NE Spring Speaker Shootout GTG - Date Poll and Discussion - AVS Forum
View Poll Results: Which date works best for you?
Saturday, April 6th 5 35.71%
Saturday, April 13th 8 57.14%
Saturday, March 30th 1 7.14%
Voters: 14. You may not vote on this poll

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post #1 of 935 Old 12-20-2012, 08:27 AM - Thread Starter
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Results thread can be found HERE.

Based on a continuation of this thread, let's set a date fellas.

It's official, the date is Saturday, April 13th. Woo! Some additional testing/demo to be done in late afternoon/early evening on Friday the 12th as well.

Location: Thornton, PA. Address details to be sent to confirmed attendees prior to the event.

Accommodations:
A few popular local choice from the last event:
Hampton Inn Concordville

My room: Gorillas basement hangout. Alternatively we could use my living room which is much more open but does not have any treatments. Or both rooms could be used like we did at the last event. smile.gif

Content: 45 second audio clips as specified by the attendees. Ben will be compiling a playback list.

Details as we discussed before:
  • 2 group of speakers to be demoed separately, perhaps in different rooms - full range without subs and high efficiency with subs
  • Standardize clip list and a volume level. Like we did with the subs, we could have a special section for "cutting them loose" at the end of the day or session.
  • Identify MOSTLY ID and DIY (current driver) setups as these would not be available for audition in stores
  • Roughly ~20-25 minutes of listening would be permitted per pair and 15-20 minutes for setup.
  • Repeat beer and food selection from Sub GTG
  • Use standardized amp to drive all speakers
  • Limit of 25 attendees so we have enough room and ensure everyone gets an opportunity to listen

Confirmed parties:

Current attendee count = 25 - currently at capacity
Current loudspeaker count: currently at capacity unless you guys can convince me otherwise
full range - 4 sets
with subs - 8 or 9 sets

1) Gorilla83, Andrew, CHT SHO-10 (with subs), DIYsoundgroup 'Sentinels' (with subs) (B&C 15PS76 15" driver / SEOS12 waveguide and DNA360 compression driver), Yorkville Unity U215 (with subs)
2) Imagic, Mark - documentation
3) Sibuna, Adam plus 2 guests - DIYsoundgroup Tempest 12s (Eminence Delta Pro 12A / SEOS12 waveguide and DNA 360 compression driver) and Fusion-10s (Eminence Delta 10" / SEOS12 waveguide and DNA 350 compression driver) , with subs
4) JimWilson - co-conspirator
5) Chopshop - Jake, food/drinks
6) Reefdvt - Dave
7) Rush2049 - Ben, KRK 10-3 monitors (full range), DJ!
8) RX-8 - Bill
9) mhrischuk - Mike, legacy focus SE (full range)
10) mikeduke - Mike
11) Jeff P from JTR speakers - Noesis, Captivator S2 subs
12) Ryansboston - Ryan, Arx A5 towers (full range)
13) 351carlo
14) goonstopper
15) SeaNile - John, JTR Triple 12s (with subs)
16) Gooddoc - food/drinks
17) Popalock - Austin, varying forms of greatness
18) Beastaudio - Brandon, TD12x SEOS (with subs) and/or LS6 line arrays (full range)
19) ironhead1230 - Mike aka the "beer king", Seaton Catylist 8Cs (with subs)
20) Mark Seaton
21) wfmiller - Wayne
22) logicators - soda/snacks
23) Kadath - beer

Special vendor guests:
1) MTG90, Matt Grant from DIYSoundgroup / The SEOS project

List of "stuff" we need:

Snacks/Water- Gorilla83
Snacks/Soft drinks -Chopshop (also beer)
Snacks/Soft drinks - open
Snacks/Soft drinks - logicators
Lunch food - Gooddoc
Lunch food - wfmiller
Lunch food - Ryansboston
Lunch food - popalock (wings)
Dinner food - rx-8 (providing $$$ to order food)
Dinner food - communal $$ fund
Dinner food - communal $$ fund
Beer / Liquor - Kadath
Beer / Liquor - ironhead1230
Beer / Liquor - Jim WIlson
Beer / Liquor - imagic / beastaudio
Dessert - Gorilla83
Dessert -MikeDuke


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post #2 of 935 Old 12-20-2012, 08:45 AM
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Where exactly in NE?
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post #3 of 935 Old 12-20-2012, 08:47 AM
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I'm in. Full range vs. high-efficiency, that is the question. I need the weekend to answer it.

