I you had $6,000 to spend............ - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 73 Old 07-21-2013, 04:29 PM - Thread Starter
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I would like to thank you all in advance for your opinions, and I think the is the best forum as it is mainly about speakers.

I am looking to upgrade the front end of my home theater. Specifically I am looking to spend about $6,000 on the following 4 items: a pair of floor standing speakers, a center channel speaker, and a new 7.1 A/V receiver. These are the items I need help with and would like your opinion on.

Keep reading if you want more details…………..

I am purchasing a Panasonic TC-P65VT60 for my TV. I have an Infinity sub and 4 surround speakers in place already that I am fairly happy with and am not going to upgrade them at this time.

I am currently using a Denon AVR-3805 and have found it to be slightly underpowered (maybe it’s my speakers-Infinity B50) and a little finicky at times for lack of a better word, hence the need for an upgrade.

I use this room daily, probably 90% TV/movies and about 10% music. However, I am sure that I will be listening to a lot more music with the new system, so that is very important.

I have included a picture of my current setup. That’s a Mitsubishi 60” DLP (as stated above it’s going). And for those who are wondering that’s a polished aluminum early toothpick style propeller blade off of a WWII B-17 bomber. smile.gif

The room is roughly 11.5ft wide, and it is 15ft from that wall to my eyes on the couch. The room is going to be getting an upgrade as well as far as paint, wall treatments/curtains to help improve sound. I cannot do anything about the fireplace which you can see the corner of in one of the pictures (with the sub tucked next to it), as well as the French doors in the other picture. I plan on having a theater curtain to cover the French doors when I want better sound/light control.

Lastly, and I know I may get yelled at for this, but I would like to purchase what I can from Best Buy/Magnolia. They are offering 0% interest for 24 months, and I would much rather use their money for free for 2 years while my money makes interest. I live in Indiana, and there is also Ovation AV in the area which carries higher end stuff. I was able to listen to a pair of GE Triton Two’s yesterday. Not bad. They had a terrible setup though in one of their smaller stores, and I plan on going to their main store on Friday to listen to a bunch of speakers, as well as the Magnolia to listen to what they have as well. I refuse to buy anything that I cannot listen to first.

I know the TV and new AV receiver I buy will probably last for about 4-5 years until a 65” 4K OLED TV is about $3-4K and I will replace them both, but I would like the speakers to last a bit longer than that.

Sorry for the lengthy post, but more details are better than less.

Again, thanks a ton!



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post #2 of 73 Old 07-21-2013, 05:14 PM
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What does Best Buy carry? biggrin.gif

Well, just audition for a while and buy the speakers that sound best to you.

Or give us a list of multiple choices and we'll all pick from the list. biggrin.gif
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post #3 of 73 Old 07-21-2013, 05:17 PM
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Can't buy at BB, but I would look at Triad Gold mains and center. You can use your current AVR and add an amp. If you would like to discuss, give us a call.

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post #4 of 73 Old 07-21-2013, 05:26 PM
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My vote would be for a full emptek setup E55ti's E56i center the surronds and two es1010i subs with a marantz 7007 reciever, that setup would be a BIG upgrade IMO, and it would also would not be any where near six grand.
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post #5 of 73 Old 07-21-2013, 05:44 PM
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Infinity Betas are pretty good. I don't think EMP speakers would be a real upgrade over those. He is going to have to spend some money to get a tangible upgrade over his current speakers. His speaker placement is awful anyway, I wouldn't bother upgrading if that is the only place the speakers can go. The room looks acoustically poor as well.

