Surround Debate: JBL 8350 vs KLIPSCH KPT-12-VB vs JTR Slanted 8's - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 26 Old 08-20-2013, 04:26 PM - Thread Starter
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I am going to throw this out there because I am in the middle of deciding on which direction to go with surround upgrade. My guess would be that I could post this question in each of the three brand threads and pretty much predict how that would go, so I thought I would start a new thread.

Currently I have three JTR Noesis 212HT speakers for LCR. My surrounds are Klipsch RS-62II's for the side and RB-61's for back duty.

I want something bigger and something that will keep up with my JTR speakers. Also the idea of going with a direct radiating speaker is something I have been wanting to do.

Here are the three options I am considering:

4 - JBL 8350A's

4 - JTR Slanted 8's

2 - Klipsch KPT-12-VB
2 - Klipsch KPT -1201

*The last option is looking tougher and tougher due to the size/weight of the speaker. Mounting might pose to much of a problem for me.

*The JBL's are the least expensive option and mounting would be simpler

*Already have JTR speakers, so I know how good they are..plus I would have a complete setup from one brand. They would also be about twice the price than the JBL option..

I have reached out to several folks on here for advice and all of it has been good.

Looking for anybody else that might be able to help.

Thank you in advance.
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post #2 of 26 Old 08-20-2013, 04:37 PM
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I'm a BIG believer in timbre matching across the entire speaker array. This will become much more apparent as you listen to multi-channel music and the very likely upcoming object based surround formats.

I'd go with the Slanted 8's. They'd probably also be ideal for overhead ceiling height effects speakers if mounted correctly (and with safety cables as in Atmos theaters... don't want something heavy dropping on your head!!) since they're already angled.

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post #3 of 26 Old 08-21-2013, 04:28 AM - Thread Starter
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I would have thought more people would chime in. No biggie....

As much as I would love to hang speakers from my ceiling....I don't see that happening. smile.gif

The decision is coming down to the JBL's or Slanted 8's....with JBL having the lead at this time.
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post #4 of 26 Old 08-21-2013, 05:45 AM
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Perfect timbre matching makes the best movie experience and of course for multichannel music. At this point of my experiences I hate when there is audio panning from the front to back and the sound changes! Now the JBL will rock for surrounds and keep up but the tone will be different and it may or may not bother you. How were the Klipsch you had? Besides direct sound did you mind the timbre change?
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post #5 of 26 Old 08-21-2013, 06:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post

Perfect timbre matching makes the best movie experience and of course for multichannel music. At this point of my experiences I hate when there is audio panning from the front to back and the sound changes! Now the JBL will rock for surrounds and keep up but the tone will be different and it may or may not bother you. How were the Klipsch you had? Besides direct sound did you mind the timbre change?

But even with the JTR slanted 8s , he won't get perfect timbre matching since he has the Noesis in the front and the Slanted 8s would have a different compression driver versus the horns in the Noesis. That being said, I would say stick to JTR since this is a long term investment and you know deep down inside it is what you want to do :-)


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post #6 of 26 Old 08-21-2013, 06:25 AM - Thread Starter
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The Klipsch I currently have are very good speakers and did a great job.....when I had my RF-7II/RC-64II LCR. Now that I have the Noesis and more powerful subs... my surrounds get lost in the shuffle.

If I can pick up some nice used JBL surrounds, I might start with those. Then if I notice a difference due to the lack of Timbre matching, I will dump those and go with some Slanted 8's. I understand the reason of the higher cost with the Slanted 8's, it just doesn't make the purchase decision any easier.

Even if I have to go with a new set of JBL surrounds, the cost will be significantly lower. My relationships I have through my job with the various theater supply companies is really going to help out when it comes to getting some JBL's. I have a solid lead on two pairs of the 8340's, not the 8340A'S.

I will be eventually moving into a AT screen and putting all my speakers behind it. At that point, I might look into a full JBL Cinema setup. Possibly three of the 4722N's..
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post #7 of 26 Old 08-21-2013, 06:27 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frohlich View Post

But even with the JTR slanted 8s , he won't get perfect timbre matching since he has the Noesis in the front and the Slanted 8s would have a different compression driver versus the horns in the Noesis. That being said, I would say stick to JTR since this is a long term investment and you know deep down inside it is what you want to do :-)

You sound like a wise jedi master..... lol

It would be much easier if the cost was lower....but like I said in my last post, I understand the need for the higher cost in the slanted 8's.
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post #8 of 26 Old 08-21-2013, 06:51 AM
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Those are all big surrounds, and I know you want to go big... But just in case you want to a bit smaller, here's a great deal on used/restored Klipsch KPT-100:

http://community.klipsch.com/forums/t/175549.aspx

I bought a pair. Big enough for rear surrounds for me, although they are the smallest speaker in my setup.