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post #4 of 935 Old 12-20-2012, 08:50 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avsnoob10 View Post

Where exactly in NE?

Thornton, PA about 25 minutes south of the Philadelphia airport.
Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post

I'm in. Full range vs. high-efficiency, that is the question. I need the weekend to answer it.

Sounds good - what options are you considering?


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post #5 of 935 Old 12-20-2012, 08:55 AM
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I will definitely be there. I have a buddy that would like to tag along as well. he gets really curious about this stuff when i show up in PA.


Put me down for a pair of Tempest 12s and a pair of Delta Max 10s - they "should" be built by then

Subs should also be done however i see no need to bring them as you already have the same things.

I believe you have amps covered, but if you need another I can bring a XPA-3 if needed.

Id simply run your daytons for subs, or the emps, unless someone really wants to hear/bring a Subm or anything else you have at last count 13 subs in your house currently eek.gif
Time most likely won’t allow for audyssey but volume matching (if doable would be good)

For content I would pick a smaller number of tracks that are longer in length (at least for music) and some movie clips and play some of both. As we won’t just be looking at bass output the track list will most likely have to be redone to get stuff that has a larger range


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post #6 of 935 Old 12-20-2012, 08:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gorilla83 View Post

Thornton, PA about 25 minutes south of the Philadelphia airport.

Thanks. Is anyone else going from northern NJ? I might be interested and really okay with any of the dates, I have a pair of Ascend Sierra Towers with RAAL tweeter that I can bring (along with food/drink) for the "full-range no sub" group. Ascend Sierra Towers are not exactly full range but close enough wink.gif
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post #7 of 935 Old 12-20-2012, 09:04 AM
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If its a contest then whatever the rules may be so be it. Rules are rules.
If its a listening session or just a chance for everyone to enjoy the speaker offerings then try to get the "Most" out of each individual speaker whatever that may be.
If it needs EQ then do it or if it doesnt then do not. Since the only rule would be to give it what it needs to succeed then try to make each speaker shine and play to their individual strenghts and avoid any weakness if possible.
It can be extremely fun either way you go.
Good Luck
Chris
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post #8 of 935 Old 12-20-2012, 09:21 AM
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I would love to come down for any of the dates listed. I will have my Seos Tempests finished and could bring those along with CV5000, behringer ep4000 Dayton single sealed 18s, or anything else you would like. I will be happy to help with anything that I can (my tech skills are limited though:D) Happy to bring along food or beer!!!


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post #9 of 935 Old 12-20-2012, 09:26 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by countryWV View Post

If its a contest then whatever the rules may be so be it. Rules are rules.
If its a listening session or just a chance for everyone to enjoy the speaker offerings then try to get the "Most" out of each individual speaker whatever that may be.
If it needs EQ then do it or if it doesnt then do not. Since the only rule would be to give it what it needs to succeed then try to make each speaker shine and play to their individual strenghts and avoid any weakness if possible.
It can be extremely fun either way you go.
Good Luck
Chris

Thanks for the input Chris. The only issue becomes if some "need" EQ to achieve a flat response and others don't, some would argue we are unequally adding or taking away from the natural characteristics of the speaker on hand. Just something to consider.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChopShop1 View Post

I would love to come down for any of the dates listed. I will have my Seos Tempests finished and could bring those along with CV5000, behringer ep4000 Dayton single sealed 18s, or anything else you would like. I will be happy to help with anything that I can (my tech skills are limited though:D) Happy to bring along food or beer!!!

Sounds good - as the date approaches we will keep in touch to see what we need. BTW what is your first name?


