Anyone heared Elac speakers? - AVS Forum
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Old 09-04-2013, 12:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Looks like they got some pretty interesting technologies.

Here's a ribbon coax driver:
http://elac.ro/ELAC_technology.html#ELAC_X-JET
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Old 10-05-2013, 05:14 AM
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I have an Elac system at home. They are great speakers.



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Originally Posted by coli View Post

Looks like they got some pretty interesting technologies.

Here's a ribbon coax driver:
http://elac.ro/ELAC_technology.html#ELAC_X-JET
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Old 10-05-2013, 09:17 AM
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I briefly heard a bookshelf pair at a store, not sure which model? I was impressed with the sound. Not sure how they would compare value wise with ID offerings but they did sound good.

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Old 11-22-2013, 03:07 AM
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I currently own a pair of fs208 Anniversary Edition and a pair of bs204.2, as part of a HT setup. Both driven with a Rotel RSX1067. I'll try to review them both below.

For starters, I should say that I have a 13 year history in pro audio and recording studio's. So I listen differently than most people and pay more attention than most to frequency spectrum balance. Where many people like big bass, I prefer deep bass that's well balanced with the rest of the audio spectrum. I also prefer a neutral, uncoloured sound with dynamics and transient behaviour that presents a believable, life like sound stage and a level of resolution that reveals low-level details. It should sound a great deal like it sounded in the studio.

Elac is a good product, but you have to dig the sound. I would characterize it as a bit "technological" as opposed to "musical". Elac is a thouroughly German speaker: well engineered and packed with advanced technoloy. Take the JET-III tweeter, for example. It's great, extremely quick and sounds fantastic. It's also found in other high-end brands, and even in studio monitors from Adam Audio, Eve Audio (I kid you not!) and Unity Audio.

There is a bunch of good technology found in these speakers. But on the other hand, Elac cut corners to save on production costs. For example: the entire cross-over of both models of speakers, is made with electrolytic capacitors - while everyone in the audio industry knows that even cheap film capacitors sound way better: more transparent because they are electrically quicker which translates to better transient handling.

The Elac fs208a has powerful and really deep bass (true 29Hz - I measured it) and in most cases doesn't require a subwoofer. With movies these speakers sound absolutely fantastic! Great dynamics, real deapth and slam in the low end, good mid-range resolution and a detailed and quick top end. And they'll go LOUD! But with music I believe they'll have to admit defeat to my smaller Dynaudio Audience 122's. Even though the low end isn't as well dimensioned in the Dynaudio's, the overall tonal balance is much more believable. The Dynaudio's sound more like music and less like good sound. Also, voices (and spoken word in particular, like dialogs in movies) sound much more believeable with the Dynaudio's. Male voices sound a little thin and disembodied through the Elac's.

The Elac fs208a's still are quite good speakers, but their frequency response is a bit "scooped": looks a bit like a smiley-face. Good, solid low end, fast and incredibly detailed treble, but in comparison the mid-range seems a bit recessed. When I first hooked these speakers to my NAD amp, I though "WOW!! Immense amounts of detail!" But after a while I came to realise it was just the tweeter that played way too loud. Fortunately Elac lets you adjust tweeter level by setting a jumper on the cross-over. So I set it down a notch. I still think it's a bit too loud, but I can live with it much better now. The bass, however, was a mess and all over the place: no definition, I wasn't able to distinguish between kick drum rumble and low bass instruments. I swapped my NAD T752 for a Rotel RSX 1067 and things improved massively. Much tighter low end, a little more extension and much more control. This implies the Elac speakers need a high quality, stable amplifier. But with a minimum impedance of 3.2Ohms, that seems only logical.

The bs204.2 is definitely a part of the Elac family: near identical sound (also "scooped"), although you can hear it's a smaller speaker. It has less power and extension in the bass range, a bit less resolution in the mid range and near identical treble. Obviously it handles dynamic peaks a little less well than it's bigger brother. But in smaller rooms, these small speakers can still conjure up a great sound.

