JTR Speakers and Music - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 67 Old 02-23-2012, 02:04 PM - Thread Starter
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I've read a lot about speakers like the JTR Triple 12HT and their other speakers and how people rave about their dynamics, huge sound stage and cost to performance ratio. These speakers seem to definitely be geared specifically to home theater. While I have my eyes on the Paradigm Sigs, these also caught my attention because they satisfy another craving of mine which would be huge dynamics, and high, unstrained SPL. I have no doubt about their ability to rock a home theater, and probably even my local clear view cinema lol, but how do they perform with music? I'm sure they produce a large, spacious, room filling sound that probably sound very much live, but hows the clarity for music? Would you still hear all the subtle nuances in the music as you would with a speaker like the Paradigm S8? For example, on the Eagles Hell Freezes Over DVD, the beginning of Hotel California, the guitars come through so clear, you can hear Joe Walshs and Don Felders hands slide up and down the neck of the guitar, and you can hear/feel the texture of the strings. Would a speaker like the Triple 12HT be able to do something like that? Somehow I doubt it, but figured it wouldn't hurt to ask.
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post #2 of 67 Old 02-23-2012, 02:17 PM
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The ability of huge dynamics, and high, unstrained SPL doesn't exclude highly resolving sound. While i know nothing of the JTR, my Klipschorns are certainly dynamic (104 dB sensitivity) but do incredibly well at the type of detail you describe, as well as image the strings being brushed.

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post #3 of 67 Old 02-23-2012, 02:29 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by psgcdn View Post

The ability of huge dynamics, and high, unstrained SPL doesn't exclude highly resolving sound. While i know nothing of the JTR, my Klipschorns are certainly dynamic (104 dB sensitivity) but do incredibly well at the type of detail you describe, as well as image the strings being brushed.

I figured there was a catch, as there usually is in audio. I hear from some people they sound very energetic. I wish there was a way to audition these lol
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post #4 of 67 Old 02-23-2012, 02:33 PM
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Where are you located? There's prob someone around that has them...

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post #5 of 67 Old 02-23-2012, 02:37 PM - Thread Starter
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I'm in Nassau County of Long Island, New York.
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post #6 of 67 Old 02-23-2012, 02:39 PM
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I demoed the S8's extensively a few years ago and decided to go with Revel Performas instead. The Paradigms are a very nice sounding speaker but I thought they were a little bright on the high frequencies. It could have been the dealers room that made them sound that way.

Regarding the Triple 12's, there have been upgrades to the compression driver and improvements to the crossover that make the current Triple 12HT the best sounding JTR speaker yet. I have the Eagles Live in Melbourne HD-DVD and that is one of the best recorded soundtracks I own (I also have the HFO DVD). I used to listen to that disk with my Revel Ultima Studio 2's ($16K pair) and get goose bumps from the detail and clarity of both the instrumentation and vocals. I listen to that disk regularly with the Triple 12's and I think that concert sounds better on the Triple 12's. No loss of clarity, no details missing. If I crank it up it gets louder and stays clear and detailed.

IMO, the only thing that Paradigms-Revels etc have on the JTR's is better aesthetics.

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post #7 of 67 Old 02-23-2012, 02:43 PM
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There you go! JTR gets mentioned, RMK to the rescue!

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post #8 of 67 Old 02-23-2012, 02:47 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RMK! View Post

I demoed the S8's extensively a few years ago and decided to go with Revel Performas instead. The Paradigms are a very nice sounding speaker but I thought they were a little bright on the high frequencies. It could have been the dealers room that made them sound that way.

Regarding the Triple 12's, there have been upgrades to the compression driver and improvements to the crossover that make the current Triple 12HT the best sounding JTR speaker yet. I have the Eagles Live in Melbourne HD-DVD and that is one of the best recorded soundtracks I own (I also have the HFO DVD). I used to listen to that disk with my Revel Ultima Studio 2's ($16K pair) and get goose bumps from the detail and clarity of both the instrumentation and vocals. I listen to that disk regularly with the Triple 12's and I think that concert sounds better on the Triple 12's. No loss of clarity, no details missing. If I crank it up it gets louder and stays clear and detailed.

IMO, the only thing that Paradigms-Revels etc have on the JTR's is better aesthetics.

That right there is making me consider the JTR's lol. Now one more question. Whats the difference between the Triple 12HT and the Triple 12HT-LP?

Do you think these guys powered by an Outlaw 7900 would suffice? The Outlaw 7900 is a very high current amp, requiring 2 separate 15 amp circuits to power it. But the Triple 12HT's are 4 ohm speakers and while I'm sure the Outlaw 7900 can handle a 4 ohm load, it doesn't specify it on their website or say how much power into 4 ohms it gives.
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post #9 of 67 Old 02-23-2012, 03:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackdevil77 View Post

That right there is making me consider the JTR's lol. Now one more question. Whats the difference between the Triple 12HT and the Triple 12HT-LP?

