2.1 System For $1000 - AVS Forum
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Old 03-30-2013, 04:13 PM - Thread Starter
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I'm looking for a new set up mainly for music. I'm looking for something with a relatively small footprint and hopefully somewhat aesthetically pleasing. As long as the sub isn't massive, looks don't matter as much for that. I listen to a wide range of music from reggae, to rap, to pop, to jazz. Not much classical or country. My current receiver is a Denon 1907. I could consider replacing it if necessary.

The room is about 1600 cu ft. I'm wide open to suggestions.
Thanks in advance!
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Old 03-30-2013, 04:27 PM
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I wouldn't replace the receiver if it's working well.

The SVS SB-1000 would be a great sub for your size room. It has a 12" driver, but very compact. You'd get great bass out of it.

That would leave you $500 for speakers. Have you listened to any speakers in your area?

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Old 03-30-2013, 04:58 PM
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I would go with the Klipsch RW-12d over the SB1000, especially for reggae and rap, it'll get much louder and cost a lot less, freeing up some budget for decent speakers.. The OP should also consider the Premier Acoustic PA-150, that is a bit large but it's relatively inexpensive and will get very loud.

Those subs suggestions will leave you roughly $600 for speakers. Since the sub has your bass covered, just look for bookshelf speakers. Some I would be looking at are the KEF Q300 and the NHT Classic Two, both are very highly regarded. These Swan Diva's look nice as well, but I don't know how well they perform. They sure are pretty though!

You definitely do not need to replace the Denon receiver, it will work just fine for two channel audio.
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Old 03-30-2013, 06:53 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the suggestions so far. Any thoughts on the KEF xq10's? KEF has a pair on sale for $799. I would have to stretch my budget a little, but it might be worth it. They look pretty sharp, but how do they sound?
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Old 03-30-2013, 07:09 PM - Thread Starter
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I like the looks of the SVS sub. The small package would go a long ways with the wife.
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Old 03-30-2013, 07:19 PM
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You might want to think through the sub part more. That PA-150? It's huge, and it also has a frequency response that starts rolling off at 63hz. It's already 10db down by 40hz. A sub with a flatter frequency response is a better choice. Then the RW-12d? Has an excellent reputation as an HT sub because it has tons of output and a flat response, but it's not known for being the most musical sub. Unless you are a basshead, for a 1600 cubic foot room, you don't have to have a high output 12 or 15" sub.

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Old 03-30-2013, 08:00 PM
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Originally Posted by cel4145 View Post

You might want to think through the sub part more. That PA-150? It's huge, and it also has a frequency response that starts rolling off at 63hz. It's already 10db down by 40hz. A sub with a flatter frequency response is a better choice. Then the RW-12d? Has an excellent reputation as an HT sub because it has tons of output and a flat response, but it's not known for being the most musical sub. Unless you are a basshead, for a 1600 cubic foot room, you don't have to have a high output 12 or 15" sub.

Lol, the PA isn't huge by my standards, but my standards may be a bit warped. It does start rolling off relatively high, but that can be EQ'd down, and it will still have a lot more headroom than the SB1000 at any frequency. The SB1000 would be like a whisper in comparison. I don't think you have to be a bass head to appreciate nice dynamics, after all, dynamics are a part of music too.
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Old 03-30-2013, 08:09 PM
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I don't think the Denon 1907 has a manual EQ, nor any Audyssey MultEQ to correct for that problem with the PA-150.

As for the SB1000, it would be appropriate for many people in that size room. If he wants a little more bass output and can go larger, the PB-1000 could be good. Still not terribly big because it's a 10" driver, but it does have more max output than the SB-1000.

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Old 03-30-2013, 08:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jerlane View Post

I like the looks of the SVS sub. The small package would go a long ways with the wife.

That's what it was designed for. Not a super high output sub, but a nice small sub that will keep the wife happy for small rooms. smile.gif

If you decide to order it, call SVS directly. SVS is known for their customer service. They can talk to you and make certain it's a good to fit your needs in terms of your listening. The PB-1000 I mentioned is the same price and only a little bigger.

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Old 03-30-2013, 10:01 PM
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Heck, why not go with an all-Hsu lineup...........


Hsu HB1 MK2 for fronts for $320/pr

Hsu VTF-3 MK4 for sub for $700.......could go down to the VTF-2 MK4 for $560.......
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Old 03-30-2013, 10:22 PM
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I second the Hsu system. Stick with the VTF-3...one can never have enough subwoofer!
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Old 03-30-2013, 11:18 PM
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Lol, the VTF3, now we are talking about big subs. Great system, but I'm sure it's way beyond the WAF for the OP.
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Old 03-31-2013, 12:19 AM
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Originally Posted by shadyJ View Post

Lol, the VTF3, now we are talking about big subs. Great system, but I'm sure it's way beyond the WAF for the OP.

