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post #1 of 35 Old 05-22-2012, 07:18 AM - Thread Starter
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I've been looking at replacing my aging Vandersteen 2Cs. I'm stuck with a plasma screen over a fireplace and currently have a Vienna Waltz Grand on the mantle as a CC.
I've been considering getting 3 identical speakers, putting the CC in front of the rarely used fireplace, considering standmounts. I'm getting some resistance from my wife.
My budget is up to about $2500/speaker.
I've been considering Selah Tempesta or Tempesta Extreme, several Salk models, Vapor Cirrus.
Ran across a great deal on the TAD inspired Pioneer EX series. I can get the S-2EX for about $5k/pr including the stands, MSRP is $8500. They won't sell me a single S-2EX for the center, but they do have the S-7EX which I can get for about $3k including the stand. It would be about 21-22" high on the stand. I know it's better to have 3 of the sam, but given the concentric tweeter/mid on these speakers, the vertical dispersion should be excellent and I wonder if it would sound just as good, if not better since the CC has 2 woofers while the S2s have one. I think it will also look less imposing that way.

Opinions?
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post #2 of 35 Old 05-22-2012, 07:25 AM
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It sounds like you have a pretty good deal with the Pioneer stuff. Is another 2C an option?
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post #3 of 35 Old 05-22-2012, 07:37 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmichaelf View Post

It sounds like you have a pretty good deal with the Pioneer stuff. Is another 2C an option?

No, I'd rather try something different.
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post #4 of 35 Old 05-22-2012, 01:07 PM
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I'm a huge fan of the JBL LSR6332 but it's not exactly high WAF.
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post #5 of 35 Old 05-22-2012, 01:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmichaelf View Post

I'm a huge fan of the JBL LSR6332 but it's not exactly high WAF.

She's a trooper for putting up with my Vandys for 25 years, so I'm trying to cut her a break. The Philharmonics didn't make the cut either, although I think they're the best value out there right now.
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post #6 of 35 Old 05-22-2012, 01:22 PM
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I really like the look of the Pioneers. It doesn't seem like a bad choice. What are her thoughts? Speakers don't exactly blend with decor. There will either be speakers in the room or there won't be speakers in the room.

Edit: They are kind of insensitive. 86dB at 6 Ohms. POWER.
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post #7 of 35 Old 05-22-2012, 01:46 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmichaelf View Post

I really like the look of the Pioneers. It doesn't seem like a bad choice. What are her thoughts? Speakers don't exactly blend with decor. There will either be speakers in the room or there won't be speakers in the room.

Edit: They are kind of insensitive. 86dB at 6 Ohms. POWER.

She actually prefers a monotone, dark speaker like the Pioneer over exotic woods, go figure. I guess if she wants fine furniture, she'll just get some. I have to see if she would be ok with the Pioneer CC on a short stand, I think I have a better chance with that than another 4 foot tall speaker.
I have an amp that puts out 225 into 8 ohms all 5 channels driven, 300 into 4.
My Vandys are similar in sensitivity, power has never been a problem, I don't listen at reference levels.
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post #8 of 35 Old 05-22-2012, 02:15 PM
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The TAD inspired Pioneers also sound very good!

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post #9 of 35 Old 05-22-2012, 02:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saeyedoc View Post

She actually prefers a monotone, dark speaker like the Pioneer over exotic woods, go figure. I guess if she wants fine furniture, she'll just get some. I have to see if she would be ok with the Pioneer CC on a short stand, I think I have a better chance with that than another 4 foot tall speaker.
I have an amp that puts out 225 into 8 ohms all 5 channels driven, 300 into 4.
My Vandys are similar in sensitivity, power has never been a problem, I don't listen at reference levels.




Good thing, because at 13' listening distance you are looking at around 93db clean peaks. You are power limited.

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post #10 of 35 Old 05-22-2012, 02:45 PM
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What about three Klipsch Heresy III's across the front. They're basically large monitors, angled up from the floor.

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post #11 of 35 Old 05-22-2012, 03:11 PM
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Way under budget Jay1. $2500/speaker.

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post #12 of 35 Old 05-22-2012, 03:16 PM
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Originally Posted by psgcdn View Post

Way under budget Jay1. $2500/speaker.

Does that matter? OP should have no issue trying it out then.
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post #13 of 35 Old 05-22-2012, 03:22 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay1 View Post

Does that matter? OP should have no issue trying it out then.

