M.L Motion 12 or Polk Monitor70 - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 26 Old 01-10-2012, 04:48 PM - Thread Starter
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I want to upgrade my HT.....So i went to New Egg site and found these 2 great deals so i need you guys help to lead me in the right direction....I want to upgrade my Polk R50' Towers.. so what which is the better speakers

I don't want to go over $1000 for my Towers.

Polk Audio Monitor70 Series II $ 360 a pair

or

Martin Logan Motion 12's $600 a pair

Can i get some Guidance please.....

Its use is to 60% movies and 40% music My mans room is in a Mid size Basement ...


I also want to add a wayy better sub then i have now, right now i have a Polk cs10

Thanks in advanced....
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post #2 of 26 Old 01-10-2012, 04:59 PM
 
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I am not a fan of Polks, tho they are a semi-decent speaker. I would suggest that you opt for the Motion 12's. They are pretty nice I think. I do not like the 10's except maybe as surround speakers. They will just shine with a good, quality AVR powering them. Perfection for movies and use a 'phantom' center. You won't go wrong.

As for sub, DIY using partsexpress.com and you will have one serious upgrade.

I paid $600/pair shipped for my ML Preface speakers and am just in awe everytime I turn the system on...Movies, music, doesn't matter. ML is the top shelf in speakers, evenb their 'entry' model like the Motion 12.
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post #3 of 26 Old 01-10-2012, 05:01 PM
 
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Looks like the Polk is $220 EACH, unless you have a code or something.
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post #4 of 26 Old 01-10-2012, 05:02 PM
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My top recommendation would be the Monitor Audio M6 speakers for $650/pair at Audio Advisor.

IMO they are way better-sounding than either of those.

For $360 per pair, though, you might have a hard time beating the Polk M70. The price is cheap for what you get there. Hard to get any halfway-good towers for under $400

I don't know what your sub budget is, but if you have $500 to spend, IMO the one to get is the Rhythmic FV 12.

The Polk PSW505 is discontinued but available for under $300. It seems to be fairly good for the price.






Quote:
Originally Posted by baddhipp View Post

I want to upgrade my HT.....So i went to New Egg site and found these 2 great deals so i need you guys help to lead me in the right direction....I want to upgrade my Polk R50' Towers.. so what which is the better speakers

I don't want to go over $1000 for my Towers.
Polk Audio Monitor70 Series II $ 360 a pair
or
Martin Logan Motion 12's $600 a pair

Can i get some Guidance please.....

Its use is to 60% movies and 40% music My mans room is in a Mid size Basement ...
I also want to add a wayy better sub then i have now, right now i have a Polk cs10
Thanks in advanced....

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post #5 of 26 Old 01-10-2012, 05:32 PM
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Polk Monitor 70's when on sale at newegg go for $300 a pair shipped

If you are willing to spend more money might want to look at higher level Polks like the Polk RTi8's or RTi12's
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post #6 of 26 Old 01-10-2012, 08:05 PM
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yep, at about $300 a pair, shipped....Polk Monitor70's are awsome speakers. Go to newegg.com and sign up for their "e-Blast" sales newsletter so you will get notice when the 70's are on sale again, like they were a week or so back,
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post #7 of 26 Old 01-10-2012, 09:06 PM
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The Motion 12 is an awesome speaker. Personally I greatly prefer it to the others mentioned here concluding the monitor audios mentioned. The sound is quite different from a speaker with a normal tweeter so make sure you check it out before buying. The Motion 12 will need a strong receiver to play loudly so if you're planning on cranking it up either buy a high end receiver or an external amp. Many people trash the Motion series because they are not true electrostatics as ML is known for. That may be true, but they are still innovative and affordable - and best of all they sound amazing. Motion 12s would be an enormous, enormous, enormous upgrade from monitor 70s. We are talking propeller plane vs G6...and that's coming from a Polk fan !

Cheers,
NM
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post #8 of 26 Old 01-10-2012, 10:03 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nm4710 View Post

The Motion 12 is an awesome speaker. Personally I greatly prefer it to the others mentioned here concluding the monitor audios mentioned. The sound is quite different from a speaker with a normal tweeter so make sure you check it out before buying. The Motion 12 will need a strong receiver to play loudly so if you're planning on cranking it up either buy a high end receiver or an external amp. Many people trash the Motion series because they are not true electrostatics as ML is known for. That may be true, but they are still innovative and affordable - and best of all they sound amazing. Motion 12s would be an enormous, enormous, enormous upgrade from monitor 70s. We are talking propeller plane vs G6...and that's coming from a Polk fan !

Cheers,
NM

Nice, that was a the answer i was looking for. I demo them a few days ago and they sounded great....but i Havn't heard the Polk m70's......i'm going to pair the motion 12's with the ML motion 8 center and the Def SuperCube .2000....Thanks for the response
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post #9 of 26 Old 01-10-2012, 10:22 PM
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That should be a fantastic setup. The only other advice I could offer would be to check out the motion C center channel. Although not much larger than the 8 it does sound much fuller. If memory serves the construction is different. The upgrade is well worth the $100.

