Trade Klipsch Reference RF-7II.... for B&W CM10 is a good decision? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 329 Old 08-31-2013, 06:36 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Hi
So i made up my mind, and since i just bough a Klispch THX Ultra 2 7.2 Set for my dedicated Home Theatre.

Now in my living room where i also like to watch movies i had Klipsch Reference RF-7 II (Front); RC-64 (Center; RF-82 II (Back); SW-115 (Subwoofer).
I sold my system to help me out to pay the THX Ultra 2.

Now that i can buy speakers again, i have 2 options.

- Buy the same Klipsch Reference set (with the exeption of the subwoofer) As for subs i am going to use SVS-PB13 Ultra

- Buy B&W CM10 (Front); CM9 (Back); CM2 (Center + SVS PB-13 Ultra


One thing i've noticed is that B&W works at 89db (CM9) and 90db (CM10) against 96 or 97db that klipsch works, that makes of it a much more dynamic and detailed speaker for movies right?
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post #2 of 329 Old 08-31-2013, 07:49 AM
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Speakers are the weakest link in the playback chain, and being rather imperfect, one has to choose a speaker one enjoys. You have to weigh the speaker design's faults against its strengths, and get what you can enjoy long-term. Klipsch and B&W are so different in design and overall sound that it is really impossible to make any kind of judgment of which is 'better'. It will depend on what you like.

Klipsch are designed for high sensitivity, so will play quite loud with little power. They use horn mids and tweeters, so dynamics can be quite exciting and lifelike. However, in general, Klipsch speakers have a 'house sound' that is forward, aggressive, bright, 'in your face', etc. It can be really fun, or it can be irritating. It's a matter of taste. I would say that if you're low on amplifier power, Klipsch is a good choice, if you like their house sound. Also, horn speakers will have limited dispersion. They focus the sound in a well defined area, rather than spreading the sound out over a wide area.

B&W are at the complete other end of the spectrum. They have more of what's called a 'British' sound. They use direct radiating cones and domes only, maybe a tiny little 'waveguide' is used in a few models. They are not nearly as sensitive as Klipsch speakers, but they tend to sound more relaxed, smooth, laid back, with 'airy' highs, etc. Because of the lower sensitivity, they require more amplifier power for a given sound pressure level in-room. Since they are direct radiator speakers, they tend to exhibit power compression at high playback levels, but their dispersion will be wider than from horns (Klipsch).

It really depends what you like. Have you auditioned the B&W's? Did you like them?

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post #3 of 329 Old 08-31-2013, 08:47 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Hi
Tank you for your description it really helped. This week i am going to hear the B&W and i will make my judge. Before i had Klipsch i had Monitor Audio RX Silver series and changed to klipsch because they have clearly more power and dynamics.
The CM10 have more power than the RF7II but less db...and i am affraid i will loose detail. However i feel more tired when i listen an entire movie more loud...
The space where this home theater is integrated is not very big so having the CM9 on the back maybe it's not necessary, the CM5 might be enough.
The dealer also advised me the Sonus Faber Venere 3.0 but i think it's inferior to the CM Series.
In terms of Amplifier since i am investing in a dedicated room i will use my Pioneer SC-LX90. Will it work good with B&W?
The dealer is going to demonstrate the CM with Onkyo Pre/Pro so i guess my Pioneer is enough.
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post #4 of 329 Old 08-31-2013, 09:30 AM
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Hi
Tank you for your description it really helped. This week i am going to hear the B&W and i will make my judge. Before i had Klipsch i had Monitor Audio RX Silver series and changed to klipsch because they have clearly more power and dynamics.
The CM10 have more power than the RF7II but less db...and i am affraid i will loose detail. However i feel more tired when i listen an entire movie more loud...
The space where this home theater is integrated is not very big so having the CM9 on the back maybe it's not necessary, the CM5 might be enough.
The dealer also advised me the Sonus Faber Venere 3.0 but i think it's inferior to the CM Series.
In terms of Amplifier since i am investing in a dedicated room i will use my Pioneer SC-LX90. Will it work good with B&W?
The dealer is going to demonstrate the CM with Onkyo Pre/Pro so i guess my Pioneer is enough.

