**Update 09/14/2012 ** 5.1 Speaker Suggestions resolved (Emotive and HSU). Switched room around. ( Suggestions for room layout / speaker placement / rack). - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 44 Old 09-20-2011, 12:16 PM - Thread Starter
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***** UPDATED 09/14/2012 - Flipped room around. Now I need help with the front speaker / rack / etc placement. ******  (PICS IN LAST POST -  http://www.avsforum.com/t/1361618/need-speaker-suggestions-5-1-or-7-1-pref-1000-00-range-but-can-do-1300-1700-max/30#post_22402304 )

 

 

I need some recommendations for a new 5.1 surround sound speaker system. I hope to spend as little as possible, but I still like quality items (quality sound).

I am probably working with a budget of $2000.00 + - (Shipped - max).

The speakers don't have to be name brand, but I do want them to last and produce nice audio for Movies and Music (Music 2nd). I can run the cables myself so positioning is not really an issue.

[50% - Movies ]
[25% - Music]
[25% - Games - XBOX]

Current components:

Keep:

Onkyo TX-SR707
Samsung BD-P3600 1080p Blu-ray Disc Player
Samsung UN60D8000 60-Inch 1080p 240Hz 3D LED HDTV
XBOX 360
ACER Revo HTPC
*** UPDATE 11.29.2011 - NEW ITEM - HSU VTF-3 MK4 (Ordered Cyber Monday) ***
*** Still looking for 5.0 speakers ***




Probably replace all of this?:

Older - Silver Sony 5.1 Surround Sound System - Theater in a box (Sub, Center, 4 Satellite Speakers) - Need an update

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post #2 of 44 Old 09-20-2011, 12:31 PM
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A setup consisting of three of Emotiva's 6.2s across the front with a pair of ERD-1s for surrounds would set you back just under $850 - use the rest on a good sub. Those speakers are 4ohm rated but they aren't very hard to drive - they don't dip below 4ohm much if at all. IMO you can't buy brick and mortar speakers that match these for the price.

I've had that setup at one time - I just bought a second pair of ERDs since I sold the first pair. Too good not to have IMO.

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post #3 of 44 Old 09-20-2011, 12:55 PM - Thread Starter
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Great....i'm looking at the Emotiva site now. So they have been around since 2003? Do they normally get good reviews?
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post #4 of 44 Old 09-20-2011, 01:40 PM
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I've owned 2 of their amps and still have one - a UPA-7. Great sounding amp. I've also owned all of their speakers at one time or another in the reference line - but none of the in-wall/ceiling speakers. All their speakers are gems IMO. The only wart in their lineup is the UMC-1 preamp processor.

Don't worry about their speakers being 4ohm rated - I drove a 5.1 setup with a lowly Onkyo 506 when my preamp processor had to be sent in for replacement. If those speakers were hard to drive the 506 would have fried - it's still alive and well with one of my nephews.

I've got an ad running on AVS wanting some Emotiva speakers - one guy PM'ed me offering some Emotiva speakers for a very good price. Since I'm not interested in the ERTs you might be. Let me know and I'll hook you up with him. He has the ERT towers - 6.3 center and ERD-1 surrounds. Price for all from Emotiva would be right at $1850 - he's asking much less.

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post #5 of 44 Old 09-21-2011, 01:11 PM - Thread Starter
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I definitely appreciate the info (PM sent). So does Emo sponsor this site? I've been reading through the EMO forums and they seem like quality products. Can anyone vouch for this?

Any other suggestions - Prefer less than $1500.00 setup if possible (give or take).
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post #6 of 44 Old 09-21-2011, 04:24 PM
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I've replied to your PM. Sorry I didn't reply earlier - I just got back from a round of golf and a few beers.

Emotiva pays advertising here and elsewhere. AV Science owns this forum site. Emotiva owns the Emotiva Lounge and control much of the content - very little is 'controlled' here so you get the unvarnished opinions from owners and past owners. The only product they have that isn't very good is the UMC-1 preamp processor. The rest of their gear gets great reviews. I've owned one of their amps for about 3 years now - no complaints - it sounds great and has gobs of power and has not had any problems whatever. I've also owned all of their speakers in the ERM/ERD line - and ERT towers. I'm sure their in-wall and in-ceiling speakers are good if they compare to the bookshelf and towers.