To the OP, I wouldn't even bother upgrading the speakers until you can get the room and placement issues taken care of. If you want a nice upgrade, just pull the speakers out from the corners and put some acoustic damping in that room, like maybe some heavy curtains, a thick rug, and some acoustic panels. Also, get a real subwoofer or two and some bass equalization for it. Simply optimizing what you have may bring about a big improvement. If you can't do that much, you are probably just throwing money by buying better speakers because not many speakers are going to sound great in the circumstances you are putting them in.
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post #6 of 73 Old 07-21-2013, 05:48 PM
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Have you heard the empteks? I own emptek and a friend has owned infinty beta's .....................and i stand by what i said, This game really isn't about msrp of products......I only focus on the quality and sound of the products...... and the marantz 7007 is a for sure upgrade over that denon
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post #7 of 73 Old 07-21-2013, 07:12 PM
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I would get a UMC-200 from emotiva and a couple of their AMPS. Maybe an XPA3 to power the mains and center and the XPA5 to power surrounds and sides/back. That stuff is much better than anything in best buy and for a much better price. As for speakers I will leave that up for others. I am a DIY guy.
Also to mention emotive has great support and they are pros. Not high school kids working in Best buy. Also to add the Emotiva guys are having a sale.

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post #8 of 73 Old 07-21-2013, 07:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shadyJ View Post

Infinity Betas are pretty good. I don't think EMP speakers would be a real upgrade over those. He is going to have to spend some money to get a tangible upgrade over his current speakers. His speaker placement is awful anyway, I wouldn't bother upgrading if that is the only place the speakers can go. The room looks acoustically poor as well.

To the OP, I wouldn't even bother upgrading the speakers until you can get the room and placement issues taken care of. If you want a nice upgrade, just pull the speakers out from the corners and put some acoustic damping in that room, like maybe some heavy curtains, a thick rug, and some acoustic panels. Also, get a real subwoofer or two and some bass equalization for it. Simply optimizing what you have may bring about a big improvement. If you can't do that much, you are probably just throwing money by buying better speakers because not many speakers are going to sound great in the circumstances you are putting them in.


Thanks. Honestly, the bottom end is not a problem which is why I'm happy with the sub. It's that I don't feel the upper end or midrange are as good as they can be. For the average person that watches a movie here they love it, but I am wanting something on the next level.

I cannot help the layout of the room. It is what it is. Like I stated in my first post, I plan on significant changes to the texture of the room to much more "AV friendly". I want to do it all at once, because the new equipment does determine the aesthetics/logistics of how I proceed. Also, I cannot really do anything about the placement. The wall/corners are what they are.

Is it your opinion that a $300 Infinity Beta would sound the same as a new $1500 floor standing speaker of another brand assuming the wall/ceiling treatments are in place?

I have done my homework on treatments/televisions. It is a whole room upgrade. I was mainly asking if people had any good suggestions on speakers in that price range given my situation.
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post #9 of 73 Old 07-21-2013, 08:16 PM
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I'm glad to see you will be addressing the room acoustics. One thing I would strongly suggest is moving the AV rack and propeller to the corners and placing the speakers next to the TV stand. You might also pull the speakers forward up from the wall a bit. That ought to help with the first order reflections right there.

As for as better speakers, first of all, I would just forget BestBuy. They have a few good speakers there, but you can do better for the money. Next thing is, I would get bookshelf speakers. No sense in spending money on bass extension which you will not end up using.

For $1500 per speaker, you have plenty of good options. If it was me, I would go for some Pi Threes or Fours with upgraded drivers, but I understand the aesthetics of those aren't for everyone. Those are for very powerful dynamics. They will get you a lot closer to a THX Imax type experience much more so than any ordinary tower with 6.5" woofers and a 1" dome tweeter. If you want powerful dynamics but need something more spouse friendly, check out the Klipsch RF-7s or RF-82s. Any of those speakers will desperately want to be paired up with a better sub though, your little infinity sub has no prayer of keeping up with them.

If you don't need to worry about the wife approval factor much and just want a huge upgrade in sound quality, check out the JBL LSR6332, those would absolutely knock you out. Extremely high performers for the money, they are used in making THX soundtracks, which very few speakers are certified to do. Again though, they would be crying for a much better subwoofer system. They are $1560 each.

