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post #721 of 964 Old 05-14-2014, 08:31 AM
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Originally Posted by tr4a View Post

Been there done that!

The finished stands are 32.5" from the floor.

Haha, that new stand is made of cast concrete? How does it sound?

I'm planning on 2 8x8x16 cinder blocks, should make for a super stiff 32 inch stand, maybe add a 4x8x16 as a base and bring it to 36 inches. 76 pounds per stand!

Will be interesting to find out how it sounds.
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post #722 of 964 Old 05-14-2014, 09:04 AM
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Originally Posted by CDLehner View Post

Wow; for me...that puts them wayyy above the de-facto "tweeter-at-ear-level" height. Anybody else this high up??

Put the tweeter at ear level, what ever that height turns out to be. If you have more than one row, then you have a decision to make. With two rows the choices are:

1. Aim at ear height of first row, because that is the row that has the main listening position.
2. Aim at ear height of second row, because that is the row that has the main listening position.
3. Aim right between first and second row ear height, because that is the least compromise for all seats.

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post #723 of 964 Old 05-14-2014, 09:07 AM
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Coli

The concrete blocks were used to test various heights.
The finished stands are a 1/4" steel plate bolted to a 1.5"x 3" extruded aluminum post.
The post is bolted to the very heavy cabinet.
A bit of Blu Tack and the speakers are not going anywhere.

Sound? Over a year later I find myself enjoying my music more and more.
Before purchasing the Ls50's I had my heart set on Dynaudio C1's
Maybe at some point I will upgrade but I am in no big hurry.

Steve
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post #724 of 964 Old 05-14-2014, 09:11 AM
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Originally Posted by tr4a View Post

Been there done that!

The finished stands are 32.5" from the floor.


Tweeter height is 32.5" from the floor.
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post #725 of 964 Old 05-14-2014, 03:18 PM
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Originally Posted by CDLehner View Post

Wow; for me...that puts them wayyy above the de-facto "tweeter-at-ear-level" height. Anybody else this high up??

I first tried them on 30" stands and now have them on 24" stands as recommended in the KEF owners manual. I personally prefer the shorter stands which places them slightly below ear level when seated. Placing the drivers at ear level is a good place to start for many speakers, but it may not apply to all speakers. According to the LS50 white paper, "the LS50 response is slightly smoother 10 degrees off axis and in many cases this is a preferable listening position".

For those of you using the LS50 in a 2 channel application, what size is your room?
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post #726 of 964 Old 05-14-2014, 05:34 PM
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So I have the LS50 spiked (3 spikes each) into a pair of 2 8x8x16 concrete blocks now, with Auddyssey XT32 off, don't have time to run calibration. The bottom concrete block is not spiked into the floor yet.

All I can say right now is... WOW. The emotions from certain songs that I never quite got with the LS50 (but I got from the KL-650-THX when sitting on a giant dinner table) is back at long last!
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post #727 of 964 Old 05-15-2014, 09:11 AM
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Originally Posted by johsti View Post

I first tried them on 30" stands and now have them on 24" stands as recommended in the KEF owners manual. I personally prefer the shorter stands which places them slightly below ear level when seated. Placing the drivers at ear level is a good place to start for many speakers, but it may not apply to all speakers. According to the LS50 white paper, "the LS50 response is slightly smoother 10 degrees off axis and in many cases this is a preferable listening position".

For those of you using the LS50 in a 2 channel application, what size is your room?

I take my cues from Harbeth; they recommend...like art...where people tend to think things should be, is usually too high. wink.gif

Sure...the higher the tweeter, the more sparkle; and if that's your preference, have at it. But I find a tad lower is more involving, and balanced.

