Best setup out there below $10k - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 237 Old 04-07-2013, 07:33 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi Everyone,

I just moved into a house and have a large living room where I'd like to setup a 5.1 system.

The floor is hard-wood and the room is about 48 by 32 with high ceilings.

I'll use the system for about 70% movies and 30% music (jazz, rock, ambient)

I am having a hard time choosing a setup with all the choices out there. I am looking for great sound at all levels.

Best buy is trying to sell me on a Bowers Wilkins set but while it sounds good, is it the best in its price-range?

I have about $10k to spend and will also need a nice amp to pair.

Thanks...
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post #2 of 237 Old 04-07-2013, 09:17 PM
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I'd look at what JTR and Seaton can offer for speakers. You'll need a coupla subs, too and they both can offer whole packages. May need more money to properly energize a room that big... smile.gif By amp do you mean AVR, integrated amp, 5 channel power amp?

http://jtrspeakers.com/
http://www.seatonsound.net/
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post #3 of 237 Old 04-07-2013, 10:17 PM
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^+1

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post #4 of 237 Old 04-07-2013, 10:33 PM
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Lol, with a 10k budget, I would stay far away from Bestbuy. First of all, you will want multiple high output subs for a room like that. I think you'll also want high sensitivity speakers as well. JTR would be a great choice there. Some which look great in that vein are GedLee Nathans and the Pi Fours with upgraded drivers. Also the JBL LSR6332, if their appearance isn't too utilitarian for you, those are $1600 each. They are THX pm3 approved, so they measure and perform superbly. Any of those would make for a terrific front stage. For the surrounds, consider the JBL 8320. Nathans, JTRs, Pi Fours, or JBL LSRs with two 8320s for surrounds leaves you with roughly $5k for receiver and subs.

For the receiver, I would get a Denon 4311CI, it will have plenty of amplification for those speakers, and it comes with Audyssey XT32 with the SubEQ, that makes is a piece of cake to setup dual subs.

That leaves you with about $3k for subs, with which I would go for two Rythmik FV15HPs. Two Power Sound Audio XV30s would also warrant consideration.

You ought to have a little bit left over for stuff like cables, for cables, get it from Bluejeans cables or Monoprice. Do NOT get cables at BestBuy, the markup is insane and you will get ripped off.
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post #5 of 237 Old 04-07-2013, 11:36 PM
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JTR Noesis 228HT's for your LCR for about $3600 if you don't get in on the sale price, and a pair of Single 8's for the surrounds along with a Captivator S2 sub. And like shady mentioned grab a Denon AVR-4520. That would be a pretty awesome system IMO.

www.jtrspeakers.com
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post #6 of 237 Old 04-08-2013, 06:22 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks everyone for the great input. :-)
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post #7 of 237 Old 04-08-2013, 06:27 AM
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Just get two of these......



a 30 watt amp will work fine. smile.gif
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post #8 of 237 Old 04-08-2013, 06:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nexusdoan View Post

Hi Everyone,

I just moved into a house and have a large living room where I'd like to setup a 5.1 system.

The floor is hard-wood and the room is about 48 by 32 with high ceilings.

I'll use the system for about 70% movies and 30% music (jazz, rock, ambient)

I am having a hard time choosing a setup with all the choices out there. I am looking for great sound at all levels.

Best buy is trying to sell me on a Bowers Wilkins set but while it sounds good, is it the best in its price-range?

B&W ain't bad, and I'm a bit of a fan of CM9s.

But be sure to budget for the following

(1) Subwoofer - budget about the same money as your mains or the AVR.

(2) Room treatments - spending ca. $10k on audio gear and putting it into the room from #$!! acoustics-wise is just plain stupid.
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post #9 of 237 Old 04-08-2013, 10:23 AM - Thread Starter
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I forgot to mention one thing. I bought a SVS PB-1000 a couple months ago since the small 8' from my Energy setup didn't do the trick.
Would this sub work for my setup if I get maybe another one or should I upgrade to a higher-end one? Also, do I have to pair the same subs
and should it be from the same manufacturer or would it be ok to get different speakers from different vendors?
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post #10 of 237 Old 04-08-2013, 10:24 AM - Thread Starter
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Arnyk, what should I consider for room treatments?
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post #11 of 237 Old 04-08-2013, 10:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nexusdoan View Post

I forgot to mention one thing. I bought a SVS PB-1000 a couple months ago since the small 8' from my Energy setup didn't do the trick.
Would this sub work for my setup if I get maybe another one or should I upgrade to a higher-end one? Also, do I have to pair the same subs
and should it be from the same manufacturer or would it be ok to get different speakers from different vendors?

