My dad was about to buy the Bose Cinemate II for $599. I said WAIT!!! - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 18 Old 01-14-2013, 11:50 AM - Thread Starter
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This thing:




We were at Best Buy, and he clicks the button to hear the speakers. I have to admit... it did sound pretty decent. But, knowing that Bose is generally over-priced, I convinced him to let me check around first and see if there are better options.

So, I know people here generally don't like Bose. But I'd like to ask you to please be fair when comparing your recommendations to this Bose system. Because I heard it in stores, and it did sound pretty decent.

Bose also claims their speakers have a "surround sound effect". How true this is, I don't know. Can somebody set me straight? In the store, there did seem to be a surround sound effect, but I'm guessing this could be due to the audio that was playing... not the speakers themselves.

So, for $599, what would be the best option for a 2.1 channel system?

Thanks guys... steer me in the right direction!
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post #2 of 18 Old 01-14-2013, 12:58 PM
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I put together a 2.1 system for my computer around that price... sounds fantastic would blow the Bose system out of the water.

Denon AVR-590 (Bought used on Ebay - $75)
Definitive Technology ProMonitor 800 Speakers ($145 each)
Outlaw M8 Subwoofer ($249)

I went with those speakers as I wanted something smaller on my desk that still would produce clean audio down to 80Hz and they more than live up to that. For the price you could get better speakers though that are bigger if space/size isn't a concern.
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post #3 of 18 Old 01-14-2013, 12:58 PM
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I'd rather have this...
http://www.amazon.com/Yamaha-YHT-597-5-1-Channel-Network-Theater/dp/B007PU2X6C

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post #4 of 18 Old 01-14-2013, 01:11 PM
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First, no system, Bose or other, provides "surround sound" unless it has rear speaker. Unless of course your room is a perfect square with no doors/windows so as to get perfect reflections and even then, limited reflection...
Second, the base module that comes with the Bose systems is a mediocre "subwoofer-like" device at best...
Finally, no satelitte speakers with 2 1/4 -3 inch drivers can provide the midbase, so you will experience gaps in the freq. produced (much like you would have with the Energy Take Classic)...and the Bose sats have no tweeters, so you will be missing highs as well- okay the twidler technology will provide the highs!?

How about this...I was able to pick up a pair of Def tech SM 450 for 208/pr recently from New Egg. If you can find that deal, then the Klipsch Sync sub for 300, you got a low 500 (plus shipping, usually free from New Egg) system that will definately beat the Cinemate system

Set up #1: EMP e5ti, e5Ci, and SLS Q line Audio surrounds, EMP 10i10i sub
Set up #2: Def Tech SM450, CLR2002, SLS Qline surrounds and Klipsch 12wD sub
Set up #3: JBL130, JBL120C and Klipsch synergy sub
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post #5 of 18 Old 01-14-2013, 01:18 PM
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This would be better

http://www.amazon.com/Onkyo-HT-S8409-7-1-Channel-Network-Receiver/dp/B005EP2HMU/ref=sr_1_2?s=aht&srs=2530057011&ie=UTF8&qid=1358197403&sr=1-2&keywords=Onkyo+Home+theater+system

or this....

http://www.amazon.com/Denon-DHT-1513BA-Channel-Theater-Acoustics/dp/B007R8U5RG/ref=sr_1_39?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1358197536&sr=1-39&keywords=home+theater+system

And if you really want to embarrass any Bose Lifestyle system for a fraction of the cost, these right here with a nice receiver

http://www.amazon.com/Mirage-MX-Channel-Miniature-High-Performance/dp/B004MEWZL2/ref=sr_1_2?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1358197601&sr=1-2&keywords=home+theater+system

A receiver like this...

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Pioneer+Elite+-+Elite+560W+7.1-Ch.+3D+Pass-Through+A/V+Home+Theater+Receiver/4989046.p?id=1218591008130&skuId=4989046

or something like this....

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Denon+-+600W+5.1-Ch.+3D+Pass+Through+A/V+Home+Theater+Receiver/4791729.p?id=1218529593955&skuId=4791729

That Mirage set-up would beat out any Bose lifestyle system they make, which can cost up to several grand.

If you really want to stay away from surround speakers, then take a look at some sound bars like this...

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Klipsch+-+Icon+SB+1+Soundbar+with+10%26%2334%3B+Wireless+Subwoofer/6263926.p?id=1218725178973&skuId=6263926

or this...

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Energy+-+Energy+Power+Bar+Elite+2-Way+Soundbar+System+with+10%26%2334%3B+Wireless+Subwoofer/4863477.p?id=1218557750218&skuId=4863477


I hope this helps. My highest recommendation out of all of these would be the Mirage speakers with the Pioneer receiver of course wink.gif But I think they are ALL better options then Bose. Definitely more bang for your buck.
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post #6 of 18 Old 01-14-2013, 01:54 PM
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I actually have hands on time with the Cinemate system and you can definitely do better. I would stay away from other HTIB solutions and soundbars as well and get something you can build upon. Something like this for a receiver:

$129
http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/DENAVR1312/DENON-AVR-1312-5.1-Channel-A/V-Home-Theater-Receiver/1.html

$125 x2 = $250
And these for speakers (if he has room for floor standing):
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Pioneer+-+5-1/4%26%2334%3B+Floor+Speaker+%28Each%29/5086937.p?id=1218610014331&skuId=5086937

If fllorstanding are too big, then consider 1 pair of these for $129 a pair:
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Pioneer+-+4%26%2334%3B+Bookshelf+Speakers+%28Pair%29/5086955.p?id=1218610014045&skuId=5086955

This center channel speaker ($99):
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Pioneer+-+Dual+4%26%2334%3B+Center-Channel+Speaker/5086891.p?id=1218610015437&skuId=5086891

And then this subwoofer for $144 shipped:
http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=300-629


If you go with the floorstanding speaker you will be slightly over $600 after taxes and everything else, but this system would blow the Bose away. Your dad can add the matching Pioneer surrounds down the road (bookshelves linked to above) and would have solid 5.1 sound on a budget. He could also get two pairs of bookshelves if you skip the floorstanding and have 5.1 for just over $600.

