Suggestion on Tower speaker in my setup when set to Large - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 30 Old 07-18-2012, 11:23 AM - Thread Starter
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I am in process of contructing my HT.
I just bought a denon 2112ci receiver.
I have a 14x12 room, not too big.
For now I want a 3.0 setup. (No Subwoofer)

My question is. In considering which tower speakers to get, I am torn between the Rti8, Tsi500, and monitor 70s.
I will be setting these speakers to Large since there will be no sub. I do enjoy a speaker with good bass.
Which of these speakers would meet my needs in terms of enough bass when set to large.
I can bi amp with this receiver also so I don't think power is a huge issue for me.

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post #2 of 30 Old 07-18-2012, 11:33 AM
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Does it have to be one of those three? What is the budget?

Also why do you want towers and not bookshelf with a subwoofer?
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post #3 of 30 Old 07-18-2012, 11:35 AM
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Obviously you're a big Polk fan. You dont want to consider any other brands?

I'd go this way.

1. RTi8
2. Monitor 70
3. Tsi 500

Monitor 70 and Tsi500 are essentially same speaker in different cabinets. Monitor 70 can be had as low as $150 when Newegg puts them on sale. Why pay more for the same speaker in the Tsi500?

Rti series is a step above the Monitor and TSi but the Rti10 has a closer driver arrangement to the Monitor 70 than the Rti8.

But make sure you can find the matching CSi5 center if you opt for the Rti8.
http://www.frys.com/product/6895146?site=sr:SEARCH:MAIN_RSLT_PG

I think Fry's had this on sale for $150 or less within the past few weeks.

If bass is your biggest priority then you should add a subwoofer. The M70 might have a little more bass than the Rti8 since it has four 6.5" drivers.

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post #4 of 30 Old 07-18-2012, 11:40 AM - Thread Starter
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It doesn't have to be those 3... I am new to getting descent quality speakers and when I was researching
I got a bit overwhelmed with how many options there were. So I decided to go with polk and research it alot since
there products go on sale.

I can spend like 400 - 700.. nothing set in stone. Just want a good value.

I was thinking towers are most expensive and bigger so they would sound better. Also, cosmetically look better next to my tv.

I am against a subwoofer because I am in an apartment. I have friend in my situation, and cant even tell his sub is on since he keeps it so low.
So I figured nice towers with some bass would be a good fit for me.

Is my logic correct here....

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post #5 of 30 Old 07-18-2012, 11:47 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by afrogt View Post

Rti10 has a closer driver arrangement to the Monitor 70 than the Rti8.
But make sure you can find the matching CSi5 center if you opt for the Rti8.
There are 2 deals I am looking at I have locally.

Monitor 70s with cs20 center. OR RTI8 with csi3 center.


If the RTI10 as you suggested is the Best fit by a large margin for me.
I will srsly consider it.

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post #6 of 30 Old 07-18-2012, 12:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drew3821 View Post

There are 2 deals I am looking at I have locally.
Monitor 70s with cs20 center. OR RTI8 with csi3 center.
If the RTI10 as you suggested is the Best fit by a large margin for me.
I will srsly consider it.

My vote is for the RTI10 first and then Monitor 70's IMO

Yamaha RX-V471 (AVR)
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Polk OWM3 (surrounds)
Polk DSW pro550wi (sub)

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post #7 of 30 Old 07-18-2012, 01:02 PM - Thread Starter
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I am buying these speakers tonight.

I can get the RTI10 for 120$ more with no center channel.
or
RTI8 with csi3
or
monitor 70 with cs20.

I am leaning towards RTI10 with no center for now
from the feedback I have gotten from Mark and Afrogt.

RTI10 worth it with no center for this price??

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post #8 of 30 Old 07-18-2012, 01:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drew3821 View Post

I am buying these speakers tonight.
I can get the RTI10 for 120$ more with no center channel.
or
RTI8 with csi3
or
monitor 70 with cs20.
I am leaning towards RTI10 with no center for now
from the feedback I have gotten from Mark and Afrogt.
RTI10 worth it with no center for this price??

I am no audio pro, so if someone more experienced wants to chime in by all means please do so, but I would thing it all depends on what you are listening too. There are a lot of people who love 2.0 for music and if Music is what you listen to the most then I say go for the RTI10, but from what I have experienced, a 3.0 setup sounds better for HT. I had the Polk Monitor 50's and CS1 center in a 3.0 setup for awhile until I completed my 5.1 setup and it sounded great. I would think the Monitor 70's with CS2 would be even better due too larger drivers plus more of them.