Under budget is ok. Most of what I've been considering have been well under $2k each. Have never been a big fan of horns, but it's been awhile since I've tried. I can't see putting that Klipsch in the center though.
For a big city, there's not much to listen to here, may have to take a road trip to Dallas.
Except for that deal on the Pioneers, I've been mostly looking at internet direct companies.
I'd like to hear the Evolution Acoustics MMMiniOne, they should have them any day now, there's a dealer up in Dallas. At $2500/pr including stands, they're under budget too.
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post #14 of 35 Old 05-22-2012, 04:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saeyedoc View Post

Under budget is ok. Most of what I've been considering have been well under $2k each. Have never been a big fan of horns, but it's been awhile since I've tried. I can't see putting that Klipsch in the center though.

Wouldn't fit on the mantle, that's for sure, but could sit on the floor in front.

If you go someplace that has the Heresy III to audition, might as well see if they have Klipschorns and audition those as well to hear what horn-loaded bass is about. Matching a center would be difficult (a Heresy III would be not so bad), but just to hear them.

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post #15 of 35 Old 05-23-2012, 06:09 AM
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I'll just copy and paste my recommendation from Audioholics here.

I recommend throwing a rug down in between the listening position and the speakers.

In regards to the fireplace, how annoying would it be to get three identical tower speakers, or three JBL LSR6332 (or monitor-style speakers) on stands? The latter are no prettier than the Vandersteen's (perhaps even uglier), but they'd make a killer front sound stage. You're in a unique situation where a tower center speaker wouldn't interfere with viewing the TV from any angle, so...

At the risk of being a pain in the butt regarding the fireplace, I'd go with three tower speakers across the front, or at least three matching monitor speakers on stands, with the center speaker standing in front of the fireplace (not above it). The tweeter should be at ear level based on most manufacturer's recommendation.


And now for some recommendations:

Salk Super-Charged SongTower's (three, which Jim would be happy to build for you)
Three JBL LSR6332's on stands (these can be purchased individually)
Three SoundField Audio Monitor1's on stands
Revel
Dynaudio
Philharmonic Audio Philharmonitor's (three across the front)

Ideally you want three identical speaker across the front, but I realize many can accommodate that. In your case, though, with the TV being mounted so high, I'd put up with the hassle of having a vertical tower in front of the fireplace, moving it (or just working around it) as necessary when making a fire.

P.S. Can you throw up a couple pics in the OP like you did at Audioholics?

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post #16 of 35 Old 05-23-2012, 06:23 AM
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Just looked up the pioneer ex series....$7000/pair
:gulp:

One of the 3 features for this $$$$ is this

"Aerodynamic frame and magnetic circuits"

Seriously?
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post #17 of 35 Old 05-23-2012, 06:26 AM
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Anyways, i would say go for 3 vertically placed identical speakers. I did that and couldn't be happier with the soundstage.
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post #18 of 35 Old 05-23-2012, 06:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saeyedoc View Post

For a big city, there's not much to listen to here, may have to take a road trip to Dallas.

This morning NPR's sports commentator, Frank Deford, referred to San Antonio as the greater Alamo area. I laughed.
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post #19 of 35 Old 05-23-2012, 06:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chikoo View Post

Just looked up the pioneer ex series....$7000/pair
:gulp:

One of the 3 features for this $$$$ is this

"Aerodynamic frame and magnetic circuits"

Seriously?

I think the aerodynamic frame comes into play during shipping
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post #20 of 35 Old 05-23-2012, 06:44 AM - Thread Starter
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Yes, the Pioneers list for $7k/pr, $8500 with the stands, but I can get them for $5k+ shipping including the stands. I don't know why I have such a hard on for them, I guess the cheapskate in me likes the idea of getting 40% off, it would make it fairly easy to sell them for very little loss if I didn't like them.
I think my best move may be 3 identical stand-mounted speakers, I think the center one will be less imposing than a tower. A slim tower like the SCST may work though.
Perhaps 3 Salk Soundscape M7s or Selah Tempestas.
The Tempesta Extreme is also tempting, but I think it may not look right and won't be as stable as I'd like with the two cabinets just sitting on top of one another.
The Soundfields have been getting alot of rave reviews, not sure if the extra power cords will scare off my SO.
I like the idea of the Accuton midrange instead of a 2 or 2.5 way with the woofer doing double duty for midrange.
I may drop Jim Salk a line to see if he could build something better that would fit in the space above the mantle, just to see what my options are.
Dennis Murphy has indicated some willingness to do a smaller, less deep version of the Phils once he finsishes with the run of 2s he has. Perhaps he and Del could custom design something.
I'll post some pics when I get home, but they can be seen here:http://forums.audioholics.com/forums...icated-cc.html

Thanks for all of your opinions, it helps being able to run my ideas through others, my wife couldn't be less interested in hearing my drivel.
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post #21 of 35 Old 05-23-2012, 06:49 AM
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I've had the 3 identical in the front setup under my plasma in front of a fireplace and it was awesome with a couple different speakers systems I've had. Seamless soundstage. MUCH more cohesive than an "identical" center channel that's horizontal. It look(ed/s) killer too either with bookshelf speakers or towers. Go for it and you won't be disappointed. I even found myself listening to 5.1 music more - something I never do.

