Post pics of your 7.1 room - was it worth it compared to 5.1? - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 124 Old 09-08-2012, 03:31 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
carp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 5,254
Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 370 Post(s)
Liked: 497
EDIT - 9/12

I figured out how to change the title of the thread (duh), it's now more fitting with what I was going for.

I'm curious to know what kind of an improvement others have experienced in their rooms when going from 5.1 to 7.1, also include if you use front wides and/or front heights.

When I was researching myself to see if going from 5.1 to 7.1 was worth it I looked at a lot of threads and read a lot of opinions but it would have been nice to actually see the room that each person was referring to, that I could get a better idea of how it would work in my own room.



Man, I should have done this years ago (hmmm, I said the exact same thing when I went to higher end subwoofers and when I went to front projection...) smile.gif

I know I'm WAY late to the party, but I finally went to 7.1 surround. I hope I'm not beating a dead horse starting a thread like this, but before I bought 2 new speakers for 7.1 I did search through all the old threads I could find comparing 5.1 to 7.1 and I appreciated every single one of them - so maybe someone else who is considering the move can read this and get some more impressions and ideas for their own room.

I really like how much more enveloping the sound is both for music and movies. Music is my priority, and I do like to listen in surround modes. Recently (when I still had 5.1) I had been using a lot of neo 6 but now that I have 7.1 I prefer Pro Logic IIx Music mode with the center width at 4 and the other presets on their default. It is so enveloping (not sure that's the word I'm looking for...) with music now. I love when background vocals come on and I really do feel surrounded by the music. At the same time though, the main vocals don't stray from the front soundstage, so it's really addicting to listen to - at least for me.

For movies it's great too, and a movie doesn't have to be in 7.1 to enjoy the improvement. I have to admit, a large part of the improvement is simply getting the surrounds closer to the side of me instead of way behind like they were when I was 5.1. Still, having the 2 rear surround speakers makes an obvious improvement too since I can toggle back and forth between having the rear surrounds on and off. When I turn them off there is suddenly a big empty void behind me. Another member (Holt7513) mentioned a similar impression, turning off the rears made it seem like there was a huge hole in the back of the room - that's a good description.

Now, I'm sure you have to have a room that will work to be able to notice a big improvement so I'm not saying 7.1 is for everyone but luckily it works in here.

I posted a bunch of pictures in my room configuration thread, getting the speaker wire through the wall proved to be tricky but thank god it's all done and nice and neat.

Click the link to see the pics: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1407184/carps-basement-hide-out/120#post_22384733


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

 

carp is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 124 Old 09-08-2012, 03:38 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
carp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 5,254
Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 370 Post(s)
Liked: 497
Also, I think it would be cool for people who have gone from 5.1 to 7.1 to post pictures of their room along with their impressions of how big, or small, they thought the improvement was.

Come to think of it, I should have called this thread, "The tell us if you think going 7.1 is worth it/pics of your room included thread" or something like that... confused.gifsmile.gif

oh well

The reason I think this is a good idea is that a few years ago I set up some speakers in this room for 7.1 to see what I thought and I wasn't impressed at all. I couldn't even really tell a difference. Looking back the problem was obvious. I had the side surrounds quite a ways behind the listening position and the rear surrounds were on along the back wall, just 6 feet or so in between them.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

 

carp is online now  
post #3 of 124 Old 09-08-2012, 04:02 PM
Member
 
subyguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 158
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 22
I ran 7.1 for a couple years and then when I got a dsx enabled receiver I moved the rears to front wides and never went back. The 7.1 was a nice gain in overall effect but I found the improvement with the front wides to be greater. You end up with a super wide and enveloping front soundstage that just forms a wall of sounds. Switching them off just makes the experience much less impressive while I didn't really notice the loss of the rears that much. At that time I was running dipole sides and direct radiating rears. I have now gone back to direct radiating sides and prefer them over the dipoles for modern movies and definitely for concerts.

Of course now that I'm running a 4311 with external amps I could go 11.2 with heights and rears...hmmm. Some day but I'm still trying to recover from the cost of 7 new JTR's let alone 4 more. Actually heights would be useless to me now with the triple 12's up on 20" stands the top of the speaker is 5' up in a 7' room which doesn't really leave room for heights. I could throw my old paradigm studio 20's up as rears to try it out I suppose but they are so different from the JTR's that it may not work well.

