HSU HB1 Mk2 vs Energy RC-10 ??? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 76 Old 08-22-2011, 04:43 PM - Thread Starter
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Has anyone heard both speakers and can comment on how they compare?

I know the HSU hb1s retail for 1/2 the price of the RC10s. Yes, the RC10s are discontinued; however, they can be had at the same price. Thus, I would love to hear your thoughts.

http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/hb-1.html

http://www.energy-speakers.com/na-en...c-10-overview/
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post #2 of 76 Old 08-22-2011, 06:31 PM
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I have not heard the rc10s, but have heard the mk2’s for about an hour or so. They sound good, very smooth and definitely a great choice. I think I preferred the smooth sound and dynamics of the hsu’s compared to the x-series, but liked the x-series for their detail and truly being one of the best bargains in the industry (what happened later is another story). My experiences with energy speakers are very good though. I liked the sound of the rc50s and I have some older energy speakers right now in an mtm design and they sound fantastic. They are just very smooth and easy to listen to. They are efficient and really sound great both at lower and high listening levels. Very impressed and I think you can’t go wrong with them, compared to other speakers that some say sound harsh or on the other hand, dull.

I did spend considerable time with the ascend cbm 170s though. Imo the ascends had a distinct advantage over the hsu’s in that they were more detailed. The ascends are said to be neutral, but I found them a tad on the forward side compared to the x-series and elt speakers from 321va. The latter speakers are a bit laid back, so this is why the ascends probably struck me as more forward sounding versus neutral. The 170s were “airy” and the midrange was great. Another thing is the 170s had great off-axis sound and were forgiving about placement. For movies I think the added detail and better off-axis response of the ascends is welcomed. For hours of music listening, I think the hsu’s pull ahead. I prefer a more neutral sounding speaker and the 170s deliver the sound I prefer here over the hsu’s. The SEAS tweeter is good and I believe the caps and inductors are probably higher quality than most b&m brands for the same price range. Bass was a touch light, but the x-series was a bit boomy here. On the other hand, the bass was accurate; there was no artificial boom or muddy sound. For their price of about $350, I think the ascends are very hard to beat for a pair of new speakers. My only gripe with the ascends was the finish, they are definitely not beauty queens. I did like that fingerprints were less likely to show up and they didn’t reflect light like my satin black x-series and piano black speakers. The build quality of the speaker was nice as well. The real kicker here is I’m talking about the classic version of the ascend 170s. I later heard the se version and thought they were a step up from the classics. Not a night and day difference, but definitely noticeable. They sounded punchier and definitely make a strong case for themselves, they are very well reviewed.

My reasoning for stating my experiences with the 170s is that I believe they pull ahead of the hsu’s in the $300 price point (they are about $50 more expensive). I will also state the 170s sounded great at lower volumes. While the hsu’s are efficient I’m not sure that I like the sound of laid back speakers at lower volumes. My experience with some speakers, notable the rockets is they really like power. They need higher volumes to shine (at low volumes they sound held back). The hsu’s look better, but ascend wins in the performance department to my ears. With that being said, my guess is the rc10 is going to be a better speaker, but it should at about $200-250 more (normal price). Depending on your room (very important) I think the upgrade from the hsu’s to the rc10s is going to be noticeable. The rc10s are VERY hard to beat at their sale price.

I know you REALLY want a fancy finish but I think the rc10s are going to be a better choice. They are very well reviewed and many people on the board enjoy them greatly. Their sale pricing seals the deal. However, the only way to truly know is to listen to them both. In the same environment is ideal but sometimes that is difficult to do. Different people hear different things, and you might prefer a sound that others don’t necessarily like. Maybe you don’t hear a difference, hell maybe you think two completely different speakers sound the same. That’s part of the fun and beauty of this hobby. However, with the rc10 currently being the same price as the hsu’s I would recommend them over the hsu’s.
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post #3 of 76 Old 08-22-2011, 06:39 PM
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Btw there was a review done with the hsu's and other speakers in that price range, but I forgot where. I do remember that the polk monitor 30s easily walked away from the hsu's. I believe all those in attendance strongly preferred the polks...
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post #4 of 76 Old 08-23-2011, 12:22 AM
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I have owned both for about 2 years now and rotate them in and out of my bedroom setup, as I do like the sound of both. I have them running off a Yamaha 765 receiver and and Emotiva UPA-2 amp. The HSU's win out in the bass category by far, at all volume levels. The HSU's are also more sensitive, proally by about 2-3db in room, and they can play a small amount louder. At normal levels the HSU's sound like they are coming from a spot directly in the middle of them, and its very hard to tell where they are.