I think Elac is a master in producing low bass from small speakers. Even for it's size, the fs208 plays lower than you'd expect. The same goes for the bs204.2. It sounds quite a bit larger than it actually is - especially at lower volumes. The downside is a little flabby and undefined low end. But if you use the supplied bungs to close the bass port, you'll be rewarded with a little more extension and a much better behaved bass response. The output in the bass range drops a dB or 2 in the usable range. But in my opinion that's a good thing. I do think the fs208a projects a larger, more 3D sound stage than the smaller bs204.2. Usually it's the other way around. But this might have to do with positioning.

All in all the Elac fs208 is good speaker. It's got a sound quality you (may) have (to learn) to like, but it has a few strong selling points. Personally, I prefer the more natural sound of Dynaudio. But I do reccomend a thorough listening session to anyone who's looking for new speakers. The newer Elac offerings sound very "hi-fi", but in a good way. A little more mid-forward than my older speakers. They're not as ruthlessly unforgiving as Dynaudio, but should still offer very much sound for a good price.
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Old 11-22-2013, 05:50 AM
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First i would like to inform that the jet tweeter is not a ribbon tweeter but an air motion technology.

The only ribbon tweeter Elac uses is in the PI tweeter. Adam Audio and other brands use ribbon no jet.


I used to have the FS 207.2 , the FS 210 , the FS 210 CE and now the top model FS 609 CE together with the BS 243.

Elac speakers are really neutral and very musical and this all depends on the rest of the chain. Rotel is absolutely no match with Elac.

I have compared the Dynaudio C1 to the BS 243 and sold the Dynaudio. Way too expensive and the tweeter wasn't any better than the JET 3 tweeter. They are both as neutral and musical.
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Old 11-22-2013, 07:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by denon a1xva View Post

First i would like to inform that the jet tweeter is not a ribbon tweeter but an air motion technology.

The only ribbon tweeter Elac uses is in the PI tweeter. Adam Audio and other brands use ribbon no jet.


I used to have the FS 207.2 , the FS 210 , the FS 210 CE and now the top model FS 609 CE together with the BS 243.

Elac speakers are really neutral and very musical and this all depends on the rest of the chain. Rotel is absolutely no match with Elac.

I have compared the Dynaudio C1 to the BS 243 and sold the Dynaudio. Way too expensive and the tweeter wasn't any better than the JET 3 tweeter. They are both as neutral and musical.

I really don't agree with you that Elac is just as neutral and musical as Dynaudio. And of course there is a reason why Dynaudio is found frequently in many big, high quality recording studio's, and Elac isn't. I really prefer Dynaudio, because it's way easier to listen to for longer periods. To my ears, they don't scream for attention the way Elac's do. For home listening, it all a matter of taste and personal preference, I guess. I'm planning to sell all my Elac's and transition to small Dynaudio Contour s-series. If I had known earlier you were swapping C1's for Elac, I'd have been willing to trade you my fs208a's for your C1's! biggrin.gif

And Elac, Unity Audio, Eve Audio and Adam Audio all use the same Air Motion Transformer tweeter. They just brand the technology differently, although Unity Audio openly states they use Elac drivers in their "the Rock" and "the Boulder" models. But you're right in that the term "Ribbon tweeter" is incorrectly used for the JET-III.

Also, I'd like to point out that I was quite dissapointed to discover that the driver baskets are made from plastic, rather than aluminium of some other strong metal. This is at least the case in my speakers.
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Old 11-22-2013, 08:31 AM
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Elac works the best with Marantz, Denon , Primare and also Audionet is a good match.

My Elac´s don't scream at all so i really can't agree with you on this point, and the 208 is an older model. The new lines are better.

I liked the C1 and they bring a great performance, but they are too expensive.

Here the Elac's are very neutral. If you have screaming Elac's you better try some other amplifiers. Elac is very detailed that's true but screaming no. To my experience a Focal Electra 1027 BE is a screaming speaker. Really terrible.




