Comparison, Unbiased Review & Ranking of 12 High-End Home Cinema Audio Systems - Page 13 - AVS Forum
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post #361 of 406 Old 11-10-2012, 06:11 PM
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thx reference levels from 50m away????

that, along with the rest of the post, indicates that sl somehow has found a way around the physics... which is, umm, doubtful...

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post #362 of 406 Old 11-10-2012, 11:48 PM
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Here are a slightly different version of the speakers in a 388 seater cinema.

http://www.steinwaylyngdorf.com/showcases/surround-sound/silverscreen-theater

Obviously the flaw in this installation is that its been done in a town where there is no one with any experience of theater sound.

By the way the limiting factor on these systems in terms of SPL's is not the speakers but the woofers. They are Boundary Woofers and not subwoofers, so they are placed in both front corners of the room and cross over to the speakers around 200 - 250Hz. With the little S15's for example we use the LS woofers which are a 2 x 12" system, so you'd have 4 x 12" woofers corner loaded in partnership with them. I think that goes some way to explaining the total systems SPLs.

The other thing that I think will have a big bearing on how loud the system plays is the construction of the room you use it in. In the UK a lot of homes are brick built whereas I guess you still use wood partition homes. I've demmed the Model S in about 20 different rooms now and having a really solid corner to place the woofers against makes a huge difference to the systems output. This is true of any sub or speaker with bass but the effect seems much more pronounced with the Boundary Woofers, perhaps because of their bandwidth.

If we can accept for a moment that none of you are going to get one a plane and come and buy something from me, I think there are more interesting thinks about the system than how loud it plays and these are things you will find even more controversial.

Four years ago I decided to build purpose built listening rooms. One of the rooms was built from the ground up for the best home cinema performance. I chose Rives Audio in the good old US of A for this and spent about $40k on a combination of their design services and the specialist building works they recommended. I have tried a variety of systems in the room and have now settled on the James 808BE front speakers, two pairs of MK150Ts, 2 x 12" bandpass James subs and 1 x 2 x 21" subs. The envelopment of this system in this room is superb, however the Steinway systems in the adjoining, completely untreated rooms sounds much better and is what people are buying.

Lyngdorf, the company behind the audio technology in the Steinway systems is Danish. I visited the owners home about 6 years ago and heard a 2.2 Lyngdorf stereo that would retail about $20k. It was in a long, hard, rectangular room with a rug on the floor and a couple of sofas and that's it. An acoustic nightmare. I really have never heard music so loud and so clear in my life. I'm a home cinema guy of 25 years and yet I had to ask for the system to be turned down. The cones were not moving on the speakers or woofers. These woofers were the Lyngdorf W210 which are designed for corner loading and are about 96db efficient and crossed over to the main speakers at 800Hz. Please see if you can get some feedback from people in the States that use these and see whats said about them, they aren't suitable for home cinema but what they do in a music system, correctly set up is astonishing.

At the time I was running Triad Platinum LCR's and 2 x 18" Triad Platinum subs and the Lyngdorf stereo played much louder and sounded a million times better. The speaker system on its own wasn't suitable for cinema as it didn't have enough low down grunt but in all other aspects it blew it away.

I really hope you guys can get a listen to some of these systems. I know it sounds like BS and hype but I can tell you that I have gone to every effort in my Rives room using conventional wisdom to get great audio and the Steinway systems take whatever combination of kit I use in this room apart.

One thing that is important is that you don't hear the Steinway system in a treated room. If relies on the rooms' reflected energy to produce the output and quality of sound that it does.

If what I'm saying is true, then people selling acoustic treatments and room designs are going to find it tough to get work in the home theater business. It also means that with Boundary Woofers, there is no need for big speakers in normal sized rooms anymore, so there will be a lot of people in the industry who will tell you its crap.