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post #10 of 935 Old 12-20-2012, 09:31 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sibuna View Post

I will definitely be there. I have a buddy that would like to tag along as well. he gets really curious about this stuff when i show up in PA.
Put me down for a pair of Tempest 12s and a pair of Delta Max 10s - they "should" be built by then
Subs should also be done however i see no need to bring them as you already have the same things.
I believe you have amps covered, but if you need another I can bring a XPA-3 if needed.
Id simply run your daytons for subs, or the emps, unless someone really wants to hear/bring a Subm or anything else you have at last count 13 subs in your house currently eek.gif
Time most likely won’t allow for audyssey but volume matching (if doable would be good)
For content I would pick a smaller number of tracks that are longer in length (at least for music) and some movie clips and play some of both. As we won’t just be looking at bass output the track list will most likely have to be redone to get stuff that has a larger range

Got it - I was going to put you down on the list without even hearing from you, heh. I'm sure I'll have something that can suffice for sub duty. Dual "Silverbacks" should do the trick for sure. I should be covered with amps too, but we'll chat as the event nears to see what else we need.

Quote:
Originally Posted by avsnoob10 View Post

Thanks. Is anyone else going from northern NJ? I might be interested and really okay with any of the dates, I have a pair of Ascend Sierra Towers with RAAL tweeter that I can bring (along with food/drink) for the "full-range no sub" group. Ascend Sierra Towers are not exactly full range but close enough wink.gif

I'm sure someone in the area or along the way is interested, but this is the place to find out. tongue.gif


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post #11 of 935 Old 12-20-2012, 10:07 AM
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Got it - I was going to put you down on the list without even hearing from you, heh. tongue.gif

biggrin.gif

also you chould change it to Delta Max 10 as there is no definmax 10, i messed things up in my head.


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post #12 of 935 Old 12-20-2012, 11:22 AM
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What content would we like to hear? Movies, music, or both?

Both. Since the vast majority of the time the speakers and subs we're going to listen to will be used for HT it seems like having a mix would be a good idea.


EQ or no EQ?
Audyssey?

Yes to both. If we're anticipating about 30 minutes per setup it seems only fair to dial everything in as good as we can, in order to get the true essence of their capabilities.


Which subs to pair with the high efficiency group?

Seems like the host has that pretty much covered, but if someone has a nice alternative to try for some of the time I think it's worth considering.


Timeframe? I'd like to keep this to a 10-12 hour event if possible since we tend to lose alot of members after such a long period. This means we must be efficient like last time.

There's 24 hours in a day, why only party half of it? tongue.gif


-Someone to help with measurements

Jonathan, I think I hear someone calling your name...


-Someone to help coordinate the day and food (I may volunteer Jim Wilson here

Um, well I definitely hear someone calling my name! biggrin.gif


I think it would be cool to get a nice mix of "value oriented" setups as well some of the higher end gear like Seaton and JTR offerings.

Perhaps we should reach out to Mark and Jeff. If they aren't able to make the trek east again maybe they'll be willing to ship something out for us to demo for them.


JimWilson - yeah, he has been "voluntold"

The last person who used that term on me I divorced!


Ryan was the one who had the Arx speakers last time, wasn't he? I wonder if we can con him into coming down again. Sounds like the perfect venue for them. I have the Arx A1b and A2b for review, and they've proven to be some pretty impressive speakers. I listened to his A5's back in October, but only briefly while we were eating lunch. I'd like to spend some quality time with those.

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post #13 of 935 Old 12-20-2012, 11:24 AM
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Thanks. Is anyone else going from northern NJ?

I live in NW Jersey. Where are you at?

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post #14 of 935 Old 12-20-2012, 11:36 AM
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I live in NW Jersey. Where are you at?

Morris Plains/Parsippany Twp.
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Morris Plains/Parsippany Twp.

We're probably an hour from each other.

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I'm not even going to RSVP. Might just show up with my lawn chairs again.

What are going to do? Not let me in???