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Originally Posted by jamesblond View Post

I really don't agree with you that Elac is just as neutral and musical as Dynaudio. And of course there is a reason why Dynaudio is found frequently in many big, high quality recording studio's, and Elac isn't. I really prefer Dynaudio, because it's way easier to listen to for longer periods. To my ears, they don't scream for attention the way Elac's do. For home listening, it all a matter of taste and personal preference, I guess. I'm planning to sell all my Elac's and transition to small Dynaudio Contour s-series. If I had known earlier you were swapping C1's for Elac, I'd have been willing to trade you my fs208a's for your C1's! biggrin.gif

And Elac, Unity Audio, Eve Audio and Adam Audio all use the same Air Motion Transformer tweeter. They just brand the technology differently, although Unity Audio openly states they use Elac drivers in their "the Rock" and "the Boulder" models. But you're right in that the term "Ribbon tweeter" is incorrectly used for the JET-III.

Also, I'd like to point out that I was quite dissapointed to discover that the driver baskets are made from plastic, rather than aluminium of some other strong metal. This is at least the case in my speakers.
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Old 06-05-2014, 02:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by denon a1xva View Post

Elac works the best with Marantz, Denon , Primare and also Audionet is a good match.

My Elac´s don't scream at all so i really can't agree with you on this point, and the 208 is an older model. The new lines are better.

I liked the C1 and they bring a great performance, but they are too expensive.

Here the Elac's are very neutral. If you have screaming Elac's you better try some other amplifiers. Elac is very detailed that's true but screaming no. To my experience a Focal Electra 1027 BE is a screaming speaker. Really terrible.
I meant "screaming for attention", not "screaming" like sounding harsh. To my ears Elac speaker don't present a life-like sound image, rather a polished-up sound that tries to sound good under all circumstances. I prefer a speaker that tells it like it is. If a record sounds great, I want my speakers to tell me that. If a record sound like crap, I want my speaker to tell me that too.
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Old 07-06-2014, 10:43 AM
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Yes, I've heard of Elac. My dad worked for them in the sixties and is one of the team who invented the neoprene compliant speaker cone surround that all modern powerful speakers use. He also found the solution to making the surround stay attached to the frame rather than ripping free when driven flat out, something that they'd been unable to successfully do. Prior to that speakers had pressed corrugated card edges which would rip if they were driven hard, they also restricted and resisted the cone's movement so reduced the maximum volume that way too, as well as introducing distortion and impairing the frequency response. All modern speakers use the neoprene compliant surround these days.