Please get a dem of the S15's with the LS woofers in a solid, untreated room and let me know what you think. Please take so good "hifi" music as well as some film with mad dynamics and SPL's like Open Range and also try some dance music with mental bass.

Please give me a nudge at rob@geckohomecinema.com so I can share your experiences.
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post #363 of 406 Old 11-11-2012, 01:33 AM
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Wow-speakers that sound a million times better than Triad Platinums and perform best in a non-treated room rolleyes.gif .

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post #364 of 406 Old 11-11-2012, 02:18 AM
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Yep - amazing isn't it. And unlike you not only have I owned and installed the Triad Platinums in several cinemas, but I've also been to the factory to hear them set up by the manufacturers.

I've now been using Steinway Lyngdorf surround systems for 4 years and they offer a completely different level of performance than is possible with the Triad Platinums, which lets face it are hardly the last word in high fidelity.
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post #365 of 406 Old 11-11-2012, 02:33 AM
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The more interesting thing is the difference in the system technology.

The Steinway Lyngdorf systems are the only surround systems that maintain the signal digitally throughout.

It doesn't matter what speakers you use, they will always be compromised by the electronics they are connected to. Steinway Lyngdorf systems are inherently better in several areas than any other system electronics. Please see the link below.


Digital Domain.pdf 214k .pdf file
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post #366 of 406 Old 11-11-2012, 07:23 AM
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The Steinway Lyngdorf systems are the only surround systems that maintain the signal digitally throughout.
Moot. The limiting factor for fidelity isn't the electronics, it's the mechanical parts, ie., the drivers. And while on paper digital electronics may have better specs than analog even analog has specs for fidelity that exceed out ability to detect them by a few orders of magnitude.

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post #367 of 406 Old 11-11-2012, 07:54 AM
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I really didn't think there was much wrong with the electronics I was using until I started using all digital electronics.

I'm not trying to pick a fight, but have you had the opportunity to have a good listen to a Steinway surround system yet, because I really don't think you'll appreciate what all the fuss is about until you do.

I see your sign off is "The laws of Physics don't bow to opinion". I completely agree which is why when I hear what I do from the systems, every day, in comparison to other high end analogue systems and then see the science detailed in the document I just posted, I really don't see what the argument can be about except that you heard it and don't like it.

If that's the case, no problem, but until you have had a good listen I don't think you are in a position to say how much signal loss and noise is created by conventional electronics compared to the all digital route.
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post #368 of 406 Old 11-11-2012, 08:06 AM
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^^^

if you read the thread, you'll see that a number of us were more than willing to demo the system...

however, the dealer chose not to give us the opportunity...

i think where most of us are getting off the boat is that very little of what is claimed squares with science*... some very lofty claims have been made... and i believe that most of us have at least a clue of what would be required to fulfill those claims...

let's take the "thx reference levels at 50m" statement for example... it's pretty simple to do the math, and the claim doesn't add up...

* well that, and the umm, exuberance of the initial poster...

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post #369 of 406 Old 11-11-2012, 08:22 AM
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I'm sorry the dealer dropped out. I hope you can re book the visit.....

What part of the science in the document I enclosed do you disagree with?

If you don't believe the reference level at 50m claim, I think you should contact the Pacific Design Center and tell them them their new 388 seater cinema wont play loud enough.

I know you haven't heard it and there were a number of leading theater designers involved in this installation but I'm sure they love to hear your thoughts.
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post #370 of 406 Old 11-11-2012, 09:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Sinden View Post

If you don't believe the reference level at 50m claim, I think you should contact the Pacific Design Center and tell them them their new 388 seater cinema wont play loud enough.

The math adds up.

76 speakers (38 stereo amps) of 96 dB sensitivity driven at 400 W each (30000W divided by 76) will reach reference 165 feet away.

But they will be at their limit, very likely compressing, and you need 76 of them and 38 amps to do it.

BTW that room looks to be treated.

