Episode 900, CHT Sho-10's ant JTR tripple 8's - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 37 Old 08-24-2012, 07:43 AM - Thread Starter
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Looks like i'm finally about to start on my build! I had pretty much narrowed down the speaker choice to the Sho/Pro-10's and the JTR's. Yesterday, the contractor suggested Episode-900's instead. I have never heard of them but I'm open to the suggestion. This will be for 95% movies/sports/tv. I will try to audition them, but I'm just looking for some opinions from the people around here. Thanks!

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post #2 of 37 Old 08-24-2012, 08:00 AM
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I have heard good things about Episode speakers, but they are not as sensitive as the horn loaded CHT and JTR speakers. What price are you getting quoted on the Episode speakers? Can you audition them? Personally, I like the sound of Planar Ribbon tweeters, but if you are looking to hit reference levels the other speakers will be easier to drive.
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post #3 of 37 Old 08-24-2012, 08:23 AM - Thread Starter
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I'm trying to find a place to audition them now. They are more money than the Sho-10's.

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post #4 of 37 Old 08-24-2012, 08:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hogues View Post

I'm trying to find a place to audition them now. They are more money than the Sho-10's.

I would see if the contractor could let you demo a pair before you buy. Seems like you have a good selection here.

It might help if you share the size of your room, how far away you will be sitting, and what will be driving these speakers (amp).
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post #5 of 37 Old 08-24-2012, 09:24 AM - Thread Starter
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I should have included that in the beginning, sorry. The room is 11 ft wide footer the first 8 ft, them opens up to 14 ft. it's about 28 ft long and 7 ft high. I had planned to drive the front speakers with the 3 channel emotiva and the rears with my denon 4311. I plan to sit between 10-13 ft away. Thanks for the help, Ack_bk.

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post #6 of 37 Old 08-24-2012, 10:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hogues View Post

I should have included that in the beginning, sorry. The room is 11 ft wide footer the first 8 ft, them opens up to 14 ft. it's about 28 ft long and 7 ft high. I had planned to drive the front speakers with the 3 channel emotiva and the rears with my denon 4311. I plan to sit between 10-13 ft away. Thanks for the help, Ack_bk.

You should have no problem driving any of those speakers with the above. Even the Episode speakers should be able to play peak reference with the gear that you have. That said, the JTR and SHO-10 speakers have a much bigger following around here and you will find more user feedback and reviews. Episode are sold to custom installers mainly, so you will not get as much feedback.

I have heard the JTR speakers (but not Episode or Sho-10) and they would be at the top of my list for sure for home theater smile.gif
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post #7 of 37 Old 08-24-2012, 10:08 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ack_bk View Post

You should have no problem driving any of those speakers with the above. Even the Episode speakers should be able to play peak reference with the gear that you have. That said, the JTR and SHO-10 speakers have a much bigger following around here and you will find more user feedback and reviews. Episode are sold to custom installers mainly, so you will not get as much feedback.
I have heard the JTR speakers (but not Episode or Sho-10) and they would be at the top of my list for sure for home theater smile.gif

Yeah, I was able to get up to Wisconsin and hear the JTR's. They are phenomenal, but cost is an issue. I was thinking about getting the Sho's and upgrading in the future. The one thing that I worry about is the inability to upgrade with in-walls.

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post #8 of 37 Old 08-24-2012, 10:13 AM
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Originally Posted by hogues View Post

Yeah, I was able to get up to Wisconsin and hear the JTR's. They are phenomenal, but cost is an issue. I was thinking about getting the Sho's and upgrading in the future. The one thing that I worry about is the inability to upgrade with in-walls.

Episode makes in-room and in-wall 900 series. http://www.episodespeakers.com/product/65/Episode-900-Series-Home-Theater-LCR-Speaker-with-Dual-6.5-in.-Woofers
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post #9 of 37 Old 08-24-2012, 03:32 PM - Thread Starter
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Those would be the in-walls that I look at. Frankly, in-walls would be perfect space wise for an 11.2 setup. Maybe the 900's for lcr wide front, wide height and the in ceiling 700's for the four rear speakers. Hmm...

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post #10 of 37 Old 08-25-2012, 07:20 AM - Thread Starter
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Well, after looking at my space again, I think that I'm back to the sho-10 or JTR's for the front. I have been worried about the rear speakers since I started planning this project. I'm now thinking of going with the Episode in-ceiling bi/di speakers for the 4 rears. Any thoughts? Thanks.