I'll post some pics of my setup later.

(3) JTR Noesis 212HT (LCR)
(2) JTR Single 8 (wides)
(2) JTR Slanted 8 (sides)
(2) DIY Eminence 10" coax (rear Surrounds)
(2) JTR Orbit Shifters
(2) Mach5 UXL-18's sealed
(2) Soundsplinter 15's sealed
Speakers powered by 6 crown xls 1500's
UXL's powered by Peavey IPR-7500

My theater:

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
subyguy is offline  
post #4 of 124 Old 09-08-2012, 04:04 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
carp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 5,254
Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 370 Post(s)
Liked: 497
BTW, my wife and I have been watching The Walking Dead season 2 the last few weekends from netflix, and it's in 7.1. Great, great show. My all time favorite will always be The Wire but this show truly is one of a kind. I never saw it on tv, it's hard to believe this is a tv show and not just a really long incredible movie. Warning though, if you don't like extremely graphic gore you will not like it!! smile.gif


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

 

carp is online now  
post #5 of 124 Old 09-08-2012, 04:09 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
carp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 5,254
Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 370 Post(s)
Liked: 497
Quote:
Originally Posted by subyguy View Post

I ran 7.1 for a couple years and then when I got a dsx enabled receiver I moved the rears to front wides and never went back. The 7.1 was a nice gain in overall effect but I found the improvement with the front wides to be greater. You end up with a super wide and enveloping front soundstage that just forms a wall of sounds. Switching them off just makes the experience much less impressive while I didn't really notice the loss of the rears that much. At that time I was running dipole sides and direct radiating rears. I have now gone back to direct radiating sides and prefer them over the dipoles for modern movies and definitely for concerts.
Of course now that I'm running a 4311 with external amps I could go 11.2 with heights and rears...hmmm. Some day but I'm still trying to recover from the cost of 7 new JTR's let alone 4 more. Actually heights would be useless to me now with the triple 12's up on 20" stands the top of the speaker is 5' up in a 7' room which doesn't really leave room for heights. I could throw my old paradigm studio 20's up as rears to try it out I suppose but they are so different from the JTR's that it may not work well.
I'll post some pics of my setup later.

7 JTR speakers, NICE - and triple 12's to boot, wow. I assume you only have 3 triple 12"s, what are your surround speakers?

I had read a lot of posts during my search that said they liked heights or wides better than surround rears, but in my room I'm similar to you. My mains are already up pretty high, but they are also very wide so I think it would be wasted on me.

Looking forward to seeing your JTR setup!!


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

 

carp is online now  
post #6 of 124 Old 09-09-2012, 05:48 PM
Member
 
subyguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 158
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 22
I'm still very much in construction/cleanup mode so excuse the mess. Still need to hang the last sound panels but wanted to wait until I had finalized the location of the orbit shifter. Also have a few wires left to hide on the wides and surrounds but it's close. Super happy with the JTR's coming from paradigm studio 100's. I thought the studios were good for music but I just moved them upstairs and hooked them up and they sound like there underwater now that I'm used to the clarity of the triple12's.

Screen is 126" 16X9 Carada. LCR each have their own bridged xls1500, another xls 1500 in stereo powers the wides and the rears are running off the Denon 4311. I have a behringer ep2500 powering the diy dual opposed 15" sub and the Orbit shifter has it's own 4K amp. Jeff at JTR built the stands for the LCR with the centre being a custom horizontal with a 10 degree angle that works great. All three are filled with sand and very stable even with the 125lb speakers on them. The front wides a single 8's while the rears are slanted 8's.









(3) JTR Noesis 212HT (LCR)
(2) JTR Single 8 (wides)
(2) JTR Slanted 8 (sides)
(2) DIY Eminence 10" coax (rear Surrounds)
(2) JTR Orbit Shifters
(2) Mach5 UXL-18's sealed
(2) Soundsplinter 15's sealed
Speakers powered by 6 crown xls 1500's
UXL's powered by Peavey IPR-7500

My theater:

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
subyguy is offline  
post #7 of 124 Old 09-09-2012, 06:37 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Smigro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Pennsyltucky
Posts: 1,850
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 19 Post(s)
Liked: 99
Damn, that is a nice set up Subyguy. BTW, I agree with you about the front wides. Before basement flooded I ran 9.1 with front wides and heights and was really impressed with the sound.