Yamaha RX-V471 (AVR)
Polk Monitor 50 (fronts)
Polk CS1 (center)
Polk OWM3 (surrounds)
Polk DSW pro550wi (sub)

Mark
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post #9 of 30 Old 07-18-2012, 02:29 PM - Thread Starter
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If the monitor 70s have larger drivers and more of them....
I just got confused.
If that is the case, what am I paying for in the RTI10 to make it more expensive. Other than cosmetics.

EDIT: I use it for both HT and music. And will be getting a matching center in the future if I chose to get the RTI10.

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post #10 of 30 Old 07-18-2012, 03:31 PM
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If I were you I would get a pair of the highest quality bookshelf speakers you can get right now. It would give you the best sound quality you can get, also most good bookshelf speakers you can get enough bass for an apartment where you can't listen to loud bass. Then if you move you won't have to upgrade your main speakers, and you can add a sub for the bass. Plus you have tons of good options in and around your price range, ascend acoustics makes good speakers in that price range. Also would used be an option?
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post #11 of 30 Old 07-18-2012, 05:01 PM
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My choice would be the Ascend Acoustic 340's. They are sensitive and offer good bass response. Those for sure would be my first choice.

Second choice would be Fluance's new towers in a MTM setup with a 8" downfiring sub. Audioholics did a review on it and liked the bass response.

My opinion,

Brian in Bakersfield...

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post #12 of 30 Old 07-18-2012, 05:18 PM - Thread Starter
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I am surprised that a pair of bookshelf speakers would sound better than RTI10.
Those things are soo huge and have many drivers in them.
I am leaning towards floorstanding speakers for cosmetic purposes. Also, buying stands for the bookshelf speakers would hike the price up even more.
And yes, I don't mind buying used.
In fact, all the deals I am looking at are used.

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post #13 of 30 Old 07-18-2012, 05:27 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi Brian thanks for suggestion. You may have a very unique taste because I am having a hard time finding these things new.
Probably impossible used. I am looking for something more, "mainstream" so I can find it used somewhere. Hope that makes sense.
The msrp on the polks rti10 were soo high, making me feel that I am getting a good deal on these speakers. But then again, seems like
people prefer other things.

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post #14 of 30 Old 07-18-2012, 05:47 PM
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I auditioned a set of the mentioned 340's and was blown away at the effortless fullrange sound. I posted my audition review on their forum and also here but may be 3 or 4 pages deep and was done last thursday. Please check out my listening thoughts.

I do dig some of the polk designs and their drivers seem somewhat efficient. I'd love to take a pair of their monsters with the MTM plus 3 drivers apart and see if i could make any improvements. Decoupling, damping, little stuff that may make said performance even better. There are a bunch of good deals on Fry's website and amazon when it comes to Polks. I like the r50's with a TWW setup, that enclosure has amazing possibilities for tweaking. One could also upgrade to a better tweeter and possibly a better crossover.


Brian in Bakersfield...

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post #15 of 30 Old 07-18-2012, 07:04 PM
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I used to own a pair of RTi8's. The Ascend's, IMHO, sound much better.

What is your budget? Another speaker to consider on a budget are these:
EMP55ti:
http://www.emptek.com/SummerSale.php

Very nice sale. And free in house trial, you don't even pay return shipping.
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post #16 of 30 Old 07-18-2012, 07:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drew3821 View Post

I am surprised that a pair of bookshelf speakers would sound better than RTI10.
Those things are soo huge and have many drivers in them.
I am leaning towards floorstanding speakers for cosmetic purposes. Also, buying stands for the bookshelf speakers would hike the price up even more.
And yes, I don't mind buying used.
In fact, all the deals I am looking at are used.

Lots of drivers doesn't mean it will sound good. These floorstanding speakers that you are looking the extra drivers are simply woofers, that along with the size only really helps the speakers go a bit lower and able to handle more power when powering that low end.

I have Polk RT2000p, and ascend 340's, In my main listening area I use the 340's along with a subwoofer. That combo is better than the 2000p.

If you are looking at used, I also quite like the polk LSi9's. Though you might have trouble powering those.

It's just you get better sound for the money when going with a bookshelf speaker for the same price as a tower. Since you spend less on the extra cab size and fewer drivers, so you get higher quality on what you do get. Then if you want good low end you get a subwoofer which is going to be better than the towers anyway, plus you can actually place it in a good spot for the bass instead of having to have it where the rest of the speaker is.

