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post #1081 of 1813 Old 08-18-2013, 09:42 AM
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Originally Posted by audiosavant View Post

It's obvious you're talking about me but I never posted that. All I said was that it's the first time that I've heard about anyone getting "ripped off" by Tekton

IIRC, you called "Bull@#(" on someone who had had difficulties with a Tekton order.
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post #1082 of 1813 Old 08-18-2013, 10:35 AM
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Originally Posted by audiosavant View Post

It's obvious you're talking about me but I never posted that. All I said was that it's the first time that I've heard about anyone getting "ripped off" by Tekton. As far as I know, their policy is to not charge your card until they have a tracking # and are ready to ship your order.

You said "I also want to call bull$hit on some of the posts on here. I don't believe that Eric @ Tekton has taken money and not delivered any speakers. He does not do business like that. He only charges you when he has a tracking number and is ready to ship. "

Your new language (above) is far more reasonable; though someone has addressed the underlying issue regarding different methods of ordering.
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If I'm not welcome here, I will graciously bow out. I'll let the AVS community decide that. I wouldn't be here if I didn't enjoy the site and think that I may have some things to contribute.

As far as I am concerned: welcome. Though I'm on many a banned list myself.
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post #1083 of 1813 Old 08-18-2013, 05:47 PM
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Though I'm on many a banned list myself.

I have never seen you post anything offensive. Did I miss out? biggrin.gif
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post #1084 of 1813 Old 08-18-2013, 06:03 PM
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Originally Posted by audiosavant View Post

btw, why is it when I check out the gear listings of all of you anti-audiophiles types, you mostly have crappy consumer a/v equipment? That's kinda funny... All of you have opinions about the high end stuff, yet own none. It's also hard to take seriously anyone who thinks using Audyssey is a good idea.

I used to dislike Audyssey XT for the longest time.

But then I tried Audyssey Flat (instead of Audyssey) and turned on Dynamic EQ, but turned off Dynamic Volume. Now the sound is fabulous.

I hope it's okay for me to express my opinions, although my equipments aren't as high-end as yours.
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post #1085 of 1813 Old 08-18-2013, 06:28 PM
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Hello AVS. Long time follower for years. I am interested in the Pendragon SEAS. The slimmer width to height dimensions seem more aesthetic to me than the bigger Pens for my room. I also like the idea of better imaging. I have a big sub already, so I am not worried about low extension. Does anyone in the Houston TX area have a pair of Pendragon or Pendragon SEAS I can audition? Free lunch for your trouble.
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post #1086 of 1813 Old 08-18-2013, 06:34 PM
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Originally Posted by AcuDefTechGuy View Post

I used to dislike Audyssey XT for the longest time.

But then I tried Audyssey Flat (instead of Audyssey) and turned on Dynamic EQ, but turned off Dynamic Volume. Now the sound is fabulous.

I hope it's okay for me to express my opinions, although my equipments aren't as high-end as yours.

That last sentence cracked me up! Good job, AcuDefTechGuy

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post #1087 of 1813 Old 08-18-2013, 06:39 PM
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Yeah pretty funny , maybe if he had some more powerful ones . 50 k is definitely low fi .
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post #1088 of 1813 Old 08-18-2013, 07:13 PM
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Originally Posted by AcuDefTechGuy View Post

I hope it's okay for me to express my opinions, although my equipments aren't as high-end as yours.

I know. Everyone else in AVS doesn't have equipment that is as high-end as he does. smile.gif
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post #1089 of 1813 Old 08-18-2013, 07:19 PM
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Does anyone in the Houston TX area have a pair of Pendragon or Pendragon SEAS I can audition?
They're all still waiting for them to be shipped. wink.gif
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post #1090 of 1813 Old 08-18-2013, 08:08 PM
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Honestly I would still like to buy a pair of Pendragon's to put on my main floor for a 2-channel setup to listen to music. But at the very least I think I'll wait another 6 months or so to see if some of these issues start to get resolved. The number one issue for me would be a lack of grills with two little ones running around the house.

There's no way my JTR's are leaving my theatre room, but if things start to get better with Eric I could see myself buying some.

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post #1091 of 1813 Old 08-18-2013, 08:34 PM
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Well that is the type of wit I have come to expect from you Fitz, lol. Your input is appreciated. I am coming from a pair of 2002 Miller & Kriesel S-125s. While they are clear and monitor like, frankly, I have always found them a little shrill. I have recently added 2' x 4' mineral wool treatments x 4 to my 12x16 media room. Better but still shrill, and i am really wanting better sound. From the reviews, the Pendragons seem to be good despite the wait. My other choice is the B&W CM9s. What do you think?
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post #1092 of 1813 Old 08-18-2013, 10:26 PM
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Originally Posted by AcuDefTechGuy View Post

I hope it's okay for me to express my opinions, although my equipments aren't as high-end as yours.