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post #371 of 406 Old 11-11-2012, 09:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Rob Sinden View Post

I really have never heard music so loud and so clear in my life. I'm a home cinema guy of 25 years and yet I had to ask for the system to be turned down.

My experience has been the opposite. When I'm listening to speakers with high sensitivity and dynamic range they sound so good and clear that I don't realize how loud the volume actually is and I feel like turning it up even more. When I listen to speakers that are less capable they sound louder because they can't handle dynamics and overall volume level. I don't necessarily hear distortion, but that's what's happening and why I feel like I need to turn it down which is exactly what you are describing - that's why you asked for the volume to be turned down.

In a truly powerful/capable system we could go deaf and the experience would be pleasurable because of zero distortion.
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post #372 of 406 Old 11-11-2012, 09:54 AM
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I think you've missed the fact that they are a line source speaker.

Because of this sound doesn't half with distance but reduce by 25%.

This is why they are fine in rooms with up to a 1000 listeners.
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post #373 of 406 Old 11-11-2012, 10:23 AM
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True enough. 76 speakers could be considered a line array. A very expensive one.

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post #374 of 406 Old 11-11-2012, 10:31 AM
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Thank you. Yes it is a line array and yes it is very expensive but it will deliver THX reference levels at 50m as I said.

With regards the distortion, there will be far, far less than with any other system as the document I posted shows.

A total system with a S/N ratio of 113db rather than the THX approved reference system that they measured at 67db is hugely different. Apparently it has 4000 times the noise power.

Like I said this technology dramatically reduces some major inherent flaws in audio reproduction. You may not like it or think it gives value for money, however it is more technically advanced than any other system that currently exists.
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post #375 of 406 Old 11-11-2012, 10:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Sinden View Post

Here are a slightly different version of the speakers in a 388 seater cinema.

http://www.steinwaylyngdorf.com/showcases/surround-sound/silverscreen-theater

Obviously the flaw in this installation is that its been done in a town where there is no one with any experience of theater sound.

By the way the limiting factor on these systems in terms of SPL's is not the speakers but the woofers. They are Boundary Woofers and not subwoofers, so they are placed in both front corners of the room and cross over to the speakers around 200 - 250Hz. With the little S15's for example we use the LS woofers which are a 2 x 12" system, so you'd have 4 x 12" woofers corner loaded in partnership with them. I think that goes some way to explaining the total systems SPLs.

The other thing that I think will have a big bearing on how loud the system plays is the construction of the room you use it in. In the UK a lot of homes are brick built whereas I guess you still use wood partition homes. I've demmed the Model S in about 20 different rooms now and having a really solid corner to place the woofers against makes a huge difference to the systems output. This is true of any sub or speaker with bass but the effect seems much more pronounced with the Boundary Woofers, perhaps because of their bandwidth.

If we can accept for a moment that none of you are going to get one a plane and come and buy something from me, I think there are more interesting thinks about the system than how loud it plays and these are things you will find even more controversial.

Four years ago I decided to build purpose built listening rooms. One of the rooms was built from the ground up for the best home cinema performance. I chose Rives Audio in the good old US of A for this and spent about $40k on a combination of their design services and the specialist building works they recommended. I have tried a variety of systems in the room and have now settled on the James 808BE front speakers, two pairs of MK150Ts, 2 x 12" bandpass James subs and 1 x 2 x 21" subs. The envelopment of this system in this room is superb, however the Steinway systems in the adjoining, completely untreated rooms sounds much better and is what people are buying.

Lyngdorf, the company behind the audio technology in the Steinway systems is Danish. I visited the owners home about 6 years ago and heard a 2.2 Lyngdorf stereo that would retail about $20k. It was in a long, hard, rectangular room with a rug on the floor and a couple of sofas and that's it. An acoustic nightmare. I really have never heard music so loud and so clear in my life. I'm a home cinema guy of 25 years and yet I had to ask for the system to be turned down. The cones were not moving on the speakers or woofers. These woofers were the Lyngdorf W210 which are designed for corner loading and are about 96db efficient and crossed over to the main speakers at 800Hz. Please see if you can get some feedback from people in the States that use these and see whats said about them, they aren't suitable for home cinema but what they do in a music system, correctly set up is astonishing.