That Pioneer should work with just about anything you could throw at it.

Although different manufacturers seek different sound profiles (certainly the case with B&W and Klipsch, as rongon aptly points out) you should not lose dynamics just because a speaker has lower sensitivity unless your amp finds itself relatively underpowered trying to fuel it. Given the brightness of Klipsch, it might be more satisfying to hear something a bit different in your audio-focused room.

Give the Sonus a try, along with B&W (how about the PM-1 if it is a small space?). KEF 201/2 (and other KEFs) might be worth a listen. Vienna Acoustics, high-level JBL (they do both direct radiating and horns well), Focal, Dynaudio, DALI, even a used set of Joseph Audio Pulsars. That SVS sub is supposed to be terrific, which gives you great flexibility by way of your fronts, and monitors may give you more bang for the buck than floorstanders (not sure how big your space is).
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post #5 of 329 Old 08-31-2013, 10:00 AM - Thread Starter
 
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The space is around 18 square meters. I also tough at Kef Reference but goes way of the budget because i would like the 205 for the front and to be honnest i don't know if they are not outperformed by B&W or Klipsh. In last case i will order the same Klipsch set that i had with the exeption of the sub.
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post #6 of 329 Old 08-31-2013, 10:19 AM
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The space is around 18 square meters. I also tough at Kef Reference but goes way of the budget because i would like the 205 for the front and to be honnest i don't know if they are not outperformed by B&W or Klipsh. In last case i will order the same Klipsch set that i had with the exeption of the sub.

Sure -- your call. Unless I am misinterpreting, that sounds like a fairly small space where monitors might well work, but we all have our preferences. I did not suggest the KEF 205 as I knew that would hit an entirely different price point. If you like B&W, even the 805s or 804s might be feasible, depending upon discounting. Happy listening, regardless!
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post #7 of 329 Old 08-31-2013, 11:00 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Today i am sure i can negotiate good discounts, and i will also try my luck with Kef, lets see...
I remember as it was today the review of Kef Reference, amazing speakers.
What i can also get today and cheap are the Pioneer S-1EX plus the rest of the EX Series but they are poor speakers....and when i say poor i mean they don't give any special performance for the price...
And the only place i might get monitors are for the surround speakers, because i like floors for the front.
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post #8 of 329 Old 08-31-2013, 11:26 AM
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Today i am sure i can negotiate good discounts, and i will also try my luck with Kef, lets see...
I remember as it was today the review of Kef Reference, amazing speakers.
What i can also get today and cheap are the Pioneer S-1EX plus the rest of the EX Series but they are poor speakers....and when i say poor i mean they don't give any special performance for the price...
And the only place i might get monitors are for the surround speakers, because i like floors for the front.

Hah -- different strokes. Just got a set of Pioneer S4-EX and cross them over to JBL PS1400 subs and so far find them exquisite. Glad I did not recommend the series to you! Please do PM me with any information you would be willing to share about well-priced EX speakers. Cheers.
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post #9 of 329 Old 08-31-2013, 12:06 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Hah -- different strokes. Just got a set of Pioneer S4-EX and cross them over to JBL PS1400 subs and so far find them exquisite. Glad I did not recommend the series to you! Please do PM me with any information you would be willing to share about well-priced EX speakers. Cheers.

If you want a friendly advice sell those speakers. The only good thing about the EX Series is for decoration purposes and they might sound good for begginners with all the respect for everyone.
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post #10 of 329 Old 08-31-2013, 01:32 PM
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Congrats on your new thx speakers. Hope you find them an upgrade biggrin.gif

Have you considered going used? Most of the time when someone spends big money like this they take care of their stuff. And a lot of times its as good as new.

