On a carpeted floor, which would be THE best for music only? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 11 Old 07-18-2012, 01:08 PM - Thread Starter
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I have decided to setup a separate, dedicated 2.0 system for music only and have decided to go with Cambridge Minx for my Blu-ray/Home theater purposes. Much less hassle and should be slightly less expensive.

Now here are my worries:

I have a carpeted floor but not sure about the material underneath. I have read that material like concrete or steel, etc makes some impact towards a speaker's sonic character.

With that in mind, I'm thinking of either getting a pair of floorstanders or bookshelves (less range) with decent stands.


What I have heard at a store and LOVE:

The Focal 706Vs and the Paradigm Studio 10's (both were on their stands)


What I want to buy:

Paradigm Studio 60 or the Focal Chorus 816V.

Now, I would prefer the floorstanders, due to more range (and they both look really nice), BUT, since I'm putting them on the carpet directly, I don't know if I'll still get the awesome sense of depth and "being there" type feeling that the bookshelves gave me. They would be 12-13 inches from the back wall, 2 feet from the side walls, and about 4.5 feet apart from one another.


Thanks!!
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post #2 of 11 Old 07-18-2012, 01:52 PM
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The monitors on stands approach has it's merits but 2.0 is difficult to achieve with Bass you can appreciate more fully without a sub IMO. I'm sure others may disagree. Much would depend on the Bookshelfs in question. But overall the floor standers should give better results depending on room/treatments and signal processing such as EQ, if any. Both floor standing speakers are not rear ported so placement should be less of an issue. No knock against the 60s but I would prefer the 6.5" drivers in the 816Vs, especially if staying with 2.0 for awhile. .

The solid cast base of the Focals should be all that you need on carpet and I would try to use a flat approach first in setup. But if the soundstage or off-axis response seems a little off at all, try elevating the fronts using the front edge spikes only. Use machined spike dimples underneath and leave the rear spikes fairly flat, barely grabbing the carpet. Just a small amount of front tilt can be very helpful at times.




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post #3 of 11 Old 07-18-2012, 02:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Would the music sound better than the floor standing units, if the bookshelves are paired with a decent sub, say an SVS SB12?

How are mids and highs better in the floorstanders?

I keep hearing it's easier and takes less power to drive floorstanders, BUT that the larger cabinet sizes creates more resonance than a bookshelf.
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post #4 of 11 Old 07-18-2012, 02:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BestInTheWorld View Post

I have read that material like concrete or steel, etc makes some impact towards a speaker's sonic character.
Only when not carpeted. The benefit to bookshelves/subs is that it allows placement of the subs other than under the mains, which usually gives a better result, especially for HT use.

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post #5 of 11 Old 07-18-2012, 02:36 PM
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v5 studio 60, 2.0 setup owner here.

since purchasing these, i have decided they simply wont go low enough, loud enough to suit my 2.0 needs. while, im certainly no bass head, i did feel they were lacking in the low end of kick drums and bass guitar notes.

i dont want to dissuade you from considering them, esp as i love the sound otherwise. But for me, a sub was mandatory.

i actually ordered my sub, then went back to hear the 100s, and fell in love with them and wound up buying them as well!

so now, my 2.0 setup became a 2.1 with the 100s and a rel sub, and the 60s are the fronts to my home theater.

what a fun, expensive, addictive little hobby we have, eh?

good luck!

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post #6 of 11 Old 07-18-2012, 03:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BestInTheWorld View Post

Would the music sound better than the floor standing units, if the bookshelves are paired with a decent sub, say an SVS SB12?
How are mids and highs better in the floorstanders?
I keep hearing it's easier and takes less power to drive floorstanders, BUT that the larger cabinet sizes creates more resonance than a bookshelf.

First things first: what is the size of your room and is it treated?

It is a long held belief by many that stand speakers will deliver better imaging and render more a more pleasing assortment of SQ characteristics in-room than comparable floorstanders. I happen to disagree but that is just my opinion. I do appreciate having a dedicated Mid driver, even with a fairly low X-over to enhance the Bass output, as many designs do. Using the approach I described in the previous post, with a top mounted tweeter design, Music actually floats in the air (think Young Frankenstein and Cloris Leachman's vioin) and even when approaching from another room there is very little difference in SQ from in-room.

The option you offer of the SVS sub is intriguing and quite possibly would make for a better overall presentation if the sub can be blended properly. This should be less of a chore with the bookshelfs as it is with floorstanders, especially if not using room EQ. Are you going the purist route with the signal?

I have been using 2.5 way towers of similar size and spec. as your choices in an untreated carpet over concrete slab room of roughly 10.5' W x 17' L for over 10 years now. But it wasn't until I plugged in a processor with Audyssey MultEQ XT that I was able to fully achieve the sound I wanted in-room. The proper blend of SUB and floorstander can be an elusive little minx in a difficult room. The SVS sub and bookshelf combination would free you in many respects to both expand the system, whenever desirable, and also deliver better articulated low Bass with Music only content.

Cost-wise it is often pretty much of a toss-up between Bookshelfs and Floorstanders once the stands are factored in. Having a Studio 60 v5 owner like lifeis11 chime in should now be very helpful.




