Speakers for 20-30K - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 03:26 PM - Thread Starter
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Finally moving to a house in July with a large room for office ( about 400sf ) , My budget for a pair of speakers is between 20-30K. Its going to be for critical listening, will be incorporated into a personal HT later. ( me only , family has a HT down stairs)
and No I have no electronics yet ( Amp, Processors,etc ) bought yet.
I live in Westchester NY. ( 25 miles north of NYC)
I have auditioned
-B&W 802 and 800.
-Adam tensor Gamma
-Wilson Sophia 3
But in different places with really different equipment and not even in the same day.
All nearby dealer hate Revels for some reason, They talk you out of buying them. ( I cant find a place to audition them, maybe I should go to city)
I plan to start with Peachtree grand integrated (400wpc) and upgrade electronics as I can afford it.
Please tell me what you think about speakers, I'm open to any suggestion.
Used or new doesn't matter. Aesthetics are not important. I mostely listen to classic rock and classical.
I'm a noob in HIFI audio but computer savvy.
I appreciate your input.
PS. I searched and couldn't find another thread with same question, pardon me if I missed it.

UPDATE:
Dear dealers, I will be happy if you PM me your price on the speakers that you have for sale, If you are not Local to Westchester NY or withing 50 miles please PM me your shipped price.
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post #2 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 03:30 PM
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Well, I haven't actually heard any speakers in this price range, but I'll offer the flagship model offered by the brand of my current speakers.

Specs: http://swanspeakers.com/products/pro...&sid=41&pid=97
Dealer: https://clevelandplasma.com/store/sw...wan_2_3b_front

Call Chris for an accurate price, he'll give you a nice offer.



There is a review or two (if I recall correctly) in the Swan Owner's Thread. The reviews were from people that demoed them when they visited Chris.

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post #3 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 03:37 PM
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With that kind of budget you really should take a chunk and have a quality custom installer set up a full assortment of room treatments (bass traps, diffusion/absorption panels, ceiling tiles, etc) . After you have an ideal room setup for $10k+ speakers then you can start arranging in home demos for all of these uber speakers.
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post #4 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 03:43 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay1 View Post

With that kind of budget you really should take a chunk and have a quality custom installer set up a full assortment of room treatments (bass traps, diffusion/absorption panels, ceiling tiles, etc) . After you have an ideal room setup for $10k+ speakers then you can start arranging in home demos for all of these uber speakers.

I'll budget that separately , since its my office and listening room.
My budget for speakers stays the same for 20-30K.
If experts here believe a pair of speakers that is less expensive is going to give me the same or better experience I'm all ears.
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post #5 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 03:46 PM
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Gees OH Pete, what do you guys do to make that kind of money to be able to spend 30 thousand dollars on speakers? I am retired now, but even when I was working with 3 college degrees that is half a year's salary. I paid just double that for my condo/townhouse.
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post #6 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 03:52 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by macfan View Post

Gees OH Pete, what do you guys do to make that kind of money to be able to spend 30 thousand dollars on speakers? I am retired now, but even when I was working with 3 college degrees that is half a year's salary. I paid just double that for my condo/townhouse.

22 Years of education ( graduating in June 40y/o) , 500K worth of student loans.
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post #7 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 03:54 PM
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With that kind of coin only Meyer X-10 will do!!!

http://www.meyersound.com/products/studioseries/x-10/

They are roughly $30k a pair and then you have a sub and controller.

http://www.hometheatershack.com/foru...rs-review.html
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post #8 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 03:58 PM
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Dynaudio Confidence C4

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post #9 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 03:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by babak147 View Post