With internet deals getting speakers new like klipsch and other brands its pretty easy to get brand new all day for 70% and if you wait for deals 50%. Not sure how good your dealer deals are and certainly don't want to get in the way of that just saying.

Also have you ever heard the old klipsch heritage? I bought a set of old cornwalls in really nice condition. They are every bit as good as my rf-7ii and would cost you much less. If your room has a modern type theme then they would look out of place but would look good in a more conservative style room.

A year ago used would of been the last thing i would buy. I love new and trust new. But a while back i put together a system for a friend and he had a really small budget. So i hit the used market. Wow the stuff people give away just to get it out of their house is like stealing.

The two speakers your looking at would both be really nice I'm sure. I personally would not trade the RF-7ii/RC-64ii for those 3 B&Ws but its your money so let your ears buy the speakers not mine biggrin.gif

Sorry for rambling good luck with your new speakers.

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post #11 of 329 Old 08-31-2013, 01:40 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Congrats on your new thx speakers. Hope you find them an upgrade biggrin.gif

Have you considered going used? Most of the time when someone spends big money like this they take care of their stuff. And a lot of times its as good as new.

With internet deals getting speakers new like klipsch and other brands its pretty easy to get brand new all day for 70% and if you wait for deals 50%. Not sure how good your dealer deals are and certainly don't want to get in the way of that just saying.

Also have you ever heard the old klipsch heritage? I bought a set of old cornwalls in really nice condition. They are every bit as good as my rf-7ii and would cost you much less. If your room has a modern type theme then they would look out of place but would look good in a more conservative style room.

A year ago used would of been the last thing i would buy. I love new and trust new. But a while back i put together a system for a friend and he had a really small budget. So i hit the used market. Wow the stuff people give away just to get it out of their house is like stealing.

The two speakers your looking at would both be really nice I'm sure. I personally would not trade the RF-7ii/RC-64ii for those 3 B&Ws but its your money so let your ears buy the speakers not mine biggrin.gif

Sorry for rambling good luck with your new speakers.

No need to say sorry, i appreciate your opinion. Well if everyone has the same taste, things would't sell.
I like the RF-7II and probably i am going to buy the same set again. I am going to hear the B&W in 2 days and i'll let you all know. In case i don't like i will buy the same exact set.
My Dealer charges me for RF-7II (2); RC-64II (1); RF-82II(2) around €3500 Euros. I think it's a good price for A stock...
If i buy the CM10(2); CM5(2); CM2(1) i guess i will have to spend more or less €5000 Euros.

Does it justifies? Let me see...

As for used, i don't like to buy used, but i find great deals. You never know if they were abused, it's hard to tell.
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post #12 of 329 Old 08-31-2013, 02:21 PM - Thread Starter
 
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One thing i am going to strange in case i go to B&W is the fact the Klipsch RC-64II (Central Speaker) is about the double of the size of the CM2 (B&W Central) and provides 200W RMS / 800W Peak.
The B&W provides less i guess... Klipsch is very present in the voices, i don't know about B&W.

I remember to watch the entry scene of "Dark Kight Rises" and when Bane starts to talk in the plane his voice fills my living room with the Klipsch. Very detailed....
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post #13 of 329 Old 08-31-2013, 02:56 PM
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Not sure if any other major speaker line sounds quite like Klipsch. You obviously enjoy their characteristic clarity and brightness, so stick with them. Trying the B&W is laudable, but I now wonder if you would end up with buyer's remorse with anything but Klipsch, particularly since your other, remaining set would remind you constantly of what you were missing.
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post #14 of 329 Old 08-31-2013, 02:59 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by howaboutthat41 View Post

Not sure if any other major speaker line sounds quite like Klipsch. You obviously enjoy their characteristic clarity and brightness, so stick with them. Trying the B&W is laudable, but I now wonder if you would end up with buyer's remorse with anything but Klipsch, particularly since your other, remaining set would remind you constantly of what you were missing.