Music is a moral law. It gives soul to the universe, wings to the mind, flight to the imagination, and charm and gaiety to life and to everything. -Plato
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post #728 of 964 Old 05-15-2014, 11:59 AM
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Originally Posted by CDLehner View Post

I take my cues from Harbeth; they recommend...like art...where people tend to think things should be, is usually too high. wink.gif

Sure...the higher the tweeter, the more sparkle; and if that's your preference, have at it. But I find a tad lower is more involving, and balanced.

Agreed, It just depends on your preference and if you prefer a taller stand then that's where you should place them. Alan Shaw recommends setting the tweeter at ear level and that's what I did with the SHL5's I used to own. KEF recommends an 18"-24" stand for the LS50 which places the tweeter below ear level unless you sit on a bean bag. They designed the speaker so they must have a reason for recommending a particular stand height.
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post #729 of 964 Old 05-15-2014, 08:24 PM
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The Kef LS50 and the Parasound A21 sound so good biggrin.gif. Very accurate and detailed, I can hear every instruments. I tested Nora Jones & Diana Krall digital collections (Logitech squeezebox). This is with an Onkyo 805 AVR. I will finish it off with a Parasound Preamp soon.

Box is freaking large. I am glad I have a truck now.



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post #730 of 964 Old 05-16-2014, 10:09 AM
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Originally Posted by tractng View Post

The Kef LS50 and the Parasound A21 sound so good biggrin.gif. Very accurate and detailed, I can hear every instruments. I tested Nora Jones & Diana Krall digital collections (Logitech squeezebox). This is with an Onkyo 805 AVR. I will finish it off with a Parasound Preamp soon.

Box is freaking large. I am glad I have a truck now.



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Congratulations on the A21. That's a very tight fit in there redface.gif
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post #731 of 964 Old 05-16-2014, 02:37 PM
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^ Thanks. It runs very cool. It has at least 8" clearance on top (had to remove one shelf) and the back is wide open.
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post #732 of 964 Old 05-16-2014, 05:04 PM
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How would the R200C mate with the LS50 as center speaker? I ordered a single LS50 and its over a month and no stock.
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post #733 of 964 Old 05-16-2014, 05:20 PM
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Originally Posted by tractng View Post

How would the R200C mate with the LS50 as center speaker? I ordered a single LS50 and its over a month and no stock.
Feedback I have seen is quite well.

Main Kef: Reference 205/2 & 202/2c, Surrounds: Kef XQ40, Velodyne Optimum 12, Integra DHC 80.3, Oppo BDP-103, Bryston 4Bsst2, Parasound Halo A31. Second B&W: 685 (3), CCM618, Def Tech Powerfield 1500, Onkyo TX-NR1008, DBP 2010, Samsung BD-C7900, Zone 2 Klipsch AW650. Sitting still CCM616, Kef...
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post #734 of 964 Old 05-16-2014, 06:23 PM
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Originally Posted by tractng View Post

The Kef LS50 and the Parasound A21 sound so good biggrin.gif. Very accurate and detailed, I can hear every instruments. I tested Nora Jones & Diana Krall digital collections (Logitech squeezebox). This is with an Onkyo 805 AVR. I will finish it off with a Parasound Preamp soon.

Box is freaking large. I am glad I have a truck now.

Yeah. The box is huge. Much bigger in real life than the pic makes it seem. The amp is long too. Rack mounting mine was a huge PITA. Congrats on the amp.

What preamp are you thinking about? I had a 2100 at one point and while better than my Onkyo 5507 pre/pro, there are better pre's out there.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence

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post #735 of 964 Old 05-16-2014, 08:02 PM
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Originally Posted by mrlittlejeans View Post

Yeah. The box is huge. Much bigger in real life than the pic makes it seem. The amp is long too. Rack mounting mine was a huge PITA. Congrats on the amp.

What preamp are you thinking about? I had a 2100 at one point and while better than my Onkyo 5507 pre/pro, there are better pre's out there.