The Andrew Jones line is getting rave reviews and is well worth the money.
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post #7 of 18 Old 01-14-2013, 02:00 PM
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fwiw,pair of ascend acoustics cbm 170se's on sale for $299
wait for the polk psw505 to go back on sale for $198 at newegg soon

i'm so laid back,i'm laid out
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post #8 of 18 Old 01-14-2013, 02:01 PM
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A pair of Infinity Primus 163 speakers (no sub) and a Denon R590 would sound pretty good - and even thrash the Bose setup even with its 'sub' (HA!). Poor excuse for a sub - it tries to cover a range of about 250hz and down which is nearly impossible for the best true sub. It does that because that little 3" 'woofer' can't go lower. There is even enough budget for a sub if you like - not entirely necessary since the Primus play very low. Why not a stereo receiver? Cause the AVR has bass management.

I've heard those Bose demo stations. Ever wonder why there are no other systems set up next to them?

Specs for the Bose Accoustimas:

SATELLITES BASS MODULE
Frequency Response 280 Hz to 13.3k Hz at ±10.5 dB 46Hz to 202Hz at ±2.3 dB
Sensitivity (SPL at 1 meter)* 85.1 dB N/A
Impedance (minimum/nominal) 5.3/8 ohms N/A
Bass Limits (-3/-6 dB) 280/220 Hz 46/40 Hz


Take a look at frequency response. The satellite speaker covers 280hz and up - the 'sub' covers 46hz to 202hz - net effect is no coverage from 202-280hz leaving a sizable hole in the mid-range. Most people do not notice this 'hole' when listening to the demos. FWIW I've got a pair of floor standing speakers that play down to 36hz at -6db. I don't 'hate' Boze. And these are simply facts that Bose apologists tend to ignore.

As for the supposed 'surround effects' from a pair of speakers - I could fart and call myself a flutist but it wouldn't make it so.

When all else fails - RTFM!

♫♫♫ Two Channel Rules! ♫♫♫

GO SEAHAWKS!!!
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post #9 of 18 Old 01-14-2013, 02:03 PM
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If his budget is fixed at $599, I would start with two good bookshelf speakers (Klipsch, HSU, Arx, Cambridge, KEF all have bookshelf speakers in this price range) and an inexpensive receiver. This alone will likely exceed the sound quality of the Bose system, and he can always add a sub later.

Aside from a poor value proposition, my main issue with a Bose system like this is that you can never upgrade it. The frequency response of the satellites is so poor that the "bass module" crossover is something absurd like 250 Hz. Therefore, you could never upgrade your sub at a later point because no traditional sub plays up to 250 Hz.
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post #10 of 18 Old 01-14-2013, 02:14 PM
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Those surround speakers may make your brain think that you are listening to sound behind your ears but that illusion is far from reality .

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post #11 of 18 Old 01-14-2013, 02:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by losservatore View Post

Those surround speakers may make your brain think that you are listening to sound behind your ears but that illusion is far from reality .
There's an illusion that there are two more speakers because for the price you paid Bose you should have gotten at least two more. cool.gif
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post #12 of 18 Old 01-14-2013, 02:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Fitzmaurice View Post

There's an illusion that there are two more speakers because for the price you paid Bose you should have gotten at least two more. cool.gif

Zing!
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post #13 of 18 Old 01-14-2013, 02:52 PM
 
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You press the button and immediately around you you can hear the BOSE sound effects sounding good.

But how far away are you from those speakers in store?

They are basically computer speakers. my 2.1 $50 computer speakers don't sound bad at all when I'm sitting at my desk. But 7 feet away, they sound like garbage.

Bose is the same, they are garbage speakers, out them next to an average set of bookshelves/center/sub etc then sit the actual distance you would sit from your TV...

Bose is garbage, their are significantly better options for a lot less money. Check out budget systems like the 5.1 pioneers (Andrew Jones) or budget brands like fluance. Bose doesn't stack up well at all.
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post #14 of 18 Old 01-14-2013, 03:04 PM
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I prefer to go with a fluance system than going with bose.

www.fluance.com







forgot to mention Andrew Jones Designed 5.1 Channel Speaker Package.
http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Home/Home-Theater-Systems/Speaker-Packages/SP-PK52FS

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post #15 of 18 Old 01-14-2013, 03:14 PM
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http://usa.denon.com/us/product/pages/productlanding.aspx?catid=hometheatersystems(denonna)&catalog=denonna_us

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post #16 of 18 Old 01-14-2013, 03:23 PM
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If your dad has room for them on either side of this TV, I'd suggest two of the Energy V5.2c from wwstereo (also have a rosenut finish), promo code VER52WW brings them down to $340 for the pair. These can be used as LCR speakers in vertical positions. Then a Denon 1312 from accessories4less.com, and add a sub later if he'd like deeper bass (which would be a plus for HT usage).

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post #17 of 18 Old 01-14-2013, 03:25 PM
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Yep, and you'll have lett over money too.

Afro GT
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post #18 of 18 Old 01-14-2013, 06:13 PM
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I was looking at that and if you click on the more expensive of the two it talks about it being a 1513 receiver for part of the description and for other parts talks about it being a 1613 receiver so it's kinda confusing but if it's a 1513 it won't have any room correction software, just an fyi.

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