I forgot to tell one thing i've noticed in my Klipsch...These is one thing i never liked of them, they are made of cheap wood and have lots of plastic.

When i had the Monitor Audio they were more weak, but the finish was a bit better. These B&W seem to be made wth lots of detail. I love the Black Gloss finish.

One important thing that i keep thinking is the fact the B&W speakers are 89db, against 101db from Klipsch (HUGE DIFFERENCE). Those are not good news when it concerns Cinema.

I have a good Amp, the SC-LX90 from Pioneer, but that doesn't mean anything, the experts always told me not to buy speakers with less than 90 to 91db for movies...this might have a good reason!
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post #15 of 329 Old 08-31-2013, 03:40 PM
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...One important thing that i keep thinking is the fact the B&W speakers are 89db, against 101db from Klipsch (HUGE DIFFERENCE). Those are not good news when it concerns Cinema.
!

I own the Original RF-7s/RC-7 and have appreciated them on a nightly basis for over a decade...That said, the RF-7IIs may be closer to 96 DB/1 meter as per this thread: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1412510/klipsch-rf7-ii-measurements

I will also say I liked my RF-7s/RC-7/RF-3s/RB-75s as much if not better than the THX line I auditioned at 3 different locations...That said, if I had the THX speakers first (along with the dual THX subs) it may have been a toss up which I would prefer, but YMMV.
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post #16 of 329 Old 08-31-2013, 05:12 PM
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One thing i am going to strange in case i go to B&W is the fact the Klipsch RC-64II (Central Speaker) is about the double of the size of the CM2 (B&W Central) and provides 200W RMS / 800W Peak.
The B&W provides less i guess... Klipsch is very present in the voices, i don't know about B&W.

I remember to watch the entry scene of "Dark Kight Rises" and when Bane starts to talk in the plane his voice fills my living room with the Klipsch. Very detailed....

I personally have never heard another brand for ht better than high end klipsch. So far the rf-7ii/rc-64ii ht system is the best ht my ears have heard so far (I do realize there is better out there)). The room filling effortless sound like the voice of bane in that part is a good example. Would be hard to lose once you have it.
You put the biggest klipsch hater on the planet in my home for 2 hrs and I guarantee that guy leaves a klipsch fan biggrin.gif
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No need to say sorry, i appreciate your opinion. Well if everyone has the same taste, things would't sell.
I like the RF-7II and probably i am going to buy the same set again. I am going to hear the B&W in 2 days and i'll let you all know. In case i don't like i will buy the same exact set.
My Dealer charges me for RF-7II (2); RC-64II (1); RF-82II(2) around €3500 Euros. I think it's a good price for A stock...
If i buy the CM10(2); CM5(2); CM2(1) i guess i will have to spend more or less €5000 Euros.

Does it justifies? Let me see...

As for used, i don't like to buy used, but i find great deals. You never know if they were abused, it's hard to tell.


Sounds like your getting a great deal if i understand the currency right biggrin.gif
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I forgot to tell one thing i've noticed in my Klipsch...These is one thing i never liked of them, they are made of cheap wood and have lots of plastic.

When i had the Monitor Audio they were more weak, but the finish was a bit better. These B&W seem to be made wth lots of detail. I love the Black Gloss finish.

One important thing that i keep thinking is the fact the B&W speakers are 89db, against 101db from Klipsch (HUGE DIFFERENCE). Those are not good news when it concerns Cinema.

I have a good Amp, the SC-LX90 from Pioneer, but that doesn't mean anything, the experts always told me not to buy speakers with less than 90 to 91db for movies...this might have a good reason!

Did you have the cherry rf-7ii or the black? I have black myself but that cherry looks pretty awesome. Both are hand made but not the high end wood like a salk speaker would have for sure. If i could go back in time i would have grabbed cherry.