But according to what you already told the OP, those HSU HB-1s wouldn't be "decent speakers." How could a $320 pair of speakers be good if $500 wasn't enough rolleyes.gif
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Old 03-31-2013, 01:49 AM
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Originally Posted by cel4145 View Post

But according to what you already told the OP, those HSU HB-1s wouldn't be "decent speakers." How could a $320 pair of speakers be good if $500 wasn't enough rolleyes.gif

Um, I never said 500 wouldn't be enough for nice speakers. I don't know where you are getting that from.
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Old 03-31-2013, 02:45 AM
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+1 the SVS sub recommendations. Speaker choices that would be good for music and in the OP's budget ...
- KEF Q300 (just under 500 a pair at accessories4less)
- Focal Chorus 706V (at musicdirect)

If the OP can expand the budget to 1300 then the SVS sub with either of these bookshelf pairs:
- Sierra 1 (B-stock)
- Monitor Audio RX1

If you go with towers you might get away without a sub ...
- FOCAL Chorus 814V (800 a pair at accessories4less)
- KEF Q900 (1240 a pair at accessories4less)

Of course there are many other fine bookshelf speakers in those price ranges - those are just the ones I'm familiar with.
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Old 03-31-2013, 09:09 AM
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Originally Posted by shadyJ View Post

Um, I never said 500 wouldn't be enough for nice speakers. I don't know where you are getting that from.

You are right. Your first post implied that only $300 to $350 should be spent on the sub, leaving $600 to $650 to get decent speakers. wink.gif

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Old 03-31-2013, 09:15 AM
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Originally Posted by sdg4vfx View Post

+1 the SVS sub recommendations. Speaker choices that would be good for music and in the OP's budget ...
- KEF Q300 (just under 500 a pair at accessories4less)
- Focal Chorus 706V (at musicdirect)

If the OP can expand the budget to 1300 then the SVS sub with either of these bookshelf pairs:
- Sierra 1 (B-stock)
- Monitor Audio RX1

If you go with towers you might get away without a sub ...
- FOCAL Chorus 814V (800 a pair at accessories4less)
- KEF Q900 (1240 a pair at accessories4less)

Of course there are many other fine bookshelf speakers in those price ranges - those are just the ones I'm familiar with.

+1

Those are all good choices. Maybe you could convince the wife to let you get towers so that you don't have to get a big, ugly sub smile.gif

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Old 03-31-2013, 11:23 AM - Thread Starter
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I just got rid of my towers, that's the whole point of this project. Does anyone have any thoughts on the KEF XQ10's? On sale at $799 seems like a good price. The NHT's and Monitors mentioned above also look nice. I'd be interested in auditioning a few pairs, but it doesn't look like KEF has a program like some of the others.
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Old 03-31-2013, 01:28 PM
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Originally Posted by cel4145 View Post

You are right. Your first post implied that only $300 to $350 should be spent on the sub, leaving $600 to $650 to get decent speakers. wink.gif

Given the OP's budget and size restrictions, there just isn't a way to work in a great sub. A small sealed one won't have any kind of decent output, especially for someone who likes reggae and hip hop, and they can't fit a large one, so that's why I recommended a less expensive ported sub. Without the sub's size restriction, I would say go for a six or seven hundred dollar ported beast and get some three hundred dollar speakers, like Ascend, Hsu, Arx, Behringer, HTD, etc.
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Old 03-31-2013, 01:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jerlane View Post

I just got rid of my towers, that's the whole point of this project. Does anyone have any thoughts on the KEF XQ10's? On sale at $799 seems like a good price. The NHT's and Monitors mentioned above also look nice. I'd be interested in auditioning a few pairs, but it doesn't look like KEF has a program like some of the others.

I think they are good speakers but at that price point there are better options. Again I'd suggest the two (higher-budget) speakers in my earlier post - the Ascend Sierra 1 (B-stock pricing from Ascend) or the Monitor Audio RX1.

I'm a KEF fan, but I've always found the smaller tweeter in the XQ series somewhat lacking, particularly at louder volumes. The newer Q and R series have a larger 1" tweeter that I think balances the sound/crossover-to-mid better. I'd take the Q300 over the XQ10, and definitely the two speakers mentioned above over the XQ10. Re auditioning KEF's, both kefdirect and accessories4less have 30 day return policies, though I believe kefdirect has a 15% restock fee.
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Old 03-31-2013, 02:15 PM
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I actually really like the XQ10s but that's just my opinion. I agree, the other KEF models, Sierras, and RX1s would be excellent choices as well. If you can take the time to addition, do it. It's worth it and you will find the speaker you like best. There's nothing worse than buying blind and being disappointed. Of course, sometimes you can get lucky too. wink.gif

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Old 03-31-2013, 03:48 PM
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Actually I probably used the wrong word re the tweeter on the XQ's - not lacking, but limited. I thought the XQ10 sounded excellent at lower volumes and as a near field monitor. But "to me" it just didn't seem like a good general purpose home speaker.