At the time I was running Triad Platinum LCR's and 2 x 18" Triad Platinum subs and the Lyngdorf stereo played much louder and sounded a million times better. The speaker system on its own wasn't suitable for cinema as it didn't have enough low down grunt but in all other aspects it blew it away.

I really hope you guys can get a listen to some of these systems. I know it sounds like BS and hype but I can tell you that I have gone to every effort in my Rives room using conventional wisdom to get great audio and the Steinway systems take whatever combination of kit I use in this room apart.

One thing that is important is that you don't hear the Steinway system in a treated room. If relies on the rooms' reflected energy to produce the output and quality of sound that it does.

If what I'm saying is true, then people selling acoustic treatments and room designs are going to find it tough to get work in the home theater business. It also means that with Boundary Woofers, there is no need for big speakers in normal sized rooms anymore, so there will be a lot of people in the industry who will tell you its crap.

Please get a dem of the S15's with the LS woofers in a solid, untreated room and let me know what you think. Please take so good "hifi" music as well as some film with mad dynamics and SPL's like Open Range and also try some dance music with mental bass.

Please give me a nudge at rob@geckohomecinema.com so I can share your experiences.

Ah, so a very different system than the one being discussed....that makes more sense. OTOH while the blue whale is near hollyweird it's mostly about design folk, like indoor decoration, furniture and the like...

"I realize that somebody playing free music isn't as commercial as a hamburger stand. But is it because you can eat a hamburger and hold it in your hand and you can't do that with music? Is it too free to control?" - Don Van Vliet (aka Captain Beefheart) discussing commercial success in the music biz


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post #376 of 406 Old 11-11-2012, 10:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Sinden View Post

I think you've missed the fact that they are a line source speaker.
Because of this sound doesn't half with distance but reduce by 25%.
Line arrays only operate in the nearfield condition, giving a 3dB loss per doubling of distance from the source, when the array is at least 3 wavelengths high, and at some point, based on the distance to the array and the frequency, they revert to the farfield condition and the inverse-square rule applies again. Those interested in the specifics should read Jim Griffin's white paper on the subject.
Quote:
however it is more technically advanced than any other system that currently exists
Don Keele would have a very different opinion.

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post #377 of 406 Old 11-14-2012, 07:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Rob Sinden View Post

Hi Guys
I’ve just noticed all the talk about this review and Steinway Lyngdorf.
I’m the UK distributor for Steinway Lyngdorf and the guy who wrote the review came to my listening rooms.
Mr. Sinden,

I'm glad you showed up in this thread. Since the Triad system was *YOUR* system in *YOUR* room, maybe you can explain this:
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Originally Posted by madcutterboy
10) TRIAD:
- Equipment:
o Speakers: 2 x Triad InRoom Platinum LCR (L & R), Bi-Amped; 1 x Triad InRoom Platinum LCR Center, Bi-Amped (Centre); 4 x Triad OnWall Gold Surround (Surrounds)
o Subwoofers: 2 x Triad InRoom Platinum DSP Sub; with 2 x Triad RackAmp 1000 DSP
o Pre-Amp/Processor: Sherbourn PT-7020A
o Power Amplifier(s): 2 x Sherbourn PA 7-350
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Originally Posted by craig john View Post

Hmmmmm....
Looking at this list of equipment shows that the Triad Platinums were "Bi-Amped". It also shows that TWO 7-channel amps, (14 total channels of amplification), were used to drive 5 speakers. That is VERY interesting! eek.gifeek.gifeek.gif If that's the case, they must have been active biamped because they can't be passive bi-amped. Triad only provides ONE set of speaker binding posts, (how refreshing is that... a high end speaker manufacturer who doesn't even provide the opportunity to indulge in "snake oil"!)