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post #17 of 329 Old 08-31-2013, 05:56 PM
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OK, here I go... Sorry if I rub anybody the wrong way. I really don't mean to.

Klipsch speakers raise high passions in those who love them. I will say this -- they are idiosyncratic. If you love Klipsch speakers, you love them. If you don't, you tend to want to run from the room screaming.

I would love to love horn speakers, and I'm still trying to. I've heard Klipschorns (great!), Altec A7's (almost as great), owned RF3's (almost good enough, but that hot upper midrange and lower treble grew tiring), auditioned Heresy's (HATE them), also heard Tangent 400's (there's that hot upper midrange again) and KLF-30's (reminded me a lot of Heresy). I also own a pair of KG4.5's (great for cheap, but they are made from very cheap parts, and sound it), which I've taken apart and am using to build new speakers in.

Since you seem to love horns, and you're in Europe (I think), I'll suggest you check out Tannoy. I have owned a pair of Tannoy T185 Dorset since about 1995. I also got a pair of System 8 NFM near-field monitors along the way. A friend has a pair of classic Little Gold Monitors which I've heard quite a bit of. I'd say the Tannoy 'house sound' is sort of near-Klipsch in intensity and impact, but with a good helping of British politeness to the sound. I haven't heard any new-production Tannoy speakers, but they are a great company that makes good stuff. Well worth checking out, especially if you are in Europe. Tannoy stuff is overpriced here, while Klipsch stuff tends to be much more expensive in Europe than it is here in the US. The Tannoy Definition line is their upper-mid line. The Revolution line is their more budget-friendly line. The Prestige line is for lords and earls.

I'd say B&W sound more on the tightly controlled and 'accurate' side than Tannoy or (most certainly!) Klipsch. However, if you are a die-hard Klipsch fan, just get bigger Klipsch's. They are fun, kick-butt speakers. I sometimes miss those RF3s. I got them cheap, just to hear them, and I did like them almost enough to keep them -- and this was for hifi, not for HT.

--

PS -- There is also the new generation of horn speakers based on oblate spheroid waveguide horns. I have yet to hear one, but the word is that you get the high sensitivity and controlled directivity of horns but lose most of the 'horn sound.' Earl Geddes of Gedlee LLC and Wayne Parham of pi Speakers are the chief proponents of these new horn speaker designs. I don't know where you'd be able to hear them though. I have high hopes for these things.

PPS -- Re: sensitivity specs -- Klipsch gives their SPL spec at 1W rms input, from 1 meter distance, in a 'typical listening room' (whatever that means). Generally, you should take 3dB away from their sensitivity specs to compare to other companies'. My KG4.5 are stated to have 95dB sensitivity, but they're really more like 91 or 92dB. Tannoy states their sensitivity with 1W input, at 1 meter distance, in an anechoic environment. So when they say 91dB, they mean it. As an example, my Tannoy System 8's (sens = 91dB) play at an almost identical level as the Klipsch KG4.5 (sens = 95dB), with the same level setting from the amp. Just something to be aware of.

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post #18 of 329 Old 08-31-2013, 06:32 PM
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OK, here I go... Sorry if I rub anybody the wrong way. I really don't mean to.

Klipsch speakers raise high passions in those who love them. I will say this -- they are idiosyncratic. If you love Klipsch speakers, you love them. If you don't, you tend to want to run from the room screaming.

I would love to love horn speakers, and I'm still trying to. I've heard Klipschorns (great!), Altec A7's (almost as great), owned RF3's (almost good enough, but that hot upper midrange and lower treble grew tiring), auditioned Heresy's (HATE them), also heard Tangent 400's (there's that hot upper midrange again) and KLF-30's (reminded me a lot of Heresy). I also own a pair of KG4.5's (great for cheap, but they are made from very cheap parts, and sound it), which I've taken apart and am using to build new speakers in.