That's fine, I'm sure I'll be able to hear just fine outside...

 

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Austin, you have to have to be their. It simply won't be the same without you. smile.gif

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post #19 of 935 Old 12-20-2012, 06:36 PM - Thread Starter
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Austin, you have to have to be their. It simply won't be the same without you. smile.gif

Oh he WILL be there. biggrin.gif


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post #20 of 935 Old 12-20-2012, 06:43 PM
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I think it would be cool to get a nice mix of "value oriented" setups as well some of the higher end gear like Seaton and JTR offerings.

Perhaps we should reach out to Mark and Jeff.


Great idea. I know I would be tempted up upgrade and buy new stuff with those two companies represented.
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Oh he WILL be there. biggrin.gif

So he's been "voluntold" as well? tongue.gif

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post #22 of 935 Old 12-20-2012, 06:59 PM
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I think it would be cool to get a nice mix of "value oriented" setups as well some of the higher end gear like Seaton and JTR offerings.
Perhaps we should reach out to Mark and Jeff.
Great idea. I know I would be tempted up upgrade and buy new stuff with those two companies represented.

Agreed. I was looking very long and hard at the Noesis and Cats. I have decided to build three of the Seos Tempest to test just because the cost of three is less than one of the preceding. It would be very cool to compare them to something truly high end like that. I don't know how they would compare, but it would be fun for sure.


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post #23 of 935 Old 12-21-2012, 06:09 AM - Thread Starter
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Agreed. I was looking very long and hard at the Noesis and Cats. I have decided to build three of the Seos Tempest to test just because the cost of three is less than one of the preceding. It would be very cool to compare them to something truly high end like that. I don't know how they would compare, but it would be fun for sure.

We will see if we can garnish some interest from those guys again. I wouldn't mind listening to the Noesis again. Only problem is I'm afraid I will keep them this time, heh.
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So he's been "voluntold" as well? tongue.gif

I can try, right? tongue.gif


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post #24 of 935 Old 12-21-2012, 06:10 AM - Thread Starter
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I think it would be cool to get a nice mix of "value oriented" setups as well some of the higher end gear like Seaton and JTR offerings.
Perhaps we should reach out to Mark and Jeff.
Great idea. I know I would be tempted up upgrade and buy new stuff with those two companies represented.

John - can we count you in on this one? smile.gif


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post #25 of 935 Old 12-21-2012, 06:51 AM
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One Idea I'm kicking around for the speakers - file under full-range. A complete rehab of my PA cabinets - added bracing, padding, new crossover and new drivers. The original was based on B-52 parts from Eminence and Selenium, including the generic crossover. Upgrades exist for every part, and I would also significantly extend the ports to change the cabinets tuning to something lower. So, that would be a pair of twin 15" woofers and a 90x40 horn in a 8 cubic foot (approx) enclosure and likely over 1000 watts of power handling. As a bonus, they already have handles and wheels which is nice.

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post #26 of 935 Old 12-21-2012, 08:12 AM
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Since I'm so close I might offer to bring my Legacy Focus SE's at 200 lbs a piece. If interested I could bring them over at an earlier date just for convenience and care.
Other possibilities to bring is a pair of older B&W Matrix 805's
SVS PB-13 Ultra Sub

Also have a pair of circa 1971 Series I Bose 901's with the original EQ that I did a cap upgrade on. Would be kinda funny to compare how crappy they sound next to the good stuff.

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post #27 of 935 Old 12-21-2012, 09:19 AM
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Since I'm so close I might offer to bring my Legacy Focus SE's at 200 lbs a piece. If interested I could bring them over at an earlier date just for convenience and care.
Other possibilities to bring is a pair of older B&W Matrix 805's
SVS PB-13 Ultra Sub

Also have a pair of circa 1971 Series I Bose 901's with the original EQ that I did a cap upgrade on. Would be kinda funny to compare how crappy they sound next to the good stuff.

Back in the day Bose was good. Today? Not so much.

I'd love to hear what you have, especially the Legacy speakers.