If need a nice looking speaker and don't need commercial cinema dynamics, I would look at KEF. Some R100s would sound very nice and be well within your budget. Also check out Ascend Sierras with upgraded RAAL tweeters, those are purported to be terrific.

Again, I would urge you to upgrade your subwoofer. You don't know what you are missing with that little Infinity, and trust me, you are missing out on a lot.

By the way, that B17 propeller is sweet.
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post #10 of 73 Old 07-21-2013, 08:53 PM
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If you source everything from Best Buy, these are my recommendations:

Polk RTi A9 ($1500)
Polk CSi A6 ($400)
Marantz SR7007 ($1600)
Total $3500

Or

DefTech BP-8060ST ($2000)
DefTech CS-8060HD ($700)
Marantz SR7007 ($1600)
Total $4300


I agree though that your current gear is pretty good and you need better placement whether you get new speakers or not. The room acoustics play a big part in how any speaker will sound and I think the changes you are going to make will help big time. I also agree that going the seperates route is a better option as getting an Emotiva UMC-200 and XPA-5 will give you far more power and better sound for the same price as the Marantz AVR I recommended. The biggest upgrade you can make I believe should be your sub. Getting a good quality sub like a SVS, Hsu, Epik, etc will make a huge difference. If you decide to bite the bullet and buy elsewhere, then these are my recommendations:

SVS PB1000 x 2 ($950) OR SVS PB12-NSD x 2 ($1450)
SVS Ultra Towers ($2000)
SVS Ultra Center ($700)
Emotiva UMC-200, XPA-3 & UPA-500 ($1590)
Total $5240 or $5740

Or substitute Aperion Versus Grand Towers and Center w/ the same Emotiva setup and same (or comparable) subs for around $5840.

That would be an incredible upgrade over what you have now, and would truly justify spending the money.
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post #11 of 73 Old 07-21-2013, 09:17 PM
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I tend to agree with ShadyJ's recommendations. Try switching the speakers with the rack and propeller to see if that helps. Getting acoustic treatments, as you said you plan to do, will also probably help a ton. You said it is 15' to where to sit. Is that right on the back wall? If it is, try moving up a couple of feet closer so you are not right on the back wall. Finally, make sure your center speaker is all the way forward on its shelf, not tucked in, to reduce reflections.

As far as speakers, you could definitely go for bookshelves for the L/R since you said mostly movie/TV watching. Kef R300 + R600c would be good options, as would the upgraded Ascend Sierras and the Horizon center. If you get towers and play them full range, I would expect them to sound a bit boomy in the corners. But, your budget would allow for some good slim towers, like the kef R500, Ascend Sierra tower, Salk Songtower.

As far as BestBuy, The B&W CM9 has gotten some good reviews. i just saw they will be releasing the CM10 in August, but I think MSRP will be about $4,000/pr. You could also try the ML Motion 40 towers.

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post #12 of 73 Old 07-21-2013, 09:23 PM
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The 2 years interest-free sounds like a good deal, but it's not. Figure how much you'll make on your money at what, 0.01% interest that banks are paying now. That's why BB is offering interest-free financing; it costs them so little.

Moving speakers in from the corners and powering the 3 fronts with external amps are excellent ideas. The Emotivia are good choices.

For mains, I'd look at:
This will give you much more for your money than any deal at BB. I don't know your sub, so I can't comment, but you may have plenty left over for a new sub, if needed.
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post #13 of 73 Old 07-21-2013, 10:59 PM
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The speaker placement issue mentioned by ShadyJ is a very important point that you need to fix. All you would be doing is putting the speakers directly on each side of the tv (if you can space them out wider then that, that would be better), and pulling them forward so they are past the plane of the screen. The point of doing all of this is to reduce immediate reflections, your current placement is about the worst it could be... Also, you might be happy with your sub, but you really dont know what you are missing. The quality of recent offerings from internet direct companies has pushed sub performance to a very high level.