Since you seem to love horns, and you're in Europe (I think), I'll suggest you check out Tannoy. I have owned a pair of Tannoy T185 Dorset since about 1995. I also got a pair of System 8 NFM near-field monitors along the way. A friend has a pair of classic Little Gold Monitors which I've heard quite a bit of. I'd say the Tannoy 'house sound' is sort of near-Klipsch in intensity and impact, but with a good helping of British politeness to the sound. I haven't heard any new-production Tannoy speakers, but they are a great company that makes good stuff. Well worth checking out, especially if you are in Europe. Tannoy stuff is overpriced here, while Klipsch stuff tends to be much more expensive in Europe than it is here in the US. The Tannoy Definition line is their upper-mid line. The Revolution line is their more budget-friendly line. The Prestige line is for lords and earls.

I'd say B&W sound more on the tightly controlled and 'accurate' side than Tannoy or (most certainly!) Klipsch. However, if you are a die-hard Klipsch fan, just get bigger Klipsch's. They are fun, kick-butt speakers. I sometimes miss those RF3s. I got them cheap, just to hear them, and I did like them almost enough to keep them -- and this was for hifi, not for HT.

--

PS -- There is also the new generation of horn speakers based on oblate spheroid waveguide horns. I have yet to hear one, but the word is that you get the high sensitivity and controlled directivity of horns but lose most of the 'horn sound.' Earl Geddes of Gedlee LLC and Wayne Parham of pi Speakers are the chief proponents of these new horn speaker designs. I don't know where you'd be able to hear them though. I have high hopes for these things.

PPS -- Re: sensitivity specs -- Klipsch gives their SPL spec at 1W rms input, from 1 meter distance, in a 'typical listening room' (whatever that means). Generally, you should take 3dB away from their sensitivity specs to compare to other companies'. My KG4.5 are stated to have 95dB sensitivity, but they're really more like 91 or 92dB. Tannoy states their sensitivity with 1W input, at 1 meter distance, in an anechoic environment. So when they say 91dB, they mean it. As an example, my Tannoy System 8's (sens = 91dB) play at an almost identical level as the Klipsch KG4.5 (sens = 95dB), with the same level setting from the amp. Just something to be aware of.

--

Well said:D Always nice to get an opnion from some one who has atleast owned the brand and ran them in there system. Imo klipsch are best in the ht. That is where they shine. As a klipsch owner who has owned a ton of there speakers (old, new, cheap, and expense).
They are to bright with no eq for basic 2channel. They need to be tamed a little to play nice. There strength becomes there weakness because most people don't want to be at a live concert everytime they turn music on biggrin.gif
I dont know about everyone else but i wear ear plugs when i go to live shows. And definitely don't want to have to start wearing them at home eek.gif
Taming them is so easy though.. its a little more sometimes then basic tone controls but most pre/avr have an eq to tame them down a bit for music. For me its worth the trade off but not for everyone. biggrin.gif

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post #19 of 329 Old 08-31-2013, 06:55 PM
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people don't want to be at a live concert everytime they turn music on

I absolutely want to turn on the hifi and be transported to the concert. But I'm sorry, no pair of Klipsch I've heard (short of a pair of Klipschorns) sound relaxed and effortless enough to sound convincing on chamber music, at least for me. They sound great if you expect chamber music played through a really clean PA system, like from Meyer Sound. But they don't sound like acoustic music to me. (Sorry, that's just how I hear it. I know it's a cliche that Klipsch speakers sound like PA speakers. That's not what I mean.)
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I dont know about everyone else but i wear ear plugs when i go to live shows.

Well, I think that says a lot. It all depends on the kinds of music you listen to. I would never go to the Metropolitan Opera or the Village Vanguard and put in earplugs. However, I would absolutely never go to hear so-called "live" music at Madison Square Garden -- but if I was forced to, I would most definitely put in the earplugs!

