Non - Standard Room, Putting together a system, need advice - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 9 Old 07-10-2012, 01:52 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi Guys,

I just threw down on a 55" ES8000 and decided to upgrade my HT system as well. Problem is my room is open on the right side the way the TV is currently setup so the only place for me to stick surrounds is up on the ceiling (room is pre-wired) or on stands behind the couch. Also, I'm pretty positive this will play havoc on the way the speakers will sound with the right side bouncing sound of the wall and left sending sound into the kitchen. Due to limited space and living in a condo, i'm stuck with either slimline towers or cube speakers. My budget is $1500.

I was thinking of getting the Onkyo TX-NR709 7.2 ($560) as the AVR and going with a Definetive Technology Pro Cinema 800 system ($1200) or Throwing together a Mirage System - 4 Mirage OS3 ($520) Mirage OS3-CC ($230) and Mirage MM-8 Sub ($380).

Anyone expierence either of the speakers? Would they work for my needs? Any other suggestions for quality small speakers? Also, how would these compare to Polk Monitor line?

Here's the layout:

448
448
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post #2 of 9 Old 07-10-2012, 02:17 PM
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Do you have someone above or below your condo?

I would spend less on the AVR. Audyssey MultiEQ is a must with that room for room correction, so something like this:
http://www.amazon.com/Denon-AVR-1612-Channel-Theater-Receiver/dp/B004U403WM/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1341954000&sr=8-1&keywords=denon

$240 brand new.

That leaves you about $1250 for something like this for your 3.1 (left, right, center, and sub):
http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/hybrid1pkg.html

The sub is very tunable to maximize your condo space, Audyssey Dynamic Volume on the Denon can help control bass after hours if you have concerns for neighbors.

For surrounds, I would call HSU and ask to buy 2 of their Ventiloquist speakers to mount on the ceiling at an angle. You may want the 5.1 package with the matching HSU surrounds in the 5.1 package as well.

Another option that I really like is this one:

$348 for mains (left, right, and center): http://www.svsound.com/systems/scs-02m-3
$149 for rear surrounds: http://www.svsound.com/speakers/s-series/sbs-02
$649 for subwoofer: http://www.svsound.com/subwoofers/sealed-box/sb12-nsd

The prices include shipping.

I have owned the SVS speakers and they are very nice for the money, and have heard the HSU speakers and really like them.

I will admit I am not a huge fan of the Mirage speakers, and the Deftech speakers are decent (I currently own Deftech) but it is hard to go wrong with the above.

Another option is to just go in-ceiling with your surrounds.
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post #3 of 9 Old 07-10-2012, 04:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the reply! The reason I want to spend a little more on the AVR is for future "up-gradeability". I'm currently renting (top floor) so a full size system might not be ideal at the moment. But I will eventually buy a house and would like to have a good AVR to push better speakers or provide pre-outs for an amp.

I've seen the HSUs before and they definitely a good value. Would I utilize a big sub like VTF-1 in a condo, or would something smaller do? Also, is mix/matching different product lines (3.1 vs the smaller surrounds) going to pose an issue?

I have not heard of SVS. How's the midrange on those sealed fronts? They must take some power to drive.
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post #4 of 9 Old 07-10-2012, 08:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmeech10 View Post

Thanks for the reply! The reason I want to spend a little more on the AVR is for future "up-gradeability". I'm currently renting (top floor) so a full size system might not be ideal at the moment. But I will eventually buy a house and would like to have a good AVR to push better speakers or provide pre-outs for an amp.
I've seen the HSUs before and they definitely a good value. Would I utilize a big sub like VTF-1 in a condo, or would something smaller do? Also, is mix/matching different product lines (3.1 vs the smaller surrounds) going to pose an issue?
I have not heard of SVS. How's the midrange on those sealed fronts? They must take some power to drive.

In my opinion, AVR technology evolves much more quickly than speaker technology. The Denon receiver I reference gives you a nice receiver with lots of features (HDMI 1.4, 3D, Audyssey MultiEq, etc). I don't see the need for an upgrade for at least 3-5 years and I have found that usually there are enough advances in AVR technology to upgrade every 5 years or so.

Bookshelf speakers are a nice compromise between smaller compact speakers and tower speakers. They will have more midrange, and clearer dialogue typically. If you move to a home in the future, the speakers will be very useable. My opinion on subwoofers (for what it is worth) is that cheaper subwoofers actually distort more and tend to be more boomy. A good HSU or SVS subwoofer will actually have tighter, more accurate bass. Hsu subs tend to have lots of tuning options.

Should not be a problem mixing and matching the Hsu mains and surrounds, but Hsu is great to talk to on the phone and you can certainly ask. They will also work with you on calibrating and tuning your system for optimal sound.

The SVS speaekers have solid midrange but all these speakers are designed to work with a dedicated subwoofer around 80hz.