Finally moving to a house in July with a large room for office ( about 400sf ) , My budget for a pair of speakers is between 20-30K. Its going to be for critical listening, will be incorporated into a personal HT later. ( me only , family has a HT down stairs)
and No I have no electronics yet ( Amp, Processors,etc ) bought yet.
I live in Westchester NY. ( 25 miles north of NYC)
I have auditioned
-B&W 802 and 800.
-Adam tensor Gamma
-Wilson Sophia 3
But in different places with really different equipment and not even in the same day.
All nearby dealer hate Revels for some reason, They talk you out of buying them. ( I cant find a place to audition them, maybe I should go to city)
I plan to start with Peachtree grand integrated (400wpc) and upgrade electronics as I can afford it.
Please tell me what you think about speakers, I'm open to any suggestion.
Used or new doesn't matter. Aesthetics are not important. I mostely listen to classic rock and classical.
I'm a noob in HIFI audio but computer savvy.
I appreciate your input.
PS. I searched and couldn't find another thread with same question, pardon me if I missed it.

That is a good sized room. i would get something that can fill it pretty easily. Not anywhere near your budget, but I would go listen to Klipschorn: http://www.klipsch.com/klipschorn-floorstanding-speaker I think you would really like how these speakers sound for classical music. I would at least listen to them to compare them against the higher end speakers.

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post #10 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 04:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by babak147 View Post

22 Years of education ( graduating in June 40y/o) , 500K worth of student loans.

Must be a Doc of some sort?
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post #11 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 04:11 PM
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Medical Doc, not Ph.D., for sure!

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post #12 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 04:26 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wrager View Post

With that kind of coin only Meyer X-10 will do!!!

http://www.meyersound.com/products/studioseries/x-10/

They are roughly $30k a pair and then you have a sub and controller.

http://www.hometheatershack.com/foru...rs-review.html

That sounds intriguing , Do you actually know anyone who uses it for everyday music listening ? The article talks more about loudness and dynamics that highs and lows and detail, Any suggestions ?
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post #13 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 04:26 PM
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If you can audition them, make sure to check out the Magnepan 20.7.

You might want to talk to Mark Seaton about a Catalyst 12C/Submersive HP based active system. This would be a massive bargain relative to your budget.

The Meyer X-10 mentioned above would be an awesome option, but I believe that you will actually surpass your $30k budget by a good amount when all is said and done, though amplification is included.

With that budget there are so many options available. Do not pass up an audition of the Revels. I'm not sure why the dealers in your area are down on them, but you owe it to yourself to at least listen and see how they fit your priorities. I've always found them (whether F series or Salons) to be very enjoyable.
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post #14 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 04:30 PM
 
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At that pricepoint I'd look to a line array with DEQX and QUALITY drivers...

http://www.selahaudio.com/id73.html

The Julietta is $19,000

The Arc Array is a joint effort with Selah Audio and Don Keele and Marshall Kay of Audio Artistry and starts at about $20,000

These speaker will best anything from the "big names" including that PA stuff that impresses so many...

For that kinda money you should be able to get a GURU designer to make a loudspeaker CUSTOM JUST FOR YOUR TASTE.

Don't look to big names with products in that pricepoint like Dynaudio et al because I'm telling ya these other guys could best them NO PROBLEM.

Here is the Audio Artistry site

http://www.audioartistry.com/

Don Keele's Keynote Speech on Line Arrays


There is SIX PARTS so view at youtube!


babak147 PM me and I'll give you a list of gentlemen that can build your $20k-30k DREAM SPEAKERS.

I would also suggest Jed Kunz of Clearwave Loudspeaker Design. He lives near you as well in Rochester and you can audition his speakers in NY at Clearsound Audio http://clearsoundaudio1.com/

Here is the best thread on the net with samples of DIY designs. Some of those designers for the kind of money your talking could really ROCK YOUR WORLD
http://www.htguide.com/forum/printthread.php4?t=28655

PS not sure why you're hellbent on Peachtree OP as I can think of better DACs (Burson) and amps at that pricepoint...
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post #15 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 04:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by babak147 View Post

That sounds intriguing , Do you actually know anyone who uses it for everyday music listening ? The article talks more about loudness and dynamics that highs and lows and detail, Any suggestions ?

