In-wall behind AT Screen Placement Help - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 19 Old 02-25-2013, 04:46 PM - Thread Starter
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Okay, so I finally took the plunge, ordered all my equiment. Panny AE7000 Projector, Jamestown AT Screen(Seymour CenterStage XD), Sony STR-DN1030 Receiver, 2 pair of BIC America FH8-W Speakers(will have an extra one, as these are for center/left/right), 1 pair of BIC America FH6-W for rear speakers, Klipsch RW12-D Subwoofer. and 3 rows of 2 recliners(risers of 7 and 14 inches for 2nd and 3rd row) Had an idea of how i wanted to lay everything out, now I'm down to actually laying it out, and wanted to get some help here.

Here is a quick and dirty image i threw together. Took a picture of the area with the screen, and then just used paint to add some graphics and information to it. Yellow lines are the location of the studs in the wall





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I hung some pieces of paper up where I'm thinking the speakers will go, now one of my problems is that b/c the speaker isn't a multiple of 16(stud distance), I can't get speakers exactly equi-distance from the sides of the screen. Will this still sound really well, or is it going to throw it off a bit b/c of it? As it is now, on the left side, the left speaker will be just about even with the center of my face if I'm sitting on that side. So if you drew a straight line from the speaker to me, my left ear will be a few inches to the left of the edge of the speaker. Now on the right side, the speaker will be about 5-6 inches to the right of the right most seat in the row.

Now, for the back of the room, I have more lee-way since it's not limited to where the screen is, and I can easily place them wider than the seats, so the back right speaker is a few inches to the right of the seats and same for the back left side. Should I do that, or do I need to line up the back speakers with the front speakers in terms of distance apart?


Next question, is 7 inches enough for risers, I've read between 6-7 inches is about where you want to be. If you look in the middle of the picture, you can see where 38 inches(measured distance from ground to ear height for me - 5'10"). So next two levels of seats would be 45 and 52. Now couple of questions there, the speaker height, I didn't place them where they will be in terms of height, so should I just put the center of the speaker around the 2nd row height(45 inches), this way it's going in the middle of lowest vs highest. Then what about the rears, should the rears height be the same or a big higher?

One last question, sub-woofer placement, My plan was to place it right where the black box is no this next picture. Now, should the cone face outward, our face where the seats will be



Uploaded with ImageShack.us

Obviously if this basement was un-finished and I had my choice, I would have built it around being a home theater, and I wouldn't have the above problems. However, for our budget, we are doing what we can to fit the home theater in the space, rather than tearing everything up and starting from scratch.
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post #2 of 19 Old 02-25-2013, 08:52 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by cbo0485 View Post

Okay, so I finally took the plunge, ordered all my equiment. Panny AE7000 Projector, Jamestown AT Screen(Seymour CenterStage XD), Sony STR-DN1030 Receiver, 2 pair of BIC America FH8-W Speakers(will have an extra one, as these are for center/left/right), 1 pair of BIC America FH6-W for rear speakers, Klipsch RW12-D Subwoofer. and 3 rows of 2 recliners(risers of 7 and 14 inches for 2nd and 3rd row) Had an idea of how i wanted to lay everything out, now I'm down to actually laying it out, and wanted to get some help here.

Here is a quick and dirty image i threw together. Took a picture of the area with the screen, and then just used paint to add some graphics and information to it. Yellow lines are the location of the studs in the wall





Uploaded with ImageShack.us

I hung some pieces of paper up where I'm thinking the speakers will go, now one of my problems is that b/c the speaker isn't a multiple of 16(stud distance), I can't get speakers exactly equi-distance from the sides of the screen. Will this still sound really well, or is it going to throw it off a bit b/c of it? As it is now, on the left side, the left speaker will be just about even with the center of my face if I'm sitting on that side. So if you drew a straight line from the speaker to me, my left ear will be a few inches to the left of the edge of the speaker. Now on the right side, the speaker will be about 5-6 inches to the right of the right most seat in the row.

Now, for the back of the room, I have more lee-way since it's not limited to where the screen is, and I can easily place them wider than the seats, so the back right speaker is a few inches to the right of the seats and same for the back left side. Should I do that, or do I need to line up the back speakers with the front speakers in terms of distance apart?


Next question, is 7 inches enough for risers, I've read between 6-7 inches is about where you want to be. If you look in the middle of the picture, you can see where 38 inches(measured distance from ground to ear height for me - 5'10"). So next two levels of seats would be 45 and 52. Now couple of questions there, the speaker height, I didn't place them where they will be in terms of height, so should I just put the center of the speaker around the 2nd row height(45 inches), this way it's going in the middle of lowest vs highest. Then what about the rears, should the rears height be the same or a big higher?