Edit: there are some very nice tower speakers that are worth it, but it's due to their design, not just because it's a tower speaker with more bass.
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post #17 of 30 Old 07-18-2012, 09:00 PM
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I really like the comparo between the new Fluance tower and the EMP55's on audioholics. Great example that having a bunch of drivers doesnt always provide extension. the fluance between these 2 easily had the measured and audible low freqs and bested the bigger emp's. fwiw

Brian in Bakersfield...

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post #18 of 30 Old 07-19-2012, 09:54 AM - Thread Starter
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From the suggestions I read, I decided not to pay extra and get a tower speaker with subs in it,
rather go with the best quality speaker I can get, then get a sub.
I got the RTI8 because they had it locally and when I heard it I really liked it.
Now I just need a sub to go with my RTI8 and CSI3 center.
What you guys think about psw10?

Note that I do not need a powerful large sub because I am in an apartment. I would prefer a sub that is not down firing and has descent quality.

EDIT: There is only ONE of these left in stock. http://www.amazon.com/BIC-AMERICA-V-80-Powered-Subwoofer/dp/tech-data/B00009WBYK/ref=de_a_smtd
Would this be good?

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post #19 of 30 Old 07-19-2012, 10:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drew3821 View Post

From the suggestions I read, I decided not to pay extra and get a tower speaker with subs in it,
rather go with the best quality speaker I can get, then get a sub.
I got the RTI8 because they had it locally and when I heard it I really liked it.
Now I just need a sub to go with my RTI8 and CSI3 center.
What you guys think about psw10?
Note that I do not need a powerful large sub because I am in an apartment. I would prefer a sub that is not down firing and has descent quality.

I live in an apartment and run a 7.2 system. I've gone with Mirage and Energy small subs for my .2, tuned correctly and since they are smaller, have had no problem with neighbors. I don't blast them, but when within the area, get more than enough good sound for my movie and music enjoyment.

I have a Mirage S8 for one and the Energy S10.3. which I would highly recommend. It's on sale now for a great price - 210 at NewEgg. To me, that's the sub to get for an apartment at a great price.

200 Watts continuous vs. 50 for the psw10, 800 Watts peak vs. 100 for the psw10, 21Hz - 120Hz coverage vs. 35 - 200Hz for the psw10. I've found that in an apartment especially, you want the best sound per speaker, since you don't have the luxury of blasting the sound. Just my 2 cents.
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post #20 of 30 Old 07-19-2012, 10:31 AM
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I would skip the PSW10. It is not very good. I would go either with the Energy S10.3 above or consider the Polk PSW505.

Smaller subwoofers do not always equate to tighter, more accurate bass. In many instances, a smaller subwoofer that is overworked will distort more and sound more "muddy". Use tools like Audyssey MultiEQ and DynamicVolume to help tune your system. DynamicVolume is helpful in an apartment/condo with shared walls after hours.
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post #21 of 30 Old 07-19-2012, 10:33 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hernanu View Post

I live in an apartment and run a 7.2 system. I've gone with Mirage and Energy small subs for my .2, tuned correctly and since they are smaller, have had no problem with neighbors. I don't blast them, but when within the area, get more than enough good sound for my movie and music enjoyment.
I have a Mirage S8 for one and the Energy S10.3. which I would highly recommend. It's on sale now for a great price - 210 at NewEgg. To me, that's the sub to get for an apartment at a great price.
200 Watts continuous vs. 50 for the psw10, 800 Watts peak vs. 100 for the psw10, 21Hz - 120Hz coverage vs. 35 - 200Hz for the psw10. I've found that in an apartment especially, you want the best sound per speaker, since you don't have the luxury of blasting the sound. Just my 2 cents.

I was excited about this until I read it was downfiring sub.
I was under the impression I want to stay away from downfiring subs at all costs. Since I am in an apartment.
With front firing, I can have sub on louder and not disturb neighbors as much?

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post #22 of 30 Old 07-19-2012, 10:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drew3821 View Post

I was excited about this until I read it was downfiring sub.
I was under the impression I want to stay away from downfiring subs at all costs. Since I am in an apartment.
With front firing, I can have sub on louder and not disturb neighbors as much?

Downfiring or frontfiring, there is no noticeable difference in terms of output and extension. Meaning you will disturb your neighbors equally if you play it loud.