I don't, wish I did. Remember these are used in recording studios where precise playback is vital.
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post #16 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 04:45 PM
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Legacy Audio Whispers, or Helix may be a good choice
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post #17 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 04:55 PM
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NHT Super Zeros come to mind.

Oh, wait. That would be my budget

My bad.

Other than that lame attempt at humor I can't for the life of me figure out why someone with 30K to drop on a pair of speakers is asking for advice on the internet.

At that price you should be having speakers brought out to your house and demoed for you.

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post #18 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 04:55 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by babak147 View Post

I live in Westchester NY. ( 25 miles north of NYC)

There was a show in NYC last weekend http://www.chestergroup.org/index.ph...wyorkaudioshow, not sure if you attended.
Couple links to the coverage:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13645_3-57...-starts-today/
http://www.enjoythemusic.com/new_york_audio_av_2012/
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=103147.0
http://www.stereophile.com/category/...av-2012?page=2
Not sure when the next one is scheduled, but it might have been a good opportunity for you to listen to a bunch of systems in one place.

cheers,

AJ
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post #19 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 04:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mmiles View Post

Dynaudio Confidence C4

+1
The Dynaudio C4 Sigs are great speakers, and you can find them in NY for sure.

And for amplification, I have heard the Confidence line on several pieces of gear, T+A's R series is nice stuff, so is their V series but a little more expensive, however very good. Octave Tube Amps are nice as well. I have heard Audio Research gear with some other Dynaudio Sapphires as well, and it was very good. The other day I heard the C2 Sigs with some Boulder Gear, and it was great.

I have heard the Wilsons and 802Ds, I like Dynaudio much more.

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post #20 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 05:03 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Kini62 View Post

NHT Super Zeros come to mind.

Oh, wait. That would be my budget

My bad.

Other than that lame attempt at humor I can't for the life of me figure out why someone with 30K to drop on a pair of speakers is asking for advice on the internet.

At that price you should be having speakers brought out to your house and demoed for you.

Here I can get advice with only personal bias, Dealer will bias based on availability ,margin and personal preference.
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post #21 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 05:05 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AJinFLA View Post

There was a show in NYC last weekend http://www.chestergroup.org/index.ph...wyorkaudioshow, not sure if you attended.
Couple links to the coverage:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13645_3-57...-starts-today/
http://www.enjoythemusic.com/new_york_audio_av_2012/
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=103147.0
http://www.stereophile.com/category/...av-2012?page=2
Not sure when the next one is scheduled, but it might have been a good opportunity for you to listen to a bunch of systems in one place.

cheers,

AJ

I wanted to go but job responsibilities would let me
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post #22 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 05:06 PM
 
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callas01 I can only imagine how much those line arrays would impress you!!!

LOL
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post #23 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 05:07 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by babak147 View Post

Here I can get advice with only personal bias, Dealer will bias based on availability ,margin and personal preference.

AND WATCH OUT

Representatives/dealers of those outfits frequent these forums and some even astroturf/sockpuppet my friend.

Especially once they smell $$$...

Seriously by employing an expert designer you avoid all of that BS.

And don't believe 80% of what the review sites say either...

And that one review site... the one that indexes many speaker consumer reviews.

I've used archive.org and google cache to PROVE they sensor bad reviews when the vendor is an advertising partner.

This industry is so rife with BS and all out SCAMS I don't know what to say other than...

WATCH OUT

and

IGNORANCE IS BLISS
(when you've been SCAMMED)
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post #24 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 05:15 PM
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Just a bit of advice....I'd bet many people on here have not heard a ton of speakers in this range. You're going to get a lot of responses commenting on your budget. I think the people are right though, the best thing for you to do is go look around and maybe listen in the store, then the ones you like the best take a trial in your home. Most speakers in that price range will be set-up in a quality listening environment, so if you treat your room like you state, they should sound equally good at home. Unfortunately the most expensive speaker I've heard is the Paradigm S8. I thought they were pretty amazing.

I would bet that Salk Sound has something you would like. They have a really good reputation on here.

http://www.salksound.com/

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post #25 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 05:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Solid-State View Post

AND WATCH OUT

Representatives/dealers of those outfits frequent these forums and some even astroturf/sockpuppet my friend.

