Is Bose the Boss? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 07:18 AM - Thread Starter
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Starting to look into speakers for the new man cave. 5.1 or possibly even 7.1 since the room is approx. 17' x 20'.

I would say that 80% of use will be movies and tv, but I still want music to sound great too.

Salesman is trying to sell me on Bose Acoustimass 10 Series. Ive listened to them before, and for movies I love how they sound. Plus the small size is very nice to look at. Sure the sub is a freaking beast, but thats easy to hide.

But I dont want to buy wondering if there was something else better for me or my wallet.

Total I plan on spending no more than $2000 for the receiver and speakers.

Recommendations please.
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post #2 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 07:31 AM
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Be careful with Bose! I like the sound of Bose but there is a lot better out there!! As I am sure lots of people will tell you! A lot of people believe Bose stands for Buy Other Sound Equipment. No Highs No Lows must be Bose!

If you like the way they sound then get them! Audition some other speakers first though then decide!
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post #3 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 07:32 AM
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Scratch Bose off your list, for $2k you can get some pretty nice sound and do better than Bose.

As far as receivers go, i'd start by looking at the first few posts in this thread for the features you want in a receiver. (I'm a Denon fan, but there are good offerings from other manufacturers as well.)

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1334369

I'd bet the 2112 would be a pretty good match for your budget, it has a very good room-correction software (MultEqXT), and networking features if you are interested in that. It also has a pretty good GUI for price range. Also, make sure to call an online retailer like Electronics Expo, J&R Electronics, or AV Science Sales for the best price. They don't usually advertise the best price online. The 2112 can be had for $<450 shipped, for example. If you don't need networking, the 1712 is also a fine option and still has good room-correction software.

As far as speakers, with $1550 left over, I'd budget about $500-$600 for the subwoofer and look and Internet Direct models in that price range from HSU, SVS, Rythmic, and Outlaw.

I'm sure others will chime in with some good speaker options, but I would spend most of the rest of the money on the front 3 (Left, Right, and Center).
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post #4 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 07:35 AM
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post #5 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 07:42 AM
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post #6 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 07:44 AM
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There are some pretty good suggestions in this thread for speakers in your price range:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1393728

Edit: Also, with your budget, I'd stick with 5.1 and add on later if you want. 5.1 is all you need and its more important to devote your resources into the best Left, Right, Center channel and Sub that you can afford.
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post #7 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 08:15 AM
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Those tiny little front speakers are a big mistake, Bose or whatever!

They will only go down to maybe 120 Hz, which means half of your sound will be coming only from the sub and be MONAURAL! Their power output will also be severely limited. You won't be able to get enough sound for the room. They only have 2.5 inch drivers, which belong in a pocket AM radio...rofl.

What is the point of having 6 speakers and having half of the sound come from just one?? That is crazy.

That setup will sound so crappy with most music you will be one unhappy camper. I can actually name four or five speaker "Systems" for under $600 that are better that the Acoustimass 10 system, but if you can spend $1000 or so there is no point in getting any of that kind of crap.

Here is a system that will blow that one into the ditch; high-quality speakers all around:

Front and rear; PSB Image B4 speakers $329/pair x 2= $660

Center; PSB Image C4; $300

Subwoofer; Rythmic FV12; $500. This is one SERIOUS subwoofer (unlike the wimpy crap that comes in any speaker "set"). It has a 12" driver, which is the smallest a SUBwoofer should have. That Bose "sub" isn't even close to being a decent woofer, with two little 5" speakers in it...that is the joke of the century.

This is a system that is 10 times better in every respect than any system from Bose. This will give you EXCELLENT sound for music or movies or what ever!!!

PSB makes some of the best speakers in the world, and Bose some of the crappiest; end of story.

For a receiver I would get the Denon AVR-1712, which has everything! Audessy MultiEQ XT, 6 HDMI inputs...the whole thing! $400.


Quote:
Originally Posted by TOA cakaroash View Post

Starting to look into speakers for the new man cave. 5.1 or possibly even 7.1 since the room is approx. 17' x 20'.
I would say that 80% of use will be movies and tv, but I still want music to sound great too.
Salesman is trying to sell me on Bose Acoustimass 10 Series. Ive listened to them before, and for movies I love how they sound. Plus the small size is very nice to look at. Sure the sub is a freaking beast, but thats easy to hide.

But I dont want to buy wondering if there was something else better for me or my wallet.
Total I plan on spending no more than $2000 for the receiver and speakers.

Recommendations please.

