Question about Monoprice in-walls combined with Klipsch center + di-pole vs. bipole surrounds - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 16 Old 08-07-2012, 03:20 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
bblackbu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 23
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I'm hoping for some additional advice related to my situation:

I am building a house, currently being framed. My receiver is a Denon AVR-591. I am planning on using either the Monoprice 7604's or 6816 for the Left-Front and Right-Fronts.

Question #1: I currently have a Klipsch C-10 center speaker that fits nicely into the TV stand that I will continue to use. Will this work well with either of the in-wall fronts that I mentioned above, or would I be better off looking at replacing the Klipsch with something from Monoprice? Any "timbre" issues or balancing issues? (I will be doing the Audyssey set-up through my receiver)

Question #2: From what I've read elsewhere on AVS, the surrounds should ideally be "bi-pole" or "di-pole" (not sure if those are the same and if I have my info correct) because you don't want to be able to pinpoint the source of the surrounds. Assuming that is correct info (and please correct me if I have it wrong), are the Monoprice 4619's (6-1/2 Inches Glass Composite 3-Way, Dual Voice Coil, Stereo In-Ceiling Speakers) considered bi-pole or di-pole and thus would they be a good choice for surrounds, or should I go with maybe the 8" directional woofer ceiling speakers (4929)?

Many thanks in advance for any advice or insights you can offer on this.
bblackbu is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 16 Old 08-07-2012, 03:59 PM
AVS Special Member
 
commsysman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Southern California
Posts: 5,298
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 141 Post(s)
Liked: 257
I would never recommend those Monoprice in-wall speakers to anyone that wants better sound than a Motel 6 clock radio.

I would also caution you against being in a hurry to buy dipole speakers, because they are very tricky to place and simply do not work well in many rooms.

It costs 3 to 4 times as much to design and make an in-wall speaker to approach the equivalent sound quality of conventional speakers. From a design standpoint, the deck is stacked against in-wall speakers.

To put it another way, your average $400 in-wall speaker will typically give you about the same sound quality of a $130 conventional speaker.

If you really really want or need in-wall speakers, you should look at some of the higher-quality speakers, such as the PSB CW363 or CW 383.
commsysman is offline  
post #3 of 16 Old 08-08-2012, 06:07 AM
Newbie
 
street388's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 6
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I'm in the same boat considering buying monoprice in wall speakers. I've read and done research and the 4101 has gotten great review across the boards. Plus the price is great too. Only reason I'm even considering in wall is to please the wife.

I would just continue doing research and see what best fits you. Good luck!

ATI 5XXX
Intel Processor
Mediaportal user
street388 is offline  
post #4 of 16 Old 08-08-2012, 07:11 AM
 
BeeMan458's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Magalia, CA
Posts: 8,374
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 801
My opinion, in wall speakers, unless absolutely necessary, is a terrible choice as in wall speakers are too directional for surrounds. My recommendation, considering you're having this home built for you is to get some added onto the wall Klipsch surrounds and irrespective of what you choose to buy, buy matching speakers so the timbre will match.

My recommendation would be to buy a different TV stand than use a center channel because it fits the TV stand.

I'm a big fan of both Klipsch and bi-poles. I'm also a fan of hiding wires and wall plates so one can only see the surround and can't see either wires or wall plates. Makes a huge presentational difference. If wires and wall plates are hidden, surrounds float in the air and blend. Leave wires and wall plates out in the open for all to see and surrounds hang on the wall in an obtrusive, utilitarian fashion; ugly.

The above are my opinions.

biggrin.gif

-
BeeMan458 is offline  
post #5 of 16 Old 08-08-2012, 08:03 AM
AVS Special Member
 
ack_bk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Maple Grove, MN
Posts: 8,841
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 29 Post(s)
Liked: 106
Well they do make bi-directional in-wall speakers..

I digress. OP,. I would try to timbre match your front three speakers. I have not heard the Monoprice speakers in question, but if you are set on in-wall speaker, I would contact Klipsch and find out the matching Klipsch in-wall.

The Monoprice speakers and Klipsch speakers will most likely not blend very well for a front soundstage as they are very different speakers with completely different tweeter designs.
ack_bk is offline  
post #6 of 16 Old 08-08-2012, 08:13 AM
 
BeeMan458's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Magalia, CA
Posts: 8,374
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 801
Quote:
Originally Posted by ack_bk View Post

Well they do make bi-directional in-wall speakers..
I digress. OP,. I would try to timbre match your front three speakers. I have not heard the Monoprice speakers in question, but if you are set on in-wall speaker, I would contact Klipsch and find out the matching Klipsch in-wall.
The Monoprice speakers and Klipsch speakers will most likely not blend very well for a front soundstage as they are very different speakers with completely different tweeter designs.

