$1000 to spend for new entertainment audio - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 56 Old 01-25-2013, 06:53 PM - Thread Starter
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Let me start off by saying I am not an audiophile by any means. My wife says I am partially deaf (or it could be selective hearing). Regardless, audio has never been of extreme importance to me in an entertainment system and anything will be a step up from my current LG HTIB. I needed to buy a new receiver and figured I would buy new speakers to go along with it. I'm looking at last year's Denon AVR-1912. I know this is a decent receiver and $375 is not a bad price for it. I want to buy two floor-standing, a center and a powered sub to go with it. I live in a small apartment, but it's an open-floor plan with the living room, dining room, and kitchen open as one. I would say it is about a 22' x 24' area. I will also not be cranking this system to ridiculously high levels for fear of angry neighbors looking to turn me in. The system will be used about 50% of the time for movies, 30% TV and 20% video games. I know $600 is not a lot to buy the speakers I want, but if anyone can help me, you guys can. If I missed any important information, please ask below. Thanks so much!
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post #2 of 56 Old 01-25-2013, 07:06 PM - Thread Starter
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After thinking of my time breakdown, I suppose I would also listen to music with the new system. I never used my entertainment system for music in the past since the speakers were not great, but streaming Pandora doesn't sound like a bad idea.
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post #3 of 56 Old 01-25-2013, 07:42 PM
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Few thoughts -
Apartment with neighbors - either bookshelf and sub (not down-firing), or floor-standing and no sub. Low frequency travels through walls and floors. I don't think you will be able to drive a sub very hard, so a set of full-range speakers would be fine. If you get bookshelf speakers you will need the sub, but a moderate (10") one, shaking the room won't be a good idea.

Drop the center to start with.

You could do something like 2 NHT absolute zeros and a matching sub as one option.Cambridge Audio S20 and a sub is another. I'm not really sure what to suggest for floorstanders, everything I think of starts at around $800/pair.
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post #4 of 56 Old 01-26-2013, 03:17 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the reply, lespurgeon. The reason I want to go with the floor standing speakers is because I want to get away from my stands that look horrible with my setup. My tv stand is just large enough for my tv, which makes the stands a requirement for bookshelf speakers. I'll stick with them only if I have to.

As for the center channel, I was under the impression center channel speakers were good for movies since it is sometimes hard to hear vocals especially in my case. I have to turn movies pretty loud to hear dialogue and then my wife yells about it being too loud.

I can see me not needing the sub so much for reasons you stated. Especially if I bought floor standing speakers that could handle the lows.

I found some nice-looking speakers from BIC. Is this a good company? Thanks again for any help.
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post #5 of 56 Old 01-26-2013, 03:38 PM
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Boston tower speakers, with a black grill - good price
http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/BOSA250WHA/BOSTON-ACOUSTICS-A250-2-Way-Dual-5.25in-Floor-Standing-Speaker-EA-White/1.html

Boston center channel
http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/BOSA225CGBA/BOSTON-ACOUSTICS-A225C-2-Way-Center-Channel-Speaker-Black/1.html

JBL subwoofer - Studio 150P
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16882665157

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post #6 of 56 Old 01-26-2013, 04:37 PM - Thread Starter
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Hey zieglj01, thanks for the links. I noticed the BA speakers are white which is a no-go for me. I guess I should have mentioned I'm looking for everything in black.

The sub does have a very nice look to it. Are down-firing subs better? Does it matter that I have medium-length carpeting?

What am I looking for in center speakers? I'd only keep one for clarity in dialogue during movies.
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post #7 of 56 Old 01-26-2013, 05:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JessePotter View Post

Hey zieglj01, thanks for the links. I noticed the BA speakers are white which is a no-go for me. I guess I should have mentioned I'm looking for everything in black.

The sub does have a very nice look to it. Are down-firing subs better? Does it matter that I have medium-length carpeting?

What am I looking for in center speakers? I'd only keep one for clarity in dialogue during movies.

A good subwoofer is a good subwoofer, regardless of how it fires - front, down or sideways.