Aren't you on audioholics too? I think of you as that "speaker collector guy". I always enjoy your input. You have some very nice gear. I also share your love of different speakers and their various tech/design. You like the Kefs and Revels a lot, no? I do too. Hate Definitive Technology though... Have you checked out the OHM Walsh? They would be a nice addition to your "collection".

My rather snide comment was directed at the people who criticize high end stereo gear when all they have is low end consumer a/v equipment. I'm pretty sure you knew I wasn't meaning you.

Although you may end up on an episode of Hoarders if you keep adding to your speaker collection! smile.gif
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post #1093 of 1813 Old 08-19-2013, 05:29 AM
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My other choice is the B&W CM9s. What do you think?
I think that if you order a pair you'll get them before the start of the next Ice Age. Maybe even the grilles, too. wink.gif

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post #1094 of 1813 Old 08-19-2013, 07:36 AM
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Originally Posted by audiosavant View Post

Aren't you on audioholics too? I think of you as that "speaker collector guy". I always enjoy your input. You have some very nice gear. I also share your love of different speakers and their various tech/design. You like the Kefs and Revels a lot, no? I do too. Hate Definitive Technology though... Have you checked out the OHM Walsh? They would be a nice addition to your "collection".

My rather snide comment was directed at the people who criticize high end stereo gear when all they have is low end consumer a/v equipment. I'm pretty sure you knew I wasn't meaning you.

Although you may end up on an episode of Hoarders if you keep adding to your speaker collection! smile.gif

You are as nuts as I am. eek.gifbiggrin.gif

I have to admit there are lauded speakers I hate at dealers, stores, showrooms, etc.

But most of the speakers I've heard in my own house & setup sound excellent. Well, okay, except for those Yamaha pro cab speakers from Guitar Center. biggrin.gif

But with the one exception, all other speakers have sounded great in my house, even though the same speakers sounded horrid at other places.

The DefTech BP7000SC was one example. At the dealer, they sounded muddy. But in my humble abode & setup, they sounded fantastic.

So I think we need to take that into account when making judgement in general.

It seems like a lot of people on Audioholics & AVS love PSB & Paradigm. But when I auditioned those speakers at the local dealers, those speakers sounded terrible to me. However, I can't help but think that they might sound great in my setup & room. biggrin.gif

And if you had asked me a few weeks ago what I thought about Audyssey, I would have said I agreed with you 100%. But experiences change. We learn along the way. I did learn with Audyssey among other things.

I've had my shares of forum excoriation and vivisection. But I have toned down my posts since then. biggrin.gif

You sound like an interesting guy like many of us. I bet if we were all in the same room drinking beer and talking audio, we would all get along. But forums tend to be a little different and we tend to offend people easier. biggrin.gif

In the end, we all want to get along. We want to express our honest opinions (like you hate DefTech & Audyssey, while I like Audyssey & DefTech), which makes the forum a lot more interesting.

Peace!
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post #1095 of 1813 Old 08-19-2013, 11:46 PM
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Another glowing review of the Pendragons here. I agree with everything John Zurek wrote.
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post #1096 of 1813 Old 08-20-2013, 06:16 AM
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Wow, what a review! The pictures of the speakers in his system looked fabulous. He must have had them for a very long time to write in such depth. Did you see Manti Te'O's girlfriend sitting next to them?

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post #1097 of 1813 Old 08-20-2013, 02:16 PM
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I am a new proud owner of a pair of Pendragon speakers. I ordered them in early June and received them this past Friday. I am thoroughly impressed with what I hear so far and I have not really played with room placement or allowed them top break in. I simply removed the Kef iQ70 speakers and inserted the Pendragons in their place. I have them connected to a Harman HK 990 Integrated Amp rated at 150 watts per channel into 8 ohms. I also have a Hsu Research VTF-II Mk4 subwoofer. I ordered the Pendragons with the black satin finish with a couple extra coats of lacquer, the clear caps upgrade and grills however the grills got lost in the order somewhere. They are definitely smoother than my Kefs and have a bigger sound stage. One thing I am a little surprised at is that they do not seem louder than my Kefs at comparable volume settings. It is my understanding that they are quite a bit more efficient but my experience does not necessarily support that. I am by no means concerned with that as they play plenty load. Aesthetically the finish matches very closely to the Hsu subwoofer. I am debating whether I really need the subwoofer or not. I will jujt have to spend a long weekend experimenting with driving them with and without bass management, equalization and crossover settings to see where the sweet spot seems to be. I would like to thank all those before me that took a leap of faith and provided their feedback after purchasing from an Internet Direct vendor. My experience with Eric was much like others have described. He listened to my needs and made suggestions to steer me to the right product and options. I think I even got a little break on shipping cost. I am a big fan if him and his company and hope he stays true to his passion and finds great reward in what he does. It was worth the wait.

