Need a new sub and maybe new speakers. - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 16 Old 08-15-2012, 03:14 PM - Thread Starter
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So I'm debating between a denon 2312ci and onkyo nr709 reciever. But while I'm debatin that, I'm looking at speaker setups. Don't want to spend more then $500. I'm thinking energy 5.0 take home classic and I see that the Polk psw505 is on sale ATM today at newegg. Is that a good sub to go with my setup. With what I'm paying for the energy speakers that leaves me with about $250 for a sub. Any other recommendations on either the sub chose or even the speaker choice. I'm new to all this so any help is appreciated.

Also if u have any insight to my receiver battle please feel free. I'm leaning towards the onkyo. On paper it seems like the better one, but I hear onkyo has some reliability concerns.

The room it's going in is a long rectangle, So its probably about 14ft from the wall the TV is on to the Wall the sofa is on. and Its probably about 24ft long. The wall the TV is on is sorta a floating Wall, with openings on both side. so that wall is only about 10ft long. The setup is sorta more left side of the room, and I don't need to fill up the whole room just my viewing area which is probably 14ft from tv to sofa and about 16ft total wide

Theater Room: 65ZT60, Denon 2313CI, Oppo 103D, Apple TV, Logitech Harmony Ultimate
Bedroom: 65VT50, Sony S790, Harmony Smart Control
Game Room: Upcoming Purchases - 4K TV (Sony 65X950B or Reference Series Vizio, Sony FMP-X10) Already Have - OPPO 103D, Harmony Ultimate, Apple TV, 24 gaming systems ready to be hooked up.
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post #2 of 16 Old 08-15-2012, 03:30 PM
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I've had the Onkyo for over a year now, and it's problem-free. Love this receiver - the wireless firmware updates are terrific. I've had Onkyo recievers for probably 20 years. I'm a fan.
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post #3 of 16 Old 08-15-2012, 03:42 PM - Thread Starter
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That's good to hear! Ya im pretty sure I'm going to get it.

What do you guys think of the energy take classic 5.0 vs 2x pioneer SP-BS21-LR and a Pioneer SP-C21 for the center. And then for the sub either the psw505 vs the pioneer SW-8 for the sub

So setup 1=
energy take classic 5.0
PSW505


Setup 2=
pioneer SP-BS21-LR
Pioneer SP-C21
And either psw505 or pio SW8

Theater Room: 65ZT60, Denon 2313CI, Oppo 103D, Apple TV, Logitech Harmony Ultimate
Bedroom: 65VT50, Sony S790, Harmony Smart Control
Game Room: Upcoming Purchases - 4K TV (Sony 65X950B or Reference Series Vizio, Sony FMP-X10) Already Have - OPPO 103D, Harmony Ultimate, Apple TV, 24 gaming systems ready to be hooked up.
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post #4 of 16 Old 08-15-2012, 04:17 PM - Thread Starter
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Reading some more looks like the pioneers will be better if u have the room to fit them. And I do. Looks like they will fill the room better. So probably going to get the pioneers.

That just leaves the subwoofer left. Any helP would be appreciated. The sale on the Polk ends today. I know it's a 12" vs 8" sub but does that really matter?

Theater Room: 65ZT60, Denon 2313CI, Oppo 103D, Apple TV, Logitech Harmony Ultimate
Bedroom: 65VT50, Sony S790, Harmony Smart Control
Game Room: Upcoming Purchases - 4K TV (Sony 65X950B or Reference Series Vizio, Sony FMP-X10) Already Have - OPPO 103D, Harmony Ultimate, Apple TV, 24 gaming systems ready to be hooked up.
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post #5 of 16 Old 08-15-2012, 04:17 PM
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One advantage of the 709 is that has full preouts in case you ever want to add an external power amplifier. Many others in that price range do not.

The PSW505 is hard to beat for $250.

You probably need a 12" subwoofer with at least 250 watts RMS. Smaller subs are pretty worthless for the average room. Size matters a lot.

The Klipsch RW12D was available for about that price for while, and it is better, but I haven't seen it for under $400 lately.

Those Take speakers have front speakers that are way way too small; the Pioneers would be a much better choice IMO.
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post #6 of 16 Old 08-15-2012, 05:00 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the input commsysman. Ya think the pioneers will fill the room Better. Going to do my order tonight. Anyone reccomend any good sites with good prices for new products? So far I have used onecall, newegg, amazon, EE, JR, crutchfield. I also use google product shopper. Just trying to find the best deal.