Parasound P5 or P7? I have to check my wallet tongue.gif
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post #736 of 964 Old 05-16-2014, 09:15 PM
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Parasound P5 or P7? I have to check my wallet tongue.gif
or JC2 biggrin.gif
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post #737 of 964 Old 05-17-2014, 11:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tractng View Post

The Kef LS50 and the Parasound A21 sound so good biggrin.gif. Very accurate and detailed, I can hear every instruments. I tested Nora Jones & Diana Krall digital collections (Logitech squeezebox). This is with an Onkyo 805 AVR. I will finish it off with a Parasound Preamp soon.

Box is freaking large. I am glad I have a truck now.



photo_zps16b0f0e5.jpg

Any more impressions of your new set up? I have my LS 50's coming in this week, from the great folks at Monaco AV also. Thanks for the tip and PM!
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post #738 of 964 Old 05-18-2014, 12:29 AM
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Any more impressions of your new set up? I have my LS 50's coming in this week, from the great folks at Monaco AV also. Thanks for the tip and PM!


Great dynamic in a 13x20x8 room. I sit about 12-13 ft away from speakers. Vocal is very clear and detailed! I sat and listened for a few hours smiling. I turned the volume to -10 and its very loud without any harsh or fatigue. Get an amp in the future if you don't have one. I tested without an external amp after I sold the Emotiva XPA-5 and it was just ok, but still good..


They have inventory soon? My single LS50 has been on order over a month and I heard nothing.
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post #739 of 964 Old 05-18-2014, 11:55 AM
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I done a ton of tweaks the last weeks, and got the following take aways.

1. You want the LS50 to be immovable. Mass coupling to the floor is essential. Spikes + concrete blocks is cheap and super effective.
2. You want to isolate everything else from the now vibrating floor, and each other. Sorbothane hemispheres for the amp, sources, is again, super effective.
3. Plugging the port on the LS50 increases the coherence of the sound, it also reduces room reflections, improving phase response.
4. Isolation transformer for the source is super effective.
5. Golden layout is a great "starting" point for speaker placement.

Still not done with the tweaks yet. But the above tips are worth $50,000 USD at a minimum.
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post #740 of 964 Old 05-18-2014, 07:02 PM
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Originally Posted by tractng View Post

Great dynamic in a 13x20x8 room. I sit about 12-13 ft away from speakers. Vocal is very clear and detailed! I sat and listened for a few hours smiling. I turned the volume to -10 and its very loud without any harsh or fatigue. Get an amp in the future if you don't have one. I tested without an external amp after I sold the Emotiva XPA-5 and it was just ok, but still good..

tractng,

Help me understand this, you originally had the XPA-5 with the LS50 and didn't like the pairing? What was it about the sound quality that the XPA-5 + LS50 that didn't go well? Not enough power/current to drive the speakers to full volume? Weak bass? Mid range not full?

The reason to ask is that I'm considering the XPA-3 with for the front sound stage of 3xLS50. I would have thought that 200W per channel from the XPA-3 is plenty for the LS50 which is rated up to 100W.

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post #741 of 964 Old 05-19-2014, 05:15 AM
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tractng,

Help me understand this, you originally had the XPA-5 with the LS50 and didn't like the pairing? What was it about the sound quality that the XPA-5 + LS50 that didn't go well? Not enough power/current to drive the speakers to full volume? Weak bass? Mid range not full?

The reason to ask is that I'm considering the XPA-3 with for the front sound stage of 3xLS50. I would have thought that 200W per channel from the XPA-3 is plenty for the LS50 which is rated up to 100W.

 

I'll be interested in those impressions too.

 

I'm in the process of setting up a home theater with the LS50s. After doing some research online and based on my budget, I've narrowed the options for 5 channel amplifiers to the Emotiva XPA-5 (Gen 2) and Marantz MM 8077.

 

I'd be interested to know if Emotiva amps pair well with the LS50s in terms of neutrality, detail and dynamics (for both music and movies).

 

Also, would the LS50 make for a good center speaker in a home theater setup? 