Do you think these guys powered by an Outlaw 7900 would suffice? The Outlaw 7900 is a very high current amp, requiring 2 separate 15 amp circuits to power it. But the Triple 12HT's are 4 ohm speakers and while I'm sure the Outlaw 7900 can handle a 4 ohm load, it doesn't specify it on their website or say how much power into 4 ohms it gives.

I haven't seen nor heard the smaller form factor, sealed Triple 12 LP's but according to Jeff they might be a bit better in the midbass if placed close to an untreated back or side wall. I have both the back wall and side walls treated so no issues.

The Outlaw amp will have no problem and according to one review is rated @ 450 wpc into 4 ohms so should easily drive the Triple 12's to insane levels in all but the largest rooms.

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post #10 of 67 Old 02-23-2012, 03:06 PM
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Originally Posted by mookie b View Post

There you go! JTR gets mentioned, RMK to the rescue!

Yeah, I'm still waiting for a commission check ...

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post #11 of 67 Old 02-23-2012, 03:17 PM - Thread Starter
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Nice. I was looking at crown amps for the Triple 12HT's but I like the low distortion and the much better Signal to noise ratio of the Outlaw amp. And I'm sure 450 watts into a speaker that efficient would be enough to shake the pillars of hell lol. If anything, I'll have loads of head room in the size room I'm gonna have them in. If I get the JTR's, I was thinking about going with an audio transparent screen and having the speakers behind the screen. Not sure with would be better for me, the LP's or the regular 12HT's.
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post #12 of 67 Old 02-23-2012, 03:43 PM
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I replaced Klipsch RF-83s in my music room with Triple 12HTs. I was worried they wouldn't be much of an improvement because the 83s sounded so good.

WOW, was that the best move!!!!

I almost mistakenly went with some PA speakers because LOUD is what I was after. The T12s gave me tons of loud, but I also got dynamics and such beautiful clarity and detail that I wouldn't have gotten with the PA speakers.

I'm so happy I got the JTRs. So much that I am now wanting to replace my Klipsch HT setup with JTR.



As for HT vs. HT-LP, I went with HT for the looks with the slotted ports. The LPs don't have as much mid-bass which makes them more ideal for setups where boundary gain (near walls/corners) is utilized. The HTs could have the potential to over-contribute to mid-bass. However, the ported HTs are no problem corner loaded in my setup.

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post #13 of 67 Old 02-23-2012, 05:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the Son View Post

I replaced Klipsch RF-83s in my music room with Triple 12HTs. I was worried they wouldn't be much of an improvement because the 83s sounded so good.

WOW, was that the best move!!!!

I almost mistakenly went with some PA speakers because LOUD is what I was after. The T12s gave me tons of loud, but I also got dynamics and such beautiful clarity and detail that I wouldn't have gotten with the PA speakers.

I'm so happy I got the JTRs. So much that I am now wanting to replace my Klipsch HT setup with JTR.

As for HT vs. HT-LP, I went with HT for the looks with the slotted ports. The LPs don't have as much mid-bass which makes them more ideal for setups where boundary gain (near walls/corners) is utilized. The HTs could have the potential to over-contribute to mid-bass. However, the ported HTs are no problem corner loaded in my setup.

The LP's do have as much mid bass they just don't extend as deep. Mid bass to me is 80hz to 200hz.
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post #14 of 67 Old 02-23-2012, 06:39 PM
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Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post

The LP's do have as much mid bass they just don't extend as deep. Mid bass to me is 80hz to 200hz.

When I was deciding on mine, Jeff said the LPs don't have as much midbass, and they benefit by being placed near a wall. Also that the HTs have more and thus do not need to be placed near a wall. I was just going by what Jeff said.

You are right about extension, though. The HTs go down to 60Hz and the LPs 65Hz.
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post #15 of 67 Old 02-24-2012, 09:46 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by RMK! View Post

I have the Eagles Live in Melbourne HD-DVD and that is one of the best recorded soundtracks I own (I also have the HFO DVD).

Forgot to mention I have this DVD also, but on regular DVD. I had to buy it as soon as it came out since I was at this concert
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post #16 of 67 Old 02-24-2012, 09:55 AM
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My experience with the JTR's may be a bit dated as mine are a few years old now. I can't remember which version they are but I got them in early 2010 I think.

They are certainly very clear and dynamic but I don't think they image nearly as well as other speakers. I rarely (if ever) got that goosebumps feeling that I would get regularly with my Magnepans and even the Revels I had previously. I think they are really excellent speakers for HT use but for stereo listening, I prefer other speakers. Newer versions that I have not heard may have fixed the problems I have with them but I found that their resolution and imaging lacked in comparison to other speakers. The JTR's put up a great big wall of sound that was very dynamic but lacked the subtle nuances other speakers provided and couldn't place instruments clearly in the soundstage.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence

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post #17 of 67 Old 03-25-2012, 05:38 PM - Thread Starter
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Just revisited my old thread I almost forgot about.