In addition, Triads are not set up from the factory for active bi-amping. There is no way to access the drivers individually, or in like-driver pairs. So, if this was done, the native internal passive crossovers would need to be disconnected and replaced with external crossovers, and additional speaker binding posts would need to be added in order to connect to the speakers individually.

This raises multiple questions: Who did this, and why? What external crossover was used? What crossover frequency and slope was used? How were the drivers accessed? What modifications were performed to the cabinet to allow the multiple connections? What drivers were grouped together: tweeter and midranges, or woofers and midranges?

If the tweeter/midranges were driven together, and the internal tweeter/midrange crossover was bypassed, the tweeter would be active down to the midrange/woofer crossover, well into the "honky" range. IOW, it is certainly possible that the tweeter in THIS system was crossed over low enough to make the system sound "honky." This would also severely limit the dynamic capability by driving the tweeter well outside it's bandwidth.

If this is the system under "review", it would hardly be a fair or appropriate system to "impartially" review. eek.gif

Nigel, please share where these speakers were demo'd, as well as how the speakers were modified. In addition, any details you can share about the room and setup, including the room correction system, would likely shed some light on the obvious issues in your demo. If the speakers were modified and made to sound worse, it's entirely possible that the subwoofer integration was similarly F'd up, which would explain the sub-optimal bass you heard.
Craig

Mr. Sinden, were you the person who modified the Triad Platinums? Is so, why? And how?

Craig

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post #378 of 406 Old 11-15-2012, 03:24 AM
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Hi

The Triad Platinums speakers I had weren't bi-amped, They were used as they left left the factory.

I don't know where the information about the amps used came from but I have never used a Sherbourne PA 7 -350. I did use oen of their original amps - I think it was a 7/2100.

I think the set up in the review that you are referring to was heard at the UK distributors for both Triad and Sherbourne - Pulse Marketing - so I'm sure they would have been set up as the manufacturer recommended..

Rob
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post #379 of 406 Old 11-15-2012, 07:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Sinden View Post

I’ve sold solely high end home cinemas for 25 years and so high SPL levels are something I’m very familiar with. One of the speakers that are good at delivering high SPL’s that some of you will know is the Triad Platinum LCR. I’m very familiar with these speakers and the rest of the Triad range because as the UK distributor I used to keep them in my listening rooms.

Rob
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Hi
The Triad Platinums speakers I had weren't bi-amped, They were used as they left left the factory.
I don't know where the information about the amps used came from but I have never used a Sherbourne PA 7 -350. I did use oen of their original amps - I think it was a 7/2100.
I think the set up in the review that you are referring to was heard at the UK distributors for both Triad and Sherbourne - Pulse Marketing - so I'm sure they would have been set up as the manufacturer recommended..
Rob

confused.gif

Who is the UK distributor of Triad? You, or Pulse Marketing?

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post #380 of 406 Old 11-16-2012, 01:31 AM
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We used to distribute Triad. Now Pulse Marketing distribute the brand in the UK and it would have been them who arranged the demonstration for the guy who wrote the review of the 12 different systems.
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post #381 of 406 Old 11-16-2012, 04:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Rob Sinden View Post

We used to distribute Triad. Now Pulse Marketing distribute the brand in the UK and it would have been them who arranged the demonstration for the guy who wrote the review of the 12 different systems.
So basically, what you're saying is confirmation that the original reviewer is full of it as far as any accuracy goes with respect to his reviews?


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post #382 of 406 Old 11-16-2012, 06:56 AM
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It gets worse. It appears the the OP is not accurate in his description of his preferred gear.

I took a look at http://www.steinwaylyngdorf.com/images/Resources/Steinway%20Lyngdorf%20-%20The%20Collection%202012.pdf.