Having said that, if I had the room and the funds I would probably go with JTR just to keep it in the same brand. I considered the JBL 8350A myself and like that the X-Curve high-frequency roll-off can be bypassed.

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post #9 of 26 Old 08-21-2013, 07:22 AM
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You know I forgot that the slant 8's were different. Maybe the single 8's would match better? Since the JTR's won't Timbre match perfectly anyways I would get the JBL's as I know they keep up with any movie out there at reference! Unless of course your surrounds are far away as every speaker as limits.

My surrounds are the largest surrounds I have used besides towers. The Midbass is fuller with a robust surround and makes for a more impactful experience. Surrounds are getting more dynamic info than ever and the skimping on surrounds for ambient background noise are just about gone. When explosions or jets pass by you don't want them to sound wimpy! Not when you have invested in a stellar front stage.
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post #10 of 26 Old 08-21-2013, 08:05 AM
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The S8 series would be the best match to the 212HT. BMS compression drivers have more in common and would be a better match to all other BMS CDs than mixing in another brand. If you decide to go another route than BMS any HE high quality CD in a MDF or Plywood cabinet would work great.
Try not to go full tilt on the front end and peter out with the surrounds b/c The better your surrounds the better your entire system will be.
Take your time to purchase since JTR speakers are built to last a lifetime.wink.gif
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post #11 of 26 Old 08-21-2013, 08:22 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post

You know I forgot that the slant 8's were different. Maybe the single 8's would match better? Since the JTR's won't Timbre match perfectly anyways I would get the JBL's as I know they keep up with any movie out there at reference! Unless of course your surrounds are far away as every speaker as limits.

My surrounds are the largest surrounds I have used besides towers. The Midbass is fuller with a robust surround and makes for a more impactful experience. Surrounds are getting more dynamic info than ever and the skimping on surrounds for ambient background noise are just about gone. When explosions or jets pass by you don't want them to sound wimpy! Not when you have invested in a stellar front stage.


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The S8 series would be the best match to the 212HT. BMS compression drivers have more in common and would be a better match to all other BMS CDs than mixing in another brand. If you decide to go another route than BMS any HE high quality CD in a MDF or Plywood cabinet would work great.
Try not to go full tilt on the front end and peter out with the surrounds b/c The better your surrounds the better your entire system will be.
Take your time to purchase since JTR speakers are built to last a lifetime.wink.gif
Chris

Guess I need to read up a little more. I thought the S8 and Slanted 8's were the same speaker but in different cabinet designs. I guess the S8's can be mounted and tilted accordingly..
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post #12 of 26 Old 08-21-2013, 08:27 AM
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S8 series = Single 8, Single 8LP, Slanted 8.
Same components different cabinets for different situations and mounting limitations.
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post #13 of 26 Old 08-21-2013, 08:33 AM
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The new Single 8 had the better CD though right? Are the slanted 8's now using the same?
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post #14 of 26 Old 08-21-2013, 08:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post

The new Single 8 had the better CD though right? Are the slanted 8's now using the same?
All three use the same. The cabinets are shaped different to allow for placement options but they are the same speaker.
The CD was updated in 2011 and even though I have read multiple posts of an even newer CD I have not read/seen proof.smile.gif
We will find out when someone is willing to take theirs apart and check like JBrown did with the 228.
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post #15 of 26 Old 08-21-2013, 08:43 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post

The new Single 8 had the better CD though right? Are the slanted 8's now using the same?

Quote:
Originally Posted by countryWV View Post


All three use the same. The cabinets are shaped different to allow for placement options but they are the same speaker.
The CD was updated in 2011 and even though I have read multiple posts of an even newer CD I have not read/seen proof.smile.gif
We will find out when someone is willing to take theirs apart and check like JBrown did with the 228.
Chris

Gotcha...

So if we can get confirmation, then it is possible that the slanted 8's have the newer CD that would compliment the 212HT's nicely?
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post #16 of 26 Old 08-21-2013, 08:49 AM
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Well that would be the best timbre for sure and best all around performance. Even big cinemas have different surrounds than their front stage! Even though it works great it is still not the best, the best would be identical speakers! Start saving for more Noesis! Yes, I just went there! Anyways the slanted 8's would work best for you as they are smaller than the cinema lines as well. I used to own slanted 8's way back when, the first set actually. On AVS anyways. I am still proud of that fact to get Jeff's products out there! I don't use them now but always recommend them when they fit. I am so happy with my speakers right now I am not even interested in trying new stuff but maybe one day I will try the 212's. I still like the 888lp's! It all depends on size, budget and performance.
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post #17 of 26 Old 08-21-2013, 08:50 AM
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How well do you think the Karma 8's would blend with his Noesis?

http://www.diysoundgroup.com/waveguide-speaker-kits/karma-series-kits/karma8-kit.html

Dumb enough to spend lots of cash on this junk!
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post #18 of 26 Old 08-21-2013, 08:58 AM
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Gotcha...