My primary music source is Apple Lossless files played from a Mac Mini connected via USB to an Oppo BDP-105 disk player that serves as my DAC. I figured the Sabre Dacs in the Oppo should be as good as or better than the DAC in the HK 990 amp. I'm diggin it!
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I am glad you like your new speakers. I sure would like to hear the Pendragons one day, they certainly create interesting forum reading.
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post #1099 of 1813 Old 08-20-2013, 02:38 PM
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Originally Posted by gnorvell View Post

I am a new proud owner of a pair of Pendragon speakers. I ordered them in early June and received them this past Friday. I am thoroughly impressed with what I hear so far and I have not really played with room placement or allowed them top break in. I simply removed the Kef iQ70 speakers and inserted the Pendragons in their place. I have them connected to a Harman HK 990 Integrated Amp rated at 150 watts per channel into 8 ohms. I also have a Hsu Research VTF-II Mk4 subwoofer. I ordered the Pendragons with the black satin finish with a couple extra coats of lacquer, the clear caps upgrade and grills however the grills got lost in the order somewhere. They are definitely smoother than my Kefs and have a bigger sound stage. One thing I am a little surprised at is that they do not seem louder than my Kefs at comparable volume settings. It is my understanding that they are quite a bit more efficient but my experience does not necessarily support that. I am by no means concerned with that as they play plenty load. Aesthetically the finish matches very closely to the Hsu subwoofer. I am debating whether I really need the subwoofer or not. I will jujt have to spend a long weekend experimenting with driving them with and without bass management, equalization and crossover settings to see where the sweet spot seems to be. I would like to thank all those before me that took a leap of faith and provided their feedback after purchasing from an Internet Direct vendor. My experience with Eric was much like others have described. He listened to my needs and made suggestions to steer me to the right product and options. I think I even got a little break on shipping cost. I am a big fan if him and his company and hope he stays true to his passion and finds great reward in what he does. It was worth the wait.

My primary music source is Apple Lossless files played from a Mac Mini connected via USB to an Oppo BDP-105 disk player that serves as my DAC. I figured the Sabre Dacs in the Oppo should be as good as or better than the DAC in the HK 990 amp. I'm diggin it!

The Grills. What's up with the grills. My order is due to be shipped in 3 weeks. I'm being told by Tekton that they don't have a quality supplier yet for grills.
For me the grills are important. Between the kids and animals in my living room, I'm scared of damage.
How do the grills connect to the Pendragons? I wonder if there is a supplier for grills out there who could make a suitable set?
I'm glad you're enjoying your new speakers. Post some pics so we can see the extra clear coats appearance.
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post #1100 of 1813 Old 08-20-2013, 02:56 PM
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Well I hate to break the news to you but don't be surprised if you don't get any grills from Eric, you certainly wouldn't be the first to never get their grills. Go back to the very first page of this thread and you can see from day one grils have always been an issue.

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post #1101 of 1813 Old 08-20-2013, 03:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Chu Gai View Post

Wow, what a review! The pictures of the speakers in his system looked fabulous. He must have had them for a very long time to write in such depth. Did you see Manti Te'O's girlfriend sitting next to them?

Wow... tough crowd! You've gotta admit Chu Gui, that despite the problems that have been reported about delays and Eric's inability/refusal to supply speaker grills, the Pendragons (much like the Lores) are receiving universal praise from various "professional" sources as well as from quite a few owners. Are we all lying? Are we all being paid by Eric to pimp his wares? Maybe the Pens are just a great speaker?

Perhaps this is too flowery of audiophile language for you when describing speakers, but it eloquently articulates the Pendragon's sound signature to a tee. I wish I would have wrote it...

"The Tektons have a bit of a dual personality, a pleasing character that makes them non-fatiguing, but they are also true dynamic monsters. I cannot emphasize the legitimate dynamic capabilities of these speakers enough. Among the finest I've ever heard, they work well with symphonic swings that go from whisper to explosion, but also can effortlessly render metal while never running out of steam. Soft musical passages work as well; their high efficiency coupled with very benign impedance curve makes it easy for almost any amp to get a good balance at low levels. Equally as important as the Tekton's dynamic prowess is its luxuriant tonal color. Natural and warm, the speaker rendered full textures of both voices and instruments projected in layers of gorgeous sound. They have the ability to convey colors of instruments and voices in a very pleasing style." -- John Zurek

I'm an artist, not a technician, so I can't tell you why his tweeter array works as well as it does or why his design is punching so far above it's class, but I do know great sound when I hear it.