Down firing subs can work on carpet - what is your definition of medium lenght?

I prefer that a center channel will timbre (voice) match the left and right speaker. I prefer to stay
in the same series. Overall a speaker that is the same as your left and right speakers, is the best
option. If you can not do 3 towers, then the same series bookshelf speaker, in vertical placement
would be a good option - if not, then the series horizontal center is the preference.

HTD Level Two speakers are good, and they also come in black - you can try them out and save
for a subwoofer - they will have some decent bass.
http://www.htd.com/Products/level-two-speakers/Level-TWO-Tower-Speakers
http://www.htd.com/Products/level-two-speakers/Level-TWO-Center-Channel-Speaker

http://www.htd.com/Products/level-two-speakers

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Speakers > MB Quart VS05, Boston VS260, Snell K7
Subwoofer > Mordaunt Short Aviano 7
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post #9 of 56 Old 01-26-2013, 08:54 PM - Thread Starter
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So many choices! Both the HTD and the Pioneers look good. For my uses, do you think I could get away with just having the two HTD towers? All I really need is clarity in the highs to understand dialogue and just enough bass to make movies more realistic. As I stated, I'm not an audiophile and I will not be listening to reference music with this system.
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post #10 of 56 Old 01-26-2013, 09:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JessePotter View Post

So many choices! Both the HTD and the Pioneers look good. For my uses, do you think I could get away with just having the two HTD towers? All I really need is clarity in the highs to understand dialogue and just enough bass to make movies more realistic. As I stated, I'm not an audiophile and I will not be listening to reference music with this system.
No

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post #11 of 56 Old 01-26-2013, 09:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JessePotter View Post

For my uses, do you think I could get away with just having the two HTD towers? All I really need is clarity in the highs to understand dialogue and just enough bass to make movies more realistic. As I stated, I'm not an audiophile and I will not be listening to reference music with this system.

The HTD towers with their center, can work for now - while you decide about sub, or no sub.
Also, HTD is having a 10% off sale.

A powered subwoofer will have a volume control - apartments can be a challange.

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Speakers > MB Quart VS05, Boston VS260, Snell K7
Subwoofer > Mordaunt Short Aviano 7
Receiver > Tascam PA-R200, Pioneer VSX-30
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post #12 of 56 Old 01-26-2013, 11:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Since I'm a little anal about things matching, I'm considering this line-up:

http://www.amazon.com/America-FT-6T-400-Watt-2-Way-Speaker/dp/B002ISZEV2/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1359269606&sr=1-1&keywords=bic+FT-6T

http://www.amazon.com/BIC-America-FH6-LCR-6-5-Inch-Frequency/dp/B0015A8Y3E/ref=pd_bxgy_e_text_y

http://www.amazon.com/BIC-America-F12-475-Watt-Subwoofer/dp/B0015A8Y5M/ref=pd_bxgy_e_text_z

I know it is a bit above that $600 cap, but I'd pay a little more for nice-looking, matching speakers as well. What do you guys think?

The Pioneer set looks nice as well, but that center channel will not fit in my TV stand. The BIC America center is more convenient for its size.
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post #13 of 56 Old 01-26-2013, 11:17 PM - Thread Starter
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What exactly am I looking for in the speakers/sub? I noticed of the two subs recommended, one had more power driving it while the other had a better frequency response. I'm sorry if I'm acting like a total noob here, but I have never taken the time before now to learn about these things.
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post #14 of 56 Old 01-26-2013, 11:32 PM - Thread Starter
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I'm now thinking about the HTD towers and center with the JBL sub (I know, I'm all over the place and my budget has just been broken). What makes those towers so much better than the Pioneers to cost twice as much?
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post #15 of 56 Old 01-27-2013, 03:59 AM
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I think you may be looking at the dimensions of the centers wrong. They are pretty close to the same size. I would guess the Pioneer is probably smaller than the fh6. You might want to investigate that further.