So if we can get confirmation, then it is possible that the slanted 8's have the newer CD that would compliment the 212HT's nicely?
Yes. The S8 series uses a very nice Neodymium CD. Very Nice!!!
Other than the 212s CD (4593/4594) and within a reasonable price the S8 would compliment the 212 the best.
Remember Jeff purposely builds these speakers and crossovers to compliment each other as his ears and skills see fit.
I have seen where Mark Seaton will recommend the S8 as a passive option to compliment his Cats if someone is not using his active designs (like the Sparks) for surrounds.
Chris
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post #19 of 26 Old 08-21-2013, 09:11 AM
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How well do you think the Karma 8's would blend with his Noesis?

http://www.diysoundgroup.com/waveguide-speaker-kits/karma-series-kits/karma8-kit.html
They will work but the low sensitivity(91.5db) would make it less than ideal. The DNA 360 would be a better choice for a CD.
Eric has a new Neo CD on the horizon and would be worth the wait if time allows.
I still would not choose to go this route if specifically trying to partner with the Noesis 212HT. This speaker is extremely capable.
I like MKs idea of 212s all around.biggrin.gif
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post #20 of 26 Old 08-21-2013, 12:58 PM - Thread Starter
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Yes. The S8 series uses a very nice Neodymium CD. Very Nice!!!
Other than the 212s CD (4593/4594) and within a reasonable price the S8 would compliment the 212 the best.
Remember Jeff purposely builds these speakers and crossovers to compliment each other as his ears and skills see fit.
I have seen where Mark Seaton will recommend the S8 as a passive option to compliment his Cats if someone is not using his active designs (like the Sparks) for surrounds.
Chris

I have a co-worker who is going this route. He ordered CAT-12's for the front and is going with 4 S8's for the surrounds. Funny you mentioned that..

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They will work but the low sensitivity(91.5db) would make it less than ideal. The DNA 360 would be a better choice for a CD.
Eric has a new Neo CD on the horizon and would be worth the wait if time allows.
I still would not choose to go this route if specifically trying to partner with the Noesis 212HT. This speaker is extremely capable.
I like MKs idea of 212s all around.biggrin.gif
Chris

Not sure if the co-CFO would approve that sort of purchase....or allow the mounting of them.. eek.gif

Just in the last few hours, I found a sweet deal on some used JBL 8340's. If I can figure out how to mount them, I might go that route first. At the end of the day, I enjoy the sound of my JTR speakers so I know the sound of the S8's should give me equal enjoyment and complete my room. I go back to the price thing again.. LOL These JBL's might be good "fill in" speakers until I know what the future holds for me in terms of speakers. Maybe I will see my 212HT's and order something else. (Let the PM's pour in on offers).... kidding.
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post #21 of 26 Old 08-21-2013, 01:23 PM
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Are the 8340's an upgrade over your Klipsch?
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post #22 of 26 Old 08-21-2013, 02:03 PM - Thread Starter
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Are the 8340's an upgrade over your Klipsch?
.

On paper, they definitely appear to be.... I am waiting on pictures and a quote on shipping before I decide for sure.

Still have an option of picking up some new 8350's at a great deal through a different customer of mine....those also appear to be the real deal.
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post #23 of 26 Old 08-21-2013, 02:09 PM
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Having said that I liked my 8340A's more than my KS-525's!
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post #24 of 26 Old 08-21-2013, 02:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Having said that I liked my 8340A's more than my KS-525's!

Seems like you have had all kinds of speakers... haha.

The 8340A's are another possibility...but the price difference is minimal, so the 8350's are the favorite.
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post #25 of 26 Old 08-21-2013, 02:26 PM
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Seems like you have had all kinds of speakers... haha.

The 8340A's are another possibility...but the price difference is minimal, so the 8350's are the favorite.

I never heard those but they look to be more sensitive with more spl capability. Can't be a bad thing.
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post #26 of 26 Old 08-21-2013, 02:43 PM - Thread Starter
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They are....

In talking with the folks I am working with, they are the speaker that Cinemark is using for their surrounds in some of the newer XD builds. Since I don't have one near me, I can't confirm that for sure.
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