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post #61 of 73 Old 07-26-2013, 05:38 PM - Thread Starter
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Ok, for anybody that cares, I went and spent some time listening to speakers today. Here’s a list of the highlights in order of what sounded the best to me:

Paradigm Studio 100 (awesome)
Bowers & Wilkins CM9 (awesome)
Vienna Acoustics Mozart Grand Symphony (pretty awesome)
Thiel SCS4T
Focal Chorus 816v
GoldenEar Triton Two
MartinLogan ESL w/ ML sub
Paradigm Studio 20 w/ Paradigm Monitor 8 sub
Wilson Magnepan 1.7 (I personally LOVED the look of these and I think they’d go great in a HT design, but the sound quality wasn’t there)
Klipsch RF-7 (I thought these would be a lot better)

Very sadly the room that housed the Klipsch THX-Ultra2 speakers (really the main reason I went) was being dismantled for an upgrade and will not be ready for like 4 weeks. The guy at the AV place stated that for movies these can almost not be beaten, but for music they cannot compare to the other speakers I listened to (his opinion).

Guitar Center does not stock the JBL LSR6332 so I couldn’t listen to them.

I went today with a very open mind. Interestingly I thought for sure I would love the Panasonic P65ZT60, but I really liked the Samsung 64F8500 a lot more. I had them play the same disc on each using the same player too.

I lucked out at both places by getting very knowledgeable and patient sales associates. The only bad thing is that I forgot to bring CD’s as the brand new vehicle I bought doesn’t have a CD player in it and I don’t need to carry them any longer. : ( At the higher end place I mentioned several times that I usually don’t listen to the type of music that they were playing, but he just kept bringing the same modern jazz CD to each system. Grrrr.

The other thing that I will point out and I’m sure I’ll be made fun of for is that my system has A LOT more bottom end than anything I listened to, and this included a Paradigm Monitor sub. I like to FEEL my bass, not just hear it. I realized more than anything today is that we certainly enjoy music in an individual way. Some people may listen to my current setup and think it is way too bottom heavy, but what I heard today was truly disappointing as far as bass goes. I understand that my current 500w Infinity SW-12 was called little and underpowered, but I routinely knock items off shelves and that’s the way I like it. Maybe I would have to hear a new sub or two in my specific room, but like I said the subs I tested today were nothing to me. I know that you guys mentioned some of the internet sub companies, but it’s hard to imagine myself justifying spending $1000 plus on a pair of subs that I can’t listen to and that I may not be happy with. I will consider this in the future, but for now I think I would rather divert that money to higher quality LCR speakers.

I think I am going to wait until the B&W CM10’s come out in a few weeks. I heard Pink Floyd’s Time as the demo on the CM9’s and it was awesome, so the 10’s should be even better. The demo also included the Marantz 7007 using those speakers which was nice to hear as well. It would be nice to hear the Klipsch THX as well, but I was disappointed with the RF-7 (which are not cheap) and it seems the THX would not be that great for music, so maybe I won’t bother.

Anway, thanks for reading this and I really appreciate all the advice so far. I was well prepared today because of you guys. I will update this thread as the upgrade comes along.
Next step, researching acoustic treatments………………….(anybody know if a paper lithograph mounted to a foam backing would be too acoustically reflective?)
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post #62 of 73 Old 07-26-2013, 06:50 PM
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Many of the subs dealers have are pretty sorry. Some are not so bad, like the Velodyne DDs and JL Audios, but they probably won't be set up to give anyone a thrill. The big subs from many internet subwoofer companies will be a lot more powerful for the money.
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post #63 of 73 Old 08-03-2013, 05:59 PM - Thread Starter
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Let's say I went with a set of Bowers and Wilkins CM10's for my left and right speakers. What do you think about using Klipsch KL-525-THX speakers as my center and left/right height speakers? Or should I stick with the matching Bowers and Wilkins CM Centre 2? I'm not sure how mixing speakers like that affects audio, if it does at all.
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post #64 of 73 Old 08-03-2013, 06:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HoosierDoc View Post

Let's say I went with a set of Bowers and Wilkins CM10's for my left and right speakers. What do you think about using Klipsch KL-525-THX speakers as my center and left/right height speakers? Or should I stick with the matching Bowers and Wilkins CM Centre 2? I'm not sure how mixing speakers like that affects audio, if it does at all.

Your LCR should be as close to identical as possible... Think about what your speakers are there for, to create a sound stage that sucks you into the on screen events. Do you want Tom Hanks to sound like he has a cold one second, and then the next second as the camera pans to sound like he got kicked in the balls? Extreme example, but that is basically what having mismatched speakers does to your sound stage.
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post #65 of 73 Old 08-03-2013, 06:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HoosierDoc View Post

Let's say I went with a set of Bowers and Wilkins CM10's for my left and right speakers. What do you think about using Klipsch KL-525-THX speakers as my center and left/right height speakers? Or should I stick with the matching Bowers and Wilkins CM Centre 2? I'm not sure how mixing speakers like that affects audio, if it does at all.

As Jay said, you want the front three to match.