Xbox GT / PSN ID - Smigro

my blu ray collection -
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


my modest theater -
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Smigro is online now  
post #8 of 124 Old 09-09-2012, 07:20 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
sdurani's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Monterey Park, CA
Posts: 19,495
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1109 Post(s)
Liked: 911
Quote:
Originally Posted by carp View Post

I know I'm WAY late to the party, but I finally went to 7.1 surround.
Kinda felt the same way in 1991 when I set up my first 7.1 system. At the time, consumer 7.1 processors had been out for 5 years and I considered myself late to the party since I was half a decade behind the latest tech. Little did I know that 7.1 wouldn't catch on, even with enthusiasts, for some time (excepting a few Fosgate, Lexicon and Meridian owners).

I also wasn't expecting discrete 5.1 to show up on laserdisc 4 years later, since I'd done a 7.1 set-up primarily for listening to stereo music in surround (yes, it's been 21 years since I've listened to 2-channel music using only 2 speakers). To that end, I agree with you: it really is addictive to listen to music that way and there's no way I'd ever go back to mapping each source channel to one and only one speaker. Everything gets scaled to my layout.

Took a look at your pic in the other thread: nice set-up! For a really good demo of what 7.1 can do, try the entire first chapter of 'Transformers 3: Dark of the Moon' with your eyes closed (no peeking). You'll hear some amazing phantom imaging between your speakers as well as excellent side vs rear separation in the surround field

Sanjay
sdurani is offline  
post #9 of 124 Old 09-10-2012, 06:17 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
carp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 5,254
Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 370 Post(s)
Liked: 497
Subyguy, great room!! Thanks for posting the pictures.

My reciever only does 9.1, either the surround rears and front heights or surround rears or front wides but not both at the same time. Like I said, if my main speakers weren't so wide (and high too for that matter) I would try it out. I bet having the wides makes music sound awesome in your room, do you use them for 2 channel music or just concert disks? I assume the front wides play when using 2 channel sources if you use PLIIx?

What are the dimensions of your room? Mine is 17'6 wide, I'm betting yours is about the same. If I had gone with a 16:9 screen I could have moved in my mains and then had room for front wide speakers. Looks like you have the first reflections taken care of for both the mains and the front wides, nice.

That DIY sub looks like a beast, kind of like a home made Submersive? How does it get along with the OS?

BTW, I love the center channel stand, wish I had something like it.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

 

carp is online now  
post #10 of 124 Old 09-10-2012, 06:20 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
carp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 5,254
Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 370 Post(s)
Liked: 497
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdurani View Post

Kinda felt the same way in 1991 when I set up my first 7.1 system. At the time, consumer 7.1 processors had been out for 5 years and I considered myself late to the party since I was half a decade behind the latest tech. Little did I know that 7.1 wouldn't catch on, even with enthusiasts, for some time (excepting a few Fosgate, Lexicon and Meridian owners).
I also wasn't expecting discrete 5.1 to show up on laserdisc 4 years later, since I'd done a 7.1 set-up primarily for listening to stereo music in surround (yes, it's been 21 years since I've listened to 2-channel music using only 2 speakers). To that end, I agree with you: it really is addictive to listen to music that way and there's no way I'd ever go back to mapping each source channel to one and only one speaker. Everything gets scaled to my layout.
Took a look at your pic in the other thread: nice set-up! For a really good demo of what 7.1 can do, try the entire first chapter of 'Transformers 3: Dark of the Moon' with your eyes closed (no peeking). You'll hear some amazing phantom imaging between your speakers as well as excellent side vs rear separation in the surround field

Thanks sdurani! Man, I thought I had been using surrounds systems for a long time but not compared to you. I didn't have a setup until around 97 when it was still just pro-logic, no 5.1 yet.

I'll have to check out T3, I didn't like the first one but it will be worth it just to experience the sound. I'm starting to mix up forum members, I can't remember if I've seen your room or not. Do you have a thread in the room configuration section?