Especially once they smell $$$...

Seriously by employing an expert designer you avoid all of that BS.

This is not totally true...almost all designers have an agenda too. They push their own line that they carry. Some offer many choices, but many have a certain brand that they will push. Manufacturers lobby designers to hock their stuff. It's up to the person buying to decide what they actually like.
Implementation of the selected speakers and room acoustics is where the designer comes in.

Panasonic P60ST50-Yamaha RX-V467 receiver-Sony PS3-Velodyne SMS-1-Canton 430 mains, 455 center and 402 surrounds-Rythmik FV15HP subwoofer- Pro-ject Debut III turntable- I also have a pair of Mark K's DIY design, the ER18DXT's
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My humble entertainment room
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1417652/midwest...
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post #26 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 05:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by babak147 View Post

... pair of speakers is between 20-30K...I'm a noob in HIFI audio...

I recommend you look at speakers that measure very accurately with flat on-axis and smooth off-axis. Then audition them and pick the best between them.

So I would cross out B&W & Wilson Audio since they measure poorly on these 2 parameters compared to speakers like Revel Salon2, KEF 207/2, Linkwitz Orion, Dynaudio, Pioneer TAD, Salk Soundscape, and Philharmonic Audio.

I think it would very hard choosing the absolute clear winner in a blinded test.

I have Salon2, KEF 201/2, Orion, & Philharmonic 3 (which sounds like Salk Soundscape since both have RAAL tweeters & same crossover designer Dennis Murphy).

They all sound fantastic, so it's difficult choosing a clear absolute winner.

Soundfield Audio might also be able to build you a custom built pair of awesome towers. AJinFLA is the man.

For amps, I recommend the ATI 3002:

http://www.classicaudioparts.com/ind...ock-120-v.html

For pre-pro, I recommend the Denon AVR-4311 (msrp $2100) from Electronics Expo for $1299 delivered Denon authorized.
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post #27 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 05:22 PM
 
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Seriously...

Have any of you heard a good line array!

It's apples and oranges compared to those conventional speakers but DUDE

If an articulate wall of sound is what you want I don't believe they can be beat!

Also when I look at the cost of those expensive BRAND NAME speakers I can't warrant the price...

Seriously some of those speaker have only three drivers!

How the hell can they be worth the money they are asking!

GET REAL!

But a line array comprised of Raal and Scanspeak and a DEQX well that's another story and the $20k pricetag can be justified because you're actually getting product worth that.

I also second Salk Sound as an honest outfit with great designs in this WASTELAND of SCAMMERS.
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post #28 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 05:28 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benclement11 View Post

This is not totally true...almost all designers have an agenda too. They push their own line that they carry. Some offer many choices, but many have a certain brand that they will push. Manufacturers lobby designers to hock their stuff. It's up to the person buying to decide what they actually like.
Implementation of the selected speakers and room acoustics is where the designer comes in.

Buddy I'm not talking a "designer" as in a CEDIA certified installer.

I'm talking a loudspeaker ENGINEER that actually ENGINEERS the loudspeaker design bro and actually has a degree in electrical engineering not some dude that paid two grand for a weekend course.

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post #29 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 05:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by babak147 View Post

Here I can get advice with only personal bias, Dealer will bias based on availability ,margin and personal preference.

But what you won't get is any idea how the speakers sound to you. Measurements are all fine and well but don't say diddly how the speaker actually sounds in room and most importantly whether you like the sound.

You might find you like the sound of speakers with poor measurements.

Sure the dealers all will have their agendas but you need to listen to as many speakers as you can. You might find that you can get by with a lot less money.

What about Martin Logan ESL
http://www.martinlogan.com/product-list.php#reserve-esl

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post #30 of 264 Old 04-19-2012, 05:40 PM
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A little below your budget but also very highly regarded...

http://www.stereophile.com/floorloud...g_loudspeaker/
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