Just saying, anything flat in a wall, isn't going have the bi-polar characteristics of a mounted on a wall speaker, no matter how the manufacture wishes to label the speaker.

b9eee574d0129867554e0f73791a18c5.jpg?1344376838

To paraphrase Crocodile Dundee, now that's a bipolar speaker.

biggrin.gif

Our set is white with wires hidden in the wall so they unobtrusively float on the wall. Let wires hang down and they immediately look like poop. Wires were hidden in the wall, after the home was constructed and yes, it takes lots of time to do it right and yes, it's a pain doing so but the improvement to the decor makes it worth the effort.

-
BeeMan458 is offline  
post #7 of 16 Old 08-08-2012, 08:41 AM
AVS Special Member
 
ack_bk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Maple Grove, MN
Posts: 8,841
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 29 Post(s)
Liked: 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeeMan458 View Post

Just saying, anything flat in a wall, isn't going have the bi-polar characteristics of a mounted on a wall speaker, no matter how the manufacture wishes to label the speaker.
-

How do you know this? Do you have actual measurements of an in-wall vs an on-wall, or are you just guessing? I have talked to several speaker designers from well known companies who do not agree with you.

For the record, I have both on-wall and in-wall bipolar surround speakers and I am hard pressed to tell you one sounds better than the other. I actually love the look of the in-wall so would probably recommend that one.
ack_bk is offline  
post #8 of 16 Old 08-08-2012, 08:53 AM
AVS Special Member
 
flyng_fool's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Frisco, TX
Posts: 3,860
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 182 Post(s)
Liked: 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeeMan458 View Post

Just saying, anything flat in a wall, isn't going have the bi-polar characteristics of a mounted on a wall speaker, no matter how the manufacture wishes to label the speaker.
b9eee574d0129867554e0f73791a18c5.jpg?1344376838
To paraphrase Crocodile Dundee, now that's a bipolar speaker.
biggrin.gif
Our set is white with wires hidden in the wall so they unobtrusively float on the wall. Let wires hang down and they immediately look like poop. Wires were hidden in the wall, after the home was constructed and yes, it takes lots of time to do it right and yes, it's a pain doing so but the improvement to the decor makes it worth the effort.
-
Wanna bet?


Television: Mitsubishi WD65737 DLP
Processor: Emotiva UMC-200
Amps: Carver AV 806x/Behringer EP4000
Mains: DCM TimeFrame 600 Center: AT 453C
Surrounds: AT 251.1 Sub: Danley DTS-10
Blu Ray: Panasonic DMP-BD655
flyng_fool is offline  
post #9 of 16 Old 08-08-2012, 08:54 AM
 
BeeMan458's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Magalia, CA
Posts: 8,374
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 801
Quote:
Originally Posted by ack_bk View Post

How do you know this? Do you have actual measurements of an in-wall vs an on-wall, or are you just guessing? I have talked to several speaker designers from well known companies who do not agree with you.
For the record, I have both on-wall and in-wall bipolar surround speakers and I am hard pressed to tell you one sounds better than the other. I actually love the look of the in-wall so would probably recommend that one.

With all due respect. I'm not going argue my point as speaker manufactures have to say what they say or they couldn't sell their products.
BeeMan458 is offline  
post #10 of 16 Old 08-08-2012, 08:55 AM
 
BeeMan458's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Magalia, CA
Posts: 8,374
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 801
Quote:
Originally Posted by flyng_fool View Post

Wanna bet?

Yup, sweet looking but it's still recessed, so no, it doesn't have the bipolar characteristics of a wall mounted speaker, so yup!

biggrin.gif

-
BeeMan458 is offline  
post #11 of 16 Old 08-08-2012, 09:05 AM
AVS Special Member
 
ack_bk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Maple Grove, MN
Posts: 8,841
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 29 Post(s)
Liked: 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeeMan458 View Post

With all due respect. I'm not going argue my point as speaker manufactures have to say what they say or they couldn't sell their products.

Both these manufacturers sell both in-wall and on-wall surrounds. What benefit would they have in lying?
ack_bk is offline  
post #12 of 16 Old 08-08-2012, 09:09 AM
 
BeeMan458's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Magalia, CA
Posts: 8,374
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 801
Quote:
Originally Posted by ack_bk View Post

Both these manufacturers sell both in-wall and on-wall surrounds. What benefit would they have in lying?