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post #11 of 37 Old 08-25-2012, 08:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hogues View Post

Well, after looking at my space again, I think that I'm back to the sho-10 or JTR's for the front. I have been worried about the rear speakers since I started planning this project. I'm now thinking of going with the Episode in-ceiling bi/di speakers for the 4 rears. Any thoughts? Thanks.

I use these for my surrounds and they work great:
http://www.definitivetech.com/Products/products.aspx?path=In-wall/In-Ceiling_Speakers&productid=UIW_RSS_III

I think the Episode surrounds would be fine. Focus the majority of your budget on your front three speakers and subwoofer since this is where 90%+ of the audio will come from.
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post #12 of 37 Old 08-25-2012, 08:24 AM - Thread Starter
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I got an error from that link. LCR are my main concern and what I will spend the most on (excluding subs). I have just never dealt with in cieling speakers and I'm concerned that the sound would be coming "down" at me instead of surrounding me. I don't have much experience with bi/di pole speakers, but from what I've read, that should help with the problem, no? Thanks again for the help.

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post #13 of 37 Old 08-25-2012, 09:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hogues View Post

I got an error from that link. LCR are my main concern and what I will spend the most on (excluding subs). I have just never dealt with in cieling speakers and I'm concerned that the sound would be coming "down" at me instead of surrounding me. I don't have much experience with bi/di pole speakers, but from what I've read, that should help with the problem, no? Thanks again for the help.

For your main left, right, and center channel speakers, in ceiling speakers should be avoided but for surrounds it is less as important and if you find a speaker with an angled woofer/tweeter the sound does not fire straight down as much. Not sure why my link did not work but here is another pic of the bipolar surrounds I am using:
http://www.amazon.com/Definitive-Technology-In-Wall-Referance-Surround/dp/B001A6GAHK
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post #14 of 37 Old 08-25-2012, 09:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ack_bk View Post

For your main left, right, and center channel speakers, in ceiling speakers should be avoided but for surrounds it is less as important and if you find a speaker with an angled woofer/tweeter the sound does not fire straight down as much. Not sure why my link did not work but here is another pic of the bipolar surrounds I am using:
http://www.amazon.com/Definitive-Technology-In-Wall-Referance-Surround/dp/B001A6GAHK

When possible, I also recommend using inwall and inceiling speakers that have engineered enclosures such as the one above. It lends to less inwall speaker loss and sound does not bleed through into adjoining rooms.
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post #15 of 37 Old 08-25-2012, 10:43 AM - Thread Starter
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I was considering these speakers for the four in-ceiling surrounds:

http://www.episodespeakers.com/product/67/Episode-700-Series-In-Ceiling-Surround-Speakers-with-6.5-in-Woofers

Just out of curiosity, my understanding is that the side surrounds would be set to dipole while the rear would be bipole. Is that correct? Thanks.

Edit: I think that I'm wrong, looks like I should go one way or the other.

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post #16 of 37 Old 08-25-2012, 11:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hogues View Post

I was considering these speakers for the four in-ceiling surrounds:
http://www.episodespeakers.com/product/67/Episode-700-Series-In-Ceiling-Surround-Speakers-with-6.5-in-Woofers
Just out of curiosity, my understanding is that the side surrounds would be set to dipole while the rear would be bipole. Is that correct? Thanks.

Dipole vs bipole is a tough one and it really depends on the room and preference. The nice thing about the speakers you linked to is you can try both bipole and dipole settings and settle on the one you prefer. I do agree that I would not use dipole on a rear wall. I would try bipole, and monopole may actually be best for the rears. For sides you may prefer dipole, but there is no best answer here IMHO and it is a preference thing for the side surrounds. Some prefer dipole, some prefer bipole.
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post #17 of 37 Old 08-25-2012, 11:27 AM
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I have in ceiling rears and I don't recommend it unless you have to use them due to the space or WAF. They work, don't get me wrong, but envelopment is not as good as it could be.

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JTR Noesis 212HT x 3 (LCR) powered by Lab Gruppen 10000Q amp
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post #18 of 37 Old 08-25-2012, 07:44 PM
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If you got the $$ and space the JTR 888's are hard to beat. Then use the JTR Slanted 8 for surrounds.

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post #19 of 37 Old 08-25-2012, 10:38 PM - Thread Starter
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If you got the $$ and space the JTR 888's are hard to beat. Then use the JTR Slanted 8 for surrounds.

I couldn't agree more. Jeff was kind enough to demo them for me up in Wisconsin. I will own them at some point, it's just a question of when. As to the single 8's, I don't think that that will ever work space wise in my basement unfortunately.