The speaker selection at magnolia is rather poor, having a budget that nice and not maximizing it isn't a great investment. But I'm guessing you do not have $6k cash, which makes that a best buy only solution? Do you have a budget outside of financing, is it possible to mix a few cash purchases outside of best buy?

What I'm thinking is a pair of monitor speakers, center, and receiver from best buy, which you can listen to, since that is important to you (rightfully so). You would also purchase a pair of subs from a internet direct brand, we'll say under $1500 for the pair. These subs will literally outperform the most expensive subs best buy carries. You would use the subs as stands for your monitors, giving you the tower look, but offering awesome sub 20hz performance.
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post #14 of 73 Old 07-21-2013, 11:01 PM
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I second BarnacleBill. However if you want to save some cash you can go with Selah Pretigios. They use the same exact drivers as the Supercharged Song Towers except that the RAAL is non AM core. But you can upgrade the to AM core if you like. You can get the Presitigios and the matching center for the price of the pair of SS ST's.
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post #16 of 73 Old 07-22-2013, 06:22 AM
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With the fact that your room is long and extremely narrow, I would recommend something with a horn or a waveguide to focus the sound directly at you, and thus minimizing the un-wanted side wall reflections. If you go with a conventional speaker with a dome tweeter then you are never going to get the most out of them due to the placement being so close to the side walls and the way the room is so narrow. I would recommend purchasing a Seos or Pi kit. Something like the 4pi or the Seos Tempest. You can get either one in a full kit version that you just assemble yourself without having to buy a bunch of tools. That is truly the best way to go as the waveguides would focus the sound at you, and not have nearly as much sidewall reflections as the conventional speakers. You can get the Seos Tempest flat packs for under $400 each.
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post #17 of 73 Old 07-22-2013, 06:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HoosierDoc View Post

I would like to thank you all in advance for your opinions, and I think the is the best forum as it is mainly about speakers.

I am looking to upgrade the front end of my home theater. Specifically I am looking to spend about $6,000 on the following 4 items: a pair of floor standing speakers, a center channel speaker, and a new 7.1 A/V receiver. These are the items I need help with and would like your opinion on.

Keep reading if you want more details…………..

I am purchasing a Panasonic TC-P65VT60 for my TV. I have an Infinity sub and 4 surround speakers in place already that I am fairly happy with and am not going to upgrade them at this time.

I am currently using a Denon AVR-3805 and have found it to be slightly underpowered (maybe it’s my speakers-Infinity B50) and a little finicky at times for lack of a better word, hence the need for an upgrade.

I use this room daily, probably 90% TV/movies and about 10% music. However, I am sure that I will be listening to a lot more music with the new system, so that is very important.

I have included a picture of my current setup. That’s a Mitsubishi 60” DLP (as stated above it’s going). And for those who are wondering that’s a polished aluminum early toothpick style propeller blade off of a WWII B-17 bomber. smile.gif

The room is roughly 11.5ft wide, and it is 15ft from that wall to my eyes on the couch. The room is going to be getting an upgrade as well as far as paint, wall treatments/curtains to help improve sound. I cannot do anything about the fireplace which you can see the corner of in one of the pictures (with the sub tucked next to it), as well as the French doors in the other picture. I plan on having a theater curtain to cover the French doors when I want better sound/light control.

Lastly, and I know I may get yelled at for this, but I would like to purchase what I can from Best Buy/Magnolia. They are offering 0% interest for 24 months, and I would much rather use their money for free for 2 years while my money makes interest. I live in Indiana, and there is also Ovation AV in the area which carries higher end stuff. I was able to listen to a pair of GE Triton Two’s yesterday. Not bad. They had a terrible setup though in one of their smaller stores, and I plan on going to their main store on Friday to listen to a bunch of speakers, as well as the Magnolia to listen to what they have as well. I refuse to buy anything that I cannot listen to first.

I know the TV and new AV receiver I buy will probably last for about 4-5 years until a 65” 4K OLED TV is about $3-4K and I will replace them both, but I would like the speakers to last a bit longer than that.