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post #8 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 08:17 AM
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[b]B[b]etter Off Shopping Elsewhere
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post #9 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 08:20 AM
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Play this against the Bose - then you tell me who is the Boss.
NHT - this will pancake the Bose.
http://www.nhthifi.com/Home-Theater-Absolute-Zero-5-1

Now you can buy 2 Absolute Zero's > one Absolute Center > and
2 SuperZero's for $900. That will leave room for an Epik sub, and
a good receiver.

Super Zero 2.0
http://www.nhthifi.com/Bookshelf-spe...&category=3772
The Sub
http://epiksubwoofers.com/legend.html

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Speakers > MB Quart VS05, Boston VS260, Snell K7
Subwoofer > Mordaunt Short Aviano 7
Receiver > Tascam PAR-200, Pioneer VSX-30
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post #10 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 08:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by commsysman View Post

Those tiny little front speakers are a big mistake, Bose or whatever!

They will only go down to maybe 120 Hz, which means half of your sound will be coming only from the sub and be MONAURAL! Their power output will also be severely limited.

What is the point of having 6 speakers and having half of the sound come from just one?? That is crazy.

That setup will sound so crappy with most music you will be one unhappy camper.

Here is a system that will blow that one into the ditch; high-quality speakers all around:

Front and rear; PSB Image B4 speakers $329/pair x 2= $660

Center; PSB Image C4; $300

Subwoofer; Rythmic FV12; $500

This is a system that is 10 times better in every respect than any system from Bose. This will give you EXCELLENT sound for music or movies or what ever!!!

PSB makes some of the best speakers in the world, and Bose some of the crappiest; end of story.

For a receiver I would get the Denon AVR-1712, which has everything! Audessy MultiEQ XT, 6 HDMI inputs...the whole thing! $400.

I think the above PSB system would sound great also. Maybe stretch the budget to get the B5 models.

Also look at Paradigm MilleniaOne 5.0 speakers ($250 each for total of $1250) and the FV12. The Paradigm price is MSRP, so you could probably get them for lower if you work the sales guy. The Millenia Sub is overpriced though, so stick with internet direct brands like Rythmik, Outlaw or Hsu. Paradigms are not sold online, so you would need to find a local dealer.

Other brands i would look at would be NHT, Energy, and Cambridge Audio.
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post #11 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 08:37 AM
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This is probalby the wrong forum to get much support for Bose. Speakers are one of those things where size matters. There are an infinite number of better solutions and for a 17x20 room I would not go with small speakers. I would look at anything mentioned above and throw in Def Tech PM1000 sats with the 2000 center and a good sub from Parts Express. Also, Vanns.com is selling Boston Acoustics VS260s and VS240s for $250 each. Throw in a $750 sub and they will crush the Bose.

Lowell


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post #12 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 08:42 AM
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I named the B4 because the OP seems to want smaller speakers. The B5 is certainly better, but the B4 would work fine and is smaller.


Quote:
Originally Posted by NewHTbuyer View Post

I think the above PSB system would sound great also. Maybe stretch the budget to get the B5 models.

Also look at Paradigm MilleniaOne 5.0 speakers ($250 each for total of $1250) and the FV12. The Paradigm price is MSRP, so you could probably get them for lower if you work the sales guy. The Millenia Sub is overpriced though, so stick with internet direct brands like Rythmik, Outlaw or Hsu. Paradigms are not sold online, so you would need to find a local dealer.

Other brands i would look at would be NHT, Energy, and Cambridge Audio.

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post #13 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 08:42 AM
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Take Commsysman advice! 2K can get you an incredible system!

I myself received an Acoustimass 6 as a gift for Christmas from my wife and after hooking it up and listing for a day, I had to break it to my wife that I needed to return it and start over! Also the Sub that comes with those systems is far from a beast! You will never get what you can with a good quality 12"-15" sub! Also if you can stretch your budget another $500 or $1000, you will just do yourself a favor and get the right equipment the first time! Depending on what your looking for and what I have learned, I would put most of my money into a receiver and a Sub! Be sure to get a receiver with Audyssey MultEQ or higher. The Denon 1912 or 2112 would be a good pick and if you do get a Sub, get something that can get down to 20hz! The Outlaw Audio LFM-1EX is a good sub the for the buck and also suggested the Rythmik FV12, now were talking beast!!!

Take you time, search the threads and ask questions! I would start with your receiver first and go from there!!! Happy shopping. Also be sure to call for a price, you can do better by giving a call!

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post #14 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 08:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tlalotoani View Post

No

Would like to add a word that starts with an H in front of that.
Performance to Cost ratio on Bose is probably the worse on earth. You are paying for the PR/Advertising/Hype of the Bose branding.


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post #15 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 08:55 AM
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Bose=junk.