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Originally Posted by mrlittlejeans View Post

My experience with the JTR's may be a bit dated as mine are a few years old now. I can't remember which version they are but I got them in early 2010 I think.

They are certainly very clear and dynamic but I don't think they image nearly as well as other speakers. I rarely (if ever) got that goosebumps feeling that I would get regularly with my Magnepans and even the Revels I had previously. I think they are really excellent speakers for HT use but for stereo listening, I prefer other speakers. Newer versions that I have not heard may have fixed the problems I have with them but I found that their resolution and imaging lacked in comparison to other speakers. The JTR's put up a great big wall of sound that was very dynamic but lacked the subtle nuances other speakers provided and couldn't place instruments clearly in the soundstage.

That was one of the things i was worried about. Can't have it all I guess. Is there a possibility perhaps the distances aren't set up quite right or there are unwanted sound reflections?

Either way, there benefits for home theater and giving that huge "live" sound is just too appealing to me. I must have them lol. If they don't satisfy my needs for more subtle 2 channel listening, I'll just have to get a separate 2 channel music rig.

Luckily, someone contacted me that is within an hour of me with T8s!

I'm planning on the T12's but I'm sure I'll still get the gist of what they are all about. Perhaps the T12's are more punchy and dynamic.
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post #18 of 67 Old 03-25-2012, 06:06 PM
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JTR's are awesome for music and most people forget they were made for live music in the first place, not HT.
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post #19 of 67 Old 03-25-2012, 06:29 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post

JTR's are awesome for music and most people forget they were made for live music in the first place, not HT.

Were they designed for live music or for the home?

Either way, they sound like way too much fun to pass up. My JBL PRX speakers were designed for music also, but designed for SPL more so then complete sound quality. Not that they don't sound good, because they really do. I thoroughly enjoy listening to music on them, but sometimes they lack that mid-range that makes certain voices sound hallow like when I listened to Andrea Bocelli today singing Besame Mucho on my PRX615ms. I'm betting the JTR's probably sound better then my JBL's.
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post #20 of 67 Old 03-25-2012, 06:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackdevil77 View Post

Just revisited my old thread I almost forgot about.



That was one of the things i was worried about. Can't have it all I guess. Is there a possibility perhaps the distances aren't set up quite right or there are unwanted sound reflections?

Either way, there benefits for home theater and giving that huge "live" sound is just too appealing to me. I must have them lol. If they don't satisfy my needs for more subtle 2 channel listening, I'll just have to get a separate 2 channel music rig.

Luckily, someone contacted me that is within an hour of me with T8s!

I'm planning on the T12's but I'm sure I'll still get the gist of what they are all about. Perhaps the T12's are more punchy and dynamic.

My prepro is an Onkyo 5507 (same as the integra 80.1) and my amps are all Parasound Halo (A21 for the front L&R). The sources are an Oppo 83 and a squeezebox touch. I listened with Audyssey engaged and not engaged. I also have a Parasound 2100 which I think sounds better than the Onkyo for pure stereo listening. I have the subs eq'd with a Velodyne SMS-1 and the room is heavily treated.

For HT, they are great. If you care about imaging and two channel music and not ultimate SPL, there are better choices.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence

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post #21 of 67 Old 03-25-2012, 07:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrlittlejeans View Post


My prepro is an Onkyo 5507 (same as the integra 80.1) and my amps are all Parasound Halo (A21 for the front L&R). The sources are an Oppo 83 and a squeezebox touch. I listened with Audyssey engaged and not engaged. I also have a Parasound 2100 which I think sounds better than the Onkyo for pure stereo listening. I have the subs eq'd with a Velodyne SMS-1 and the room is heavily treated.

For HT, they are great. If you care about imaging and two channel music and not ultimate SPL, there are better choices.

What if you want louder than what the Maggies and revels provide? What happens when you have a room that demands it? I also owned Maggies and loved them for music but they have 2 flaws as well, they don't play loud and their sweet spot for that great image is small anyways. I guess if you sit in one spot and don't move, the Maggies are awesome at about 100 dBs.
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post #22 of 67 Old 03-25-2012, 07:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrlittlejeans View Post

My prepro is an Onkyo 5507 (same as the integra 80.1) and my amps are all Parasound Halo (A21 for the front L&R). The sources are an Oppo 83 and a squeezebox touch. I listened with Audyssey engaged and not engaged. I also have a Parasound 2100 which I think sounds better than the Onkyo for pure stereo listening. I have the subs eq'd with a Velodyne SMS-1 and the room is heavily treated.