Looks like my setup is going to be
Onkyo nr709
Pioneer SP-BS21-LR x2 pairs
Pioneer SP-C21
And Polk PSW505

Wish I could find that RW12D at that sale price but have had no luck. I will keep an eye out

Also what do u guys reccomend for wires? Monoprice or somewhere else?

Theater Room: 65ZT60, Denon 2313CI, Oppo 103D, Apple TV, Logitech Harmony Ultimate
Bedroom: 65VT50, Sony S790, Harmony Smart Control
Game Room: Upcoming Purchases - 4K TV (Sony 65X950B or Reference Series Vizio, Sony FMP-X10) Already Have - OPPO 103D, Harmony Ultimate, Apple TV, 24 gaming systems ready to be hooked up.
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post #7 of 16 Old 08-15-2012, 05:44 PM
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fwiw, imo look at the denon avr 1912 $299 at accessories4less ( this has all the bells and whistles you'll need)and put the extra money towards your speakers ,and with that kind of budget and size room i would start out with a 2.0 or 2.1 system and slowly add the other pieces in, this will give you a better sounding system especially in that open area. theres o.k sound then theres great sound

i'm so laid back,i'm laid out
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post #8 of 16 Old 08-15-2012, 09:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calilife17 View Post

Thanks for the input commsysman. Ya think the pioneers will fill the room Better. Going to do my order tonight. Anyone reccomend any good sites with good prices for new products? So far I have used onecall, newegg, amazon, EE, JR, crutchfield. I also use google product shopper. Just trying to find the best deal.
Looks like my setup is going to be
Onkyo nr709
Pioneer SP-BS21-LR x2 pairs
Pioneer SP-C21
And Polk PSW505
Wish I could find that RW12D at that sale price but have had no luck. I will keep an eye out
Also what do u guys reccomend for wires? Monoprice or somewhere else?

Don't get the BS21s - get the new BS22s! They are available at BB, now, on sale. I am listening to them right now and they sound amazing.

Monoprice for cables/wires.
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post #9 of 16 Old 08-15-2012, 09:21 PM - Thread Starter
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Whats the diference between the 2? worth the extra cost?

Theater Room: 65ZT60, Denon 2313CI, Oppo 103D, Apple TV, Logitech Harmony Ultimate
Bedroom: 65VT50, Sony S790, Harmony Smart Control
Game Room: Upcoming Purchases - 4K TV (Sony 65X950B or Reference Series Vizio, Sony FMP-X10) Already Have - OPPO 103D, Harmony Ultimate, Apple TV, 24 gaming systems ready to be hooked up.
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post #10 of 16 Old 08-15-2012, 10:04 PM - Thread Starter
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Well i was able to Pick up the FS52s, for cheaper then the BS21s, Was able to get the CS22 for cheaper then the CS21, and Was able to get the BS22 for the same price for the BS21s. So i was able to save money to upgrade to the 2012 line up. So thanks for leading me on to the 22 Line.

Theater Room: 65ZT60, Denon 2313CI, Oppo 103D, Apple TV, Logitech Harmony Ultimate
Bedroom: 65VT50, Sony S790, Harmony Smart Control
Game Room: Upcoming Purchases - 4K TV (Sony 65X950B or Reference Series Vizio, Sony FMP-X10) Already Have - OPPO 103D, Harmony Ultimate, Apple TV, 24 gaming systems ready to be hooked up.
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post #11 of 16 Old 08-15-2012, 10:06 PM - Thread Starter
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Interesting on the CS22 it looks like they dropped the Woofer size from 5.25" to 4". I wonder why they would of dropped the size. Anyone know why? wouldnt a bigger one be better, especially if it fits in the same size area. Is it possible for the 4" to sound better then the 5.25"?

Theater Room: 65ZT60, Denon 2313CI, Oppo 103D, Apple TV, Logitech Harmony Ultimate
Bedroom: 65VT50, Sony S790, Harmony Smart Control
Game Room: Upcoming Purchases - 4K TV (Sony 65X950B or Reference Series Vizio, Sony FMP-X10) Already Have - OPPO 103D, Harmony Ultimate, Apple TV, 24 gaming systems ready to be hooked up.
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post #12 of 16 Old 08-16-2012, 05:17 AM
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I think that a lot of companies are going to 4" drivers in center speakers because they sound better in the upper midrange; better clarity for speech etc. There is no CS22; you must mean BS22.