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post #66 of 73 Old 08-03-2013, 08:20 PM - Thread Starter
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I really appreciate the information. Does this hold for the front height speakers as well, or does that not matter as much?
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post #67 of 73 Old 08-03-2013, 10:42 PM
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Have you considered KEF in your line up. I was doing a speaker demo last week in which I was comparing the B&W 805D ($5000 a pair) to the KEF reference 201/2 ($6000). I also listened to the KEF R series and was very impressed. I think I prefer to the KEF R series to the B&W CM series. BTW I have B&W in-ceiling CCM 818 speakers so I am familiar with B&W sound quality (which is excellent).

One possible solution for you would be the following:

KEF R 700 - $3600
KEF R600c - $1500

or

KEF R500 $2600
KEF R200c $1000

The R700 has a larger woofer 6.5 vs 5.25.
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post #68 of 73 Old 08-04-2013, 07:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deeda View Post

Have you considered KEF in your line up. I was doing a speaker demo last week in which I was comparing the B&W 805D ($5000 a pair) to the KEF reference 201/2 ($6000). I also listened to the KEF R series and was very impressed. I think I prefer to the KEF R series to the B&W CM series. BTW I have B&W in-ceiling CCM 818 speakers so I am familiar with B&W sound quality (which is excellent).

One possible solution for you would be the following:

KEF R 700 - $3600
KEF R600c - $1500

or

KEF R500 $2600
KEF R200c $1000

The R700 has a larger woofer 6.5 vs 5.25.
I would concur with this recommendation. I believe the R series is a step above the CM series, especially for combined music and movies. I think the R700 and R600c would be the best. However, it will be interesting to see how the new CM10 performs.

Main Kef: Reference 205/2 & 202/2c, Surrounds: Kef XQ40, Velodyne Optimum 12, Integra DHC 80.3, Oppo BDP-103, Bryston 4Bsst2, Parasound Halo A31. Second B&W: 685 (3), CCM618, Def Tech Powerfield 1500, Onkyo TX-NR1008, DBP 2010, Samsung BD-C7900, Zone 2 Klipsch AW650. Sitting still CCM616, Kef...
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post #69 of 73 Old 08-04-2013, 09:32 AM - Thread Starter
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I appreciate the advice. Unfortunately there are no KEF dealers within several hundred miles of here, and there are other financial reasons that make my above choices better for my particular build.
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post #70 of 73 Old 08-04-2013, 10:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HoosierDoc View Post

I really appreciate the information. Does this hold for the front height speakers as well, or does that not matter as much?

I would not waste any money on any Height or Width speakers.

Just stick with 5 speakers same brand/line and at least 2 subwoofers. At most get 7 speakers same brand. Surround speakers are not very important, so spend the least money here. Focus on the front 3 and subs.

I am assuming the B&W are from Best Buy? biggrin.gif

One other idea is to get a CC that allows 18 months 0% interest. That way you could buy some speakers at 40% to 50% off MSRP elsewhere, instead of paying 100% MSRP @ Best Buy.
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post #71 of 73 Old 08-04-2013, 03:13 PM
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I was at best buy yesterday and listened to b&w cm5, cm8, 683, def tech 8060, Martin Logan motions. After adjusting the gain on the DT powered sub(100% gain to about 30%) pushing speakers back and pulling others forward to get setups sounding correct. I listened to the marantz 7007 and pioneer sc77. Playing alac files from my iPhone using a iPhone/USB adapter cable to the USB Input on The front of the receivers I was amazed at how veiled the B$Ws sounded and how muddy the DTs were. And I thought "no wonder I stopped shopping at best buy! This stuff is crap."

IMO stick with the higher end Internet direct brands or look at some other local audio shops.

Dynaudio Focus 260s, Focus 210C, DM 2/6, Hsu VTF2 MK4, Oppo BDP-103,
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post #72 of 73 Old 08-04-2013, 05:50 PM
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Originally Posted by callas01 View Post

I was at best buy yesterday and listened to b&w cm5, cm8, 683, def tech 8060, Martin Logan motions. After adjusting the gain on the DT powered sub(100% gain to about 30%) pushing speakers back and pulling others forward to get setups sounding correct. I listened to the marantz 7007 and pioneer sc77. Playing alac files from my iPhone using a iPhone/USB adapter cable to the USB Input on The front of the receivers I was amazed at how veiled the B$Ws sounded and how muddy the DTs were. And I thought "no wonder I stopped shopping at best buy! This stuff is crap."

IMO stick with the higher end Internet direct brands or look at some other local audio shops.

It could just be the Best Buy store. A lot of shops and dealers are just acoustical nightmares. These speakers may sound fine in a better home environment and better setup.
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post #73 of 73 Old 08-04-2013, 11:23 PM
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It could just be the Best Buy store. A lot of shops and dealers are just acoustical nightmares. These speakers may sound fine in a better home environment and better setup.

most certianly, this store has a dedicated listening room, and the setups arent ideal, but they are better then other best buys ive been too. i really tried to isolate the speakers and make the most out of it.

Dynaudio Focus 260s, Focus 210C, DM 2/6, Hsu VTF2 MK4, Oppo BDP-103,
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