Dumb enough to spend lots of cash on this junk!
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post #16 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 09:19 AM
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For $2K you can get a complete Paradigm Monitor Series system, whether it's a Mini Monitor or Monitor 7 mains. Bose=, well I can't say what I think...

Jeff
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post #17 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 09:29 AM
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Are you shopping at Best Buy?

If you take some time, you will find a lot of options that are better.

Bose is like a Toyota Camry. Everybody loves it because it does one thing really well what 80% of humans enjoy....a smooth middle of the road experience. But if you ever push the limits, you will find out that the Camry or the Bose are no match for the competition. In any case, check out other options mentioned here before you buy it.

My poor (rich) brother got himself a Bose system. We were watching a movie and the protagonist had a really deep voice, and everytime he spoke, I could hear him speaking from behind the sofa where the acoustimass module was hiding....really funny.

Moral of the story: Don't buy Bose. But if you do, hide the acoustimass behind the TV, at least that will keep the voice channel in the center.
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post #18 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 09:31 AM
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Haahahaha Bose

"We can complain because rose bushes have thorns or rejoice because thorn bushes have roses". - Abraham Lincoln
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post #19 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 09:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TOA cakaroash View Post

Starting to look into speakers for the new man cave. 5.1 or possibly even 7.1 since the room is approx. 17' x 20'.

I would say that 80% of use will be movies and tv, but I still want music to sound great too.

Salesman is trying to sell me on Bose Acoustimass 10 Series. Ive listened to them before, and for movies I love how they sound. Plus the small size is very nice to look at. Sure the sub is a freaking beast, but thats easy to hide.

But I dont want to buy wondering if there was something else better for me or my wallet.

Total I plan on spending no more than $2000 for the receiver and speakers.

Recommendations please.

Bose=overpriced crap. Enough said lol.
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post #20 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 09:37 AM
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I suggest you look at an Axiom system...

http://axiomaudio.com/epic50_main.html
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post #21 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 09:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chikoo View Post

Are you shopping at Best Buy?

If you take some time, you will find a lot of options that are better.

Bose is like a Toyota Camry. Everybody loves it because it does one thing really well what 80% of humans enjoy....a smooth middle of the road experience. But if you ever push the limits, you will find out that the Camry or the Bose are no match for the competition. In any case, check out other options mentioned here before you buy it.

Hey...I own a Toyota Camry

I have to agree. If you are indeed shopping at a "big box" company like Best Buy you really don't get a chance to hear what decent speakers can sound like. Those Bose are good for people who don't want the hassle of having to do research to find something better or for people who want to stay ignorant to what's actually out there. Because, if you got to hear a REAL sound system, you'd never buy the Bose system you auditioned.

Another thing to mention are your room dimensions. It's a fairly decent sized room. If you ever wanted to crank up the volume on those you're going to be very disappointed. They will sound distorted and not clear at all.

I've listened to that Bose system. They actually have a dedicated Bose store near me. Either their salesmen all drank the coolaid or they really are ignorant to what else is out there because they seem to all think their speakers are like the second coming of Christ.

My JTR Triple 8's are quite the experience and put on a great show. There are so many speakers out there vastly superior to those Bose at this price point. Trust all of us when we say you can do MUCH better for your money especially if you have $2000 to spend.

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post #22 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 09:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chikoo View Post

Are you shopping at Best Buy?

If you take some time, you will find a lot of options that are better.

Bose is like a Toyota Camry. Everybody loves it because it does one thing really well what 80% of humans enjoy....a smooth middle of the road experience. But if you ever push the limits, you will find out that the Camry or the Bose are no match for the competition. In any case, check out other options mentioned here before you buy it.

My poor (rich) brother got himself a Bose system. We were watching a movie and the protagonist had a really deep voice, and everytime he spoke, I could hear him speaking from behind the sofa where the acoustimass module was hiding....really funny.

Moral of the story: Don't buy Bose. But if you do, hide the acoustimass behind the TV, at least that will keep the voice channel in the center.

I have a Camry also, but my daughter is using it! Me, I now have a Suburu Legacy..I mentioned the Paradigms because I have the Monitor 9s, but there are SO many options in that catagory, especially in that price range. Remember, BB sells Bose, they also sell and push Monster Cable, both are way overpriced products.

Jeff
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post #23 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 09:46 AM
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Now for a recommendation:
Here is what I got for well under $2000 and sounds as good as it can get for this price range.

3 ea of C/L/R 2002 = $624.00 from Electronics Expo (shipping included)
2 ea of SR-8040BP = #355.00 from Electronics Expo (Shipping Included)
2 ea of Velodyne VX11 = $358.00 from Velodyne Direct (Shipping Included)
1 ea of Harmon Kardon AVR-2600 = $249.00 from Newegg (Shipping Included)

Total Cost = $1586.00

Movie Soundstage = Amazing. I actually enjoyed watching Pirates of the Caribbean on this setup more than I did in the theatres.