One last question, sub-woofer placement, My plan was to place it right where the black box is no this next picture. Now, should the cone face outward, our face where the seats will be



Uploaded with ImageShack.us

Obviously if this basement was un-finished and I had my choice, I would have built it around being a home theater, and I wouldn't have the above problems. However, for our budget, we are doing what we can to fit the home theater in the space, rather than tearing everything up and starting from scratch.
any help?
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post #3 of 19 Old 02-26-2013, 04:46 AM
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Put the center of your speakers vertically at ear height. Split the difference between rows or use the second row ear height if having 3 rows. Move your L/R speakers one stud bay further out for better soundstage, 5 feet apart is too close. Its OK if it is slightly off center. Subwoofer is too hard to tell without measurements but 2 or more subs would be better to get a more consistent bass response between seats. Risers are typically 8-12" and anything 10" and over needs a second step by code in most areas. 6-7" seems small but how tall is your ceiling? With 3 rows you might run out of headroom. You have to work the sight lines for riser height, there are a number of programs to help. But you need to know how far each row is from the screen as well. Lastly, paint your ceiling black this will help with a screen 4" from the ceiling. Side surrounds and rears should be 2-3' above ear height.
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post #4 of 19 Old 02-26-2013, 07:19 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the help, also I just checked and those walls are not load bearing. The basement was originally unfinished, so all the drywall areas are essentially curtain walls. So I'll just go ahead and cut out an area of a couple studs if I need to. This will allow me to place my speakears anywhere. I think I'll go for 12 inches from the edge of the screen, giving me 96 inches between the left/right speakers. The ceiling is 94.5 inches. Going with 7 inch risers already pushes the headroom issue, so maybe I'll stick with two rows. I have only bought the first two rows worth of seats. I should be able to fit 3 seats in the 2nd row, since the built in cabinets that stick out, stop before that row would start.

Even with this being a completely dark basement, will I still need to paint the ceiling black? I already have some left over blue paint like I did on the walls(eggshell, dark blue, glidden team colors for chicago bears), so would that work for the tile, or should it be flat black? One row of tiles or two? The tiles are 2x2.

So the rears, should I line the rear channel up with the front channel speaker, or set them even wider?
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post #5 of 19 Old 02-26-2013, 09:12 AM
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Two rows is better acoustically as you won't have as much of a difference between rows for volume levels. Also, the added space will hopefully allow you to not have the 2nd row against the rear wall which is not a good spot acoustically. Keep it away from the back wall 2-3 feet. If you do add a 3rd row know it will be the cheap seats.

When light hits the ceiling it will reflect back light in all directions and some of it towards the screen reducing your contrast. It will also cause a reflection on the ceiling and be distraction for the viewers. Being as close as your screen is to the ceiling it is even more important. You want to absorb this light and while black would be best any dark color will do. I would recommend flat paint over eggshell or something with a gloss. search the forums and you will see that people that have painted their ceiling have noticed a big improvement in picture quality.

I want to make sure we are talking about the same thing when you reference rear speakers, are you talking about the rear speakers in a 7 speaker surround system or are you referring to what should be the side surrounds in a 5 speaker system? If you are doing a 5 speaker system the surround speakers should ideally be on the side walls and not the rear wall. Some where between the rows would work fine for a single pair of surround speakers. Putting the side surrounds in back does not allow a very good soundstage of panning between the speakers. If you are doing 7.1 the back speakers can be a little more variable for distance apart but matching the fronts or slightly closer would be fine.

http://www.dolby.com/us/en/consumer/setup/connection-guide/home-theater-speaker-guide/index.html

http://www.dolby.com/uploadedFiles/Assets/US/Doc/Consumer/Dolby-Home-Theatre-Speaker-Guide-5.1-8-12.pdf

http://www.thx.com/consumer/home-entertainment/home-theater/surround-sound-speaker-set-up/
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post #6 of 19 Old 02-26-2013, 09:32 AM - Thread Starter
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As it is now they'd be in the rear wall in a 5.1 setup. So 3 behind the screen and 2 in wall speakers in the rear wall.