You'll have to ask the manufacture that question. From now on, I'll only respond to the OP.
BeeMan458 is offline  
post #13 of 16 Old 08-08-2012, 09:47 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
bblackbu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 23
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Thanks for all the input and discussion. The reason for going with in-wall/in-ceiling is to keep the clean look that the wife demands, since this will be in our main living area and not a 100% dedicated media room. The reason for thinking about the monoprice speakers really came down to value, and all of the glowing reviews that I've found elsewhere on this site regarding their in-wall/ceiling products.

So it sounds like it is recommended that I match the front three speakers' manufacturers so that I don't have a timbre mismatch, and thus it is unlikely that sticking with my current non-wall Klipsch speaker would give good results with the in-wall Monoprice speakers. OK, that makes sense.

It sounds like the jury is still out regarding the surround speakers. So, assuming I'm comparing these two speakers: a) Model 4619 vs. b) this speaker, or c) this one.

Thoughts on option A, B or C above? I still am not clear if option A would give the non-directional benefit of a bi-pole that it sounds like is preferred for a surround speaker.
bblackbu is offline  
post #14 of 16 Old 08-08-2012, 10:49 AM
 
BeeMan458's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Magalia, CA
Posts: 8,374
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 801
Quote:
Originally Posted by bblackbu View Post

Thanks for all the input and discussion. The reason for going with in-wall/in-ceiling is to keep the clean look that the wife demands, since this will be in our main living area and not a 100% dedicated media room.\

What momma want's, momma gets. tongue.gif

As to the speaker choices listed, they're outside my tastes and with all due respect, my opinion, I think you'll dishonor both yourself and your new home with these choices. I would rather see you put something like these Klipsch R-5502-W II, in-wall speakers for surrounds.

If you go with less, you'll find yourself chasing more. With these, you won't feel as compelled to chase other in-wall surrounds. Upgrade-itis is a terrible disease to suffer from.

Klipsch has a full line of architectural speakers. and Klipsch's manual might give you additional ideas.

Please don't take offense for my recommendations. For me, my trouble is, recommending speakers that downgraded the listening experience; especially in a new home. One also needs to explore the listening environment of this new lvrm and purchase room pertinent speakers to match the sound characteristics of the room as opposed to purchasing speakers one can easily afford; horses for courses.

-
BeeMan458 is offline  
post #15 of 16 Old 08-08-2012, 12:34 PM
AVS Special Member
 
ack_bk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Maple Grove, MN
Posts: 8,841
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 29 Post(s)
Liked: 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by bblackbu View Post

Thanks for all the input and discussion. The reason for going with in-wall/in-ceiling is to keep the clean look that the wife demands, since this will be in our main living area and not a 100% dedicated media room. The reason for thinking about the monoprice speakers really came down to value, and all of the glowing reviews that I've found elsewhere on this site regarding their in-wall/ceiling products.
So it sounds like it is recommended that I match the front three speakers' manufacturers so that I don't have a timbre mismatch, and thus it is unlikely that sticking with my current non-wall Klipsch speaker would give good results with the in-wall Monoprice speakers. OK, that makes sense.
It sounds like the jury is still out regarding the surround speakers. So, assuming I'm comparing these two speakers: a) Model 4619 vs. b) this speaker, or c) this one.
Thoughts on option A, B or C above? I still am not clear if option A would give the non-directional benefit of a bi-pole that it sounds like is preferred for a surround speaker.

I would pick this one that is on clearance instead for a surround in your price range:
http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/SNELLOHT7/SNELL-OH-T7-Full-range-6.5-inch-coax-Direct-Power-waveguide-Each/1.html

Spend your money on your mains. If you are used to and like the Klipsch sound, I would stay with Klipsch in-wall speakers with the horn loaded tweeter. You can find them from an authorized dealer for about $299 and on Ebay for less:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Klipsch-R-3650-W-In-Wall-Speaker-3650W-/120965194249?pt=Speakers_Subwoofers&hash=item1c2a166209
ack_bk is offline  
post #16 of 16 Old 08-08-2012, 01:58 PM
AVS Special Member
 
flyng_fool's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Frisco, TX
Posts: 3,860
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 182 Post(s)
Liked: 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeeMan458 View Post

Yup, sweet looking but it's still recessed, so no, it doesn't have the bipolar characteristics of a wall mounted speaker, so yup!
biggrin.gif
-
Yes it does. I own it. The sound is just as diffuse as on walls.

Television: Mitsubishi WD65737 DLP
Processor: Emotiva UMC-200
Amps: Carver AV 806x/Behringer EP4000
Mains: DCM TimeFrame 600 Center: AT 453C
Surrounds: AT 251.1 Sub: Danley DTS-10
Blu Ray: Panasonic DMP-BD655
flyng_fool is offline  
Reply Speakers



Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off