Sorry for the lengthy post, but more details are better than less.

Again, thanks a ton!




I understand wanting to use other people's money and getting the financing from BB.

However, if your credit is decent you might be able to get a Discover card if you don't already have one and use it for 14 months of interest free purchasing.

Plus, it would extend the warranty on the receiver by a year.

This would certainly give you a lot of options for buying gear.
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post #18 of 73 Old 07-22-2013, 09:44 AM - Thread Starter
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I would like to REALLY thank everyone that has contributed to this thread. It looks like I have alot of research to do tonight on the speakers that have been suggested to me.

As far as the whole BB issue, it's not that I don't have or couldn't pay for everything cash, it's just that paying it off over 2 years and not seeing that money jump out of the checking account will make this build much easier on the marriage if you know what I mean.

Is there a reason that more people don't use studio speakers like the JBL's suggested above? What is the drawback of that?

As far as speaker placement goes, I had always had them in the corners because I had heard that the wider they are the better the sound can be, but I had no idea about the reflection issues. I really appreciate that advice. I am removing that rack and propeller from the room and will be buying/making something custom to sit below the TV that the center can sit on as well.
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post #19 of 73 Old 07-22-2013, 10:00 AM
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I have comment to make here.

You really need to get that center speaker pointed at your ears, rather than your feet. i bet your legs are getting good quality audio during movies. if you could solve that issue and get those speakers out of the corner, you may find some of your issues with the sound quality of your system disappearing. The room treatments you want to do will take care of the rest.

Of course if you just have upgradeitis, shop away, just make sure to seriously re-evaluate your setup when you are done and this might include needing a different tv stand to facilitate higher placement of your center channel (you want to go almost a foot higher than its current position if possible)

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post #20 of 73 Old 07-22-2013, 10:15 AM
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Originally Posted by HoosierDoc View Post

Is there a reason that more people don't use studio speakers like the JBL's suggested above? What is the drawback of that?

The reason why people don't use them is because of their utilitarian looks. Usually when people are on the market for pricier speakers, they are looking for something that looks nice. Also most monitors are self-powered (not these though), and a lot of people, for whatever reason, think they should use their AVR's amplifier, as if that were a better value (it's not).The JBL LSRs are purely performance driven. The 6332s in particular are used in Harmon's Reference room. Harmon owns JBL, Infinity, Revel, Mark Levinson, and a bunch of other audio companies, and are widely regarded to have one of the best if not the best audio engineering department in the world, so if Harmon is using these speakers in their reference room, that means these speakers have met an extremely high standard of technical excellence. Even among the THX pm3 certified speakers, the 6332s are higher performing. Genelec has have some comparable speakers, but they are multiple times the cost.
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post #21 of 73 Old 07-22-2013, 11:48 AM - Thread Starter
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The reason why people don't use them is because of their utilitarian looks. Usually when people are on the market for pricier speakers, they are looking for something that looks nice. Also most monitors are self-powered (not these though), and a lot of people, for whatever reason, think they should use their AVR's amplifier, as if that were a better value (it's not).The JBL LSRs are purely performance driven. The 6332s in particular are used in Harmon's Reference room. Harmon owns JBL, Infinity, Revel, Mark Levinson, and a bunch of other audio companies, and are widely regarded to have one of the best if not the best audio engineering department in the world, so if Harmon is using these speakers in their reference room, that means these speakers have met an extremely high standard of technical excellence. Even among the THX pm3 certified speakers, the 6332s are higher performing. Genelec has have some comparable speakers, but they are multiple times the cost.