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post #24 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 10:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chikoo View Post

Bose is like a Toyota Camry.

No, there are no existing car analogies that match Bose's product line. But we can make one up!

If the 1985 Yugo GV was reintroduced with no changes, but Yugo spent a billion dollars marketing it as a high performance luxury car, and set the MSRP at $175,000 ... that would be roughly comparable to the Bose product line.
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post #25 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 10:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cacophony777 View Post

No, there are no existing car analogies that match Bose's product line. But we can make one up!

If the 1985 Yugo GV was reintroduced with no changes, but Yugo spent a billion dollars marketing it as a high performance luxury car, and set the MSRP at $175,000 ... that would be roughly comparable to the Bose product line.

I think that the price of the 1985 Yugo GV, adjusted for inflation, should be mentioned.
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post #26 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 10:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by allsop4now View Post

I think that the price of the 1985 Yugo GV, adjusted for inflation, should be mentioned.

Sure, in 1985 the Yugo GV was available for the low low price of $3999. In today's dollar that would be $8424.

Here's a video review of a newer, much higher spec 1988 model for those that aren't familiar:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tgG8K86wK2o
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post #27 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 10:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cacophony777 View Post

No, there are no existing car analogies that match Bose's product line. But we can make one up!

If the 1985 Yugo GV was reintroduced with no changes, but Yugo spent a billion dollars marketing it as a high performance luxury car, and set the MSRP at $175,000 ... that would be roughly comparable to the Bose product line.

That is not the correct analogy.

Bose = Camry is the right one.

Like a Camry, Bose is pretty reliable. I have my brother and couple of friends who have Bose (and I call them friends...shame on me ) and they work pretty reliably. In addition, the outdoor mall near me has roughly 300 Bose outdoor speakers and I have not heard anyone of them not working anytime I walk through the streets of the mall. Just like a Camry. Pretty reliable.
But when it comes time to push the limits of performance, just like a Camry, they are no good.
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post #28 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 10:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chikoo View Post

That is not the correct analogy.

Bose = Camry is the right one.

Like a Camry, Bose is pretty reliable. I have my brother and couple of friends who have Bose (and I call them friends...shame on me ) and they work pretty reliably. In addition, the outdoor mall near me has roughly 300 Bose outdoor speakers and I have not heard anyone of them not working anytime I walk through the streets of the mall. Just like a Camry. Pretty reliable.
But when it comes time to push the limits of performance, just like a Camry, they are no good.

But the Camry is actually a good car. In fact it's currently Consumer Report's highest rated family sedan! It's quite, comfortable, roomy, fuel efficient, has a good powertrain, cheap to maintain/insure, reliable, lots of trunk space, etc etc. The Camry is a good car recommendation for many people. Just not for those that value steering feel or sporty handling.

Bose 5.1/7.1 systems would not be a good recommendation for anybody. You can get superior performance for 1/10th the cost (a $300 Energy Take 5.1 is superior to the $3k Bose 7.1 system). If a person only cares about having tiny speakers, orb audio is much better and cheaper.

So no, I don't think the Camry is a good analogy.
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post #29 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 10:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cacophony777 View Post

But the Camry is actually a good car. It's relatively quite, fuel efficient, cheap to maintain/insure, reliable, has a nice ride, fits a large family with lots of trunk space, etc etc. The Camry is a reasonable car recommendation for many people.

Bose would not be a good recommendation for anybody. You can get superior performance for 1/10th the cost. If a person cares about having tiny speakers, orb audio is better and cheaper.

So no, I don't think the Camry is a good analogy.

Bose = Reliable
Camry = Reliable

Bose = Expensive
Camry = Expensive
(You can have a Mazda6 or a Nissan Altima for cheaper (or more features for the same price and they perform better in all departments of performance than a Camry)

Even thought Bose = Tiny speakers, they perform just well for most normal non critical TV viewers. For those viewers they do not know what they are missing because they don't even get to hear it

For users of Camry, they do not know what they are missing because either they don't care or are not looking for those performance such as better handling, superior road feel, better brake feel, more trunk room, fully folding rear seats, 6-cd changer as standard, Blind spot monitoring system, bluetooth audio as standard...and the list goes on.
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post #30 of 220 Old 02-18-2012, 11:04 AM
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Speaking of a Camry. I just sent mine to the junkyard ( body rusted) engine was great. 250000 mi. And didn't use oil or anything. Ran like a sewing machine. Year 1990.

"We can complain because rose bushes have thorns or rejoice because thorn bushes have roses". - Abraham Lincoln
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