I complete agree with postrokfan though - "take the time to audition"! Two big variables are your ears and your room/space ; )
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Old 03-31-2013, 05:42 PM
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Originally Posted by shadyJ View Post

Given the OP's budget and size restrictions, there just isn't a way to work in a great sub. A small sealed one won't have any kind of decent output, especially for someone who likes reggae and hip hop, and they can't fit a large one, so that's why I recommended a less expensive ported sub. Without the sub's size restriction, I would say go for a six or seven hundred dollar ported beast and get some three hundred dollar speakers, like Ascend, Hsu, Arx, Behringer, HTD, etc.

But that's the problem. It's the "I" there. Your needs as an extreme basshead are quite different from the average individual. Even HSU used to recommend their 8" ported subs as good in rooms up to 1500 cubic feet. Audioholics recommended the SB12-NSD as good for medium sized rooms, which is up to 3,000 cubic feet. The SB1000 won't have quite the output of the SB12, but it should have enough output for most people in a 1600 cubic ft room, even for listening to reggae and hip hop.

So nothing wrong with you liking extreme bass, but that's not what most people need. I like bass, but I"m more interested in SQ over SPL, and would never consider your desktop setup of dual 15" subs:



Nothing wrong with that, but once again, it's not what most people want or need biggrin.gif

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Old 03-31-2013, 06:10 PM
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Lol, you have a point, but you didn't have to drive it home by exposing my insanity! Anyway, I find that most people respond more to dynamic range than less tangible things like upper bass nuance, detailed treble, or a 'holographic soundstage', but I certainly don't expect everyone to share my own tastes a hundred percent. It depends on how loud people like it. At modest volumes a moderately powered sealed 12" might be fine, but when you want to rock, it will be riding its limiter the whole time. I think a RW-12d is a good compromise, it can get loud and it's not huge or expensive. To better the bass quality, get some bookshelfs with good extension, lower the crossover to something like 60 hz, that way more of the bass range will be handled with more finesse.
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Old 03-31-2013, 06:44 PM
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Originally Posted by cel4145 View Post

But that's the problem. It's the "I" there. Your needs as an extreme basshead are quite different from the average individual. Even HSU used to recommend their 8" ported subs as good in rooms up to 1500 cubic feet. Audioholics recommended the SB12-NSD as good for medium sized rooms, which is up to 3,000 cubic feet. The SB1000 won't have quite the output of the SB12, but it should have enough output for most people in a 1600 cubic ft room, even for listening to reggae and hip hop.

So nothing wrong with you liking extreme bass, but that's not what most people need. I like bass, but I"m more interested in SQ over SPL, and would never consider your desktop setup of dual 15" subs:



Nothing wrong with that, but once again, it's not what most people want or need biggrin.gif

Holy Bass Batman!! D*mn shadyj, if that's your desktop setup what does your HT or alternate listening setup look like? wink.gif

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Old 03-31-2013, 06:54 PM
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Originally Posted by shadyJ View Post

Lol, you have a point, but you didn't have to drive it home by exposing my insanity! Anyway, I find that most people respond more to dynamic range than less tangible things like upper bass nuance, detailed treble, or a 'holographic soundstage', but I certainly don't expect everyone to share my own tastes a hundred percent. It depends on how loud people like it. At modest volumes a moderately powered sealed 12" might be fine, but when you want to rock, it will be riding its limiter the whole time. I think a RW-12d is a good compromise, it can get loud and it's not huge or expensive. To better the bass quality, get some bookshelfs with good extension, lower the crossover to something like 60 hz, that way more of the bass range will be handled with more finesse.

Nothing wrong with liking LOTS of bass biggrin.gif

But neither you nor I can know whether or not the SB-1000 is enough for the OP's needs. But SVS can tell him if he calls. It's their sub, and they know it's output. I'm sure that they would suggest he upgrade to the PB-1000 if the SB-1000 wouldn't be enough. It's the same price, just bigger. And based on what people who have bought the PB-1000 have said, it would have more than enough output for a 1600 cubic ft space. Just not enough for you smile.gif

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Old 03-31-2013, 07:21 PM
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Holy Bass Batman!! D*mn shadyj, if that's your desktop setup what does your HT or alternate listening setup look like? wink.gif

My home theater isn't as massive as you might think from my desktop. Front left/right are Infinity Primus p362s, center is Primus c350, surrounds are Primus p162s. Subs are two near-field Hsu VTF3s and two Outlaw LFM EXs in the front corners. Receiver is Onkyo TX sr707. I got great deals on everything, my entire home theater audio system cost less than $3k.
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Old 03-31-2013, 08:59 PM
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Yes, but you do have four subwoofers. I imagine that room shakes on movie night.

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Old 03-31-2013, 09:04 PM
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Yes, but you do have four subwoofers. I imagine that room shakes on movie night.

And not just 4 subs, but 4 high output 12" subs smile.gif

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Old 04-01-2013, 07:04 PM - Thread Starter
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I'm going to talk to SVS to get their input on the subs. I might be able to swing the PB-1000 if it would make a big difference. It still doesn't seem too huge. I'm going to be out of town for the next ten days so I probably won't be able to do much on this for a bit. Thanks for the help! I'll chime in when I'm back in town.
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