Cheers,
NM
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post #10 of 26 Old 01-17-2012, 12:23 PM
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Fry's has the ML Motion 12 for $240.
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post #11 of 26 Old 01-17-2012, 02:46 PM
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I'm not sure omni-direction speakers such as the Motion are good with imaging, which I think pretty important in movies. Uncontrolled reflection from walls would produce a large but diffused sound stage. I want to recommend constant directivity monitors like Behringer B2031P's, which can be toed in sharply to avoid side wall reflection without compromising tweeter response. But Behringer doesn't make a center channel, so you'll have to use another B2031P for that duty.

Edit: sorry I confused the ElectroMotion with Motion series Still, check out the Behringer.
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post #12 of 26 Old 01-19-2012, 07:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nm4710 View Post

The Motion 12 is an awesome speaker. Personally I greatly prefer it to the others mentioned here concluding the monitor audios mentioned. The sound is quite different from a speaker with a normal tweeter so make sure you check it out before buying. The Motion 12 will need a strong receiver to play loudly so if you're planning on cranking it up either buy a high end receiver or an external amp. Many people trash the Motion series because they are not true electrostatics as ML is known for. That may be true, but they are still innovative and affordable - and best of all they sound amazing. Motion 12s would be an enormous, enormous, enormous upgrade from monitor 70s. We are talking propeller plane vs G6...and that's coming from a Polk fan !

Cheers,
NM

NM,

As you seem to have experience with the Motion 12's I'm curious what you'd suggest to be the minimum strong receiver to drive them with? I've got the 12's 8 and 4's (w/ a non ML sub, for now..) and have to crank my Denon 1911 to adequately do this setup justice (I've run multiple Audyssey and found I needed to up the dB across the board to get them to 'cut the room' when I want to be frightened from volume... Any thoughts?
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post #13 of 26 Old 01-19-2012, 09:46 PM
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Martin Logan states that though the speakers are nominally 4 ohms they are compatible with 8 ohm receivers such as your Denon. I think that in a medium to large room that receiver would have trouble reaching reference volume. Rather than wattage I think current is what becomes the issue. To achieve an improvement there you would have to move up to something along the lines of a Denon 4311. Or perhaps a 3312 with an external amp. Not cheap, but i suspect it will make your 12s sound better. What is your volume set to for normal listening?

Cheers,
NM
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post #14 of 26 Old 01-19-2012, 11:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nm4710 View Post

Martin Logan states that though the speakers are nominally 4 ohms they are compatible with 8 ohm receivers such as your Denon. I think that in a medium to large room that receiver would have trouble reaching reference volume. Rather than wattage I think current is what becomes the issue. To achieve an improvement there you would have to move up to something along the lines of a Denon 4311. Or perhaps a 3312 with an external amp. Not cheap, but i suspect it will make your 12s sound better. What is your volume set to for normal listening?

Cheers,
NM

Last night, watching the dark knight, I had it around -3 to get the pop I was looking for... this was also after I'd kick'd up dB on the center 8 so the quiet dialog was a little more present. Audyssey put the center at around -7, I brought it up to -3 and brought the rest of the system balance up accordingly till it hit my ears a little better, while keeping the balance both numerically and sonically in mind as I went. Anyway, I've had my eye on a 4311, I'm curious if this was something youve demo'd, or what you used specifically, it feels that these speakers have SO much more to give than what this amp can do, but I'm also concerned with buying so much amp (and not pissing off g/f if I do) that I 'outrun' the speakers. did I make sense? I know from running pwr amps to PA systems that if your speakers arent up to it you can run out of speaker, real fast. I'm sure a 43** would be a more substantial match, is it overkill?
Thanks alot for all your help!

H
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post #15 of 26 Old 01-20-2012, 08:02 AM
 
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I have the 4310 w/ML Preface speakers and watching Saving Private Ryan last nite I had it at -3.5dB.

You need to see why Auddyssey set the levels so low. Things should be closer to 0dB than -12dB. Also, try phantom center and see if things aren't better.

I went from a Denon 789 to the 4310 and the improvement in audio quality was not subtle.
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post #16 of 26 Old 01-20-2012, 09:13 AM
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I purchased the follwoing from Newegg:

1. monitor 70's - 300 delivered
2. CS2 center - 99 delivered
3. Monitor 40's - 109 delivered
4. 2 kw-12d klipsch subs - 299.99 each delivered

Great value on the polks and klipsch sub. Sometimes you might have to piece your system together as different parts go on sale at different times but you will be able to get everything on sale if you are willing to wait a couple of weeks.
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post #17 of 26 Old 01-20-2012, 09:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Splicer010 View Post

I have the 4310 w/ML Preface speakers and watching Saving Private Ryan last nite I had it at -3.5dB.

