After 18 years of using Bose, looking for a new 7.1 system?? - Page 2 - AVS Forum
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post #31 of 42 Old 10-14-2012, 01:18 PM - Thread Starter
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Tank all of you so much for your posts.

I went to a theatre store and listened to a set by bowers and Wilkins. 1500 for pair of fronts, 500 for pair of rears and 649 for center. Thoughts?

Also, I did pay 225 for that subwoofer on amazon, I only bought it a few months ago, and for rut now anyway. I will be keeping it. I think anyway smile.gif
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post #32 of 42 Old 10-14-2012, 02:27 PM
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Based on the price, you probably listened to the 600 series. B&W towers are way over priced compared to the options out there in that price range. The Klipsch RF82 II will beat the B&W 683 hands down. There are also other brands that are better value than the B&W 683 or 684, like the PSB T5, T6

Note that this is coming from an owner of B&W 602 S2's. The 603, 604 towers of that series were a lot better than the 683, 684. Even now used 603's, 604's go for a very high price. In fact an used 603 or 604 would be a better value than the new 683 or 684.

Ditch the B&W and get the Klipsch reference series. It is a lot more value for the money. You would also need a more powerful amp to drive the B&W's and also the PSB's. A low or mid level AVR will not cut it.
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post #33 of 42 Old 10-14-2012, 04:33 PM - Thread Starter
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I;ll check out Klipsh reference series,.

I'm not a very knowledgeable audiophile, but I thought my denon was considred a great receiver?
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post #34 of 42 Old 10-14-2012, 04:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ericuf View Post

I;ll check out Klipsh reference series,.
I'm not a very knowledgeable audiophile, but I thought my denon was considred a great receiver?

I think it's a fine receiver for someone working with your budget. Replacing it would not be worthwhile considering how much it would eat up of your speaker budget.

As far as Klipsch, best to listen to some first. Some people find the horns on the Klipsch fatiguing.

Meanwhile, what Polk subwoofer model did you buy? Some of the $250 Polk subs are not very good.

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post #35 of 42 Old 10-14-2012, 05:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ericuf View Post

I;ll check out Klipsh reference series,.
I'm not a very knowledgeable audiophile, but I thought my denon was considred a great receiver?

It is all about you and your room, and your preference and choice. A lot of people
like Klipsch, and a lot of people prefer something else. >> There are good choices
out there - find something that works for you. > PSB can be good for movies and
decent music listening, they also will pancake the Bose. I have owned Bose, PSB
and Klipsch. However, I am not a big B&W fan >> testing speakers in your home
for a trial period, is the way to go.

For one on a tight budget, your receiver is decent to begin with.

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Who and Where - is the Way, the Truth and the Life?

Speakers > MB Quart VS05, Boston VS260, Snell K7
Subwoofer > Mordaunt Short Aviano 7
Receiver > Tascam PA-R200, Pioneer VSX-30
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post #36 of 42 Old 10-14-2012, 08:51 PM
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Something from Definitive Technology might work for you too. A lot of small, local shops will carry them and even have some older 7000 or Mythos series they want to part with. Same with Klipsch though as it is a love them / hate them because they are bi-polar. They tend to be better for movies than music. Having said that, I think mine sound great with music too, especially multi-channel music. Room shape is more critical with DefTechs. Something in the 8040 series or older 7004 series would be in your budget.

As far as the Denon AVR-1912. Yes. It is fine for a 5.1 setup with maybe $1500 to $2500 in speakers. I wouldn't dump that just yet but maybe upgrade in a couple of years to something with pre-outs. It all depends on whether you feel you are going to want more power later on OR go beyond 7.2.

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post #37 of 42 Old 10-14-2012, 09:57 PM
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You should take a look at EMOTIVA great value for the money plus they have 30 day MBG
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post #38 of 42 Old 10-15-2012, 07:03 AM - Thread Starter
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I don't want to buy a speaker that I can't hear before hand ..