Being in a condo, you will be able to utilize Audyssey MuliEQ and Dynamic volume to get a good sound without disturbing your neighbors. And if you ever want a little more bass, you will be able to achieve it without having to upgrade smile.gif
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post #5 of 9 Old 07-13-2012, 07:48 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ack_bk View Post

In my opinion, AVR technology evolves much more quickly than speaker technology. The Denon receiver I reference gives you a nice receiver with lots of features (HDMI 1.4, 3D, Audyssey MultiEq, etc). I don't see the need for an upgrade for at least 3-5 years and I have found that usually there are enough advances in AVR technology to upgrade every 5 years or so.
Bookshelf speakers are a nice compromise between smaller compact speakers and tower speakers. They will have more midrange, and clearer dialogue typically. If you move to a home in the future, the speakers will be very useable. My opinion on subwoofers (for what it is worth) is that cheaper subwoofers actually distort more and tend to be more boomy. A good HSU or SVS subwoofer will actually have tighter, more accurate bass. Hsu subs tend to have lots of tuning options.
Should not be a problem mixing and matching the Hsu mains and surrounds, but Hsu is great to talk to on the phone and you can certainly ask. They will also work with you on calibrating and tuning your system for optimal sound.
The SVS speaekers have solid midrange but all these speakers are designed to work with a dedicated subwoofer around 80hz.
Being in a condo, you will be able to utilize Audyssey MuliEQ and Dynamic volume to get a good sound without disturbing your neighbors. And if you ever want a little more bass, you will be able to achieve it without having to upgrade smile.gif

So I checked out the Def Tech StudioMOnitor/ProCinema and various floor standing models( Mirage Floor standing and Satellite, Energy and B&W) at a local Magnolia. Out of the all the various bookshelf speakers I listened to (outside of B&W), the DefTech SM55s sounded the best. I was listening to a Jazz CD track (2.0, R/L speaker only) pushed through a Denon Receiver, and the lead female vocals were practically floating in the air in front of me almost as if the singer was standing in front of me on stage while the music surrounded her coming from directly behind and wide left and right of her. One thing these speakers had which other speakers lacked (personal opinion) was good mid-bass - they almost didn't need a sub to take care of that range and would pair well with a sub crossed at 60HZ. Have you noticed these qualities with your Def Techs? Have you hear the Hsu's Bookshelf speakers, I'm curious to see how the two would compare. Def Techs would def put me at least $500-$800 over budget as the SM55s are $300 each!!!
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post #6 of 9 Old 07-13-2012, 09:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmeech10 View Post

So I checked out the Def Tech StudioMOnitor/ProCinema and various floor standing models( Mirage Floor standing and Satellite, Energy and B&W) at a local Magnolia. Out of the all the various bookshelf speakers I listened to (outside of B&W), the DefTech SM55s sounded the best. I was listening to a Jazz CD track (2.0, R/L speaker only) pushed through a Denon Receiver, and the lead female vocals were practically floating in the air in front of me almost as if the singer was standing in front of me on stage while the music surrounded her coming from directly behind and wide left and right of her. One thing these speakers had which other speakers lacked (personal opinion) was good mid-bass - they almost didn't need a sub to take care of that range and would pair well with a sub crossed at 60HZ. Have you noticed these qualities with your Def Techs? Have you hear the Hsu's Bookshelf speakers, I'm curious to see how the two would compare. Def Techs would def put me at least $500-$800 over budget as the SM55s are $300 each!!!

I love my Deftech speakers, but I own something very different from what you are looking at. I have these behind an accoustically transparent screen:
http://www.definitivetech.com/products/products.aspx?path=Speakers_By_Series|UIW_Reference_Series&productid=UIW_RLS_II

Yes, my Deftech's have good midbass, Audyssey consistently wants to set the crossover to 40hz, but I like it at 80hz since I have a good subwoofer.

I have not heard the new SM series bookshelves. I have heard the Procinema series, were you able to listen to those? You can get them for about half the price of the SM55's. Hard to compare the Procinema series to the Hsu speakers since I did not listen to them in the same room, but the Hsu speakers may have sounded a little better to me.

I recommend a subwoofer no matter what you do.

We're you able to listen to the Procinema 1000 speakers? I can point you to a place that sells them for about half the price of the SM55 speakers.
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post #7 of 9 Old 07-14-2012, 12:17 AM
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I would take a hard look at the Studio Monitor 350 - a real good price for the pair, and they are nice.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16882325059

C/L/R 2002 Center channel
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16882325019

For smaller/tighter placement, the ProCenter 2000 can work
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16882325045

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post #8 of 9 Old 09-10-2012, 07:34 PM - Thread Starter
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Update. I picked up a pair of DefTech bp7006 on ebay. I'll be be able to place them about 9inch max away from the wall. Also there's that corner on right which might cause issues with the BiPol Def Techs. What do you guys think?

I checked out B&W 685 as well and really liked the imaging and the clarity they threw - the DefTech 8040 (simlar to BP7006), not so much, (the bass was wonderful though) my only hope is that the bipols will sound better in my room.

Speakers are coming Thursday. AVR will be Marantz 1602 as it's the only thing that fits into the TV stand.
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post #9 of 9 Old 09-29-2012, 12:32 PM - Thread Starter
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Update for those that helped out.

Got the speakers set up, they sounded really good! The bass from the built in sub blended extremely well! Soundstage was big, treble was tiny bit muted ( most of my listening is at low to moderate volumes, so a brighter speaker would work better for me). Unfortunately, did not pass the SO test. I went from a Slim Silver Sony HTIB to two huge black monoliths, even I thought they looked a bit ugly in the room hehe. They are going back and the search is back on, only now for a smaller, more eye pleasing, good sounding speaker which will satisfy both parties. (Oh the things we do for our SOs. cool.gif) Any suggestions? Bowers 686s? I'm 90% theater, 10% music.
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