If you're willing to spend 10k on a system I personally wouldn't be using a $500 sub with it. Get something that will keep up with the rest of the speakers. If you had said you wanted to spend 2K on a 5.0 system then yes a PB-1000 would be perfectly okay to use.
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post #12 of 237 Old 04-08-2013, 10:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nexusdoan View Post

I forgot to mention one thing. I bought a SVS PB-1000 a couple months ago since the small 8' from my Energy setup didn't do the trick.
Would this sub work for my setup if I get maybe another one or should I upgrade to a higher-end one? Also, do I have to pair the same subs
and should it be from the same manufacturer or would it be ok to get different speakers from different vendors?

The PB1000 does not belong in a 10k setup, especially in a room of that size. You will want at least two high powered subs, the PB1000 is nowhere near high powered.
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post #13 of 237 Old 04-08-2013, 10:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nexusdoan View Post

Arnyk, what should I consider for room treatments?

Bass traps at the very minimum and maybe a couple acoustical panels at your first reflection points.
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post #14 of 237 Old 04-08-2013, 12:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nexusdoan View Post

Arnyk, what should I consider for room treatments?

+1

Depends on the room.

The usual path for this kind of thing is to develop your own acoustics measurement facility based on a PC, a measurement-type microphone and a mic preamp with some software such as Room Eq Wizard (REW). From your measurements and other observations you determine what sort of corrective devices that you need.

There is a REW thread on AVS which can help you get you started.

This is a web site belonging to a "safe: vendor - one who provides many options and that doesn't oversell his products.

http://www.realtraps.com/products.htm
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post #15 of 237 Old 04-08-2013, 12:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nexusdoan View Post

I forgot to mention one thing. I bought a SVS PB-1000 a couple months ago since the small 8' from my Energy setup didn't do the trick.
Would this sub work for my setup if I get maybe another one or should I upgrade to a higher-end one? Also, do I have to pair the same subs
and should it be from the same manufacturer or would it be ok to get different speakers from different vendors?

Nothing wrong with a SVS PB-1000 in a small mid-fi system. It would be great.

In a $10k system, its out of place.
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post #16 of 237 Old 04-08-2013, 12:09 PM
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Originally Posted by shadyJ View Post

The PB1000 does not belong in a 10k setup, especially in a room of that size. You will want at least two high powered subs, the PB1000 is nowhere near high powered.

Well, I would argue that the PB1000 would do just fine in a $10k setup, provided the room is less than 1500 cf. tongue.gif

You're going to want at least two very large subs in your space. I own one Rythmik FV15HP, wonderful sub but even it will be lacking in your big room.

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post #17 of 237 Old 04-08-2013, 12:52 PM - Thread Starter
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Ok, I think I am narrowing down to the following setup.


Front: Left: JTR 228HT @ $2k
Front Center: JTR 228HT @ $2k
Front Right: JTR 228HT @ $2k
Rear Left: JTR 228HT @ $2k
Rear Right: JTR 228HT @ $2k

Sub 1: JTR Captivator S1 (below front-left speaker) @ $2.2k
Sub 2: JTR Captivator S1 (below front-right speaker) @ $2.2k

AVR: Denon AVR-4520CI @ $2.5k

Total: ~ $17,000


For the subs, do I need two? Should I opt for the S2 with the two drivers? Maybe just one?

For the rears, I was trying to stay consistent with the fronts. Should I consider an alternative?