I know there is some debate about this, but if my LR speakers are closer to the TV, do I even need a center channel speaker? Also, if I move them closer to the TV will that significantly affect the "width" of the sound for lack of a better term? Can they be closer to the side walls if I angle them in and the walls are treated, or is that just defeating the whole purpose? Should the speakers be set higher than what they would be just sitting on a sub? Lastly (for now), what do you think of the towers with built in subs (GE Triton Two, DT Towers)?
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post #22 of 73 Old 07-22-2013, 12:21 PM
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Originally Posted by HoosierDoc View Post

I know there is some debate about this, but if my LR speakers are closer to the TV, do I even need a center channel speaker? Also, if I move them closer to the TV will that significantly affect the "width" of the sound for lack of a better term? Can they be closer to the side walls if I angle them in and the walls are treated, or is that just defeating the whole purpose? Should the speakers be set higher than what they would be just sitting on a sub? Lastly (for now), what do you think of the towers with built in subs (GE Triton Two, DT Towers)?
I sent you a PM...smile.gif...and you will get a lot of views on towers with built in sub's...my recommendation is listen yourself and see how you like them...after all its you who will use them...smile.gif

Doing what I do best...LIVIN!
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post #23 of 73 Old 07-22-2013, 12:21 PM
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Originally Posted by HoosierDoc View Post

I know there is some debate about this, but if my LR speakers are closer to the TV, do I even need a center channel speaker? Also, if I move them closer to the TV will that significantly affect the "width" of the sound for lack of a better term? Can they be closer to the side walls if I angle them in and the walls are treated, or is that just defeating the whole purpose? Should the speakers be set higher than what they would be just sitting on a sub? Lastly (for now), what do you think of the towers with built in subs (GE Triton Two, DT Towers)?

Here is what you should do



Note that I have them pulled forward, based on where the bottom of the black rectangle is sitting. You can toe them in as much as you need to.

If you get a tall sub, it will be like the speakers are on stands. This HSU is 22.25" high

http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/vtf-3mk4.html

This Rythmik is 24" high

http://www.ascendacoustics.com/pages/products/subs/d15se.html

The built in subs are poor performers, barely reaching 30hz, and distorting at high output. That HSU and Rythmik will easily hit 16hz or lower in your room, with more power then you probably think is even possible right now.
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post #24 of 73 Old 07-22-2013, 12:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay1 View Post

Here is what you should do



Note that I have them pulled forward, based on where the bottom of the black rectangle is sitting. You can toe them in as much as you need to.

If you get a tall sub, it will be like the speakers are on stands. This HSU is 22.25" high

http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/vtf-3mk4.html

This Rythmik is 24" high

http://www.ascendacoustics.com/pages/products/subs/d15se.html

The built in subs are poor performers, barely reaching 30hz, and distorting at high output. That HSU and Rythmik will easily hit 16hz or lower in your room, with more power then you probably think is even possible right now.
I beg to differ..I have definitive 8060-st's and they output to 21 hz in my living room...they don't distort at all...even at high volume.A dedicated sub will offer lower output but really isn't needed unless you want to feel a gut punch...smile.gif

Doing what I do best...LIVIN!
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post #25 of 73 Old 07-22-2013, 12:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by josh6113 View Post

I beg to differ..I have definitive 8060-st's and they output to 21 hz in my living room...they don't distort at all...even at high volume.A dedicated sub will offer lower output but really isn't needed unless you want to feel a gut punch...smile.gif

That is great that you're happy with them, but a 300 watt 10" sub is a 300 watt 10" sub wink.gif Given the $2k price, a pair of VTF3's with a pair of SM55's makes a lot more sense.

Edit: Looking at this cutaway, there's massive spans of side panel with no bracing, another compromise to a built in sub. The resonances created effect the sound of the entire speaker

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post #26 of 73 Old 07-22-2013, 12:47 PM
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Originally Posted by HoosierDoc View Post

I know there is some debate about this, but if my LR speakers are closer to the TV, do I even need a center channel speaker? Also, if I move them closer to the TV will that significantly affect the "width" of the sound for lack of a better term? Can they be closer to the side walls if I angle them in and the walls are treated, or is that just defeating the whole purpose? Should the speakers be set higher than what they would be just sitting on a sub? Lastly (for now), what do you think of the towers with built in subs (GE Triton Two, DT Towers)?