One great test of a pair of speakers is a well-recorded string quartet. Ever hear a pair of Heresy's playing a string quartet? It ain't pretty. However, more current high-end Klipsch speakers do a reasonable job of it, but not quite good enough for me. Some Tannoy speakers can do OK with that, as they are less strident than Klipsch for that kind of thing. However, a higher end pair of Focal or Magnepan should do really well with a string quartet, but might sound unexciting for home theater.

It's not that I'm a horn hater. The biggest surprise of my audio life was when I heard a pair of Klipschorns, properly placed in the corners of a room, playing classical music from a big Onkyo receiver, back around 1990 or so. It really sounded like music! I was astounded. But I've heard a lot of Klipsch speakers in a lot of rooms after that, and I never found that experience again. Maybe Jubilees or something like that would float my boat... wink.gif

Again, it all depends.

PS -- So far, the best systems I've heard use line arrays of Jordan drivers. But I don't know how they'd work for home theater.

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post #20 of 329 Old 08-31-2013, 08:44 PM
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Originally Posted by rongon View Post

I absolutely want to turn on the hifi and be transported to the concert. But I'm sorry, no pair of Klipsch I've heard (short of a pair of Klipschorns) sound relaxed and effortless enough to sound convincing on chamber music, at least for me. They sound great if you expect chamber music played through a really clean PA system, like from Meyer Sound. But they don't sound like acoustic music to me. (Sorry, that's just how I hear it. I know it's a cliche that Klipsch speakers sound like PA speakers. That's not what I mean.)
Well, I think that says a lot. It all depends on the kinds of music you listen to. I would never go to the Metropolitan Opera or the Village Vanguard and put in earplugs. However, I would absolutely never go to hear so-called "live" music at Madison Square Garden -- but if I was forced to, I would most definitely put in the earplugs!

One great test of a pair of speakers is a well-recorded string quartet. Ever hear a pair of Heresy's playing a string quartet? It ain't pretty. However, more current high-end Klipsch speakers do a reasonable job of it, but not quite good enough for me. Some Tannoy speakers can do OK with that, as they are less strident than Klipsch for that kind of thing. However, a higher end pair of Focal or Magnepan should do really well with a string quartet, but might sound unexciting for home theater.

It's not that I'm a horn hater. The biggest surprise of my audio life was when I heard a pair of Klipschorns, properly placed in the corners of a room, playing classical music from a big Onkyo receiver, back around 1990 or so. It really sounded like music! I was astounded. But I've heard a lot of Klipsch speakers in a lot of rooms after that, and I never found that experience again. Maybe Jubilees or something like that would float my boat... wink.gif

Again, it all depends.

PS -- So far, the best systems I've heard use line arrays of Jordan drivers. But I don't know how they'd work for home theater.

For live music i was just referring to loud. I think we have a big gap in the kind of music shows we go see. The last show i was at was cannibal corpse lol biggrin.gif. And I could see calling them refined pa speakers as debatable for certain models.
But I stand by my statement... give me two hours with any non klipsch fan and they will leave my home a fan. eek.gifwink.gifbiggrin.gif

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post #21 of 329 Old 09-01-2013, 01:43 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Everyone tank you so much, i value everyone opinion here, and the only thing i will do now is to hear the B&W just to rest my soul.

It's funny that until now nobody said anything special about B&W in what concerns to Cinema, maybe it's just not the right speaker...

Let's say i keep with Klipsch and order a new set as i had. I had the RF-82II for Back Surrounds. Should i keep these or the RS-62II are enough? My only concern is that floor standing speakers in the back are partially cover by the coutch. My couch is covering 70 to 80% of the speaker, and i think the sound is loss because it goes alot to the side if the coutch.