I've now got a drop down screen for BIG movies, so I'm back to the horizontal center.

Why do all of my threads suck? Is there an internet posting school somewhere? -wes k
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post #22 of 35 Old 05-23-2012, 06:54 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boarder1995 View Post

I've had the 3 identical in the front setup under my plasma in front of a fireplace and it was awesome with a couple different speakers systems I've had. Seamless soundstage. MUCH more cohesive than an "identical" center channel that's horizontal. It look(ed/s) killer too either with bookshelf speakers or towers. Go for it and you won't be disappointed. I even found myself listening to 5.1 music more - something I never do.

I've now got a drop down screen for BIG movies, so I'm back to the horizontal center.

Awesome, glad to hear from someone who's actually done this!
Did you ever use your fireplace? Did you have to move the center speaker when you did?
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post #23 of 35 Old 05-23-2012, 07:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saeyedoc View Post

I'll post some pics when I get home, but they can be seen here:http://forums.audioholics.com/forums...icated-cc.html

Boy that TV is up high!




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post #24 of 35 Old 05-23-2012, 07:17 AM
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I'm in Houston, so no, didn't even and still don't/won't use the fireplace. It's odd that in Houston fireplaces are pretty much standard in homes. Whereas, my relatives in NM in their new home builds, fireplaces are upgrade options.

So, my wife thought the three towers across the front looked good. From what I remember with the 3 towers, off axis voices were much better, mid-bass was more impactful and consistent across the front. It worked well with identical settings for each of the three up front, same crossovers, same amps, same distance from seating position, same driver heights.

Why do all of my threads suck? Is there an internet posting school somewhere? -wes k
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post #25 of 35 Old 05-23-2012, 07:29 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
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I'm in Houston, so no, didn't even and still don't/won't use the fireplace. It's odd that in Houston fireplaces are pretty much standard in homes. Whereas, my relatives in NM in their new home builds, fireplaces are upgrade options.

So, my wife thought the three towers across the front looked good. From what I remember with the 3 towers, off axis voices were much better, mid-bass was more impactful and consistent across the front. It worked well with identical settings for each of the three up front, same crossovers, same amps, same distance from seating position, same driver heights.

I don't get it either. Apparently it's really hard to sell a home here without a fireplace, but it's hotter than hades most of the year. I think we turned ours on twice this winter. It doesn't really put out enough heat that you can even feel it 12' away. I've given up trying to figure out women.
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post #26 of 35 Old 05-23-2012, 07:52 AM
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Here's an old shot of my room with three Mirage bipolar towers up front. I was also testing some acoustic paneling I bought cheap (black panels).

Attachment 247380
LL

Why do all of my threads suck? Is there an internet posting school somewhere? -wes k
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post #27 of 35 Old 05-23-2012, 08:19 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boarder1995 View Post

Here's an old shot of my room with three Mirage bipolar towers up front. I was also testing some acoustic paneling I bought cheap (black panels).

Thanks, that center just disappears doesn't it? My plan is when my 6 yr old plasma eventually dies, I could get a bigger screen and move it down a little if I don't need a CC on the mantle, the way you have it set up.
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post #28 of 35 Old 05-23-2012, 08:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boarder1995 View Post

Here's an old shot of my room with three Mirage bipolar towers up front. I was also testing some acoustic paneling I bought cheap (black panels).

Attachment 247380

That looks very nice, and is exactly what I would do if I was saeyedoc, though using different speakers.

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post #29 of 35 Old 05-23-2012, 10:55 AM
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Myself, I've just never understood the TV over the fireplace approach. I realize fireplaces are oftentimes the focal point, however it's just somewhat un-natural for me, ... others clearly don't mind it. I get it, the resale etc, buyers swoon over the frpl line item, but man it really is quite the anathema for A/V enthusiasts.

Just my take...

btw; three identical fronts, no question

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post #30 of 35 Old 05-23-2012, 11:02 AM
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I agree. What's on the wall opposite the fireplace? Maybe you can have a cosy two-person seating area close to the fireplace and general seating towards the opposite wall where the TV would be? The TV up so high is never going to be ideal...

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