphy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,583
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 29 Post(s)
Liked: 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by Monkish54 View Post

LMAO!

Those look gorgeous!! Who are those going to, Dennis?

Someone who likes bright shiny red speakers, and who already owns Orions and some obscure speaker from the Harmon Group. The name escapes me now--Saloon? Balloon? No, that's not it. And one of those funny looking concentric driver thingies from KEF.
Dennis Murphy is offline  
post #859 of 4690 Old 03-15-2012, 07:41 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Monkish54's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: LA
Posts: 1,306
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dennis Murphy View Post


Someone who likes bright shiny red speakers, and who already owns Orions and some obscure speaker from the Harmon Group. The name escapes me now--Saloon? Balloon? No, that's not it. And one of those funny looking concentric driver thingies from KEF.

LMAO! I don't know 'im. Tell me more about these Balloon's!!!

Yes!! I'm more excited than he is!!

HAVE:

Receiver: Marantz SR6004
Speakers: Philharmonic 2; TagMclaren Calliope; Pioneer BS-22
Sub: W15GTI MKII (Tuned to 20hz; 300 liter enclosure) X 2
Monkish54 is offline  
post #860 of 4690 Old 03-16-2012, 04:12 AM
Senior Member
 
jclif77's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 269
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I'm in love with this speaker line, never heard them but I've been keeping up with this thread and I wish I could get a pair. The tweeter and mid range looks like a symphony all balled up into a beautiful work of art. Just sharing....
jclif77 is offline  
post #861 of 4690 Old 03-16-2012, 05:59 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Nuance's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 11,583
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 58
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dennis Murphy View Post


Right. But amps are boring. Back to speakers--I just packed these up and will send them Oklahoma-way tomorrow.

LOL - nice segue, Dennis!

My journey to find the "perfect" speaker
Dr. Olive's Blog

 

 

No matter what measurements tell us, a loudspeaker isn’t good until it
sounds good. - Dr. Floyd Toole
Nuance is offline  
post #862 of 4690 Old 03-16-2012, 06:14 AM
Member
 
bcg27's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Rockville, MD
Posts: 121
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dennis Murphy View Post

Someone who likes bright shiny red speakers, and who already owns Orions and some obscure speaker from the Harmon Group. The name escapes me now--Saloon? Balloon? No, that's not it. And one of those funny looking concentric driver thingies from KEF.

I would be very interested in hearing a comparison to Orions.
bcg27 is offline  
post #863 of 4690 Old 03-16-2012, 07:13 AM
AVS Special Member
 
d_m1010's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Northern Exposure Canada
Posts: 1,866
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Liked: 146
Shiny is nice. I like my SVS subs and NHTs that are all gloss black, but they reflect light. The Phils are going in the same room with the ht and projector, and hence I'm glad the finish is satin/matte to keep those reflections to a minimum. And no one is going to see them anyway but me lol.
d_m1010 is offline  
post #864 of 4690 Old 03-16-2012, 08:12 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Randy Bessinger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,279
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 24 Post(s)
Liked: 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dennis Murphy View Post

Someone who likes bright shiny red speakers, and who already owns Orions and some obscure speaker from the Harmon Group. The name escapes me now--Saloon? Balloon? No, that's not it. And one of those funny looking concentric driver thingies from KEF.

My understanding is that the Harmon "Balloons" are filled with helium and the image just floats in the middle of the room....amazing technology.
Randy Bessinger is offline  
post #865 of 4690 Old 03-16-2012, 10:15 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 4,257
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 102 Post(s)
Liked: 235
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dennis Murphy View Post

Someone who likes bright shiny red speakers, and who already owns Orions and some obscure speaker from the Harmon Group. The name escapes me now--Saloon? Balloon? No, that's not it. And one of those funny looking concentric driver thingies from KEF.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Monkish54 View Post

LMAO! I don't know 'im. Tell me more about these Balloon's!!!

Yes!! I'm more excited than he is!!

Got everything ready for the shiny red Phil3. All I have to do is hook them up once I get them. They will sit between the Salon2 & Orion3.

Sitting chart: 201/2 --> Salon2 --> Philharmonic3 --> Orion3

Hey, I just noticed the 2's go before the 3's.
AcuDefTechGuy is offline  
post #866 of 4690 Old 03-16-2012, 10:47 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Dennis Murphy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,583
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 29 Post(s)
Liked: 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by AcuDefTechGuy View Post

Got everything ready for the shiny red Phil3. All I have to do is hook them up once I get them. They will sit between the Salon2 & Orion3.

Sitting chart: 201/2 --> Salon2 --> Philharmonic3 --> Orion3

Hey, I just noticed the 2's go before the 3's.

Well, they're sitting out front waiting for the Fed Ex dude. Who pretty much hates me. I've never heard the Salons--what's their useful low end extension?
Dennis Murphy is offline  
post #867 of 4690 Old 03-16-2012, 10:50 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Monkish54's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: LA
Posts: 1,306
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dennis Murphy View Post


Well, they're sitting out front waiting for the Fed Ex dude. Who pretty much hates me.

LOL He wont be buying you any electric knifes in the near future?

HAVE:

Receiver: Marantz SR6004
Speakers: Philharmonic 2; TagMclaren Calliope; Pioneer BS-22
Sub: W15GTI MKII (Tuned to 20hz; 300 liter enclosure) X 2
Monkish54 is offline  
post #868 of 4690 Old 03-16-2012, 10:58 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Monkish54's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: LA
Posts: 1,306
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dennis Murphy View Post


I've never heard the Salons--what's their useful low end extension?

23hz @ -3db
17hz @ -10db

HAVE:

Receiver: Marantz SR6004
Speakers: Philharmonic 2; TagMclaren Calliope; Pioneer BS-22
Sub: W15GTI MKII (Tuned to 20hz; 300 liter enclosure) X 2
Monkish54 is offline  
post #869 of 4690 Old 03-16-2012, 11:32 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Nuance's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 11,583
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 58
Quote:
Originally Posted by AcuDefTechGuy View Post

Got everything ready for the shiny red Phil3. All I have to do is hook them up once I get them. They will sit between the Salon2 & Orion3.

Sitting chart: 201/2 --> Salon2 --> Philharmonic3 --> Orion3

Hey, I just noticed the 2's go before the 3's.

Do you pull them out when you listen? Just curious. I am looking forward to seeing pics of the Three Amigos all next to each other.

My journey to find the "perfect" speaker
Dr. Olive's Blog

 

 

No matter what measurements tell us, a loudspeaker isn’t good until it
sounds good. - Dr. Floyd Toole
Nuance is offline  
post #870 of 4690 Old 03-16-2012, 11:35 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Nethawk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 2,513
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dennis Murphy View Post

Well, they're sitting out front waiting for the Fed Ex dude. Who pretty much hates me. I've never heard the Salons--what's their useful low end extension?

I wouldn't worry too much ADTG, he probably won't mishandle the boxes that badly!

Nethawk is offline  
Reply Speakers

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off