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post #16 of 56 Old 01-27-2013, 04:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JessePotter View Post

I'm now thinking about the HTD towers and center with the JBL sub (I know, I'm all over the place and my budget has just been broken). What makes those towers so much better than the Pioneers to cost twice as much?
Nothing. They have a nicer looking cabinet if that's worth paying twice as much to you. My guess would be the Pioneer sound as good if not possibly better. The Bics are good speakers too. You will get more bass out of them but that wont make any difference once you get a sub. Again the Pioneer probably sound better and cost less. Your not going to beat the Pioneer unless you spend a lot more or find a big discount on something imo. The JBL sub looks like a good bargain. I haven't heard anything about it. The F12 is a proven performer in that $ class but the JBL has 100rms more and it looks like it may be more accurate.
And, don't forget you will have a 5.1 system for your money and wont be concerned with piecing it together in a couple of months. Everything will match acoustically and cosmetically with the Pioneer.

Good luck.

btw If you want to know more about the Pioneer, go here. Many people here love them:

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1278774/pioneers-speaker-genius-hits-low-price-point

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post #17 of 56 Old 01-27-2013, 05:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JessePotter View Post

What exactly am I looking for in the speakers/sub? I noticed of the two subs recommended, one had more power driving it while the other had a better frequency response. I'm sorry if I'm acting like a total noob here, but I have never taken the time before now to learn about these things.
The F12 is a 12" and probably goes a little lower. The JBL is a 10" and looks like it is more accurate. With more wattage on the JBL they probably have about the same output. Personally I would trade accuracy over a slightly lower frequency response any day. The JBL will probably be much better for music and about the same for theater. I have an F12 (got it before I upgraded to a better sub) and it is fine for theater but a terd for music. Its loud enough but not accurate and that can be annoying for music.

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post #18 of 56 Old 01-27-2013, 06:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JessePotter View Post

I'm now thinking about the HTD towers and center with the JBL sub (I know, I'm all over the place and my budget has just been broken). What makes those towers so much better than the Pioneers to cost twice as much?

Looking at so-called sub frequency response, will not tell you a lot. If you want a good performing sub that is controlled and does
go down low - Then the JBL is solid for the price.
There are more expensive subs - that falls short of this review
http://www.avhub.com.au/images/stories/australian-hifi/reviews/2011-05_to_12/2011-11/jbl_sub150p_subwoofer_review_lores.pdf

Also speculation is nice - however, HTD has more going for it than just a cabinet - they would also cost more, if sold in stores.

It all comes down to what is enough for you, and what will make you happy - the Pioneer is a good speaker. Even if you buy the
Pioneer speakers - I would still take the JBL sub.

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post #19 of 56 Old 01-27-2013, 08:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JessePotter View Post

What exactly am I looking for in the speakers/sub? I noticed of the two subs recommended, one had more power driving it while the other had a better frequency response. I'm sorry if I'm acting like a total noob here, but I have never taken the time before now to learn about these things.

Yeah. Understanding sub specs can be difficult, and then the manufacturers often mislead with the way that they state things. The BIC F12 has a very peaky frequency response high up and thus may not have much usable output down below 30hz. Go with the JBL. It should have better sounding bass.

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post #20 of 56 Old 01-27-2013, 08:46 AM
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If I was you and you were me and since we're living in a apartment I would look at this. http://usa.denon.com/us/product/pages/productlanding.aspx?catid=hometheatersystems(denonna)&catalog=denonna_us
I bet it would be a step up from the HTIB you have now. Then when "we" move out of the apartment and get a residential house we can really buy a better system. We won't be able to crank it up anyways especially with the way our neighbors are.

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post #21 of 56 Old 01-27-2013, 01:48 PM
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If I was you and you were me and since we're living in a apartment I would look at this. http://usa.denon.com/us/product/pages/productlanding.aspx?catid=hometheatersystems(denonna)&catalog=denonna_us
I bet it would be a step up from the HTIB you have now. Then when "we" move out of the apartment and get a residential house we can really buy a better system. We won't be able to crank it up anyways especially with the way our neighbors are.
Mehhh Id go with the Pioneer 3.0, then decide if you still want a sub. Despite what people on here say you don't NEED a sub especially coming from TV speakers.