Last edited by MickeyT2008; 07-23-2014 at 09:50 PM. Reason: To improve the accuracy of what I wrote.
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Old 12-02-2014, 11:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesblond View Post
I currently own a pair of fs208 Anniversary Edition and a pair of bs204.2, as part of a HT setup. Both driven with a Rotel RSX1067. I'll try to review them both below.<br><br>
For starters, I should say that I have a 13 year history in pro audio and recording studio's. So I listen differently than most people and pay more attention than most to frequency spectrum balance. Where many people like big bass, I prefer deep bass that's well balanced with the rest of the audio spectrum. I also prefer a neutral, uncoloured sound with dynamics and transient behaviour that presents a believable, life like sound stage and a level of resolution that reveals low-level details. It should sound a great deal like it sounded in the studio.<br><br>
Elac is a good product, but you have to dig the sound. I would characterize it as a bit "technological" as opposed to "musical". Elac is a thouroughly German speaker: well engineered and packed with advanced technoloy. Take the JET-III tweeter, for example. It's great, extremely quick and sounds fantastic. It's also found in other high-end brands, and even in studio monitors from Adam Audio, Eve Audio (I kid you not!) and Unity Audio.<br><br>
There is a bunch of good technology found in these speakers. But on the other hand, Elac cut corners to save on production costs. For example: the entire cross-over of both models of speakers, is made with electrolytic capacitors - while everyone in the audio industry knows that even cheap film capacitors sound way better: more transparent because they are electrically quicker which translates to better transient handling.<br><br>
The Elac fs208a has powerful and really deep bass (true 29Hz - I measured it) and in most cases doesn't require a subwoofer. With movies these speakers sound absolutely fantastic! Great dynamics, real deapth and slam in the low end, good mid-range resolution and a detailed and quick top end. And they'll go LOUD! But with music I believe they'll have to admit defeat to my smaller Dynaudio Audience 122's. Even though the low end isn't as well dimensioned in the Dynaudio's, the overall tonal balance is much more believable. The Dynaudio's sound more like music and less like good sound. Also, voices (and spoken word in particular, like dialogs in movies) sound much more believeable with the Dynaudio's. Male voices sound a little thin and disembodied through the Elac's.<br><br>
The Elac fs208a's still are quite good speakers, but their frequency response is a bit "scooped": looks a bit like a smiley-face. Good, solid low end, fast and incredibly detailed treble, but in comparison the mid-range seems a bit recessed. When I first hooked these speakers to my NAD amp, I though "WOW!! Immense amounts of detail!" But after a while I came to realise it was just the tweeter that played way too loud. Fortunately Elac lets you adjust tweeter level by setting a jumper on the cross-over. So I set it down a notch. I still think it's a bit too loud, but I can live with it much better now. The bass, however, was a mess and all over the place: no definition, I wasn't able to distinguish between kick drum rumble and low bass instruments. I swapped my NAD T752 for a Rotel RSX 1067 and things improved massively. Much tighter low end, a little more extension and much more control. This implies the Elac speakers need a high quality, stable amplifier. But with a minimum impedance of 3.2Ohms, that seems only logical.<br><br>
The bs204.2 is definitely a part of the Elac family: near identical sound (also "scooped"), although you can hear it's a smaller speaker. It has less power and extension in the bass range, a bit less resolution in the mid range and near identical treble. Obviously it handles dynamic peaks a little less well than it's bigger brother. But in smaller rooms, these small speakers can still conjure up a great sound.<br><br>
I think Elac is a master in producing low bass from small speakers. Even for it's size, the fs208 plays lower than you'd expect. The same goes for the bs204.2. It sounds quite a bit larger than it actually is - especially at lower volumes. The downside is a little flabby and undefined low end. But if you use the supplied bungs to close the bass port, you'll be rewarded with a little more extension and a much better behaved bass response. The output in the bass range drops a dB or 2 in the usable range. But in my opinion that's a good thing. I do think the fs208a projects a larger, more 3D sound stage than the smaller bs204.2. Usually it's the other way around. But this might have to do with positioning.<br><br>
All in all the Elac fs208 is good speaker. It's got a sound quality you (may) have (to learn) to like, but it has a few strong selling points. Personally, I prefer the more natural sound of Dynaudio. But I do reccomend a thorough listening session to anyone who's looking for new speakers. The newer Elac offerings sound very "hi-fi", but in a good way. A little more mid-forward than my older speakers. They're not as ruthlessly unforgiving as Dynaudio, but should still offer very much sound for a good price.
Hi jamesblond

thank you so much for your insightful post about Elac speakers a while ago.
I now have a problem with coupling my Elac FS57 with NAD T748. It's like this:
- I had been using these FS 57 with the mini NAD C715(20W/ch). For me it was a perfect match given the limited power output of the NAD. The tone is balance and the separation is there, and the low is quite decent. It had been quite a sweet experience.
- HOWEVER, i just bought a NAD T748. and i matched this T748 with the old FS57 for a month now. Something is not quite right. It sounds too mechanical. too harsh on the high (the cymbals often come out so harsh so metal, i miss the sweet cymbal sound from the last coupling) mp3 reproduction now is very loud and noisy not as nice as before. CD sounds way better but very mechanical.
Now i can not replace either of these 2 with anything soon, i will have to leave with them for a while due to budget limit.
Can you please help by advising me on…
- is there anyway i can improve the sound with the FS57 and T748 still in the mix?
- if i am to buy another pair of speakers in future, which brand and series do you think can harmonize with T748?
Right now i feel very bad and really question my investment on the T748. any advise will help. Big thanks, man.
TA
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Old 12-03-2014, 07:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TA Nguyen View Post
Hi jamesblond

