Bose Acoustimass 10 with Pioneer VSX-1022-k Speaker Settings - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 130 Old 09-28-2012, 02:00 PM - Thread Starter
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Hello, I recently purchased the Bose Acoustimass 10 and a Pioneer VSX-1022-k receiver. This is my first time buying surround sound as well as a receiver. I'm not all that tech savy on the speaker settings thru the receiver and need help bad. Here's the issues Im having:

1. What is the Hz level I should set the rear speakers too?

2. Any suggestions on the cross-over?

3. I'm not sure on how the sub should be set thru the receiver. I have no idea about the LFE or bass relationship.

I would very much appreciate any suggestions. I'm trying to make the surround sound, sound as good as possible and feel like I'm not quite there yet. I just need to make a few adjustments hopefully. Thanks!
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post #2 of 130 Old 09-28-2012, 08:29 PM
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I wish you would have spoken to us prior to purchasing Bose.

http://www.intellexual.net/bose.html

Dumb enough to spend lots of cash on this junk!
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post #3 of 130 Old 09-29-2012, 07:32 AM - Thread Starter
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Well the good news is I could always return them up to the end of October. Like I said Im a novice at the audio game. Thanks for the link it make me feel like an idiot ha ha. Im not sure where to go from here? Is my receiver ok? What are some other surround sound systems that are top notch? Thanks again
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post #4 of 130 Old 09-29-2012, 08:10 AM
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Don't feel too badly, millions have been suckered by Bose. Your receiver is just fine. If you want a small unobtrusive system that is excellent you could look at the Paradigm Millenia One. I would get a different sub though. It's expensive and not that great of a performer.

Dumb enough to spend lots of cash on this junk!
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post #5 of 130 Old 09-29-2012, 08:26 AM
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The Martin Logan MLT-2 (rebadged Paradigm Cinema 70s) is a good setup currently on sale through today for $299 at Newegg.

But you can definitely far exceed the sound quality of the Bose A10 if you can use larger, full range speakers in your setup and spend the same amount. Larger drivers just do a better job of producing a more full range sound, and then the sub is not having to produce so much of the upper mid-bass. For example, 2 pairs of Energy RC-10s and an RC-LCR would blow away the Bose A10 in SQ, even without adding a sub to start. Then add a BIC F12 sub.

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post #6 of 130 Old 09-29-2012, 10:17 AM
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Bose AM-10 goes for $899. You could definitely get a better setup for the same or less money. I like the RC-10 & LCR recommendation myself since I have those speakers.

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post #7 of 130 Old 09-29-2012, 12:35 PM
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There are so many systems that will absolutely slaughter the Bose at that price point you could literally write them down on a piece of paper, stick it to the wall, throw a dart at it and purchase the system it landed on. Any of the suggestions so far are solid ones.

Here's a good list:

http://www.hometheater.com/compact-speaker-top-picks

This is one of my favorites:

http://hsuresearch.com/products/value2pkg.html

HSU has top notch subs!

Dumb enough to spend lots of cash on this junk!
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post #8 of 130 Old 09-29-2012, 06:28 PM
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Why the heck can't you people just answer a poster's question without going on an anti-Bose tirade? Good grief it gets old. mad.gif

To address the O.P.'s question: I believe the crossover to the cubes is in the Acoustimass module, so all speakers should be set to full range at the receiver. So you really don't need to worry about the crossover settings at the receiver. Just set all to large or full-range. As for the LFE, I think there is an LFE input on the Acoustimass module. If so, hook it there. Read your manual for the Bose Acoustimass 10. It's really pretty easy, even for first-timers.
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post #9 of 130 Old 09-29-2012, 06:47 PM
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Originally Posted by dat56 View Post

Why the heck can't you people just answer a poster's question without going on an anti-Bose tirade? Good grief it gets old. mad.gif

Huh? Yours is the first "tirade" in this thread. There's nothing wrong with suggesting there is much better value out there than any setup someone just bought. rolleyes.gif

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post #10 of 130 Old 09-29-2012, 07:16 PM
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Originally Posted by dat56 View Post