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post #20 of 37 Old 08-26-2012, 06:31 AM
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While the JTR's are fantastic speakers, according to a lot of the guys that have heard both, the SHO-10's are 98% of the T8's for a whole lot less cash. They are awfully cool looking though. The SHO's are pretty boring to look at in comparison.

Dumb enough to spend lots of cash on this junk!
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post #21 of 37 Old 08-26-2012, 07:13 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyng_fool View Post

While the JTR's are fantastic speakers, according to a lot of the guys that have heard both, the SHO-10's are 98% of the T8's for a whole lot less cash. They are awfully cool looking though. The SHO's are pretty boring to look at in comparison.

I think that's what I'll end up with, but I'm still looking at the Episodes and thinking about these Episode in walls if they can fit:

http://www.snapav.com/p-430-es-ht950-iw-7.aspx

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post #22 of 37 Old 08-26-2012, 02:04 PM
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You're going to need a lot of power to make those things sing. They are only 87 dB on the sensitivity. I think the SHO-10's are 97 dB sensitive. So for the 10 dB difference you will need a little over triple the power for the same output.

Oops, my math was bad. every 3dB more in output you need double the power so it is actually a logarithmic scale. If you are using 10 watts, then you need 20 for 3 more dB, then 40 for 3 dB more, then 80 for the next 3 dB and so on and so on.....

You get the picture.

Also the Episode 900's have ribbon tweeters which are great for music but they lack the dynamics required for movies. There are a couple of manufacturers out there with ribbon tweets that can handle movies but I can't recall who right now.

Dumb enough to spend lots of cash on this junk!
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post #23 of 37 Old 08-27-2012, 12:10 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the advice, FF. I think that I'm going to try to listen to them, but I'm pretty convinced that I'm going the sho-10 rout. Your point about the DB's is well taken, though I do have the xpa-3 to drive whatever i get. It is just so tempting to save the space with in-walls. But, in reality, the in-walls with the proper amp is more expensive that the JTR quint-8's. I just always worry about making the right decision until it's done. Then I want to upgrade, lol.

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post #24 of 37 Old 08-27-2012, 01:24 PM
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Don't we all!biggrin.gif

Dumb enough to spend lots of cash on this junk!
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post #25 of 37 Old 08-27-2012, 01:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hogues View Post

Thanks for the advice, FF. I think that I'm going to try to listen to them, but I'm pretty convinced that I'm going the sho-10 rout. Your point about the DB's is well taken, though I do have the xpa-3 to drive whatever i get. It is just so tempting to save the space with in-walls. But, in reality, the in-walls with the proper amp is more expensive that the JTR quint-8's. I just always worry about making the right decision until it's done. Then I want to upgrade, lol.

What size space do you have for in-wall speakers? There are other in-wall speakers out there that are more sensitive that are better for your situation that should be in your price range.

Aside from that, I think you cannot go wrong with the SHO-10's for home theater.

Can I ask, are you going with a projector or an HDTV for viewing?
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post #26 of 37 Old 08-27-2012, 01:45 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by ack_bk View Post

What size space do you have for in-wall speakers? There are other in-wall speakers out there that are more sensitive that are better for your situation that should be in your price range.
Aside from that, I think you cannot go wrong with the SHO-10's for home theater.
Can I ask, are you going with a projector or an HDTV for viewing?

Haven't started the build yet, but I could make allowances space wise for in-wall if I wanted to. I think that I'm pretty much set on the Sho-10 package. I think that I'm going with the 65 in Panasonic VT50 for a display.

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post #27 of 37 Old 09-15-2012, 06:04 PM
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I have inwall 950s and they are great speakers. I use them mostly for home theater in a media room and drive them with a Denon 4308. The clarity and output are great. They are built like a tank. If you have and problems with they are great to deal with also.
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post #28 of 37 Old 09-17-2012, 05:06 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks, Rev. My project has been pushed back (again), so I have yet to make a decision. I do see, however, that CHT is about to start work on Sho-10 towers. I can't wait to see the results.

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post #29 of 37 Old 09-18-2012, 03:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hogues View Post

Thanks, Rev. My project has been pushed back (again), so I have yet to make a decision. I do see, however, that CHT is about to start work on Sho-10 towers. I can't wait to see the results.
where did you see this? can u send the link.. Pls
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post #30 of 37 Old 09-18-2012, 03:48 PM - Thread Starter
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where did you see this? can u send the link.. Pls

Absoutly. It's on the CHT forum:

https://www.chasehometheater.com/forum/showpost.php?p=88001&postcount=63

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