One of the most interesting things about the Pendragons is how they perform like much higher priced speakers. $2500.00 is pretty modest by high end standards so getting the sound of what 10k (and up) provides at that price is pretty freakin' cool. I know a lot of people scoffed when Andrew Robinson compared the Pendragon to higher end Wilsons, but he's not the only one who thinks they are priced very low compared to how they actually perform.

"If I had to guess the Pendragon's cost based on looks and performance I would have said ~$9K. If Eric had added a few accoutrements (grills, fancy logo, some really nice spikes, etc.) that figure could easily have been ~$12-15K. What really matters is that the Tektons' performance, like the Dude, abides. The Pendragon easily sets a new benchmark for performance at this price. I can't think of another speaker that can perform anywhere near this level for $2.5k. But, what if its personality is not your cup of tea? If that's the case Eric's got your back with a 30-day return policy." -- John Zurek


Wow... "Eric's got your back"? I guess Mr. Zurek hasn't read this thread! wink.gif


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I am a new proud owner of a pair of Pendragon speakers...


Welcome to the club! You're gonna love them.smile.gif
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post #1102 of 1813 Old 08-20-2013, 04:49 PM
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Wow... tough crowd! You've gotta admit Chu Gui, that despite the problems that have been reported about delays and Eric's inability/refusal to supply speaker grills, the Pendragons (much like the Lores) are receiving universal praise from various "professional" sources as well as from quite a few owners. Are we all lying? Are we all being paid by Eric to pimp his wares? Maybe the Pens are just a great speaker?

Perhaps this is too flowery of audiophile language for you when describing speakers, but it eloquently articulates the Pendragon's sound signature to a tee. I wish I would have wrote it...

"The Tektons have a bit of a dual personality, a pleasing character that makes them non-fatiguing, but they are also true dynamic monsters. I cannot emphasize the legitimate dynamic capabilities of these speakers enough. Among the finest I've ever heard, they work well with symphonic swings that go from whisper to explosion, but also can effortlessly render metal while never running out of steam. Soft musical passages work as well; their high efficiency coupled with very benign impedance curve makes it easy for almost any amp to get a good balance at low levels. Equally as important as the Tekton's dynamic prowess is its luxuriant tonal color. Natural and warm, the speaker rendered full textures of both voices and instruments projected in layers of gorgeous sound. They have the ability to convey colors of instruments and voices in a very pleasing style." -- John Zurek

I'm an artist, not a technician, so I can't tell you why his tweeter array works as well as it does or why his design is punching so far above it's class, but I do know great sound when I hear it.

One of the most interesting things about the Pendragons is how they perform like much higher priced speakers. $2500.00 is pretty modest by high end standards so getting the sound of what 10k (and up) provides at that price is pretty freakin' cool. I know a lot of people scoffed when Andrew Robinson compared the Pendragon to higher end Wilsons, but he's not the only one who thinks they are priced very low compared to how they actually perform.

"If I had to guess the Pendragon's cost based on looks and performance I would have said ~$9K. If Eric had added a few accoutrements (grills, fancy logo, some really nice spikes, etc.) that figure could easily have been ~$12-15K. What really matters is that the Tektons' performance, like the Dude, abides. The Pendragon easily sets a new benchmark for performance at this price. I can't think of another speaker that can perform anywhere near this level for $2.5k. But, what if its personality is not your cup of tea? If that's the case Eric's got your back with a 30-day return policy." -- John Zurek


Wow... "Eric's got your back"? I guess Mr. Zurek hasn't read this thread! wink.gif


Welcome to the club! You're gonna love them.smile.gif
I have a few beefs which aren't necessarily about Tekton.

One, is pictures. What's the point of just having stock photos? Reviews have more credibility when the person can actually demonstrate its in their system.

I and even you could have written that review without ever having the speaker in our room. Just a white paper, some stuff off the website, and a quick google will turn up all we'd need.

The writer is paid per review. If the principals at PF like your writing enough, they'll offer you a standard fee for what they accept. To me, much of this is the review sites acting as marketing extensions for the products they feature.

If you cut away the obvious from that particular review, there's not much. What did he drive it with? What musical selections and why?