You can find all of their speaker lineup here. You can read the Emotiva Speaker Owners thread here. I think you'll find most Emotiva speaker owners have been very suitably impressed with the quality of the sound even if the box is a bit utilitarian. For the $ they are hard to beat - I know!

I'm reasonably sure there are other internet direct companies that have just as good a product. Look up Elemental Designs - HSU - Energy (not ID) - Aperion - there are quite a few.

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post #7 of 44 Old 09-21-2011, 04:52 PM
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Look at NHT
http://www.nhthifi.com/Home-Theater-Absolute-Zero-5-1

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Who and Where - is the Way, the Truth and the Life?

Speakers > MB Quart VS05, Boston VS260, Snell K7
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post #8 of 44 Old 09-21-2011, 05:26 PM
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You might look at Hsu's enthusiast 2 package, which comes to under $1400 shipped. You also might look into Infinity Primus speakers, paired with a sub from Hsu Research or Outlaw Audio, or a Elemental Designs A3-300. I think those are the best bang for the buck deals out there, and they are within your budget.
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post #9 of 44 Old 09-21-2011, 06:20 PM
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+1 for the Hsu's enthusiast 2 package, the NHT suggestions, and the subs from Hsu Research or Outlaw Audio, or a Elemental Designs A3-300. If you have a big room or an open floor layout, you'll need a 12" sub; smaller rooms, a 10" might work. Bigger (12") will be better for HT. Add the Rythmik FV12 to that list of sub makers because it's a great price for a 12" at the moment.

Also, look at the recent posts in Energy Owners thread and you'll hear great things about the Energy RC-10s and Energy RC-LCR. Vanns has them for $650, and then you just need a pair of surrounds (see the Energy Owners thread for ideas). For instance, Vanns was running the CB-10s for $150 with coupon "energy", but you may have to call in your order to get it.

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post #10 of 44 Old 09-23-2011, 07:00 PM - Thread Starter
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man, this is killing me. I wish I knew more about the subs. I've been to all of the sites you suggested, but I wish there some comparison that reviewed all of the subs in the 500-800 price range.

I've definitely been thinking about the EMO set up you described:

Pair of ERDs

6.2 - LCR

and a sub from somewhere ( looked at the SVS, HSU, Rythmik, etc, but i'm stuck). I want something good for HT - 60% - Music - 20% Games - 20%

The room I have is 18.5 x18.5 and I could use some suggestions for the speaker positioning as well. Diagram attached...should I move everything around or will this work ok?
















Would you suggest keeping the room this way or moving everything around?
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post #11 of 44 Old 09-23-2011, 10:35 PM
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If you go for the Emotiva speakers, make sure your receiver can handle 4 ohm speakers. Most entry level and mid level receivers aren't designed to handle that kind of load. I think Emotiva deliberately designs them that way so they can sell more of their amps.
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post #12 of 44 Old 09-23-2011, 11:09 PM
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I've driven a pair of them with a HK 254 and an entire 5.1 setup with an Onkyo 506 - neither receiver is rated for 4ohm loads - they are easy enough to drive. No big dips in impedance. The OPs 707 should be able to handle them just fine. Read some of the experiences of their buyers on the Emotiva Speaker Owner's thread and on the Emotiva Lounge.

I'd be more concerned about the shape of the listening space. Not ideal by any stretch.

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post #13 of 44 Old 09-26-2011, 09:07 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Knucklehead90 View Post

I've driven a pair of them with a HK 254 and an entire 5.1 setup with an Onkyo 506 - neither receiver is rated for 4ohm loads - they are easy enough to drive. No big dips in impedance. The OPs 707 should be able to handle them just fine. Read some of the experiences of their buyers on the Emotiva Speaker Owner's thread and on the Emotiva Lounge.

I'd be more concerned about the shape of the listening space. Not ideal by any stretch.

Shewwww...I know it's not ideal by any means. Any suggestions? I just moved in so i just threw it together real fast to get some opinions.
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post #14 of 44 Old 09-26-2011, 01:02 PM
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Corner placement of the tv is about the worst possible spot. I'd put the tv against the outside wall on the r/h of that diagram and go from there. You can then set your speakers around the tv and surrounds to the sides of your listening position.

When all else fails - RTFM!

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post #15 of 44 Old 09-26-2011, 01:56 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Knucklehead90 View Post

Corner placement of the tv is about the worst possible spot. I'd put the tv against the outside wall on the r/h of that diagram and go from there. You can then set your speakers around the tv and surrounds to the sides of your listening position.