Don't really have a good place for surrounds on the side. If I were to go with 7.1 what about placing 2 in the ceiling between be 1st and 2nd row? Anything else the speakers won't be equidistance on the sides. The one would be 2-3 feet, and the other would be 5-7 feet if I went with on wall surrounds. I'd need to go in ceiling, unless that difference doesn't really matter.
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post #7 of 19 Old 02-26-2013, 09:37 AM - Thread Starter
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Oh one other thing. If I did in ceilings they would be maybe 3-4 feet from the projector. Would that cause a vibration issue?
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post #8 of 19 Old 02-26-2013, 09:47 AM
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Non-equidistant side speakers are fine as the level and distances can be adjusted in the receiver/ processor. In ceilings can work depending on the design of the in ceilings and where they are placed. Either might be a better solution than side speakers in the back of the theater. How far is the rear wall from the first row?
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post #9 of 19 Old 02-26-2013, 01:53 PM - Thread Starter
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Non-equidistant side speakers are fine as the level and distances can be adjusted in the receiver/ processor. In ceilings can work depending on the design of the in ceilings and where they are placed. Either might be a better solution than side speakers in the back of the theater. How far is the rear wall from the first row?
14 feet or so.

Considering what I bought I'll have to at least start with those. Ill just have to consider buying two more bookshelf type speakers for the sides.
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post #10 of 19 Old 02-26-2013, 03:17 PM
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14 ft is pretty far, I'd look at the book shelves sooner rather than later:-)
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post #11 of 19 Old 02-26-2013, 04:03 PM - Thread Starter
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14 ft is pretty far, I'd look at the book shelves sooner rather than later:-)
okay, any off the top ideas for 150ish for the pair? Satellites or bookshelf? Ill need to get a wall mount for them.
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post #12 of 19 Old 02-26-2013, 04:20 PM - Thread Starter
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14 ft is pretty far, I'd look at the book shelves sooner rather than later:-)
okay, any off the top ideas for 150ish for the pair? Satellites or bookshelf? Ill need to get a wall mount for them.
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post #13 of 19 Old 02-26-2013, 05:06 PM
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post #15 of 19 Old 02-26-2013, 06:12 PM
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can those be mounted using wall mounts. That's about my only option for sides. Stands would get in the way.

So I need satellites or bookshelves that can be mounted.

Yes:



Amazon has the speakers cheaper too.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00006JPDI/ref=s9_simh_gw_p23_d0_i1?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=center-2&pf_rd_r=0367W6KZH047PMQQBHT5&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=1389517282&pf_rd_i=507846

Larger picture on their site of the mounted speaker.
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post #16 of 19 Old 02-26-2013, 07:59 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ack_bk View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by cbo0485 View Post

can those be mounted using wall mounts. That's about my only option for sides. Stands would get in the way.

So I need satellites or bookshelves that can be mounted.

Yes:



Amazon has the speakers cheaper too.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00006JPDI/ref=s9_simh_gw_p23_d0_i1?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=center-2&pf_rd_r=0367W6KZH047PMQQBHT5&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=1389517282&pf_rd_i=507846

Larger picture on their site of the mounted speaker.
going with these and found these wall mounts.

http://amzn.com/B002UV03MW

Distance from center of viewing isn't as bad I originally thought. Only 1.5 foot difference.

So to recap, klipsch rw12d SUB, 3 BIC America FH8-W(center, fr left, fr right), 2 BIC America FH6-w for left/right rear, 2 BIC America DV62si Bookshelf Speakers, and the Sony STRDN1030 receiver.

The side/surrounds are about 5-6 feet behind first row and 3-4 feet to the side.

Sound like a good 7.1 setup for my first home theater?
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post #17 of 19 Old 02-28-2013, 05:15 PM - Thread Starter
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So after getting final dimensions and planning everything out, have another question. As it is I can place speakers both 14 inches from the edges of the screen. This places my center channel dead center of a stud. Now, I could cut it out, but at got a power line running down it and I don't want to mess with that. If I place my center channel off-center will that screw up the sound?

The center channel would be 63 inches from the left and 48 inches from the right. That's to the center of the speaker. It would be 34 inches from the right channel speaker and 54 inches from the left channel.

Would that be enough to throw off the sound in a noticeable way? Would it be worth cutting out that stud and trying to reroute that electrical wire?
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post #18 of 19 Old 03-01-2013, 04:08 AM - Thread Starter
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post #19 of 19 Old 03-01-2013, 04:19 AM
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I would try to center it of possible. If the electrical is running down a stud you shouldn't have a problem just be careful with the cut out. If it is going between the studs you might want to adjust the height slightly. I'd try to work around it first. Your in walls are small enough you should be able to work around this +/- 8" for height will be fine and an 8" wide speaker should be easy to adjust in a normal stud cavity if the electrical runs down the stud. Don't run the speaker wire next to it.
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