Now that the product is reviewed, what happens to it? Does it go to,the next reviewer? Back to Tekton and if so, can it ethically be sold as new?

Btw, earlier you suggested possibly leaving. Don't!
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post #1103 of 1813 Old 08-20-2013, 05:09 PM
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I would like to see a picture but it doesn't sway
Me. I am pretty sure he tells the amp and music selection . I looked at a couple of his other reviews but he doesn't have enough reviews for me to use him. I realize that reviewers are paid , and have bias but if they have dozens of reviews on products that I agree are really good since I have heard them then I take them into account . They are a piece of the pie but no more then 25-30% of my overall judgement . That's for me not intended to impart on others.
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post #1104 of 1813 Old 08-20-2013, 07:12 PM
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Could you imagine any one of the car magazines doing a reasonably in depth review of a car and using stock footage? Any idea how to contact this guy?

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post #1105 of 1813 Old 08-20-2013, 08:16 PM
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Actually Edmunds. Uses stock photos with rarely a photo of the guy doing the test drive. Us news rankings also uses stock photos a lot. If it was a small website , unknown , and had few reviews then I would agree Chu . For well established sites I think its irrelevant .
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post #1106 of 1813 Old 08-20-2013, 09:10 PM
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I don't remember whether I read that the grilles were held in place with insertion studs or magnetic plates but either way, they have to factor the receiving part into the box build. I suppose you could velcro some homemade grilles in place but I personally would not tolerate a flimsy add on solution. I am not too worried as i don't have small kids or pets to worry about. Just the occasional curious teen or adult who like to poke things they don't fully understand. I'll try to get some good pictures of the finish and post them this weekend.
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post #1107 of 1813 Old 08-20-2013, 11:06 PM
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Originally Posted by gnorvell View Post

I am a new proud owner of a pair of Pendragon speakers. I ordered the Pendragons with the black satin finish with a couple extra coats of lacquer, the clear caps upgrade and grills however the grills got lost in the order somewhere. !
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Originally Posted by gnorvell View Post

I don't remember whether I read that the grilles were held in place with insertion studs or magnetic plates but either way, they have to factor the receiving part into the box build. I suppose you could velcro some homemade grilles in place but I personally would not tolerate a flimsy add on solution. I am not too worried as i don't have small kids or pets to worry about. Just the occasional curious teen or adult who like to poke things they don't fully understand. I'll try to get some good pictures of the finish and post them this weekend.

Hi Gnorvell, Congratulations on you Pendragons. They are great sounding speakers but welcome to the grill drama...

Based of your remarks do I understand that you thought you ordered grills?
I have attached a pic of the grill hole in my Pendragon. I am guessing that if you have no holes looks like you ain't getting any grills...Well I have holes and in 6 days it will be a year that I have been holding my breath for my grills so Im thinking possibly none of us are getting any grills.


I look at it like this... At least one grill has been made as the web site shows a grill on one of the Pendragons unless it is Photoshop grill. After looking at the pic on the site again, you tell me if it's a real grill?

If he can make one grill to take the picture for the website why in this world can he not make mine? Why does he just simply make good on the existing orders and remove that picture and optional grill offering from his website and never sell grills again? Does it take a rocket scientist to realize if you cant make a grill don't offer them! How can he still in good faith take a grill order? Has it not been well over a year that any grills have been made? Can he simply not say NO?

Months ago I was told that he needed to make either 50 grills or 50 pairs for customers and mine would ship soon; That was many months ago and I am wondering just how many people he now owes.

When all these customers go a year like I have he is going to have some big time PO'd customers. I do not think a good review will help when you have 50 - 100 +/- customers in the field that are as unhappy as I am.



It blows my mind when I see people still ordering grills.

Caveat Emptor People!



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post #1108 of 1813 Old 08-20-2013, 11:20 PM
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Amazing that it might be grills that are the straw that kills him. You would think the speaker would.be the thing that needs an.engineer !
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post #1109 of 1813 Old 08-21-2013, 05:54 AM
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Amazing that it might be grills that are the straw that kills him. You would think the speaker would.be the thing that needs an.engineer !
For the lack of a nail...a kingdom was lost.

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post #1110 of 1813 Old 08-21-2013, 06:08 AM
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There's a place out in California that makes speaker cabinets and grills. They're used by a few well known companies for some of their products. The thing is, to contract with them, you'd be looking at minimum orders of I would think at least 50 pieces if not more. So, if Tekton has let's say six speaker lines, theyd have to order 300 grills which would have to be paid for up front. Purely speculating, but if the average cost is $40 each, he'd have to come up with 12 thousand. From the time the final design is figured out to the first shipment could take several months.

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