For HT, they are great. If you care about imaging and two channel music and not ultimate SPL, there are better choices.

That's the problem. I care about everything equally lol. It just depends on my mood. My thinking is, due to my budgets and wants/needs, it would be best to have the JTR's for the theater, and a separate, dedicated 2 channel music rig so there doesn't have to be any compromises.
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post #23 of 67 Old 03-25-2012, 07:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackdevil77 View Post


That's the problem. I care about everything equally lol. It just depends on my mood. My thinking is, due to my budgets and wants/needs, it would be best to have the JTR's for the theater, and a separate, dedicated 2 channel music rig so there doesn't have to be any compromises.

The JTR's gave me goose bumps! I had a front stage triple 8LP with dual Cap 1000's crossed over at 100hz. My gear was an Ada suite 7.1 HD with an Ada MPA-501 amp! It was great for music. Tom Petty never sound better!
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post #24 of 67 Old 03-25-2012, 07:23 PM
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Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post

What if you want louder than what the Maggies and revels provide? What happens when you have a room that demands it? I also owned Maggies and loved them for music but they have 2 flaws as well, they don't play loud and their sweet spot for that great image is small anyways. I guess if you sit in one spot and don't move, the Maggies are awesome at about 100 dBs.

I don't have the Mags anymore because my current room isn't quite as big as I would like. When I did have them, they were in a 15' X 25' room and I had no problem getting them loud enough when listening to music. My current room is 12.5' x just over 20'.

I'm currently using some JBL PT800's for two channel and they are much better for two channel than the JTR's. For HT, I prefer the JTR's. I still have the JTR's but will most likely sell them shortly.

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post #25 of 67 Old 03-25-2012, 07:25 PM
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Originally Posted by mrlittlejeans View Post


I don't have the Mags anymore because my current room isn't quite as big as I would like. When I did have them, they were in a 15' X 25' room and I had no problem getting them loud enough when listening to music. My current room is 12.5' x just over 20'.

I'm currently using some JBL PT800's for two channel and they are much better for two channel than the JTR's. For HT, I prefer the JTR's. I still have the JTR's but will most likely sell them shortly.

I have to google those JBL's, which ones are they? I have some awesome JBL's myself.
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post #26 of 67 Old 03-25-2012, 07:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackdevil77 View Post

That's the problem. I care about everything equally lol. It just depends on my mood. My thinking is, due to my budgets and wants/needs, it would be best to have the JTR's for the theater, and a separate, dedicated 2 channel music rig so there doesn't have to be any compromises.

Don't forget, starting last year Jeff made some changes to the speaker line with the intent of improving their fidelity. A new compression driver as well as other changes, I forget all the details. Give them a listen first before you make any decisions.
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post #27 of 67 Old 03-25-2012, 07:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackdevil77 View Post

That's the problem. I care about everything equally lol. It just depends on my mood. My thinking is, due to my budgets and wants/needs, it would be best to have the JTR's for the theater, and a separate, dedicated 2 channel music rig so there doesn't have to be any compromises.

You could try some Geddes loudspeakers. I haven't heard them but they get really good reviews and have excellent measurements. They are said to image very well and throw a very nice soundstage for two channel use while having the SPL and dynamics for HT.

If you want to go with a two system approach, you could get some nice speakers for two channel where you won't need the extreme dynamics you want for HT and pick up some cheap HT speakers like the ED or Chase offerings.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence

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post #28 of 67 Old 03-25-2012, 07:32 PM - Thread Starter
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JBL, that's not a name I expected to hear for 2 channel music lmao. My JBL pro system was anything but subtle. I took them to a local club with a fellow DJ friend to see how hard we could rock the place. We were told to turn it down because the neighborhood was complaining (and this is a club!!!! NOT a residency!) and my ears were ringing for over 3 days straight. I had to take advil the next day because my ears and head hurt so bad. Now that's some seriously damaging SPL.
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post #29 of 67 Old 03-25-2012, 07:34 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dpc716 View Post

Don't forget, starting last year Jeff made some changes to the speaker line with the intent of improving their fidelity. A new compression driver as well as other changes, I forget all the details. Give them a listen first before you make any decisions.

That's what I'm trying to do. Finding them to audition has proven to be a hell of a job in itself. One generous member on here pm-ed me telling me he owns the T8's if I wanted to take a listen and he's within an hour from me. I don't know how old his are, or if he got them prior to the improvements.
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post #30 of 67 Old 03-25-2012, 07:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post

I have to google those JBL's, which ones are they? I have some awesome JBL's myself.

They are what the Revel Gem 2 is based on (even share a driver or two IIRC). I like them but I have found they are a bit hot on the highs like the M22's and F32's I had. Hot may be the wrong word but they have a bit of sibilance that can get fatiguing.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence

mrlittlejeans is offline  
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