Obviously, I am way over budget... :-)

Thanks everyone for your help.
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post #18 of 237 Old 04-08-2013, 12:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nexusdoan View Post

Also, do I have to pair the same subs
and should it be from the same manufacturer or would it be ok to get different speakers from different vendors?
You should pair the same subs. Also you will want the front stage to be from the same line of speakers, however it isn't nearly as important for the surround speakers to match.
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Originally Posted by Nethawk View Post

Well, I would argue that the PB1000 would do just fine in a $10k setup, provided the room is less than 1500 cf. tongue.gif
Honestly, it wouldn't cut it for me even in a 1500 cubic foot room. But then I like a good punch in the face.
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post #19 of 237 Old 04-08-2013, 01:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nexusdoan View Post

Ok, I think I am narrowing down to the following setup.


Front: Left: JTR 228HT @ $2k
Front Center: JTR 228HT @ $2k
Front Right: JTR 228HT @ $2k
Rear Left: JTR 228HT @ $2k
Rear Right: JTR 228HT @ $2k

Sub 1: JTR Captivator S1 (below front-left speaker) @ $2.2k
Sub 2: JTR Captivator S1 (below front-right speaker) @ $2.2k

AVR: Denon AVR-4520CI @ $2.5k

Total: ~ $17,000


For the subs, do I need two? Should I opt for the S2 with the two drivers? Maybe just one?

For the rears, I was trying to stay consistent with the fronts. Should I consider an alternative?

Obviously, I am way over budget... :-)

Thanks everyone for your help.

I would say those surrounds are pretty bad overkill. The JTR slanted 8 would be far more appropriate for surround speakers, and they would be easier to mount and cost half as much. I would also get the ported version of those subs, not the sealed, and yes, you will want two subs, spaced apart. If you are going to go over budget, put it into your subs, not the surrounds! Also, if you don't care about sticking to your budget at all, you could get more punch out of the JTR 228ss if you got separate amps for them. They claim to handle 1200 watts RMS. Get some kilowatt monoblocks for them if you really want to go overboard.
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post #20 of 237 Old 04-08-2013, 01:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nexusdoan View Post

Ok, I think I am narrowing down to the following setup.


Front: Left: JTR 228HT @ $2k
Front Center: JTR 228HT @ $2k
Front Right: JTR 228HT @ $2k
Rear Left: JTR 228HT @ $2k
Rear Right: JTR 228HT @ $2k

Sub 1: JTR Captivator S1 (below front-left speaker) @ $2.2k
Sub 2: JTR Captivator S1 (below front-right speaker) @ $2.2k

AVR: Denon AVR-4520CI @ $2.5k

Total: ~ $17,000


For the subs, do I need two? Should I opt for the S2 with the two drivers? Maybe just one?

For the rears, I was trying to stay consistent with the fronts. Should I consider an alternative?

Obviously, I am way over budget... :-)

Thanks everyone for your help.

The price on the 228 is $1200 each ($1100 up til April 15), so that should help. If any two subs can do that space, the S1s should be at the head of the pack but why not go for the s2? biggrin.gif

48 x 32 x 10 (12?) is 15,360 cuft (or 18,432!). Thats a lot of space!

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post #21 of 237 Old 04-08-2013, 01:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nexusdoan View Post

I'll use the system for about 70% movies and 30% music (jazz, rock, ambient)

Just be warned... once you get a good system that usage could change to 70% music, 30% movies. Think about speakers that will perform very well on music as well... otherwise you might get upgradeites before the year is out.

With your budget there is plenty to choose from. Even consider the used market for speakers. You could get astonishing value for money that way.
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post #22 of 237 Old 04-08-2013, 01:38 PM - Thread Starter
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Ok, I am setup as follows then.

Front: Left: JTR 228HT @ $1.2k
Front Center: JTR 228HT @ $1.2k
Front Right: JTR 228HT @ $1.2k
Rear Left: JTR Slanted 8 @ $900
Rear Right: JTR Slanted 8 @ $900

Sub 1: JTR Captivator 2400 @ $2.5k

This one isn't sealed. Would one of these be good enough for now? Does anyone have an alternate recommendation on a sub? I want strong and precise LFE for HT but it needs to keep up with music as well.
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post #23 of 237 Old 04-08-2013, 01:39 PM - Thread Starter
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Kiwi2, You are absolutely right. Do you think this setup is solid for music as well?
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post #24 of 237 Old 04-08-2013, 01:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kiwi2 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by nexusdoan View Post

I'll use the system for about 70% movies and 30% music (jazz, rock, ambient)

Just be warned... once you get a good system that usage could change to 70% music, 30% movies. Think about speakers that will perform very well on music as well... otherwise you might get upgradeites before the year is out.