Why the heck can't you people just answer a poster's question without going on an anti-Bose tirade? Good grief it gets old. mad.gif
To address the O.P.'s question: I believe the crossover to the cubes is in the Acoustimass module, so all speakers should be set to full range at the receiver. So you really don't need to worry about the crossover settings at the receiver. Just set all to large or full-range. As for the LFE, I think there is an LFE input on the Acoustimass module. If so, hook it there. Read your manual for the Bose Acoustimass 10. It's really pretty easy, even for first-timers.
He did say that he wanted the surround sound to sound as good as possible didn't he? The only way to do that was get rid of the Bose!tongue.gif

Dumb enough to spend lots of cash on this junk!
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post #11 of 130 Old 09-29-2012, 08:00 PM
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Originally Posted by cel4145 View Post

Huh? Yours is the first "tirade" in this thread. There's nothing wrong with suggesting there is much better value out there than any setup someone just bought. rolleyes.gif

Look up the definition of "tirade". Apparently you don't know what it is.

The OP did not ask for a suggestion of alternative equipment. But that's all he got, in addition to the typical Bose slam-fest.
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post #12 of 130 Old 09-29-2012, 08:09 PM
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Originally Posted by dat56 View Post

Look up the definition of "tirade". Apparently you don't know what it is.
The OP did not ask for a suggestion of alternative equipment. But that's all he got, in addition to the typical Bose slam-fest.

You might want to look up the definition of tirade yourself because none of the reponses have been tirades. I see no anger or bitterness anywhere.

Tirade:

: a protracted speech usually marked by intemperate, vituperative, or harshly censorious language

a prolonged outburst of bitter, outspoken denunciation: a tirade against smoking.

A long angry or violent speech, usually of a censorious or denunciatory nature;

Afro GT
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post #13 of 130 Old 09-29-2012, 08:15 PM
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Originally Posted by dat56 View Post

Look up the definition of "tirade". Apparently you don't know what it is.
The OP did not ask for a suggestion of alternative equipment. But that's all he got, in addition to the typical Bose slam-fest.

Somehow I knew your post was the start of a tirade. And it continues. LOL

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Originally Posted by afrogt View Post

You might want to look up the definition of tirade yourself because none of the reponses have been tirades. I see no anger or bitterness anywhere.
Tirade:
: a protracted speech usually marked by intemperate, vituperative, or harshly censorious language
a prolonged outburst of bitter, outspoken denunciation: a tirade against smoking.
A long angry or violent speech, usually of a censorious or denunciatory nature;

So you call two sentences a "protracted speech"? Explain that reasoning, please. You are the ones denouncing Bose, over and over, in every post where someone asks a question about their Bose speakers. What is your experience with the system in question anyway? Do you have any? I've heard the Acoustimass systems in stores many times and I find them to be very competitive with other "micro" sub/sat systems.
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Somehow I knew your post was the start of a tirade. And it continues. LOL

You can call it whatever you want. All I'm doing is pointing out that in every Bose thread, someone has to jump in and ignore the OP's question and instead start slamming Bose. How is that being helpful? If someone buys a Bose Acoustimass system, I would assume they want that type of system. So why criticize their purchase? If they wanted a room full of big speakers, they would have bought it. As hard as you may find this to believe, some people prefer their speakers be very unobtrusive.

And furthermore, there are many sonic advantages that come from small enclosure size and from single-driver designs. Smaller enclosures yield minimal resonance issues, minimal cabinet diffraction issues, superior dispersion and more placement flexibility. Single and "multiple-single" driver, crossover-less designs can have higher power handling, better dispersion, minimal phase and interference issues due to the lack of disparate drivers and crossover, and a smoother, more relaxed and natural presentation due to same. Sure there are trade-offs, as there always is when talking about speakers. But what makes your choices more valid than someone elses?
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post #15 of 130 Old 09-29-2012, 10:17 PM
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Originally Posted by dat56 View Post