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

 

carp is online now  
post #11 of 124 Old 09-10-2012, 06:32 AM
Senior Member
 
Invader3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 296
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 29 Post(s)
Liked: 17
Went to 7.1 in our living room a couple months ago when we added two pairs of Paradigm in-ceiling speakers. I really love the added depth of sound. Used to have a pair of ADP-390s on stands... The in-ceiling speakers work much better to provide a convincing movie experience.

Sent from my SCH-R530U using Tapatalk 2
Invader3 is offline  
post #12 of 124 Old 09-10-2012, 07:20 AM
Member
 
subyguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 158
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by carp View Post

Subyguy, great room!! Thanks for posting the pictures.
My reciever only does 9.1, either the surround rears and front heights or surround rears or front wides but not both at the same time. Like I said, if my main speakers weren't so wide (and high too for that matter) I would try it out. I bet having the wides makes music sound awesome in your room, do you use them for 2 channel music or just concert disks? I assume the front wides play when using 2 channel sources if you use PLIIx?
What are the dimensions of your room? Mine is 17'6 wide, I'm betting yours is about the same. If I had gone with a 16:9 screen I could have moved in my mains and then had room for front wide speakers. Looks like you have the first reflections taken care of for both the mains and the front wides, nice.
That DIY sub looks like a beast, kind of like a home made Submersive? How does it get along with the OS?
BTW, I love the center channel stand, wish I had something like it.

Yup, my room is 17'6" wide as wel and the main room is 40' or so long plus the open hallway to the gym at the other end and the stairway. I really need to put a door in to seal off the theater. I have 4' from the side walls to the screen so lots of room for the mains to be tucked in a bit. I don't typically run the wides for 2 channel but I use audsessy dsx for everything multichannel so they're on for everything else. I've tried going back to to other surround formats but I always end up back on DSx just for the huge soundstage it gives.

The diy is okay but it's running old soundsplinter drivers which are tough but not exceptional performance wise. It really needs something like twin uxl's and a whole lot more power. I thgink I could cut the holes big enough to cram 18's in there or maybe if anyone starts making a good reasonably priced 15" again I'll swap them out and put a second ep2500 on there for some real low end grunt. I'm actually amazed how well it works with the OS actually. Since I have a terrible null at 40-50Hz if I corner load the OS I had to put it to almost the midpoint of the wall which limited it's low end extension. As a result I high passed it at 20Hz or so and low passed the diy at 25ish to cover the bottom. I expected some huge phase issues with the sealed/horn combo but it works perfectly with 36db/oct BW filters. Any other filters and some weird things started happening. The omnimic/mini dsp combo is amazing for tweaking stuff like that on the fly and seeing the result. The diy doesn't have the power to keep up to the OS even just covering 5-25Hz but if I run it a bit lower it works pretty well right up past reference. At first I had it flat right to 5Hz but I started bottoming the DIY out and clipping the behiringer on 5 star bass scenes so I backed off the DIY and ditched the low end boost. I don't really want to deal with the clone amp issues or run a second cable around the room or else I would feed it more power and see what happens. It's a lot to ask for it to keep up with the OS. I think I have the gain on the OS at about 1/3rd to hit about 120dB at reference and it's still just idling. If I could corner load the OS I wouldn't even need the second sub.

(3) JTR Noesis 212HT (LCR)
(2) JTR Single 8 (wides)
(2) JTR Slanted 8 (sides)
(2) DIY Eminence 10" coax (rear Surrounds)
(2) JTR Orbit Shifters
(2) Mach5 UXL-18's sealed
(2) Soundsplinter 15's sealed
Speakers powered by 6 crown xls 1500's
UXL's powered by Peavey IPR-7500

My theater:

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
subyguy is offline  
post #13 of 124 Old 09-10-2012, 10:09 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
carp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 5,254
Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 370 Post(s)
Liked: 497
Quote:
Originally Posted by Invader3 View Post

Went to 7.1 in our living room a couple months ago when we added two pairs of Paradigm in-ceiling speakers. I really love the added depth of sound. Used to have a pair of ADP-390s on stands... The in-ceiling speakers work much better to provide a convincing movie experience.
Sent from my SCH-R530U using Tapatalk 2

My rear surrounds aren't in ceiling speakers, but I do think that having them up high like that (as you can see below) is better since they are on a direct line to my ears instead of firing into the back of the couch since the back of my couch is kind of high.