You may want to consider an isolation pad if someone is below you for the sub. Something like this. Regardless of down or front firing:
http://www.amazon.com/Auralex-Subwoofer-Isolation-15x15x2-inch-Charcoal/dp/B001140OZ0
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post #23 of 30 Old 07-19-2012, 10:50 AM - Thread Starter
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I have been advised front firing sub is better for carpet, as well as more "Accurate" bass.
Also, downfiring sub will bounce at my rear wall.
Seems like there is a difference between front firing and down firing?
The subwoofer isolation pad is an excellent idea btw. I will end up getting that with the sub.

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post #24 of 30 Old 07-19-2012, 10:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drew3821 View Post

I have been advised front firing sub is better for carpet, as well as more "Accurate" bass.
Also, downfiring sub will bounce at my rear wall.
Seems like there is a difference between front firing and down firing?
The subwoofer isolation pad is an excellent idea btw. I will end up getting that with the sub.

Downfiring/front firing do not really work that way.

Here is a an old thread that should explain it:
http://forum.hsuresearch.com/archive/index.php/t-540.html

I would not worry about down vs front. It really matters on where you place the sub, how you tune and tweak it, and how loud you are playing.
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post #25 of 30 Old 07-19-2012, 11:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drew3821 View Post

I have been advised front firing sub is better for carpet, as well as more "Accurate" bass.
Also, downfiring sub will bounce at my rear wall.
Seems like there is a difference between front firing and down firing?
The subwoofer isolation pad is an excellent idea btw. I will end up getting that with the sub.

It's not the technology (front vs. down), but the quality of the components that produce accurate bass.

The Energy is a great sub. I haven't found any problem with the S10.3 being more or less bothersome than my previous pairing of the Mirage with an Energy ESW-V8, a front firing sub. I also have carpets, have had no problems with those. So to answer your question, for me there is no difference in performance or effect on the neighbors on front / down firing. The only difference was that the S10.3 was better than the ESW-V8. That has been moved to my bedroom system.

I haven't used the subdudes, but definitely considered it if there had been complaints from my neighbors. So far none.
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post #26 of 30 Old 07-19-2012, 11:48 AM - Thread Starter
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Alright I am convinced the down firing and front firing aspect doesn't matter.
Thanks for the insight.
I been looking locally and have these options for the sub. Energy V10 , Klipshch KSW12 , and Energy S10.3, and Energy ES12.
The Energy V10 is more expensive but if it is alot better I will consider it.
The S10.3 is still the best of those options?

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post #27 of 30 Old 07-19-2012, 11:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drew3821 View Post

Alright I am convinced the down firing and front firing aspect doesn't matter.
Thanks for the insight.
I been looking locally and have these options for the sub. Energy V10 , Klipshch KSW12 , and Energy S10.3 .
The S10.3 is still the best of those options?

Folks seem very happy with the Energy S10.3 and measurements seem pretty decent. Newegg has it on sale quite a bit, so you may want to check the price there first before you buy local.
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post #28 of 30 Old 07-19-2012, 12:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drew3821 View Post

Alright I am convinced the down firing and front firing aspect doesn't matter.
Thanks for the insight.
I been looking locally and have these options for the sub. Energy V10 , Klipshch KSW12 , and Energy S10.3, and Energy ES12.
The Energy V10 is more expensive but if it is alot better I will consider it.
The S10.3 is still the best of those options?

The ESW-V10 is a more powerful sub, 300 Watts RMS vs. 200 for the S10.3, 1200 Watts Peak vs 800 for the S10.3. I have the ESW-v8 and it is a more visually attractive speaker, gloss black finish, et. al.

It depends how much more the V10 is, used or new. In your application, with the consideration of the neighbors, neither sub is going to be pushed significantly, so it comes down to bang for the buck. I like both, the ESW-V10 was from the higher end Veritas line, so .... ??? Depends on the money you want to spend.
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post #29 of 30 Old 07-19-2012, 12:40 PM
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The s10.3 actually plays slightly lower though..21hz vs 23hz on the Veritas sub.

The Veritas has more power and the lovely glossy finish if that matters.

Afro GT
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post #30 of 30 Old 07-19-2012, 04:38 PM - Thread Starter
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I am more interested in quality rather than power since it is not being played that loud.
In terms of quality per buck, the latest post by afrogt is making me lean toward the s10.3.
I do care about cosmetics so if the other one is more appealing and same quality I would prefer that.

All the subs I have listed are in my price range. If I dont find it used, I will wait for a deal or just bite the bullet.

WD 73740 DLP HDTV - 73 inches
Polk RTI 8 Towers
CSi3 Center
Energy 10.3 subwoofer
denon 2112ci receiver
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