The HSU's are alot more industrial looking then the Energys(I have cherry ones). The RC-10's are a very attractive speaker. I use both with the grills off. I can listen to both of the speakers for a long time and not get tired of either. If I had to pick one, for two channel without a sub, I would say the HSU's. With a sub, its proally a toss up depending on what kind of sound you like. Good luck...
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post #5 of 76 Old 08-23-2011, 05:52 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the thoughts Interspy24. Great write up.

Nixonrsx, you were the guy I was hoping existed! Thank you for the comparison, as that is invaluable information to me.

I currently have the piano black HSU HB1 mk2s. The finish is absolutely beautiful. I saw the black ash Energy RC10s on sale and was debating about getting them. Honestly, I am happy with the HSUs. I did not know what, if any, I would gain by getting the RC10s. There is no doubt the RC10 is well reviewed and more popular compared to the HSU. That doesn't necessarily mean that the RC10 is the clear winner.






Here is a link to my install:

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post #6 of 76 Old 08-23-2011, 09:14 AM
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Interesting observations-I thought the majority of people would prefer the RC-10s. I've never heard the HSUs but would certainly like to. I wonder why there's not a ton of talk about HSU speakers? You would think the outstanding reputation of their subs would create more buzz about their speakers.

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post #7 of 76 Old 08-23-2011, 09:36 AM
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Originally Posted by holt7153 View Post
Interesting observations-I thought the majority of people would prefer the RC-10s. I've never heard the HSUs but would certainly like to. I wonder why there's not a ton of talk about HSU speakers? You would think the outstanding reputation of their subs would create more buzz about their speakers.
holt...Hsu is in Anaheim. Make an appointment and head over for a demo of the speakers and their subs. Great bang for the buck.

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post #8 of 76 Old 08-23-2011, 09:42 AM
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I would go with the RC-10s.
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post #9 of 76 Old 08-23-2011, 09:55 AM
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Hey no problem, yours a very nice looking, I have the matte black ones. Also I forgot to mention that the size of the room had a big effect on the RC-10's for me. I have them in my room, which is about 13 x 15, and they have no problem in there. But if I put them out in the tv room or my pool room they just lose all there excitement to me, those room are about 20 x 17. They just get lost in the room. Depending on the volumes you listen I would take that into consideration.
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post #10 of 76 Old 08-23-2011, 09:59 AM
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I had the opportunity to listen the Hsu's at their location in Anaheim, and I was really impressed. Ultimately I decided to spend more money and get Ascend Sierras, but if I had not had the budget I would have picked up the Hsu's without a second thought.

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post #11 of 76 Old 08-23-2011, 10:01 AM
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I listened to the HB1s at their old Anaheim location as well. They were pretty good with movies, no doubt. The RCs have a much better tweeter though and sounded much better with music, IMO. I owned a pair of RC-50s.
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post #12 of 76 Old 08-23-2011, 10:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drewTT View Post
I listened to the HB1s at their old Anaheim location as well. They were pretty good with movies, no doubt. The RCs have a much better tweeter though and sounded much better with music, IMO. I owned a pair of RC-50s.
Drew, if it was at their old facility(that complex is next to the new complex), I would guess you heard the MK1 as opposed to the MK2. Do you happen to know?

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post #13 of 76 Old 08-23-2011, 10:21 AM
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Drew, if it was at their old facility(that complex is next to the new complex), I would guess you heard the MK1 as opposed to the MK2. Do you happen to know?
Well. I am not sure. I was there demoing a sub and listening to the speakers was secondary so I can't exactly recall if it was the MK1 or MK2. It was right before they moved offices.
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post #14 of 76 Old 08-23-2011, 10:28 AM
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holt...Hsu is in Anaheim. Make an appointment and head over for a demo of the speakers and their subs. Great bang for the buck.