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post #7 of 11 Old 07-19-2012, 06:35 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClarkeBar View Post

First things first: what is the size of your room and is it treated?
It is a long held belief by many that stand speakers will deliver better imaging and render more a more pleasing assortment of SQ characteristics in-room than comparable floorstanders. I happen to disagree but that is just my opinion. I do appreciate having a dedicated Mid driver, even with a fairly low X-over to enhance the Bass output, as many designs do. Using the approach I described in the previous post, with a top mounted tweeter design, Music actually floats in the air (think Young Frankenstein and Cloris Leachman's vioin) and even when approaching from another room there is very little difference in SQ from in-room.
The option you offer of the SVS sub is intriguing and quite possibly would make for a better overall presentation if the sub can be blended properly. This should be less of a chore with the bookshelfs as it is with floorstanders, especially if not using room EQ. Are you going the purist route with the signal?
I have been using 2.5 way towers of similar size and spec. as your choices in an untreated carpet over concrete slab room of roughly 10.5' W x 17' L for over 10 years now. But it wasn't until I plugged in a processor with Audyssey MultEQ XT that I was able to fully achieve the sound I wanted in-room. The proper blend of SUB and floorstander can be an elusive little minx in a difficult room. The SVS sub and bookshelf combination would free you in many respects to both expand the system, whenever desirable, and also deliver better articulated low Bass with Music only content.
Cost-wise it is often pretty much of a toss-up between Bookshelfs and Floorstanders once the stands are factored in. Having a Studio 60 v5 owner like lifeis11 chime in should now be very helpful.

Carpet isn't treated and I don't know what Audyssey is. I have decided to go with bookshelves since the sound will be amazing, I will save $1000 or so, which I can use the money towards the amplifier/preamp/solid state/etc and use the rest for the stands. I am 99% sure I will get the Focal 807Vs and get the stand at my shop for $155 (after discounts). I think this would be the best way, and the tweeter for this series is "inverted" and on the top.
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post #8 of 11 Old 07-19-2012, 08:39 PM
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Two weeks ago I got a pair for Focal 706Vs for a music only stereo setup. I have them on the Focal stands with carpet spikes in. The mids and highs are fantastic, but, in my room (15 x 25 x 10 with heavy room treatments), I needed to cross them over with a Hsu sub at around 65Hz to get a full sound. If you do go with the Focal bookshelves, you will probably want to pair them with a good sub or things like bass guitars may sound very faint, kick drums won't kick, etc. I have them paired with a Hsu VTF-2 MK4 and a Marantz PM6004 and have been exceptionally pleased with the setup.
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post #9 of 11 Old 07-20-2012, 03:32 PM - Thread Starter
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Hey dmsdms,

Welcome to the AVS forums! I have more or less decided to get either the 807V in moka/piano black or a pair of 706V's for half the cost (but at a color I'm not a fan of). I think I may just get an SVS sub and use that with these speakers (when i buy them in a few months). This SVS sub is basically to be used with my Cambridge Minx system that I plan to have installed and set up by the middle of next week.

I just googled that Marantz model and it has gotten good reviews, so I may just get that model or something similar to it as well. I am still uncertain what "crossover" means, and also when people say they "mate" a sub with a set of speakers...but what does this do, and which frequency do you know to set it on??
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post #10 of 11 Old 07-20-2012, 05:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BestInTheWorld View Post

I just googled that Marantz model and it has gotten good reviews, so I may just get that model or something similar to it as well. I am still uncertain what "crossover" means, and also when people say they "mate" a sub with a set of speakers...but what does this do, and which frequency do you know to set it on??

The Marantz is nice but, I would be sure it's what you are looking for: It has no digital inputs, primitive EQ, no sub outs and it's not all that powerful. Those are all very significant drawbacks depending on how/where you plan to use it. I only use mine with a USB DAC for listening at moderate volume (< 80dB at listening position) from 10 feet away, bypass the EQ with direct mode and don't mind fiddling with the crossover/volume on the sub to get it integrated.

As for "crossover", it basically means a method (there are several) of having your sub only play low frequencies that your speakers can't (or don't because of a high pass filter). There are plenty of detailed explanations out there on how to do this that are better than what I would write to fully explain it.
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post #11 of 11 Old 07-20-2012, 06:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by dmsdms View Post

The Marantz is nice but, I would be sure it's what you are looking for: It has no digital inputs, primitive EQ, no sub outs and it's not all that powerful. Those are all very significant drawbacks depending on how/where you plan to use it. I only use mine with a USB DAC for listening at moderate volume (< 80dB at listening position) from 10 feet away, bypass the EQ with direct mode and don't mind fiddling with the crossover/volume on the sub to get it integrated.
As for "crossover", it basically means a method (there are several) of having your sub only play low frequencies that your speakers can't (or don't because of a high pass filter). There are plenty of detailed explanations out there on how to do this that are better than what I would write to fully explain it.

I don't know how loud 80 dB is but it sounds pretty loud. Good and bad thing is I live in an apartment so this "drawback" could pose no issue for myself, depending how loud 80 dB is.

As for the crossover, just look at the range my speakers go to, and just essentially get the sub to "fill in the blanks" and cover the lower end spectrum of the frequency response range.
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