Oops....Diagram updated (room space). The outside (RH) area has a window w curtains. Do you still think that placement is best? Maybe put curtains along the entire RH wall??

I'm still looking at speakers/subs btw. I appreciate all of the input.

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post #16 of 44 Old 09-26-2011, 06:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mindprobe View Post

man, this is killing me. I wish I knew more about the subs. I've been to all of the sites you suggested, but I wish there some comparison that reviewed all of the subs in the 500-800 price range.

I've definitely been thinking about the EMO set up you described:

Pair of ERDs

6.2 - LCR

and a sub from somewhere ( looked at the SVS, HSU, Rythmik, etc, but i'm stuck). I want something good for HT - 60% - Music - 20% Games - 20%

You'll be good with whichever sub you pick in that price range for the vendors you mention. They'll all be good. IMHO, narrow it down to the two or three 12" subs that seem best to you, and then pick based on price. I drove myself nuts trying to figure it out. I ended up with the Outlaw Audio LFM-1 EX (I bought a B-stock), but I have no doubt that I would have been happy with my 2nd or 3rd choice and could have made the decision much sooner

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post #17 of 44 Old 09-28-2011, 06:39 AM - Thread Starter
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Any opinions guys/ladies?

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1362861

I just noticed this thread and the Martin Logan's (Motion 12) are going for $300.00 bucks a piece on Newegg. Would this be something to consider? Add a sub, center and rears?

Thanks for the advice in advance. I'm going by recommendations so any advice or opinions are appreciated.
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post #18 of 44 Old 09-28-2011, 07:55 AM
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Rythmik FV12 for $566 shipped:
http://www.rythmikaudio.com/FV12.html

Infinity P363 x 2 (front L/R) for $400 shipped:
http://www.amazon.com/Infinity-Primu...7219176&sr=8-1

Infinity P163 x 5 (front C + Side Surround L/R + Back Surround L/R) for $425 shipped:
http://www.amazon.com/Infinity-Primu...7219295&sr=1-1

Total shipped: $1,391.

Infinity P162:
http://www.soundstagenetwork.com/mea...y_primus_p162/

Infinity P360:
http://www.stereophile.com/content/i...r-measurements
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post #19 of 44 Old 09-28-2011, 01:42 PM
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Corners are hard especially if you go with rear ported speakers due to the way that the bass from the port reflects off the angled walls. In your price range I suggest 2x Infinity P363 towers, a PC351 center, and 2 P153 bookshelves as surrounds. These punch well above their price class. Except for the center the Infinities are front ported which will help with your corner. That leaves you $950 for subwoofers. Square rooms are hard for subwoofer so my first choice would be two Rythmik FV12 or one Hsu Research VTF-3. The two sub solution is probably better but shipping takes you over budget. On the other hand the Hsu has plenty of capacity for that room and leaves money in your pocket.
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post #20 of 44 Old 11-09-2011, 12:23 PM - Thread Starter
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So, I've still been debating different speakers and subs and I still have a total budget of around $2000.00 (with everything shipped / taxes / stands, etc).

I recently noticed the new Emotiva line - the X-Ref. I'm still trying to piece together a 5.1 or 7.1 system.

Anyone know of any other great deals going on? Speakers / Subs? Wait for Black Friday?

I measured the cabinet and the area to place my center speaker would only be around 6 inches high unless I had some sort of mount from the wall or ceiling sticking out about 2 ft.

I noticed the new Emoptiva XRC-5.2 (6 inches tall - Center Speaker).

Anyways .....I don't have stands to place bookshelf speakers on. Any recommendations? Bookshelf / Monitors with stands or Reference Towers?

I have put some thought into these? Suggestions? Newegg, VANNS, or Amazon have anything good right now?

HSU:

Enthusiast 3 package

Includes:

1 VTF-3 MK 4 Subwoofer
6 HB-1 MK2 Horn Bookshelf available in 2 different finishes
1 HC-1 MK2 Horn Center Channel available in 2 different finishes



Emotiva:

XRT-5.2 - X-Ref Tower

XRC-5.2- X-Ref Center/LCR Monitor

XRS-4.1 - X-Ref Surround OR.......... ERD-1 - Surround Speakers

A good sub to go with this (maybe one of these? suggestions again?):


SVS

SB12–NSD
PB12-NSD

HSU

VTF-3 MK 4
VTF-2 MK 4

Outlaw

The LFM-1 EX Subwoofer


OR

Emotiva has some clearance items:

3 X ERM 6.2 (Stands as well?)

ERD-1 - Surround Speakers

VTF-3 MK 4 (HSU)


(figure out some sort of stand or mounts?) Still trying to keep the system under 2 grand - with everything shipped.