With your budget there is plenty to choose from. Even consider the used market for speakers. You could get astonishing value for money that way.

Have you seen this http://www.avsforum.com/t/1458711/jtr-noesis-228ht-the-best-speaker-you-never-heard-of-for-1100-pricepoint ? Seems they handle music very well. Then there's always the Noesis 212...but back up on the pricepoint.

Used can be hit or miss even in a big metro area; I look regularly in the SF Bay Area and not that much comes up, especially for stuff that doesn't come up often like multiple matching subs and 5 channel speaker sets or current state of the art avrs. The value level on new JTR is quite good, too.

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post #25 of 237 Old 04-08-2013, 02:16 PM
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Originally Posted by nexusdoan View Post

Kiwi2, You are absolutely right. Do you think this setup is solid for music as well?

Couldn't say for sure but they do seem to be more HT based. Read as many reviews as you can on these speakers and try to suss what the general trend is.

I only speak from personal experience when first setting up my own HT system a few years ago. I got the music bug are more and more as I got better and better speakers. I like my jazz and acoustical and folk and a bit of classical as well.

I have spent a fair amount of money on owning different speakers from the likes of PSB, Monitor Audio, Dynaudio... but all that upgradeites stopped when I picked up a secondhand pair of R630 speakers from this company for $800.
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post #26 of 237 Old 04-08-2013, 02:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nexusdoan View Post

Ok, I am setup as follows then.

Front: Left: JTR 228HT @ $1.2k
Front Center: JTR 228HT @ $1.2k
Front Right: JTR 228HT @ $1.2k
Rear Left: JTR Slanted 8 @ $900
Rear Right: JTR Slanted 8 @ $900

Sub 1: JTR Captivator 2400 @ $2.5k

This one isn't sealed. Would one of these be good enough for now? Does anyone have an alternate recommendation on a sub? I want strong and precise LFE for HT but it needs to keep up with music as well.

I would go with two subs. Your planned receiver makes dual sub setups a cinch to setup, for starters. Plus, frequency response dips caused by cancellation can't be fixed by equalization, but they can be fixed by another sub. Also, you will defeat localization, as one sub can draw attention to its position, but multiples will do a lot more to get an even bass sound throughout the room.
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post #27 of 237 Old 04-08-2013, 03:48 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks everyone. I live in Austin, TX. Does anyone know who might carry these so I can listen to them before I buy them?
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post #28 of 237 Old 04-08-2013, 05:14 PM
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If you really are that serious about getting a JTR setup email Jeff at jeff@jtrspeakers.com. If you bought three 228HT's right now it would only cost you $3300 plus $1800 for the slant 8's and Jeff has two Captivator 2400's that I think he's willing to sell at a sale price. Plus you get the discount of a multi piece order. This would be a VERY impressive set up!
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post #29 of 237 Old 04-08-2013, 05:26 PM
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If you go to the JTR speaker thread I believe KevinH is from Houston Tx and has some of the Noesis line of speakers. Doesn't have the 228HT's but they would sound similar to the 228HT's.
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post #30 of 237 Old 04-08-2013, 05:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nexusdoan View Post

The floor is hard-wood and the room is about 48 by 32 with high ceilings.

Assuming 48' x 32' x 15' = 23,000 cubic ft.

The important thing here is getting enough subs to pressurize your room and do it accurately (low distortion, low Q).

I say get 4 Rtyhmik F25 subs @ $1400 each & 10% discount for multiple subs = $5,000. biggrin.gif

http://www.rythmikaudio.com/F25.html

...... And then get some speakers and AVR.

You don't have to buy JTR speakers. It's fine if you do, but they are not the ONLY good choice.

There are many great choices out there. Audition first before spending any money. Do more research.
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