I agree that the surround effect is more convincing now with 7.1.

016-1.jpg


025-3.jpg


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

 

carp is online now  
post #14 of 124 Old 09-10-2012, 10:18 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
carp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 5,254
Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 370 Post(s)
Liked: 497
Quote:
Originally Posted by subyguy View Post

Yup, my room is 17'6" wide as wel and the main room is 40' or so long plus the open hallway to the gym at the other end and the stairway. I really need to put a door in to seal off the theater. I have 4' from the side walls to the screen so lots of room for the mains to be tucked in a bit. I don't typically run the wides for 2 channel but I use audsessy dsx for everything multichannel so they're on for everything else. I've tried going back to to other surround formats but I always end up back on DSx just for the huge soundstage it gives.
The diy is okay but it's running old soundsplinter drivers which are tough but not exceptional performance wise. It really needs something like twin uxl's and a whole lot more power. I thgink I could cut the holes big enough to cram 18's in there or maybe if anyone starts making a good reasonably priced 15" again I'll swap them out and put a second ep2500 on there for some real low end grunt. I'm actually amazed how well it works with the OS actually. Since I have a terrible null at 40-50Hz if I corner load the OS I had to put it to almost the midpoint of the wall which limited it's low end extension. As a result I high passed it at 20Hz or so and low passed the diy at 25ish to cover the bottom. I expected some huge phase issues with the sealed/horn combo but it works perfectly with 36db/oct BW filters. Any other filters and some weird things started happening. The omnimic/mini dsp combo is amazing for tweaking stuff like that on the fly and seeing the result. The diy doesn't have the power to keep up to the OS even just covering 5-25Hz but if I run it a bit lower it works pretty well right up past reference. At first I had it flat right to 5Hz but I started bottoming the DIY out and clipping the behiringer on 5 star bass scenes so I backed off the DIY and ditched the low end boost. I don't really want to deal with the clone amp issues or run a second cable around the room or else I would feed it more power and see what happens. It's a lot to ask for it to keep up with the OS. I think I have the gain on the OS at about 1/3rd to hit about 120dB at reference and it's still just idling. If I could corner load the OS I wouldn't even need the second sub.

I'm not familiar with DSx for surround. Is it similar to pro logic IIx?

That's great that you don't have phase issues with the 2 subs. Yeah, I've had the OS in my room before and it's output is ridiculous and the sound quality is top notch too.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

 

carp is online now  
post #15 of 124 Old 09-10-2012, 11:14 AM
Member
 
subyguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 158
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by carp View Post

I'm not familiar with DSx for surround. Is it similar to pro logic IIx?
That's great that you don't have phase issues with the 2 subs. Yeah, I've had the OS in my room before and it's output is ridiculous and the sound quality is top notch too.
Pretty much, it adds wides an/or heights to any multichannel source with some fancy matrixing or something. Sounds good anyway.

(3) JTR Noesis 212HT (LCR)
(2) JTR Single 8 (wides)
(2) JTR Slanted 8 (sides)
(2) DIY Eminence 10" coax (rear Surrounds)
(2) JTR Orbit Shifters
(2) Mach5 UXL-18's sealed
(2) Soundsplinter 15's sealed
Speakers powered by 6 crown xls 1500's
UXL's powered by Peavey IPR-7500

My theater:

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
subyguy is offline  
post #16 of 124 Old 09-10-2012, 02:05 PM
AVS Special Member
 
holt7153's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: City of Angels
Posts: 3,218
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9 Post(s)
Liked: 105
Quote:
Originally Posted by subyguy View Post

Screen is 126" 16X9 Carada.

Nice looking screen-my 118" Carada Criterion BW is supposed to arrive tomorrow. What's your viewing distance and wall height?

Carp-if it's cool with you I'll post some pics in this thread after my screen is hung.