 

Any impressions or advise would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

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post #742 of 964 Old 05-20-2014, 12:36 PM
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I posted this also in the thread I created when looking for new speakers 5 months ago but decided to copy it here as this is a more suitable thread for it smile.gif

I have had the LS50's for 5 months now and I would like to give my opinions so far.

Well.. I just love them! And now that that's out of the way let's go to specifics smile.gif

My current setup:

2x LS50
SVS SB-12NSD
Antimode 8033 Cinema
Denon X-1000 (MultEQ XT)
WDTV Live

Use: Movies (blu-ray) and music. Music varies from cuban music to jazz and from r&b to classical and beyond.

My PC is connected to the audio system via HDMI and I use both it and WDTV live for music and videos. I use the WDTV Live when I want complete silence (gaming pc makes some noise) and no other distraction. Facebook I'm looking at you and your *pop* noises.

I have had two different rooms for the speakers with the same equipment and that is something I would like to share as I have found the results interesting. When I first bought the speakers, I used them to replace my Wharfedales (2x 10.2 + 10.CM) as I noticed that I had used so much more money on everything else in my setup and wanted to see what I could achieve with better speakers. I know, it's the basic "me wants" situation but what can you do? I had heard and read that the LS50 wouldn't have so much bass but it didn't worry my because I knew I would be using the sub with a crossover in the 80-100 region anyway.

My first setup was so that the speakers were 3 meters apart from each other and about 0,5 meters from the wall. The room was a basic apartment building living room and my distance was about 3-4 meters from the center of the speakers. The speakers were on basic 60 cm speaker stands. In that room they sounded phenomenal! I wondered about all the talk about the lack of bass because in that room the LS50's went so low I didn't even always remember to put the subwoofer on when listening to music (jazz/latin music). The speakers sounded very clear and detailed but even then I knew that the room layout was terrible and a part of the sofa was muffing the sound of the left speaker. It wasn't directly on the way as I could see the speaker but from my point of view where the speaker ended the sofa started. I could hear a tremendous difference if I raised my head even 10 cm. So visual contact to the woofers is not sometimes enough.

I then moved to my current, temporary apartment. I decided to unite my PC and A/V stuff to save space but in an ideal situation the speakers would be on stands on the sides of my desk. In this apartment, I have to have them on my cheap Ikea table and it really does some serious work on the sound. Before running Audyssey they sounded really muddy and all the bass was gone if run without the subwoofer. Audyssey worked quite well they sounded little better, and this near-field situation the imaging is of course perfet. I then decided to buy some basic speaker pads. That was the magic trick for my situation! The sound was so much clearer and detailed, I can really recommend this for anyone thinking about a table positioning for these (or any) speakers! Proper stands would, of course, still yield better sound.

Now I'm desperately waiting to find a bigger and a more permanent apartment, if that even can happen for a student with my income. I would really like to have the LS50's on real stands as that really changed the way they sounded! I already know which stands to buy, based on the height of my desk and my listening position. In my next apartment, the speakers and audio layout will be the defining thing, everything else will just have to follow. All in all, these speakers are the best I think I will be able to afford for 5-10 years and I have to say I'm in no rush. It's actually hard to imagine what better speakers would sound like, these are just so clear, detailed and focused but "bigger" than what they look. Plus they look amazing! I think I have found the speakers that will last me a lifetime. Unless my studies in musicology end up paying really well after graduating wink.gif
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post #743 of 964 Old 05-20-2014, 02:23 PM
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Great info pasisti, I'm looking forward to my pair arriving in a few weeks.