I know many people use a phantom center channel. My downstairs room has two SVS Ultra towers and the dialogue seems great for movies and TV. Still, I think most people recommend a dedicated center, but I will let other chime in with their thoughts.

There is a balance between too close together and too close to the walls. Probably it is best to experiment. Having the distance between the left and right less than the distance to your seat is ok, as long as they are not super close to each other.

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post #27 of 73 Old 07-22-2013, 12:51 PM
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Originally Posted by HoosierDoc View Post

Is there a reason that more people don't use studio speakers like the JBL's suggested above? What is the drawback of that?

No speaker grilles. biggrin.gif

You could also get the excellent JBL Synthesis LS40 bookshelf speakers (has grilles).

JBL-LS40-02-450x291.jpg

http://www.hometheater.com/content/jbl-ls40-speaker-system
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post #28 of 73 Old 07-22-2013, 12:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HoosierDoc View Post

I know there is some debate about this, but if my LR speakers are closer to the TV, do I even need a center channel speaker? Also, if I move them closer to the TV will that significantly affect the "width" of the sound for lack of a better term? Can they be closer to the side walls if I angle them in and the walls are treated, or is that just defeating the whole purpose? Should the speakers be set higher than what they would be just sitting on a sub? Lastly (for now), what do you think of the towers with built in subs (GE Triton Two, DT Towers)?

I agree with much of the replies here. Your sound stage probably won't be badly affected by moving the speakers to flank your TV stand, but your frequency response might be given a very nice improvement. In other words, it will help a lot more than it will hurt. As for angling the speakers, try different toe-ins regardless of where they end up, it can effect the sound stage and could help a bit. Infinity Betas have very good off-axis response though, so toeing them in to be aimed right at you probably won't give you any dramatic improvements, however you have nothing to lose by simply trying it. I also agree that you should really angle your center speaker to be aimed at your ear level.

The ideal height for speakers is with the tweeters at ear level. A little bit above or below that won't hurt though. As for towers with built in subs, as with what has already been said, I would definitely skip those. Yes, they have subs built in but those are compromised subs, they aren't great subs. Your dollar with go further in achieving good sound by just getting speakers that don't even try for deep bass extension and let the subs handle the bass.
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post #29 of 73 Old 07-22-2013, 12:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay1 View Post

Here is what you should do



Note that I have them pulled forward, based on where the bottom of the black rectangle is sitting. You can toe them in as much as you need to.

If you get a tall sub, it will be like the speakers are on stands. This HSU is 22.25" high

http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/vtf-3mk4.html

This Rythmik is 24" high

http://www.ascendacoustics.com/pages/products/subs/d15se.html

The built in subs are poor performers, barely reaching 30hz, and distorting at high output. That HSU and Rythmik will easily hit 16hz or lower in your room, with more power then you probably think is even possible right now.

+ 1.

Also, can you wall mount your TV so it goes higher and get the AV rack for under the TV that is not as wide as your existing one giving you more room. Place your Center on top. Speaker placement will be very similar (given your room) regardless of what speaker you get. So before buying the speakers, you should try making these changes, maybe adding the subs as your first purchase and listen to the difference. It should be quite different with your current speakers in a better setup. If you feel you want to upgrade after that, then you may get more accurate recommendations depending on what characteristics are missing, and what you want to get out the system.

Yamaha RX-V673 | HSU HC-1 MK2 | HSU HB-1 MK2 - LR | Pioneer SP-BS22-SLR | BIC RtR-V44-2 (Presence)
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post #30 of 73 Old 07-22-2013, 01:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AcuDefTechGuy View Post

No speaker grilles. biggrin.gif

You could also get the excellent JBL Synthesis LS40 bookshelf speakers (has grilles).

JBL-LS40-02-450x291.jpg

http://www.hometheater.com/content/jbl-ls40-speaker-system

I don't know why you like grills so much! Personally I think most speakers look better without grills. Unless you have kids or are particularly clumsy, grills so no purpose.
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