******************
Somebody told me it was frightening how much topsoil we are losing each year, but I told that story around the campfire and nobody got scared.
holt7153 is offline  
post #17 of 124 Old 09-10-2012, 10:58 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
sdurani's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Monterey Park, CA
Posts: 19,495
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1109 Post(s)
Liked: 911
Quote:
Originally Posted by carp View Post

I didn't have a setup until around 97 when it was still just pro-logic, no 5.1 yet.
We consumers got discrete 5.1 soundtracks on laserdisc in '94, which is why I switched from my all-analogue Fosgate processor to a new Lexicon model that had digital inputs and AC-3 decoding (remember the old name for Dolby Digital?).
Quote:
Originally Posted by carp View Post

Do you have a thread in the room configuration section?
Nah, it's just my living room; nothing much to look at and certainly not worth creating a thread over. But, if you're ever in the Los Angeles area and want to hear it, shoot me a PM.

Sanjay
sdurani is offline  
post #18 of 124 Old 09-10-2012, 11:21 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
sdurani's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Monterey Park, CA
Posts: 19,495
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1109 Post(s)
Liked: 911
Quote:
Originally Posted by carp View Post

I'm not familiar with DSx for surround. Is it similar to pro logic IIx?
No, they operate very differently. Surround processing can be thought of as two categories: generated vs extracted.

Audyssey DSX, like Yamaha DSP modes, generates early reflections (that weren't in the original recording) based on concert hall acoustics. These new signals are fed to their height and wide speakers in order to simulate a larger listening space.

By comparison, Pro Logic IIx (like DTS Neo:X) extracts content from the recording itself, steering certain sounds to additional speakers. For example: if you apply PLIIx to a 2-channel signal, it will look for anything that is the same in both channels and steer those particular sounds to the centre speaker (where it would have phantom imaged anyway). When you apply PLIIx to a 5.1 signal, it will take the 2 surround channels and extract side and rear outputs.

BTW, you can use both together: PLIIx will scale a 2-channel or 5.1-channel source to 7 speakers, and then DSX will generate heights and wides to expand the soundstage.

Sanjay
sdurani is offline  
post #19 of 124 Old 09-11-2012, 10:09 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
carp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 5,254
Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 370 Post(s)
Liked: 497
Quote:
Originally Posted by holt7153 View Post

Nice looking screen-my 118" Carada Criterion BW is supposed to arrive tomorrow. What's your viewing distance and wall height?
Carp-if it's cool with you I'll post some pics in this thread after my screen is hung.

I'd love to see your setup and how you like your screen.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

 

carp is online now  
post #20 of 124 Old 09-11-2012, 10:11 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
carp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 5,254
Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 370 Post(s)
Liked: 497
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdurani View Post

We consumers got discrete 5.1 soundtracks on laserdisc in '94, which is why I switched from my all-analogue Fosgate processor to a new Lexicon model that had digital inputs and AC-3 decoding (remember the old name for Dolby Digital?). Nah, it's just my living room; nothing much to look at and certainly not worth creating a thread over. But, if you're ever in the Los Angeles area and want to hear it, shoot me a PM.

Ahh, that's right. I do remember when it was just known as AC-3, I forgot that was way back in the laserdisc days. I never had a LD player. I do still have a receiver that has a input for laser disk, I bought the receiver around 96 if I remember right.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

 

carp is online now  
post #21 of 124 Old 09-11-2012, 10:14 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
carp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 5,254
Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 370 Post(s)
Liked: 497
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdurani View Post

No, they operate very differently. Surround processing can be thought of as two categories: generated vs extracted.
Audyssey DSX, like Yamaha DSP modes, generates early reflections (that weren't in the original recording) based on concert hall acoustics. These new signals are fed to their height and wide speakers in order to simulate a larger listening space.
By comparison, Pro Logic IIx (like DTS Neo:X) extracts content from the recording itself, steering certain sounds to additional speakers. For example: if you apply PLIIx to a 2-channel signal, it will look for anything that is the same in both channels and steer those particular sounds to the centre speaker (where it would have phantom imaged anyway). When you apply PLIIx to a 5.1 signal, it will take the 2 surround channels and extract side and rear outputs.
BTW, you can use both together: PLIIx will scale a 2-channel or 5.1-channel source to 7 speakers, and then DSX will generate heights and wides to expand the soundstage.