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post #28 of 935 Old 12-21-2012, 09:39 AM
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I am up for it. I can bring my KRK 10-3's again, (play them earlier in the day so people can actually hear them, lol).

They are high-efficiency and full range..... so either category works.... or both.




I can also do the DJ work again, (My project file from the last meet was currupted somehow, but I have all the clips).

if we do 15-30 min per setup I suggest we have 12-15 clips total. Something made up before hand with print outs of track listing and an area for notes.


For the high efficiency category:
some material in the 20khz+ range,
sweeps at common crossover points for multi-way designs (400hz, 2khz, etc.),
and some very iconic and recognizable pieces should be used.

For the full-rage category: in addition to the above stuff:
sweeps or content that goes up/down the crossover between the mains and subs.


Also for those that were at the last event:
Did you like the frequency spectrum graphs? Would you like those again? (For this event they wouldn't be skewed so highly towards to low range)
Any additional visualization you would like? (I can see what I can do to meet demands)
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post #29 of 935 Old 12-21-2012, 11:01 AM
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I voted for the 13th but any day would probably work for me. I am pretty set on mains but that does not mean I am not interested in listening to some stuff I never heard before. I think if anybody has a DIY set that may be cool. Plus, I never really had a listening session with JTR speakers so I would love to hear them also. I am open to any format that the more experienced people decide on. Another long day of listening to speakers. What's not to love about that.

So would each setup (full range and speakers with sub) be playing at the same time? If so that means that a person would have to pick what they are interested the most in. Or would it be one group first, then the other group second.

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post #30 of 935 Old 12-21-2012, 12:01 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MIkeDuke View Post

I voted for the 13th but any day would probably work for me. I am pretty set on mains but that does not mean I am not interested in listening to some stuff I never heard before. I think if anybody has a DIY set that may be cool. Plus, I never really had a listening session with JTR speakers so I would love to hear them also. I am open to any format that the more experienced people decide on. Another long day of listening to speakers. What's not to love about that.
So would each setup (full range and speakers with sub) be playing at the same time? If so that means that a person would have to pick what they are interested the most in. Or would it be one group first, then the other group second.

Mike - I'd like to run the groups separate, we'll have to pick which goes first. I think if we limit setup and listening to 45 minutes per, we'll be fine.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rush2049 View Post

I am up for it. I can bring my KRK 10-3's again, (play them earlier in the day so people can actually hear them, lol).
They are high-efficiency and full range..... so either category works.... or both.
I can also do the DJ work again, (My project file from the last meet was currupted somehow, but I have all the clips).
if we do 15-30 min per setup I suggest we have 12-15 clips total. Something made up before hand with print outs of track listing and an area for notes.
For the high efficiency category:
some material in the 20khz+ range,
sweeps at common crossover points for multi-way designs (400hz, 2khz, etc.),
and some very iconic and recognizable pieces should be used.
For the full-rage category: in addition to the above stuff:
sweeps or content that goes up/down the crossover between the mains and subs.
Also for those that were at the last event:
Did you like the frequency spectrum graphs? Would you like those again? (For this event they wouldn't be skewed so highly towards to low range)
Any additional visualization you would like? (I can see what I can do to meet demands)

Thanks Ben! Would it be possible to see the actual video while demo'ing movie clips but the frequency graphs for music? That would be sweet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mhrischuk View Post

Since I'm so close I might offer to bring my Legacy Focus SE's at 200 lbs a piece. If interested I could bring them over at an earlier date just for convenience and care.
Other possibilities to bring is a pair of older B&W Matrix 805's
SVS PB-13 Ultra Sub
Also have a pair of circa 1971 Series I Bose 901's with the original EQ that I did a cap upgrade on. Would be kinda funny to compare how crappy they sound next to the good stuff.
Mike

Mike - You're probably 5 minutes away so you'll have to come. We could definitely help you haul the Legacys if you'd like to bring them. Might as bring the Ultra too since we didn't have that in the mix last time. biggrin.gif Let me know if you're in and I'll add you to the list.


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