Paradigm Speakers - Problems with Surround Sound Results - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 5 Old 03-02-2013, 09:55 AM - Thread Starter
Newbie
 
abenevides's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 1
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Six or seven years ago I bought the following Paradigm Speakers for use in my home surround sound system:

Fronts: Two (2) Monitor 7 V.3 Floor standing Loudspeakers

Center: One (1) CC-370 V.3 Center Channel Speakers

Rear: Two (2) Mini Monitor V.3 Bookshelf Speakers.

I also have an old Cambridge Soundworks powered sub Model PSW-1 that seems to work Ok.

When I bought the system I genearlly liked the sound, but I was not completely satisfied with the performance as a surround system. During
movie watching I was always turning the volume up to hear the dialog, then down when the action scenes come on. I also never heard much sound
from the rear speakers. It didn’t sound like the sound that I heard when I went to a store to hear systems on inferior speakers. The sound with movies is just not full, well balanced surround sound.

That said, I always thought it was my older receiver. However, last weekend a bought a new Dennon 3313ci receiver. Unfortunately, although there is a slight improvement, I am still unsatisfied with surround sound for the same reasons as before.

Did I get the wrong combination of Paradigm Speakers that would allow for a well-balanced and complimentary sound? did I get the wrong new receiver? I thought about the Marantz 7007 but the extray $600 did not seem worth it for a sister receiver.

Not sure what it is, but I had higher expectations for what is a pretty good and reputable set of speakers and receiver.
abenevides is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 5 Old 03-02-2013, 12:12 PM
Advanced Member
 
Robert Cook's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: San Diego County, CA, USA
Posts: 985
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by abenevides View Post

During movie watching I was always turning the volume up to hear the dialog, then down when the action scenes come on.

That's a fairly common problem, actually. In some cases the speaker isn't good enough, but yours should be pretty good. I think that in general some movie soundtracks are rather dynamic and are meant to be played very loudly, in which case you can hear the dialogue fine, but in most homes there is so much sound reflecting off the untreated walls (and in some cases speakers and receivers being pushed to the point that they sound harsh) that you're forced to turn down the volume, which then makes dialogue difficult to hear.

The first bit of advice is always to make sure that the relative levels of the channels are all balanced. If that is already the case and the problem persists, then you could do what quite a few people here do (I'm led to believe), which is set the center channel level louder than the other channels by 1-3 dB, or as much as you need in order to make dialogue intelligible. This of course would result in a miscalibrated system, but then again it is common for folks to run their subwoofers a bit hot, too--whatever it takes to make your movie-watching experience more enjoyable.

Some people have benefited significantly in this regard by upgrading their speakers (or just their centers), but there is NO guarantee that this would help in your case, unless perhaps your center sounds unclear to you and you wish to upgrade anyway.
Quote:
Originally Posted by abenevides View Post

I also never heard much sound from the rear speakers. It didn’t sound like the sound that I heard when I went to a store to hear systems on inferior speakers. The sound with movies is just not full, well balanced surround sound.

Is your whole audio system calibrated with respect to speaker levels? If so, then you're probably getting everything the directors and re-recording mixers intended you to hear. Some movies have tons of surround channel content throughout, while others use it sparingly at low volumes. It's possible that the systems you've heard at the store had their surround channels set too high. On the other hand, you can set up your system in any way you prefer to make it sound pleasing to you--try turning up the surround channels to find out how you like it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by abenevides View Post

That said, I always thought it was my older receiver. However, last weekend a bought a new Dennon 3313ci receiver. Unfortunately, although there is a slight improvement, I am still unsatisfied with surround sound for the same reasons as before.

Did you use the Denon's auto-calibration/setup?
Quote:
Originally Posted by abenevides View Post

Did I get the wrong combination of Paradigm Speakers that would allow for a well-balanced and complimentary sound?

These speakers should work together well. Balance is achieved with settings in your receiver.
Quote:
Originally Posted by abenevides View Post

did I get the wrong new receiver? I thought about the Marantz 7007 but the extray $600 did not seem worth it for a sister receiver.

The Denon you have is fine.
Quote:
Originally Posted by abenevides View Post

Not sure what it is, but I had higher expectations for what is a pretty good and reputable set of speakers and receiver.

It's probably not the speakers--certainly not the surrounds. Placement, for example, can oftentimes be more important. Are your surrounds set to the sides of the viewers? They're not "rears," as many people call them. And is your center speaker pretty much out in the open, or is it shoved inside a cabinet?
Robert Cook is offline  
post #3 of 5 Old 03-02-2013, 12:27 PM
Senior Member
 
dowop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: N.E. Ohio
Posts: 384
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 15
^^^^^
Ecelllent advice. I have Paradigm`s & was not happy with the dialogue. I upped the the center by 3db & it sounds great to me now. I also upped the crossover which made it sound clearer. I am using a Onkyo 3009 on the system.
dowop is offline  
post #4 of 5 Old 03-02-2013, 12:32 PM
AVS Special Member
 
eljaycanuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Ottawa, Canada
Posts: 5,110
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 56 Post(s)
Liked: 475
+1 to the comments above.

Also, and FWIW, I used to have Paradigm Monitor 7v4s, CC-370v3 and Mini Monitorv4s, and what I noticed is:
- the surrounds can benefit from being bumped up by 1-2dB;
- the CC speaker, while a pretty good match to the M7v4s, was a bit weak, and the Studio/CC v2 actually sounded better (fuller, cleaner).
eljaycanuck is offline  
post #5 of 5 Old 03-02-2013, 04:31 PM
Advanced Member
 
Robert Cook's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: San Diego County, CA, USA
Posts: 985
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by dowop View Post

I also upped the crossover which made it sound clearer.

Good suggestion! Subwoofer crossover frequencies are one of the things that calibration/room correction systems often get wrong--sometimes grossly so.

OP, check the crossover settings for each channel. All of your speakers should be set to Small. In your case, the crossover for the surrounds should be set to 80 Hz, the left & right fronts to 60-80 Hz, and the center to 80-100 Hz. Try different settings for the center to see if any of them help improve dialogue intelligibility.
Quote:
Originally Posted by eljaycanuck View Post

Also, and FWIW, I used to have Paradigm Monitor 7v4s, CC-370v3 and Mini Monitorv4s, and what I noticed is:
- the surrounds can benefit from being bumped up by 1-2dB;
- the CC speaker, while a pretty good match to the M7v4s, was a bit weak, and the Studio/CC v2 actually sounded better (fuller, cleaner).

What I've read about the CC370 is that it has a tendency to sound "boxy" and that its upper bass is a bit weak, so setting its crossover higher could potentially help.

I've also encountered several reports of tweeters failing in this speaker. What I would do is turn off the center speaker (set it to None or whatever in the receiver), sit right in the center of the sweet spot, and play back some problematic dialogue to find out whether there is a significant improvement when using a "phantom center." If so, then either the center speaker is faulty or possibly it's not good enough. Upgrading to the Studio series should make a noticeable difference, and at least in terms of tonal balance they don't sound completely different from the Monitor series (according to the last time I auditioned Paradigm speakers, which was years ago)--mostly just clearer and better (the Signature series, on the other hand, did sound different to me). And the latest Monitor series centers also appear to be substantial upgrades, at least judging from the fact that they have dedicated midrange drivers now. Not that I would recommend upgrading at this point--first let's try to find out what's wrong and how to correct it.
Robert Cook is offline  
Reply Speakers

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off