Do you think you are missing anything by not having a center channel? I'm going to have a similar setup but not sure if I should spring for a third for the center (especially for movies).
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post #744 of 964 Old 05-20-2014, 02:37 PM
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pasisti: There are 3 bookshelf speakers I love, KEF LS50 being one of them, I also might add... Dynaudio Focus 160s and Dali series has a bunch of good ones as well.
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post #745 of 964 Old 05-20-2014, 04:22 PM
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The LS50 never sounded so real.
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post #746 of 964 Old 05-20-2014, 06:11 PM
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^coli,

The isolation from floor and damping force of the (50lb) bag must be doing something to the sound of the LS50...smile.gif

Such a shame to place a beautiful speaker in it's present surroundings. I'm sure it's temporary until you a better home for them. If not, let me know as I'm planning to move into a new place in a year's time and looking hard at the LS50 as new front sound stage..tongue.gif

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post #747 of 964 Old 05-20-2014, 06:33 PM
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^coli,

The isolation from floor and damping force of the (50lb) bag must be doing something to the sound of the LS50...smile.gif

Such a shame to place a beautiful speaker in it's present surroundings. I'm sure it's temporary until you a better home for them. If not, let me know as I'm planning to move into a new place in a year's time and looking hard at the LS50 as new front sound stage..tongue.gif

That pillar is 122 pounds. I got a feeling this is what the Blade sounds like without the woofer units.
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post #748 of 964 Old 05-20-2014, 11:34 PM
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Great info pasisti, I'm looking forward to my pair arriving in a few weeks.

Do you think you are missing anything by not having a center channel? I'm going to have a similar setup but not sure if I should spring for a third for the center (especially for movies).

First of all congrats on a great speaker decision, I'm very positive that you won't regret them!

As I said in my post, I used to have a 3.1 system before this. Purchasing that center channel was the best thing I ever did with that system, but in retrospect I think it had more to do with our room layout being really croocked. The viewing angle to the A/V system was so out-of-center that there would have been no way to create a phantom center with two speakers. We were also two persons living there and we would look at movies and listen to music in an area 3 meters wide. With that combo the center channel was absolutely a must and it really brought the image to the imaging. When I bought the LS50's I was afraid of losing that imaging because I was used to the center channel in our apartment. To tell you the truth I don't remember much about those times as we were just about to separate with my gf but if I remember correctly I did feel like I missed the center channel.

But then I moved to my current apartment. I'm here alone and all my listening positions are in a direct line from the middle of the speakers and now I feel that I wouldn't need the center channel for anything. At least for that money. Also there is no room on the table and over the display would be too far up as I'm usually sitting in front of the PC display. My guess would be that if I end up in a bigger apartment where I have the room and at one point have separate PC and A/V media locations I would consider the center channel if I fell like I have a wide listening area. Also especially if I end up living with someone again.

To sum up; if I live alone and the setup has me always in the middle of the speakers, I don't think I would ever need the center. But if I would move in with some one or otherwise have a wide listening area, I would like to have the center. I'm sure that there is a thread dedicated to the debate about the need for center channel but these are just my opinions concerning the LS50's smile.gif
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post #749 of 964 Old 05-21-2014, 06:22 AM
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Thanks pasisti, that helps. It sounds like I might need a center channel then since it is a rather wide listening area I will have these in and there are a lot of us.

Glad you are happy with the Ls50s, I auditioned as many speakers as I could and they were really on a different level.

I have a sub to go with them but it sounds like for everyday listening I might not even need it.
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post #750 of 964 Old 05-21-2014, 06:42 AM
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Nice to be of assistance!

The need for sub has very much to do with the room and the speakers' positioning. It's pretty much impossible to predict, the only option is to try and see what happens. What sub do you have? Does your receiver have an EQ (Audyssey etc) for matching it with the speakers?

You might end up needing a center channel, but the other option is to always sit in the center of the listening are yourself and see if the other people notice anything! wink.gif My advice would be to first try without one and then if you feel like you might need one, try it before you buy (if possible). That way you can't lose anything! Although I can't see why owning lots and lots of these speakers would in any way be a loss...
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Kef Ls50 2 Way Speaker System

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