Best buy in atlanta has a somewhat decent higher-end speaker room ... The B&W cm9 are their featured speaker, and I tried a few, but I really did love that sound, although it was QUITE a short demo and I need to hear more for sure.
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post #39 of 42 Old 10-15-2012, 07:12 AM
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if you are in Atlanta, drive out to Frys in Duluth. They has some of the mentioned speakers in this thread. I was in town for business and checked out the klipsch RF-82II there.
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post #40 of 42 Old 10-15-2012, 07:19 AM - Thread Starter
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That's a great idea... Are they good about letting you try different speakers/taking your time/etc? Do you know if they also have the B&W speakers there? Thanks!
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post #41 of 42 Old 10-15-2012, 08:30 AM
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The subwoofer will sound fine, especially considering that you are coming from a Bose system that really doesn't have a true subwoofer!

Another good speaker that won't break the bank is the DeF Tech SM450...I was able to buy a pair for right around 200 dollars (New Egg a couple months ago) and those really shine for music in their price range! My guess is that they would be a very good HT speakers as well, but I have never had them in that capacity!

Set up #1: EMP e5ti, e5Ci, and SLS Q line Audio surrounds, EMP 10i10i sub
Set up #2: Def Tech SM450, CLR2002, SLS Qline surrounds and Klipsch 12wD sub
Set up #3: JBL130, JBL120C and Klipsch synergy sub
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post #42 of 42 Old 10-20-2012, 07:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ericuf View Post

I;ll check out Klipsh reference series,.
I'm not a very knowledgeable audiophile, but I thought my denon was considred a great receiver?

Great in what aspects? Didn't want to throw stones at your gear. I myself own the Denon 3310 and it just does not have the power to drive speakers with low sensitivity and low (nominal) ohm rating. When you hook up 5 or 7 speakers to your AVR and try to drive low sensitivity speakers like B&W, PSB, Magnepan or many others, you will realize that they dont have enough power. Also when you start cranking up your AVR, you get more distortion. This is the main reason I suggested Klipsch.

A lot of amp manufacturers would say that their amp can drive any speaker. That is true only if you are feeding the amp the voltage as per the amp sensitivity to get the full power from the amp. A lot of powerful amps like WIRED 4 have a ridiculous sensitivity value like 2.5V. I am not aware of any AVR on this planet that can deliver 2.5V at the pre-outs. AVR's, including the high end ones, only output some 1.2V and that too at max volume and there will be distortion. Typical pre-out voltage may be like 0.6V at moderate volumes. Now when you use an amp like WIRED 4 with a sensitivity of 2.5V and feed it 0.6V using an AVR, all you get is a SMALL fraction of the peak power of the amp, which would not be enough to drive many low sensitivity speakers. So you have to take those claims by the amp manufacturers with a grain of salt.

In fact I corrected the mistake they had at WIRED4 web site regarding the sensitivity of their amps. I was thrilled when they had quoted a very low sensitivity for their high power amps. Later they came back with the correct number which was like 2.5V!

I see analog pre-amps like Emotiva and Parasound claiming 9V or 6V pre-out voltage. Yeah right? I have tried Emotiva USP-1 with the Rotel RB-1080 and I just could not drive my Magnepans to high volume. Who has verified the claim that Emotiva or Parasound analog pre-amps can deliver 9V or 6V. Even if it is 6V peak, I get 3V at half the volume if it is linear and 3V is plenty to drive any amp to full power. But I dont think it is the case. They are all unverified claims always with a caveat/disclaimer. Show me a review that measured 9v using the Emotiva pre-amp and I will buy it again.

The bottom like is that you have to match the power requirement of the speakers you want to buy with the capability of your current AVR. Otherwise you may be disappointed later. You can keep your AVR to drive just the center channel and rear speakers and use separate amps for the fronts. But you have to make sure your AVR has pre-outs. I doubt if the 1912 has pre-outs. The 3310 was the lowest model in 2010 to have pre-outs. I have the Yamaha RX-V663 and it has pre-outs. The mid-end Onkyo models may also have the pre-outs.

You can still keep your AVR for a bedroom or basement system and invest on a new AVR with pre-outs and separate amps. Emotiva amps would give you the best bang for the buck. I have seen many posts about hiss from the Emotiva amps. I have also seen many posts that refute the other posts that mention the hiss. I did try the Emotiva UPA-2 2channel amp long time back and I dont recall hearing any hiss but I also did not notice any advantage over my Yamaha RX-V663 AVR as I was driving the Klipsch RB81's which do not need a lot of power. May be it is the multichannel amp that has the hiss? Dont know. I will never buy them as I just cant handle the weight even if they are cheap.
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