You need to see why Auddyssey set the levels so low. Things should be closer to 0dB than -12dB. Also, try phantom center and see if things aren't better.

I went from a Denon 789 to the 4310 and the improvement in audio quality was not subtle.

Ha! perfect, I was going to ask some of the guys running w/ the Preface's that same question! I'm guessing Audyssey pulled the o/p down to compensate the room size and arrangement ( I'm not 7ft from the screen/fronts).
Splicer, are you running anything else on the floor besides the Preface?
And please explain phantom center. Take it out of the system? re-run audyssey w/out it? Pull the speakers out of the motion 8 and pretend it's a center? I need some 'splainin...
Thanks!

H
EDIT: Splice, may I direct you and some of the other ML Motion/Preface owners here:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1388554
I'd really like to get some data here and possibly make selections easier for those of us in this speaker range-
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post #18 of 26 Old 01-20-2012, 03:44 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gainiac View Post

Splicer, are you running anything else on the floor besides the Preface?

You mean like surrounds? Yes, I run 2 MartinLogan Encore TF for the surround. And 2 DIY subs.

Quote:


And please explain phantom center.

Take out the center and rerun audyssey, after, ensure all speaks are set to 'small'.
Quote:


Take it out of the system? re-run audyssey w/out it?

Yuuuup!
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post #19 of 26 Old 01-20-2012, 08:19 PM
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My friend just bought the same exact system 2 days ago.

He bought an Onkyo 609 receiver, and I let him have a BIC sub I had laying around.

We ran the Audyssey room system built into the receiver and it sounded fantastic with movies. Music was so so in my opinion.

He was running it at -12 on the receiver and it was loud as can be.

The imaging was not what I thought it should be, but,he had the speakers a little closer together then he will when his new tv arrives tomorrow.

I use aperion audio 6T,6C,5BP, and a SVS sub in my theater room but I liked his system so much that I'm gonna pick up the ML12,ML8 center and use the ML 10 as surrounds in my kids playroom.
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post #20 of 26 Old 01-21-2012, 04:31 AM
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Dang that's some serious stuff for a kids room ahah

No subwoofer I've heard has been able to produce the bass I've experienced in the Corps!

Must..stop...buying...every bluray release...
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post #21 of 26 Old 01-21-2012, 10:14 AM
 
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Quote:
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Dang that's some serious stuff for a kids room ahah

I had the same thoughts...
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post #22 of 26 Old 01-21-2012, 11:26 AM
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I was looking at the motion 12's myself. I have Paradigm monitor 7.2's right now. I also listened to some def tech bp 8020's and 40's and they sounded incredible.. What do you guys think?
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post #23 of 26 Old 01-21-2012, 11:42 AM
 
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I am partial to MartinLogan...
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post #24 of 26 Old 01-21-2012, 11:44 AM
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You know,for some reason def tech just rubbed me the wrong way.. Maybe because I thought they were overpriced. But I actually gave them a shot at bb the other day and compared to logan,mirage ect.. They sounded alot more full. They had Ironman 2 on and it sounded awesome.. Funny,the guy helping me just went from def tech to logan..lol
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post #25 of 26 Old 01-23-2012, 08:08 AM
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Ha, I just caught IM2 nite b4 last, it was amazing once I brought up the dB a bit in the receiver. I realized 2 things, one, as I've been hammering the 12's up front, (recent purchase) they are mellowing a bit as they break in, and I'm in a strange room config and the mic was quite close to the speakers and this forced Audyssey to turn the o/p down quite a bit. Now that I've pushed it back up IM2 sounded terrific. I'm diggin the ML's!
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post #26 of 26 Old 01-25-2012, 08:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Splicer010 View Post

I have the 4310 w/ML Preface speakers and watching Saving Private Ryan last nite I had it at -3.5dB.

You need to see why Auddyssey set the levels so low. Things should be closer to 0dB than -12dB. Also, try phantom center and see if things aren't better.

I went from a Denon 789 to the 4310 and the improvement in audio quality was not subtle.


Hey Splicer!
As I mentioned the front speakers were set to large initially after Aud. but I reset em to small right away based on all that i'd read previously. The systems sounding much better now that I bumped up the dB all around and the 12s are breaking in a bit, but just to test ur idea, I took down my Numbers, then re-ran Audyssey w/out the Center, it knocked the settings back down again (my little HT's in a small room) and didnt seem to change the sound quality, so I ran thru the amps parameters and didnt notice anything else changed, so I bumped everything back up an it's still sounds great, ran thru a few movies last nite and it sounds much better as I've used my ears to 'correct' for the room and just opened the amp up a bunch and let it fly! Thanks again for all the input Bro!
fwiw, I'm compelled to say between looking at all the terrific systems and info on here, the great ideas for future projects and the members who are always willing to lend a hand, this site is a fantastic resource and a great place to learn. Thanks !
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