Thanks-not in the market right now but just curious as to why I don't see them recommended all that often. $300-$350 for a pair is very reasonable.

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post #15 of 76 Old 08-28-2011, 03:46 PM - Thread Starter
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I thought I was content with my HSU HB1s; however, all these thoughts of change has given me the itch (not the kind that needs antibiotics).

I don't know if it is worth me snagging a pair of the RC-10s to replace my HB1s. A couple of quick questions.

1) Will the RC-10 be a more forward speaker compared to the HB1? Is the aluminum tweeter on the RC-10 a little more lively compared to the HB1?

2) Is there position orientation with the RC-10 tweeter? I am trying to ask if the dispersion of the tweeter will be different if an RC-10 is layed on it's side and used as a center.

One last RANDOM question. Can anyone comment on how the Infinity Primus P163/162 would compare to the RC-10 and the HB1 mk2??
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post #16 of 76 Old 08-28-2011, 08:41 PM
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Deepstang, if I were going to replace the Hsus, I would go a step up in price. I haven't heard the RC10, but I don't think it is going to be a dramatic improvement against the Hsus, because I have other highly regarded speakers in the same price range and the Hsus sound as good as they do (including the Primus p162). If you seriously want a more forward treble, this is what I would get, not the Energy speakers. But I don't think either would look as nice as the Hsu speakers.
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post #17 of 76 Old 08-28-2011, 10:41 PM
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Energy RC-10s are incredible for bookshelf speakers.

For those looking into getting Energy speakers, or upgrading their current Energy setup, here are some reviews I've written that may help:http://www.tempestaudio.blogspot.com  (haven't updated in a while, but include Energy Take Classic 5.1, RC-10, CF-70, and CC-10)

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post #18 of 76 Old 08-29-2011, 12:00 AM
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1) Will the RC-10 be a more forward speaker compared to the HB1? Is the aluminum tweeter on the RC-10 a little more lively compared to the HB1?

Yes, the RC-10 is slightly more forward than the HSU's, and slightly more lively, but not by much, but enough to notice.

2) Is there position orientation with the RC-10 tweeter? I am trying to ask if the dispersion of the tweeter will be different if an RC-10 is layed on it's side and used as a center.

They cannot be rotated like the HSU's, and I dont really see to much of a problem in lying the RC-10 on its side, I have never tired. Some people say they can hear a difference.

Check out eD's new cinema 6 1/2" horn speaker. They look pretty nice.
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post #19 of 76 Old 08-29-2011, 12:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deepstang View Post

2) Is there position orientation with the RC-10 tweeter? I am trying to ask if the dispersion of the tweeter will be different if an RC-10 is layed on it's side and used as a center.

I have RC-10 mains and an RC-LCR center, so I don't use RC-10s as centers on their sides, BUT my RC-10s are laying on their sides and the sound is just as good. I don't notice it hurting the sound any.

For those looking into getting Energy speakers, or upgrading their current Energy setup, here are some reviews I've written that may help:http://www.tempestaudio.blogspot.com  (haven't updated in a while, but include Energy Take Classic 5.1, RC-10, CF-70, and CC-10)

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post #20 of 76 Old 08-30-2011, 07:50 AM - Thread Starter
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ShadyJ, great feedback. From what most are saying, it seems the 3 speakers mentioned (HB-1, RC-10, and P162) will probably have similar performance. As you said, it would probably take something like the Kipsch to have a truly noticeable forward treble.

Thanks for the honest answer Nixon. I like how you said the RC-10 is a bit more forward and lively; however, not by much. The whole point of changing and "upgrading" is to attempt to have a noticeable improvement.

I have learned what many have said, it is not always about the speaker itself but the environment it is in. The slight concerns I have in my application is that the left speaker has a wall directly behind it, and the right does not. Also, the center speaker is in that fireplace cubby. Is say all this because I wonder if a front ported speaker would perform better. I know the HB1 and RC10 are rear ported, while the Primus is front ported. In the grand scheme of things, I think the final difference would be minimal.