So you call two sentences a "protracted speech"? Explain that reasoning, please. You are the ones denouncing Bose, over and over, in every post where someone asks a question about their Bose speakers. What is your experience with the system in question anyway? Do you have any? I've heard the Acoustimass systems in stores many times and I find them to be very competitive with other "micro" sub/sat systems.
You can call it whatever you want. All I'm doing is pointing out that in every Bose thread, someone has to jump in and ignore the OP's question and instead start slamming Bose. How is that being helpful? If someone buys a Bose Acoustimass system, I would assume they want that type of system. So why criticize their purchase? If they wanted a room full of big speakers, they would have bought it. As hard as you may find this to believe, some people prefer their speakers be very unobtrusive.
And furthermore, there are many sonic advantages that come from small enclosure size and from single-driver designs. Smaller enclosures yield minimal resonance issues, minimal cabinet diffraction issues, superior dispersion and more placement flexibility. Single and "multiple-single" driver, crossover-less designs can have higher power handling, better dispersion, minimal phase and interference issues due to the lack of disparate drivers and crossover, and a smoother, more relaxed and natural presentation due to same. Sure there are trade-offs, as there always is when talking about speakers. But what makes your choices more valid than someone elses?

preserved for future reference.
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What a long, strange trip its been....
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post #16 of 130 Old 09-29-2012, 10:34 PM
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So why criticize their purchase? because they might have time to return it.

some people prefer their speakers be very unobtrusive. Fine, as long as they know what the trade-offs are.

there are many sonic advantages that come from small enclosure size. Like not being able to turn it up without distortion?

higher power handling... false

superior dispersion What, in a closet?

minimal phase and interference issues Sure, if you put your head inbetween them, 1 foot away.

disparate drivers and crossover Common in cheap speakers, which noone here is recommending.

smoother, more relaxed and natural presentation Subjective, to say the least; indicative of someone who has never heard better, IMO.

there are trade-offs. True, but it shouldn't be hard earned $$ for inferior, over hyped, over marketed , over priced crap.

What a long, strange trip its been....
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post #17 of 130 Old 09-29-2012, 11:51 PM
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So you call two sentences a "protracted speech"? Explain that reasoning, please.

Those definitions for tirade were cut and paste from dictionary websites. They aren't something I made up.
Quote:
What is your experience with the system in question anyway? Do you have any? I've heard the Acoustimass systems in stores many times and I find them to be very competitive with other "micro" sub/sat systems.

No, I don't have any because I've heard them several times in homes, stores and demos before and know they are bad value for the money. I know from experience they weren't better than the Energy Take 5 speakers I purchased for $199 plus subwoofer over 10 years ago.
Bose has great marketing and if people don't know anything about audio they tend to go with a name that is familiar to them. That doesn't make them the best choice though. The OP admitted he was a novice at the audio game, so he wasn't sure what was good. At least he came here for sound advice.
Quote:
You can call it whatever you want. All I'm doing is pointing out that in every Bose thread, someone has to jump in and ignore the OP's question and instead start slamming Bose. How is that being helpful? If someone buys a Bose Acoustimass system, I would assume they want that type of system. So why criticize their purchase? If they wanted a room full of big speakers, they would have bought it. As hard as you may find this to believe, some people prefer their speakers be very unobtrusive.
And furthermore, there are many sonic advantages that come from small enclosure size and from single-driver designs. Smaller enclosures yield minimal resonance issues, minimal cabinet diffraction issues, superior dispersion and more placement flexibility. Single and "multiple-single" driver, crossover-less designs can have higher power handling, better dispersion, minimal phase and interference issues due to the lack of disparate drivers and crossover, and a smoother, more relaxed and natural presentation due to same. Sure there are trade-offs, as there always is when talking about speakers. But what makes your choices more valid than someone elses?


Um..ok...cool.gif

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post #18 of 130 Old 09-29-2012, 11:58 PM
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Originally Posted by wlhungdude View Post

So why criticize their purchase? because they might have time to return it.
some people prefer their speakers be very unobtrusive. Fine, as long as they know what the trade-offs are.
there are many sonic advantages that come from small enclosure size. Like not being able to turn it up without distortion?
higher power handling... false
superior dispersion What, in a closet?
minimal phase and interference issues Sure, if you put your head inbetween them, 1 foot away.
disparate drivers and crossover Common in cheap speakers, which noone here is recommending.
smoother, more relaxed and natural presentation Subjective, to say the least; indicative of someone who has never heard better, IMO.
there are trade-offs. True, but it shouldn't be hard earned $$ for inferior, over hyped, over marketed , over priced crap.