WIth regular speakers i think that's not a concern, but with horns they should be directed to our ears, because the sound doesn't flow as a regular speaker.
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post #22 of 329 Old 09-01-2013, 02:46 AM
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In that case the rs-62ii are a great choice. They are really awesome speakers. You could also save money going with the rb-61ii. If you can mount them so the horn is pointing right at you they would be nice and cost half as much. The rs62ii are better though. I have both

Klipsch Pro Cinema KPT-904 L/C/R, Pro Cinema KPT-1201-T2 for sides and Heresy II for backs.
SVS PB13-Ultra, PB12-Plus x2, and Velodyne SMS-1 Sub EQ
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Oppo BDP-103 9 ATS Acoustic panels
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post #23 of 329 Old 09-01-2013, 02:56 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Do you know if there are optinal stands for the RS-62II? Because in one side i have the wall, but on the other side, no wall. So putting one in the wall and another in a stand doesn't look good, i will need 2 stands.
The difference in price for the RF-82II is almost nothing, around €100 Euros per speaker....i live the looks of the 82's, but i don't know if they are properly working like that.

Besides i put the Sub in a side of the coutch, and the back of the sub is about 10cm near one of the RF-82's, that's not good i guess.... If i put the 62's with stands, when both 62's and sub are performing they will not be in front of the other.

I am thinking correctly?


Also checked by curiosity the SVS Towers, Surrounds, Center. Since i am putting SVS sub i tough it was worth to take a look.
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post #24 of 329 Old 09-01-2013, 08:45 AM
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CM10 speakers do not make sense to me. For similar price you can get previous generation 803D - this would be a much better value. If you want surround setup, add 805S in the back and you will be all set. All CM series is not efficient in price/performance.
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post #25 of 329 Old 09-01-2013, 09:22 AM
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Originally Posted by MV_Cinema View Post

Everyone tank you so much, i value everyone opinion here, and the only thing i will do now is to hear the B&W just to rest my soul.

It's funny that until now nobody said anything special about B&W in what concerns to Cinema, maybe it's just not the right speaker...
Oh, B&W makes very capable theater speakers, I just don't have any experience with the CM models. Pretty much everything in their 800 series is just amazing IMO.
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post #26 of 329 Old 09-01-2013, 11:39 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Oh, B&W makes very capable theater speakers, I just don't have any experience with the CM models. Pretty much everything in their 800 series is just amazing IMO.
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Originally Posted by ap1 View Post

CM10 speakers do not make sense to me. For similar price you can get previous generation 803D - this would be a much better value. If you want surround setup, add 805S in the back and you will be all set. All CM series is not efficient in price/performance.

I just checked the website of B&W, and they still make the 803 Diamond, however from the 800 series doesn't seem to exist any Central Speaker...Strange...

I really don't mind to invest in the 800 Series for example, a pair to the front and the central, and then buy the surrounds for example the 805's...
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post #27 of 329 Old 09-01-2013, 11:50 AM - Thread Starter
 
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I just saw this article...

http://www.hometheater.com/content/bampw-802-diamond-speaker-system

Found the Center Speaker finally. It's an interesting system, and i will try to hear it, or similar at my dealer.

However some things i would change here, i would save a few bucks on the subs, and the system will even be better in my opinion.

In case i go for a system like this, instead of the 804's on the back, i would put the 803's. And the B&W Sub...with that price i buy 2 SVS PB-13 Ultra and i save $1000.

At the end, and with a proposal to the dealer to buy this set, i think that a discount is also applied.

However... is this the ideal system, and will it be better than Klipsch? If yes, i must hear it to believe.
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post #28 of 329 Old 09-01-2013, 12:10 PM
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JTR Noesis would clobber either of the systems you're looking at.
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post #29 of 329 Old 09-01-2013, 12:17 PM - Thread Starter
 
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JTR Noesis would clobber either of the systems you're looking at.

Sorry for my ignorance, but is that brand new? I am 100% into Theater and just checked the site, called my atention smile.gif
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post #30 of 329 Old 09-01-2013, 12:24 PM
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JTR Noesis would clobber either of the systems you're looking at.

For HT use yes, but I have yet to hear JTR system that sounds really good for music in stereo.
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