If you are stuck on the Denon its a good receiver but id go with the Pioneer 1022 its only $250 right now... and it will match the speakers lol
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post #22 of 56 Old 01-27-2013, 01:51 PM
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Yeah I am a Denon fan gave my son to use a Denon 3808CI and now I have a Denon A100. Never any problems with the two of them.

"We can complain because rose bushes have thorns or rejoice because thorn bushes have roses". - Abraham Lincoln
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post #23 of 56 Old 01-27-2013, 02:01 PM
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Mehhh Id go with the Pioneer 3.0, then decide if you still want a sub. Despite what people on here say you don't NEED a sub especially coming from TV speakers.

If you are stuck on the Denon its a good receiver but id go with the Pioneer 1022 its only $250 right now... and it will match the speakers lol

you don't even need 3.0 go with a phantom center. What speakers do the Pioneer come with? The Pioneers? They are pretty decent my son has the towers in his BR without a sub and they go pretty low and they are inexpensive

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post #24 of 56 Old 01-27-2013, 02:21 PM
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you don't even need 3.0 go with a phantom center. What speakers do the Pioneer come with? The Pioneers? They are pretty decent my son has the towers in his BR without a sub and they go pretty low and they are inexpensive
But why not get then center for $100? What do you mean what do they come with? There's the center, towers and book shelves and the SW-8 sub, there is a 5.1 tower package for $600 some and a 5.1 bookshelf package for like $500, but for a 3.0 you can just buy the towers and center around $100 a pop. I have the old FS51, BS21 5.0 in my bedroom too and they go really low, I feel like a sub would just shake stuff more. They do great with movies I just like my 8" KRK monitors more for music.
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post #25 of 56 Old 01-27-2013, 02:30 PM
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What speakers are you referring to with the Pioneer 3.0 package. Just being in a apartment I would go the less expensive route hence the Denon package I mentioned and when the OP moves to a permanent residence just move the less expensive to his BR.

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post #26 of 56 Old 01-27-2013, 02:54 PM - Thread Starter
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ScaryFatKidGT, I seriously had not even considered other AVRs since I had heard so many good things about the Denons. I looked at the Pioneer and it seems the line has issues with dropping out the HDMI signal every so often. I have not heard of any issues like this with the Denons.
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post #27 of 56 Old 01-27-2013, 03:11 PM
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Right now on Denon website you can get that setup as a Factory refurb for a $100 less than I quoted. http://usa.denon.com/us/product/pages/ProductDetail.aspx?catalog=denonna_us&PCatId=refurbishedprocat(denonna)&CatId=HomeTheaterSystemsRef(DenonNA)&Pid=DHT1513BA(DenonNA)&IsRef=1
I'm just giving some insight. I wish instead of upgrading and selling 4 or 5 times over the years and losing money even though my buddies got some decent equipment for a great price I would of just used a decent but less expensive setup and saved up or purchased little by little of a system I would not have to upgrade.

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post #28 of 56 Old 01-27-2013, 03:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Browninggold, the problem with that 1513 is it only has three HDMI inputs. I need a bare minimum of four right now with room for expansion preferable. I also wanted to get away from the speaker stands that I would require for any bookshelf speakers. That's why I started looking at towers. It looks like the Pioneer towers and center with the JVC sub is the best deal so far.
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post #29 of 56 Old 01-27-2013, 03:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JessePotter View Post

That's why I started looking at towers. It looks like the Pioneer towers and center with the JVC sub is the best deal so far.

Are you talking about JVC or a JBL subwoofer?

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Speakers > MB Quart VS05, Boston VS260, Snell K7
Subwoofer > Mordaunt Short Aviano 7
Receiver > Tascam PA-R200, Pioneer VSX-30
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post #30 of 56 Old 01-27-2013, 03:38 PM - Thread Starter
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I meant the JBL, sorry. JVC sucks in my experience, not sure why I typed that. The only problem with the Pioneers is that center is about 18" wide and the hole I want to fit it in is about 17" wide. I guess I can find a work-around.
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