Why do you assume someone would not know the trade-offs? Or maybe they just don't care!

Small sat size does not necessarily imply increased distortion. That would be dependent on the sats being operated within their linear range.

Higher power handing, at least in the higher frequency range is a fact due to the absence of a tweeter.

Small baffles = better (cleaner) dispersion. When the wavelength of the tone being reproduced is less than the baffle dimensions it will tend to be affected by diffraction from the cabinets edges.

Phase anomolies and driver interference occur when you have two disparate drivers, separated on a baffle, covering the same frequencies, in essence, the crossover range. It has nothing to do with listening distance, but it is affected by vertical relationship of the two (or more) drivers in a vertical array, relative to the ear height of the listener.

By "disparate" drivers, I am talking about woofers, mid and tweeters, not manufacturing variances.

Yes, "smoother, more relaxed and natural presentation" is a subjective judgement. I buy speakers according to how they sound, not how they measure.

"Indicative of someone who has never heard better" Exactly how do you arrive at that conclusion? I've owned Advents, ESS, Klipschorns, Klipsch La Scala II's, Polk LSi9's, Klipsch Cornwalls, Amrita Reference Standards, Energy RC50's, Mobile Fidelity Sound Lab OML-2's and a/d/s/ HT series. I think I've heard enough.

"inferior, over hyped, over marketed , over priced crap" Aren't you being subjective, too? That's all just your opinion. You offer nothing to back up any of it.
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post #19 of 130 Old 09-30-2012, 12:16 AM
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Originally Posted by afrogt View Post

Those definitions for tirade were cut and paste from dictionary websites. They aren't something I made up.
No, I don't have any because I've heard them several times in homes, stores and demos before and know they are bad value for the money. I know from experience they weren't better than the Energy Take 5 speakers I purchased for $199 plus subwoofer over 10 years ago.
Bose has great marketing and if people don't know anything about audio they tend to go with a name that is familiar to them. That doesn't make them the best choice though. The OP admitted he was a novice at the audio game, so he wasn't sure what was good. At least he came here for sound advice.
Um..ok...cool.gif

I did not question your definition. Your mistake is in applying it to anything I've posted.

So you don't like the Bose Acoustimass systems. It is not really comparable to the Energy Take systems that I've seen, anyway. They are pretty conventional. They may well sound better, at least to some people, maybe even to me. (I've never heard the Takes) So what? That is no excuse to slam someones Bose system every chance you get. Every speaker sounds different and there's thousands out there. I would imagine many people would prefer the Bose, if not on sonic grounds, then because of the tiny sat size, less boxy sub, and simpler hook-up.

I'm not interested in arguing who's speaker is best. As far as I'm concerned, that all comes down to personal opinion. My beef is that everytime a Bose-related thread is started, it instantly becomes a Bose-bashing party, and usually from the same people. That's all.
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post #20 of 130 Old 09-30-2012, 12:30 AM
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Originally Posted by dat56 View Post

You can call it whatever you want. All I'm doing is pointing out that in every Bose thread, someone has to jump in and ignore the OP's question and instead start slamming Bose.

I did not slam Bose. I merely pointed out that there are better price/performance options by taking advantage of specials and that more full range speakers offer advantages. I would have done the same if someone had recently bought a 5.1 set of Energy Take Classics at full MSRP, too.

But I can tell by your very short posting history that you are quite the Bose fan. Time for a wake up call. You are in the wrong place if you expect people here to start embracing Bose Acoustimass. It's not going to happen on AVS. Ever. eek.gif

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post #21 of 130 Old 09-30-2012, 02:49 AM
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You can tell by posting history what speaker brand the poster is a "fan" of? That's a very impressive power! How does that work? What if I have posts on lots of other audio forums, say, going back 13 years or so? What can you deduce from that?