Polk? Klipsch? Etc????
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post #21 of 44 Old 11-09-2011, 02:21 PM
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Of the ones you listed above, I'd go with the HSU Enthusiast 3 package.

Good bang vs. buck.

If you plan on wall mounting any of the HB-1's, HSU recommends the Pinpoint AM-40 wall mounts.

Good matching stands for the front HB-1 L/R's are VTI's DF series at 29" high.

Listen up, studios! Just say "NO" to DNR and EE!!
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post #22 of 44 Old 11-10-2011, 09:02 AM
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If you decide to go with the Emotiva speakers get the reference line - the x-ref (or whatever they call them) are a step down - not up as the price would indicate. The 6.2s are a fantastic bargain at $199 each. If you can afford it the 6.3 is just a bit better for voice - get one for center duty. Not much to be gained by getting 6.3 for LCR IMO. The reference line have cast frame drivers and milled aluminum faces. They aren't nearly as boxy as they appear in the pics.

I've gone back to all Emotiva speakers since you started this thread. I bought a complete 5.0 package from a fellow forum member and bought a pair of ERM-1s - smaller than the 6.2 but IMO just as good. I'm glad I did go back. I've got the ERTs - 6.3 center - and ERD surrounds. Same as I had a few years ago. Sometimes we start chasing our tails looking for better sound when it is/was right there all along. There are better sounding speakers out there but you'd better bring lots of money - these Emotiva speakers are tough to beat. I drive the ERTs with a Harman Kardon 990 - the ERTs can take everything the 990 can dish out. A match made in heaven IMO.

From all the speakers I've owned over the years I'd have no problem going back to the 6.2 LCR and ERD surrounds for HT if I didn't have the ERTs.

When all else fails - RTFM!

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post #23 of 44 Old 11-10-2011, 12:10 PM - Thread Starter
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I really appreciate the feedback guys. I'm sort of looking at these options now:

Emotiva

2 x ERT-8.3 - Reference Towers - 1200.00

1 x ERM-6.3 - LCR Monitors - 400.00

1 pair - ERD-1 - Surround Speakers - 250.00

1 Sub - 800.00

2650.00 + tax

--------------
Emotiva

3 x ERM-6.2 LCR Monitors - 600.00

1 pair - ERD-1 - Surround Speakers - 250.00

1 Sub - 800.00

1650.00 + tax

-------------
Emotiva

2 x ERM-6.2 LCR Monitors - 400.00

1 x ERM-6.3 - LCR Monitors - 400.00

1 pair - ERD-1 - Surround Speakers - 250.00

1 Sub - 800.00

Total - 1850.00 + tax

-------------

Emotiva

3 x ERM-6.3 (L/C/R) - $1,197
2 x ERD-1 (surround) - $249

1 x HSU VTF-3 mk4 (sub) - $699

(Dan's suggestion)

-------------
Enthusiast 3 Package

6 HB-1 MK2 Horn Bookshelf

1 HC-1 MK2 Horn Center Channel

1 VTF-3 MK 4 Subwoofer

Shipping (300.00)

Total - 1900.00 + Tax

------------

SVS

SCS-02M 5.0 Set

SSS-02 Surrounds Black

PB12-NSD Charcoal Black

Total - 1900.00 + tax

----------------------

I wish I could afford the first option with the 8.3s, but I think that is probably pushing it. I still have to factor in stands and mounting equipment.

Any thoughts on these? I don't have an option to hear any of these.

Thanks again (Knuckle)
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post #24 of 44 Old 11-10-2011, 01:14 PM
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Get a good sub and you will not need the Emotiva towers (if you can even get them now).

Here's my suggestion:

3 x ERM-6.3 (L/C/R) - $1,197
2 x ERD-1 (surround) - $249

1 x HSU VTF-3 mk4 (sub) - $699

Make the short stands for the two ERM-6.3's for L/R out of MDF yourself if you want. There are good ideas right on this site.