The other concern is the dispersion of the tweeter. From what I have read, the horn tweeters inherently have a narrow spread with the material it plays. I have noticed that with the HB1 horns. The highs also sound a bit muffled at low volumes (they come to life when cranked). I keep asking myself if that is something I can live with. The other concern is that my listening area is a bit broader than the speakers. That causes a slight concern because the highs from the speaker immediately in front is apparent, while the further speaker is not. I know that will be the case in all applications as tweeters yield a narrow field; however, a speaker with better off-axis performance may help.

*The speakers are about 82" apart (6.5ft), while the seating area is about 96" apart (8ft)




I would only know the TRUTH by testing them myself. From the info I gathered from this thread, it seems that it may not be worth it. I just ran a lot of different material through the HB1s. They are impressive speakers, and seem to fit my application pretty well. I was tempted to pull the trigger on the Primus or maybe the RC10s; however, it seems like it may be more trouble than it is worth. I guess ignorance is bliss....sweet sweet HSU HB-1 bliss
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post #21 of 76 Old 08-30-2011, 10:53 AM
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Something else to think about, since you have the speakers near to other surfaces, is the fact that horns won't be affected as much by nearby reflection as dome tweeters. The speakers shouldn't sound muffled at any volume however, high or low. If you want more pronounced treble, have you thought about EQing a bit to bring up the highs a bit more?
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post #22 of 76 Old 08-30-2011, 11:22 AM
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Deepstang, what are you using to power the speakers? Receiver? Amp?
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post #23 of 76 Old 08-30-2011, 12:21 PM - Thread Starter
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Shady, that is good to know (that near wall placement with horns are more forgiving). I have bumped the treble 2 notches, and it does improve the desire I have for highs. I am pushing the speakers with a Denon 2112 w/ MultEQ XT.
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post #24 of 76 Old 08-30-2011, 01:04 PM
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deepstang, how much room behind your speakers next to fireplace?

also what rears are you running, not the in wall ones?
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post #25 of 76 Old 08-30-2011, 01:39 PM - Thread Starter
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deepstang, how much room behind your speakers next to fireplace?

also what rears are you running, not the in wall ones?

The left main has about 2-1/4", the center has 6-1/2" (but I plugged the rear port of this one as it is in that boxed space), and the right has over a couple of feet.






I am only running the rear silver Infinity bi-poles (ES250s).
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post #26 of 76 Old 08-30-2011, 01:43 PM
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Shady, that is good to know (that near wall placement with horns are more forgiving). I have bumped the treble 2 notches, and it does improve the desire I have for highs. I am pushing the speakers with a Denon 2112 w/ MultEQ XT.

Man, I've been looking at these HB-1's for a while now. HSU's website says these are for HUGE rooms, but a single 6" driver has me concerned - I'm not sure why since I dont listen to movies that loud anyway. These will be replacing monitor 70's and a CSi5 center channel from polk in a downsize move in an exact setup as yours. I hope they are adequate.

How do you like the imaging on the 3 HB1's you have there?

And how did you get to adjust the treble on your denon? Is this something new on the '12 models, because on my 3310 you either use audyssey *OR* the bass/treble - in other words, once audyssey is set, you cant add or take away anything EQ wise like bass/treble. Very frustrating if you feel it's not bright enough and you want to raise it a little like you did on yours.
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post #27 of 76 Old 08-30-2011, 01:45 PM
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are you hearing anything outta the left main that you dont on the right main as far as the port being closer to wall

any sound from air moving and hitting the wall any?

looking at the HB1s for my room as well some they will be a little farther from the wall than yours but not a whole lot
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post #28 of 76 Old 08-30-2011, 08:17 PM
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Also, I'd like to know how vocals/voices sound with this set, are they thin or full sounding, etc.

Since I'm going from a monitor 70/center channel setup (ten 6.5 in. drivers) to three 6.5 in drivers, will there be a drastic difference in the midrange?
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post #29 of 76 Old 08-31-2011, 09:18 AM
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deepstang,

Are you able to check the distance/levels of your LCR?

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post #30 of 76 Old 08-31-2011, 12:59 PM
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