Actually, if you look at the owner's manual for the BS21, it says that the main driver is a 4" driver. That is pretty small for a front speaker. I also thought they were larger, so perhaps there was a production change somewhere? I'm not sure.

They also specify the sensitivity as on 84 DB per watt, which is very very low. That is poor. Perhaps that is not what you want to get after all.

A pair of Polk Monitor 40 speakers with a Polk CS10 center should be much better. You should be able to get those for about $250 total. Monitor 30 for rear.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Calilife17 View Post

Interesting on the CS22 it looks like they dropped the Woofer size from 5.25" to 4". I wonder why they would of dropped the size. Anyone know why? wouldnt a bigger one be better, especially if it fits in the same size area. Is it possible for the 4" to sound better then the 5.25"?
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post #13 of 16 Old 08-16-2012, 07:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calilife17 View Post

Interesting on the CS22 it looks like they dropped the Woofer size from 5.25" to 4". I wonder why they would of dropped the size. Anyone know why? wouldnt a bigger one be better, especially if it fits in the same size area. Is it possible for the 4" to sound better then the 5.25"?

Many people complained about the size of the old center - so Pioneer changed it.

There is nothing in the Polk Monitor series, that I would choose over the Pioneer Phase 2 speakers.
This series sounds better than the Phase 1 speakers - with better bass control, midrange and treble.
The new center has been voiced to timbre match the Phase 2 speakers, and will balance the system
out. The imaging and soundstage of the Phase 2 speakers is better. This new center is rated as 88db
sensitive - and is rated for 90 watts. The old center could handle more power - however I would not
mix it, with the Phase 2 speakers. Try it out and see if you like it. Good Luck!

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post #14 of 16 Old 08-16-2012, 08:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calilife17 View Post

Well i was able to Pick up the FS52s, for cheaper then the BS21s, Was able to get the CS22 for cheaper then the CS21, and Was able to get the BS22 for the same price for the BS21s. So i was able to save money to upgrade to the 2012 line up. So thanks for leading me on to the 22 Line.

Where did you get the FS52's for cheaper than the BS21's? And the same question for the CS22's and BS22's.

So the FS52's for fronts combined with 2 BS22's and 1 center speaker would be a more desirable setup than having 4 BS21's ( OR 22'S) and a center speaker? Sorry if this sounds dumb, I am new to home audio, switching over from the pre boxed 5.1 systems to these. (i.e. I'm used to all the speakers being the same size etc...) Would simply 4 of the BS22's fill an 18x12.5 room ok?

Thanks in advance!
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post #15 of 16 Old 08-16-2012, 11:36 AM - Thread Starter
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@commsysman the CS22 is the new center speaker of their line.

[=http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Home/Speakers/Home+Theater+Speakers][/]

4th one down from the top

@zieg thanks for the info. I was wondering why they changed it.

@Neal I don't know if I'm allowed to say where I got them from.

Now just to decided on reciever.

Theater Room: 65ZT60, Denon 2313CI, Oppo 103D, Apple TV, Logitech Harmony Ultimate
Bedroom: 65VT50, Sony S790, Harmony Smart Control
Game Room: Upcoming Purchases - 4K TV (Sony 65X950B or Reference Series Vizio, Sony FMP-X10) Already Have - OPPO 103D, Harmony Ultimate, Apple TV, 24 gaming systems ready to be hooked up.
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post #16 of 16 Old 08-16-2012, 04:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NealAtTheWheel View Post

Where did you get the FS52's for cheaper than the BS21's? And the same question for the CS22's and BS22's.
So the FS52's for fronts combined with 2 BS22's and 1 center speaker would be a more desirable setup than having 4 BS21's ( OR 22'S) and a center speaker? Sorry if this sounds dumb, I am new to home audio, switching over from the pre boxed 5.1 systems to these. (i.e. I'm used to all the speakers being the same size etc...) Would simply 4 of the BS22's fill an 18x12.5 room ok?
Thanks in advance!

I think he meant that he got the BS22's cheaper than the BS21's. They are on sale at BB now for $89/pr.
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