Thanks, but no thanks, on the "wake-up call". I'm not expecting anyone to embrace anything, Bose or otherwise.. Do you read my posts? My whole complaint, and I will not state it again (three times should be more than enough) is that everytime a Bose-related thread is started, some people jump in and start slamming Bose, instead of addressing the OP's question. I don't see that happening much if at all with other brands of loudspeakers.

I don't own Bose Acoustimass and have never owned them, but I have heard them and for what they are (micro sats plus a bass module), they sound pretty darned good. They just are what they are. That type of system has distinct plus's and minuses, regardless of brand. Besides, Bose is hardly the only maker of such systems.
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post #22 of 130 Old 09-30-2012, 04:51 AM
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People come here to get good information. They do not come here to be lied to. If I had purchased something that was junk I would be grateful to find out before it was too late to return it. I would walk away feeling like I had gotten a much better value for my dollar and felt wiser in the process. Bose is crap, they deserve the moniker, and they deserve every bit of venom spewed their way because they are flatly ripping people off.

Dumb enough to spend lots of cash on this junk!
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post #23 of 130 Old 09-30-2012, 08:40 AM
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Originally Posted by dat56 View Post

You can tell by posting history what speaker brand the poster is a "fan" of? That's a very impressive power! How does that work? What if I have posts on lots of other audio forums, say, going back 13 years or so? What can you deduce from that?
Thanks, but no thanks, on the "wake-up call". I'm not expecting anyone to embrace anything, Bose or otherwise.. Do you read my posts? My whole complaint, and I will not state it again (three times should be more than enough) is that everytime a Bose-related thread is started, some people jump in and start slamming Bose, instead of addressing the OP's question.

Agreed. Three times is more than enough.

And if you do have years of experience posting on other audio forums, then you already know that most audiophiles and serious HT enthusiasts think most Bose speakers to be a poor value and have a lot of disdain for the business model of the company. And if you don't understand why, you can certainly research it and find out instead of rehashing what has been repeatedly discussed over and over again on the Internet. AVS is most definitely a Bose unfriendly place. Only Bose could change that.

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post #24 of 130 Old 09-30-2012, 06:32 PM
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The fact remains, twenty-three posts into the thread, I am the only one (in post #8) to address the OP's questions. All the rest of you have done is trash-talk Bose and/or promote, among other things, what you just happen to own. And the same thing plays out, ad nauseum, every time someone starts a Bose-related thread. It's really sickening.

All the "venom" spewn at Bose is really pathetic. The thought that people would get so worked up about...a speaker company. What did Bose do to any of you? Build something that you would not choose to own? Then don't buy their products! No harm, no foul. But obviously, many people like their products. That's why they are so successful.

Bose does not really pursue the tiny (and shrinking) audiophile market, anyway. Audiophiles are often more impressed by things that have nothing to do with the actual enjoyment of music. Other than the '01 speakers, most of their home audio products would fall more into the "lifestyle" category, and that's a whole different ballgame. Judging those products by "audiophile" standards is really pointless.
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post #25 of 130 Old 09-30-2012, 07:00 PM
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How about judging their products by the bare minimum that they make an attempt to come close to accurately reproducing sound?

Dumb enough to spend lots of cash on this junk!
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post #26 of 130 Old 09-30-2012, 07:38 PM
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Originally Posted by flyng_fool View Post

How about judging their products by the bare minimum that they make an attempt to come close to accurately reproducing sound?

Come on. You had to bait him so that he could continue his tirade?

LOL

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post #27 of 130 Old 10-01-2012, 05:18 AM
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What did Bose do to any of you? Build something that you would not choose to own? Then don't buy their products! No harm, no foul. But obviously, many people like their products. That's why they are so successful.
They're successful because they spend as much on advertising as all the rest of the industry combined. The cost of that advertising is why their products cost twice what they're worth. The only thing they lack is a spokesman. This guy would be an appropriate choice:

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post #28 of 130 Old 10-01-2012, 05:56 AM
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Without getting into the Bose is good/bad argument...I think what people are saying is that small satellite speakers with a single small driver, like the Bose system, will not be full range and will not produce good volume. Show me the Freq response plot where a small single driver speaker that produces a flat response with no gaps and I will recommend that speaker.