If you take a look at the speakers, you'll see they list "amplification required", and if you take a look at the "A1" product, you'll see it's a class D amplifier combined with a DAC.

From what I can digest: starting with your (say) BD player, you would use a conventional HDMI connector to the P1, which would run through conventional decoding of your (say) THX signal. At that point, rather than performing the DAC in place and sending an analog connection to the preamp, it converts it to another digital format (which, BTW, introduces the possibility of generational loss) and communicates via that to the A1 box.

The A1 then performs DAC and amplification; connecting to the analog speakers via a spekon connector (common in pro audio, as are class D amps)

In essence: this is typical pro-audio setup with the XLR interconnects replaced with Ethernet connections running a proprietary digital signal, and the DAC moved from the decoder to the amp..

It's not a bad idea (especially given how far the runs might be in a theater...) but I would not expect any improvement in a home environment.

And before the response comes from the OP about how great the sound was: there's no way available to him to qualify the cause of that perceived greatness.

*edit: the model D and model C are active speakers (again common in pro-audio), moving the DAC/amp combo's physical location to "next to/on the speaker".
On the up-side, that *may* mean an active, dsp-based crossover; which I am a huge fan of.
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post #383 of 406 Old 11-16-2012, 07:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Leo Karner View Post

I have been told by Kim Donvig of Artcoustic, that you didn´t hear Spitfire 16-8SL as claimed, it was 8-4SL.
You didn´t listen to Spitfire 180-43 subs as claimed, because they were not installed at that time.
So the cost of the system was about 12k and not 22k as claimed.
And you has been informed, that the showroom was not finished and even not calibrated.
And that you didn´t hear Thor, as mentioned in the report.

I think most of us knew the OP was full of it, but this post really sums it up.. This was nothing but a big marketing ploy from either an uber fanboy of Steinway Lyngdorf (which is most likely), or some direct association through the distributor, or the company itself (which seems the least likely).

I can say that I traded some PM's with a gentleman (whom I tend to believe more than the OP, or the distributor) who have heard the Steinway Lyngdorf model the OP has purchased versus many other speakers and he much preferred the speakers from Wisdom Audio vs the Steinway speakers he heard when he demoed them.

Speakers are always going to be very subjective, but it seems odd that the OP is trying to push these speakers so hard, to the point that he was making up auditions and writing reviews to try to make the Steinway speakers sound so superior. If I was Steinway, I would probably try to distance myself from this individual....
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post #384 of 406 Old 11-16-2012, 08:00 AM
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I've posted the document about the technical benefits of the system working in the digital domain. If you choose to ignore it that's fine.

You have clearly made you mind up that you don't agree with what has been written and you think the writer was lying, deaf or stupid.

The one thing I would say in his favor is that he thought it would be a good idea to listen to a range of different system before choosing the one he liked most.

You have written off a system without hearing it which I think is stupid.
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post #385 of 406 Old 11-16-2012, 08:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Rob Sinden View Post

I've posted the document about the technical benefits of the system working in the digital domain. If you choose to ignore it that's fine.
You have clearly made you mind up that you don't agree with what has been written and you think the writer was lying, deaf or stupid.
The one thing I would say in his favor is that he thought it would be a good idea to listen to a range of different system before choosing the one he liked most.
You have written off a system without hearing it which I think is stupid.

But that's just it. See above. The OP appears to have falsified some (or perhaps all of these reviews). It is hard to take anyone serious when they are not being honest and, if you read his review, have a clear agenda.
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post #386 of 406 Old 11-16-2012, 08:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Rob Sinden View Post

I've posted the document about the technical benefits of the system working in the digital domain. If you choose to ignore it that's fine.
You don't seem to understand. You aren't "working in the digital domain". What you are doing is adding a DDC into the mix, and then changing the wire length.

Normal system.
Source -> Decoder -> DAC -> Amp -> Driver.