Thanks for the explanation. I used to have a Yamaha receiver (rxv-3000 - it was a beast) that had the front channels on it. I tried it out and couldn't tell much difference (this was in a different room) so I stopped using the "front" speakers. I think the speakers only received something like 25 or 35 watts if I remember right. This would have been back in 2002 ish. Are the current height/wide channels similar to this or do they get more power/frequency range/etc.? thanks


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

 

carp is online now  
post #22 of 124 Old 09-11-2012, 10:58 AM
Member
 
espodo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: San Francisco, CA
Posts: 67
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by carp View Post

Also, I think it would be cool for people who have gone from 5.1 to 7.1 to post pictures of their room along with their impressions of how big, or small, they thought the improvement was.
Come to think of it, I should have called this thread, "The tell us if you think going 7.1 is worth it/pics of your room included thread" or something like that... confused.gifsmile.gif

 

This is a great idea! If we get enough photo submissions on this thread, AVS would love to make it into a featured article showcasing 7.1 upgrades. 

 

I'm sure there are plenty of folks debating whether to make the upgrade, and this would be a great way to lay out the pros and cons. 

 

So please, upload those 7.1 photos!

espodo is offline  
post #23 of 124 Old 09-11-2012, 11:46 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
sdurani's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Monterey Park, CA
Posts: 19,495
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1109 Post(s)
Liked: 911
Quote:
Originally Posted by carp View Post

Are the current height/wide channels similar to this or do they get more power/frequency range/etc.?
Modern processing yields full range channels, modern receivers send equal power to all channels.

Sanjay
sdurani is offline  
post #24 of 124 Old 09-11-2012, 12:43 PM
Member
 
subyguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 158
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 22
I'm sending 300 watts to each front wide speaker with an xls1500 in stereo. They certainly do play full range and are very noticeable improvement without drawing undue attention to themselves if you know what I mean. Mine are significantly closer to the LP than the mains but the receiver corrects with time delay.

(3) JTR Noesis 212HT (LCR)
(2) JTR Single 8 (wides)
(2) JTR Slanted 8 (sides)
(2) DIY Eminence 10" coax (rear Surrounds)
(2) JTR Orbit Shifters
(2) Mach5 UXL-18's sealed
(2) Soundsplinter 15's sealed
Speakers powered by 6 crown xls 1500's
UXL's powered by Peavey IPR-7500

My theater:

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
subyguy is offline  
post #25 of 124 Old 09-12-2012, 06:21 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
carp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 5,254
Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 370 Post(s)
Liked: 497
Quote:
Originally Posted by espodo View Post

This is a great idea! If we get enough photo submissions on this thread, AVS would love to make it into a featured article showcasing 7.1 upgrades. 

I'm sure there are plenty of folks debating whether to make the upgrade, and this would be a great way to lay out the pros and cons. 

So please, upload those 7.1 photos!

Thanks espodo, that's what I was going for - I changed the name of the thread hopefully that gets some more people to post pics.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdurani View Post

Modern processing yields full range channels, modern receivers send equal power to all channels.

Nice. Lack of power was probably why I didn't notice much with the old Yamaha receiver.
Quote:
Originally Posted by subyguy View Post

I'm sending 300 watts to each front wide speaker with an xls1500 in stereo. They certainly do play full range and are very noticeable improvement without drawing undue attention to themselves if you know what I mean. Mine are significantly closer to the LP than the mains but the receiver corrects with time delay.

You mention that your wides are a lot closer to you than your mains, I wonder what kind of results I would get if I put the wides on the side walls closer to my LP. Obviously I dont' have room to actually put them to the sides of my mains since my mains are so close to the wall. Hmmm, only one way to find out... smile.gif When I get time I might use a set of Axiom speakers to try it out.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

 

carp is online now  
post #26 of 124 Old 09-12-2012, 11:02 AM
Member
 
subyguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 158
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 22
Audessey just says 45º from main LP which in pretty much any room will move them down the side walls toward you. Audessey should have no problem accounting for this difference in distance. For me it was one of those deals where when I first fired them up I remember thinking, it's pretty cool but not really that different. I left them that way for a while then decided to shut them off and immediately both myself and my wife felt that the front soundstage sounded narrow and weak by comparison. Seemed to lack the power and openness that the wides provide and it was immediately apparent that something was missing. That is compared to the rear surrounds which were noticeable but even after running them for several years I didn't really miss them when I moved them to wides. Again this is all dependent on your system and room plus personal preference. I'm actually curious if the wides are as necessary now with the much bigger image thrown by the triple12's as compared to my old paradign studio 100's. If I had the ambition and money for 4 more single 8's I would go to 11.2 in a heartbeat.