Btw, if you want a small speaker system that will sound better than the Bose (again, not my opinion, check the freq response plots)...The Cambridge Audio Minx system. Not cheap and I would get their sub, but...

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post #29 of 130 Old 10-01-2012, 05:16 PM - Thread Starter
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Well thank you for everyones opinion. I think I'll try adjusting a few specs on my receiver and see what I think. Appreciate the tips dat56 I'll be sure to try out your advice. I must say Im not disappointed with the Bose AM to be honest but I haven't heard many different surround sounds to trust the quality of the speakers. When I was watching a blu ray recently there was a car crash in the film and there was audio that I couldn't even dicifer. I'm not sure if that has to do with the inadequate midrange frequencies or I need to make adjustments on my reciever or just turn the bass down a bit so its not shaking the house. After buying this surround sound I feel like I am learning what to look for in a quality system and hope I can be happy with whatever I get stick with. Thanks again!
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post #30 of 130 Old 10-01-2012, 06:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Bill Fitzmaurice View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by dat56 View Post

What did Bose do to any of you? Build something that you would not choose to own? Then don't buy their products! No harm, no foul. But obviously, many people like their products. That's why they are so successful.
They're successful because they spend as much on advertising as all the rest of the industry combined. The cost of that advertising is why their products cost twice what they're worth.

Do you really know how much Bose spends on adverts, especially relative to the rest of the industry? How did you arrive at your conclusion that "their products cost twice what they're worth? A product is worth whatever someone is willing to pay for it. Maybe if other audio companies followed Bose lead, they'd be in better financial shape than they're in!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elihawk View Post

Without getting into the Bose is good/bad argument...I think what people are saying is that small satellite speakers with a single small driver, like the Bose system, will not be full range and will not produce good volume. Show me the Freq response plot where a small single driver speaker that produces a flat response with no gaps and I will recommend that speaker.

Btw, if you want a small speaker system that will sound better than the Bose (again, not my opinion, check the freq response plots)...The Cambridge Audio Minx system. Not cheap and I would get their sub, but...

I've not seen very many frequency response graphs of any loudspeaker that looked particularly flat! And furthermore, I've seen no correlation between flat response and price, but I have noticed that simpler designs tend to have smoother response than complex ones. And flat measured response is hardly a guarantor of subjectively "good" sound, anyway. Most speakers are measured anechoically, or at least, quasi-anechoically. Put the same speaker in a real room and measure it and see how the response below 300Hz goes all over the place.

I'm not sure about the Bose systems in question, but Bose does use EQ in some of their designs to extend and/or flatten response. This offsets, to varying degrees, the lack of conventional tweeters and woofers... So yes, it is a (very) small speaker with one or two identical small drivers. It is what it is. To say it should be compared to any speaker that is much, much larger is just silly. If a person want's what a bigger speaker offers, they should buy a bigger speaker.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bsig83 View Post

Well thank you for everyones opinion. I think I'll try adjusting a few specs on my receiver and see what I think. Appreciate the tips dat56 I'll be sure to try out your advice. I must say Im not disappointed with the Bose AM to be honest but I haven't heard many different surround sounds to trust the quality of the speakers. When I was watching a blu ray recently there was a car crash in the film and there was audio that I couldn't even dicifer. I'm not sure if that has to do with the inadequate midrange frequencies or I need to make adjustments on my reciever or just turn the bass down a bit so its not shaking the house. After buying this surround sound I feel like I am learning what to look for in a quality system and hope I can be happy with whatever I get stick with. Thanks again!

It almost always pays to shop around, regardless of what it is your shopping for. There are just so many speaker options out there. But the Bose Acoustimass systems are very good -for what they are! But what they are not, are big speakers. And that will always mean trade-offs, for better and for worse. You just have to decide which trade-offs are most important to you. Good luck!
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