Your system.
Source -> Decoder -> DDC -> DAC -> Amp -> Driver.

The DAC is physically located in an assembly adjacent to the speaker cabinet; and the speaker is active. That's not typical, but hardly significant as all it does is shorten the speaker cable (compared to a conventional setup), or the analog interconnect length (compared to an active speaker).

That's not nothing in a very long run (like in a full-sized theater). It's analogous to why pro gear (also often long runs) uses XLR cables (high voltage) and active speakers as often as they do... but in a home / home-theater environment; there's not enough down-side to speaker cables (which attach to far longer, far thinner cables at the voice-coil) to experience a performance gain.

I've no doubt these speakers sound good. Likely even great. A high-SPL open-baffle system in a well setup room should blow off socks. But it is not related to their choice to run active speakers or use proprietary interlinks.
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What part of the science in the document I enclosed do you disagree with?

Well, let's start with their comparison of bit-depth data.

They accurately relate bit depth to dynamic range (max SPL) with their (rather arbitrary) "quality at volume" chart; but in order to relate that to the actual system we have to engage in a few lies.
We have to lie and say that a 24-bit source in a standard system would be down-sampled to a 16-bit source (it would not: a 24-bit rig would convert to analog, which has resolution bounded only by signal strength).
We would also have to lie and say that DDC on a 16-bit source to a 24-bit interconnect would improve useful dynamic range to that allowed under 24-bit. It would not do so. (your extra bits would contain no data)

Then there's complete snake oil like "distinguish between embedded noise". There is no noise introduced at any resolution in a digital signal. Noise would come from pre-ADC, and even 64-bit should reproduce that accurately, not lessen it. There's a failure to understand digital waveform encoding there.

*edit
I just saw that actual bottom of the PDF.

To make their case: they assume
1) That a digital equalizer has been inserted between the DAC and the amp (the only spot in any of my gear that does this is my DCX2496).
2) That the connection between the DAC and EQ is analog (I suppose necessary since post DAC)
3) That the connection is 3v (my DCX uses XLR connectors which are higher voltage)
4) That the ADAC steps are not 24bit + (they are 24-bit in the DCX)
5) that there's a 20x increase in the noise-floor caused by the EQ (there isn't).

I too can turn my volumes up to ear-shattering levels and then (with no sound) stick my ear to the speaker and not hear a hiss... which was , you may recall, the test proposed by the OP.
its phillip likes this.
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post #387 of 406 Old 11-16-2012, 01:22 PM
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Originally Posted by JerryLove View Post

You don't seem to understand. You aren't "working in the digital domain". What you are doing is adding a DDC into the mix, and then changing the wire length.
+1. What we seem to be dealing with here is a marketeer who knows just enough more than potential customers to seem authoritative. But that's not going to get him far in a room full of real engineers whose understanding of how gear works extends much deeper than sales brochures.

Bill Fitzmaurice Loudspeaker Design

The Laws of Physics aren't swayed by opinion.
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post #388 of 406 Old 11-18-2012, 05:57 PM
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We used to distribute Triad.
AAAaahhh... that explains a LOT! rolleyes.gif

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Lombardi said it:
Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence."

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post #389 of 406 Old 08-31-2013, 11:49 AM
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Hi gents.

Was reading this thread earlier and the thrashing dished out to the OP. Have noticed that over at the Uk site this guy has completed his cinema room and opened it up to members there. The response seems to have been favourable. Has anyone heard the system since the last post?

http://www.avforums.com/forums/shows-events/1715176-gecko-home-cinema-forum-days-29.html
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post #390 of 406 Old 09-01-2013, 09:11 AM
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Oops, wrong spot

"I realize that somebody playing free music isn't as commercial as a hamburger stand. But is it because you can eat a hamburger and hold it in your hand and you can't do that with music? Is it too free to control?" - Don Van Vliet (aka Captain Beefheart) discussing commercial success in the music biz


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