(3) JTR Noesis 212HT (LCR)
(2) JTR Single 8 (wides)
(2) JTR Slanted 8 (sides)
(2) DIY Eminence 10" coax (rear Surrounds)
(2) JTR Orbit Shifters
(2) Mach5 UXL-18's sealed
(2) Soundsplinter 15's sealed
Speakers powered by 6 crown xls 1500's
UXL's powered by Peavey IPR-7500

My theater:

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
subyguy is offline  
post #27 of 124 Old 09-12-2012, 01:29 PM
Member
 
khoelle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 27
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 12


nothing to special still havent tried to hide the wires just upgraded to 7.1 2 weeks ago and the sound is so much more immersive than 5.1 was. still have to wrap my center speaker 'stand' in the black velvet.

Polk Monitor 60s Front
Polk CS10 Center
Fluance AVBP2 Side surrounds
Polk T15 Back Surruonds
Dayton Audio SUB-1200 12" 120w sub
Denon 890 AVR

tried to make it as cheap as possible and am super impressed with everything for how little i ended up spending. Really enjoy all aspects of my little theater.
khoelle is offline  
post #28 of 124 Old 09-12-2012, 02:30 PM
AVS Special Member
 
g_bartman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: cleveland, oh
Posts: 3,240
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 37 Post(s)
Liked: 60
carver2003.jpg


carver2001.jpg

DSCF1919.jpg

I'm glad to be 7.1. I was 9.1 for a short time but didn't hear any real difference with the height channels. Could be due to my fronts being 6'. Been into the audio/ht thing for over 30 years and think I'm finally satisfied with my system (for now;)biggrin.gif) I listen to some multi channel music and a lot of concert videos so having rears is a great addition. I have also cleaned up the wiring in the back since those photos were taken

g_bartman is offline  
post #29 of 124 Old 09-12-2012, 06:27 PM
Señor Member
 
RMK!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: 95608
Posts: 5,881
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 202 Post(s)
Liked: 313
I started with 5.1, moved to 6.1 then 7.1 and now have a 9.1 setup. Each move up speaker wise has provided better surround effects with the current 9 speakers providing the most enveloping sound. My room is just large enough (3600cf) to accommodate this config and if my room were much smaller I might go with 5.1.

I am mostly bluray and use DTS MA as my preferred surround format . I use Audyssey DSX, DTS NeoX and Dolby Height to matrix whatever the source format to all of the speakers. Movies and concerts sound fantastic.

The front (JTR Triple 12HT's, Orbit Shifter Subs)


Front with 127" AT screen up (JTR Slanted 8 height speakers)


Surrounds (JTR Triple 8's) and Surround Backs (JTR Slanted 8's)


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


"Well, la di fricken da."!
RMK! is offline  
post #30 of 124 Old 09-12-2012, 07:20 PM
AVS Special Member
 
jproy13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: East of West, Canada
Posts: 1,195
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Liked: 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdurani View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by carp View Post

I'm not familiar with DSx for surround. Is it similar to pro logic IIx?
No, they operate very differently. Surround processing can be thought of as two categories: generated vs extracted.

Audyssey DSX, like Yamaha DSP modes, generates early reflections (that weren't in the original recording) based on concert hall acoustics. These new signals are fed to their height and wide speakers in order to simulate a larger listening space.

By comparison, Pro Logic IIx (like DTS Neo:X) extracts content from the recording itself, steering certain sounds to additional speakers. For example: if you apply PLIIx to a 2-channel signal, it will look for anything that is the same in both channels and steer those particular sounds to the centre speaker (where it would have phantom imaged anyway). When you apply PLIIx to a 5.1 signal, it will take the 2 surround channels and extract side and rear outputs.

BTW, you can use both together: PLIIx will scale a 2-channel or 5.1-channel source to 7 speakers, and then DSX will generate heights and wides to expand the soundstage.

Thanks for that post, very informative.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
jproy13 is offline  
Reply Speakers

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off