Use 12 gauge speaker wire (in-wall rated jackets if you're fishing the wires in the wall) from Monoprice.com or Bluejeanscable.com. HDMI cables from them too.

Listen up, studios! Just say "NO" to DNR and EE!!
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post #25 of 44 Old 11-10-2011, 01:18 PM
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From that list, I would go with the Hsu speakers. The problem with all the Emotiva stuff is their impedance. Those are all 4 ohm speakers, and, like I said, I think Emotiva does this so they can sell more of their own amps. The Onkyo TX-SR707 is not rated for 4 ohm speakers, and, as you must know by now, it gets hot enough with 8 ohm speakers. As for the SVS speakers, their sensitivity is just too low, they aren't even 85 db sensitive. For a medium size to large theater room, that is nowhere near good enough, unless you only ever listen at modest volumes.

I do think the Hsu speakers get some serious competition from Ascend speakers, and Infinity Primus, which are largely considered the best bang-for-your-buck speakers anywhere. The Hsu speakers are good at what they do though, and are certainly worth considering.
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post #26 of 44 Old 11-10-2011, 01:24 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shadyJ View Post

From that list, I would go with the Hsu speakers. The problem with all the Emotiva stuff is their impedance. Those are all 4 ohm speakers, and, like I said, I think Emotiva does this so they can sell more of their own amps. The Onkyo TX-SR707 is not rated for 4 ohm speakers, and, as you must know by now, it gets hot enough with 8 ohm speakers. As for the SVS speakers, their sensitivity is just too low, they aren't even 85 db sensitive. For a medium size to large theater room, that is nowhere near good enough, unless you only ever listen at modest volumes.

I do think the Hsu speakers get some serious competition from Ascend speakers, and Infinity Primus, which are largely considered the best bang-for-your-buck speakers anywhere. The Hsu speakers are good at what they do though, and are certainly worth considering.


Yeah, I was wondering about the 4 ohm vs 8 ohm with my Onkyo TX-SR707. It already gets hot and I have some very low end speakers connected to it.

I don't have to blow the neighbors away down the street, but I do want something with a little Boom Tisk if needed.
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post #27 of 44 Old 11-10-2011, 01:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shadyJ View Post

From that list, I would go with the Hsu speakers. The problem with all the Emotiva stuff is their impedance. Those are all 4 ohm speakers, and, like I said, I think Emotiva does this so they can sell more of their own amps. The Onkyo TX-SR707 is not rated for 4 ohm speakers, and, as you must know by now, it gets hot enough with 8 ohm speakers. As for the SVS speakers, their sensitivity is just too low, they aren't even 85 db sensitive. For a medium size to large theater room, that is nowhere near good enough, unless you only ever listen at modest volumes.

I do think the Hsu speakers get some serious competition from Ascend speakers, and Infinity Primus, which are largely considered the best bang-for-your-buck speakers anywhere. The Hsu speakers are good at what they do though, and are certainly worth considering.

I've heard that the Emotiva's are not very hard to drive... could be wrong, though I do recommend adding a power amp at some point anyway no matter what you end up buying. That Onkyo has pre-amp outs. It's a good upgrade to consider. I have an 805 and an ATI multi-channel amp driving Paradigm Studio speakers. Sounds great!!

If you're still worried. Go with the HSU package. You won't regret it.

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post #28 of 44 Old 11-10-2011, 06:49 PM
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I think I reiterated twice about how easy the 4ohm speakers from Emotiva are to drive. I'm speaking from experience - not from anything I've only read. If someone were thinking about getting a 7.0 all Emotiva I'd say an external amp or stout AVR should be in the mix. Even the SR707 could use some help with a 5.0 setup. The ERTs aren't available yet but its probably because they haven't unpacked them from the transport van. They just got a huge shipment in with all their new speakers - amps - etc. Takes time to go through all that stuff I suppose.

I'll reiterate one other thing - for HT the 6.3s aren't needed except for maybe the center - and the 6.2 is nearly as good and half the price. They are very close sonically. The 6.2 is an excellent value. I challenge anyone to find a better speaker for $199 new. They are an astoundingly good value. Three of them across the front would be a fine sounding HT setup.

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post #29 of 44 Old 11-10-2011, 07:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Knucklehead90 View Post

I think I reiterated twice .

Really?

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post #30 of 44 Old 11-10-2011, 07:32 PM
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Originally Posted by lovinthehd View Post

Really?

So I digressed?

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