thank you so much for your insightful post about Elac speakers a while ago.
I now have a problem with coupling my Elac FS57 with NAD T748. It's like this:
- I had been using these FS 57 with the mini NAD C715(20W/ch). For me it was a perfect match given the limited power output of the NAD. The tone is balance and the separation is there, and the low is quite decent. It had been quite a sweet experience.
- HOWEVER, i just bought a NAD T748. and i matched this T748 with the old FS57 for a month now. Something is not quite right. It sounds too mechanical. too harsh on the high (the cymbals often come out so harsh so metal, i miss the sweet cymbal sound from the last coupling) mp3 reproduction now is very loud and noisy not as nice as before. CD sounds way better but very mechanical.
Now i can not replace either of these 2 with anything soon, i will have to leave with them for a while due to budget limit.
Can you please help by advising me on…
- is there anyway i can improve the sound with the FS57 and T748 still in the mix?
- if i am to buy another pair of speakers in future, which brand and series do you think can harmonize with T748?
Right now i feel very bad and really question my investment on the T748. any advise will help. Big thanks, man.
TA
Sorry to hear your sound has deteriorated after buying a new AVR. Bummer!

Without hearing the sound you have, it's difficult to come up with a solution.
A quick way to change the sound of your speakers subtly, is swapping cabes. There's not much difference in the low end of the market, but the more boutique cables can actually change the colour of your sound somewhat. Whether or not that change is attributatbe to the cable adding or, in fact, removing certain signal components remains open to discussion. But the effect of cables on sound increase as the length of the run increases.

Also, acoustics are all-important in the way your system sounds. The room is more important than any other component in your chain.

I'm not sure about the specs of the fs57 speakers, but I have seen that your current NAD AVR is rated at a mere 7x40W or 2x160W at 4 Ohms. This number doesn't tell us much, without knowing it's maximum current capacity and damping factor at 4 Ohms. In my experience, Elac speakers need a lot of current and grip from the amplifier to sound their best. Entry-level NAD's probably aren't the best matches with Elac speakers.

I've had very good results with my NAD T752 paired with Dynaudio Audience 122. I'm pretty sure that any smaller entry level Dynaudio speaker (DM or Excite series) will sound good with your current amp. Although, as with any particular brand of loudspeaker, you have to like the sound. Personally, I prefer the sound of Dynaudio (and general build quality) over Elac.

If you want to check out Dynaudio, try finding a used pair of Audience 52's, 122's or similar from the current DM and/or Excite series. They can be had for good prices. If you want to sell your current Elac's later on, you might be able to break even in the end. More likely so when you choose Audience series.

Best of luck!

James.
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Old 12-03-2014, 09:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesblond View Post
Sorry to hear your sound has deteriorated after buying a new AVR. Bummer!

Without hearing the sound you have, it's difficult to come up with a solution.
A quick way to change the sound of your speakers subtly, is swapping cabes. There's not much difference in the low end of the market, but the more boutique cables can actually change the colour of your sound somewhat. Whether or not that change is attributatbe to the cable adding or, in fact, removing certain signal components remains open to discussion. But the effect of cables on sound increase as the length of the run increases.

Also, acoustics are all-important in the way your system sounds. The room is more important than any other component in your chain.

I'm not sure about the specs of the fs57 speakers, but I have seen that your current NAD AVR is rated at a mere 7x40W or 2x160W at 4 Ohms. This number doesn't tell us much, without knowing it's maximum current capacity and damping factor at 4 Ohms. In my experience, Elac speakers need a lot of current and grip from the amplifier to sound their best. Entry-level NAD's probably aren't the best matches with Elac speakers.

I've had very good results with my NAD T752 paired with Dynaudio Audience 122. I'm pretty sure that any smaller entry level Dynaudio speaker (DM or Excite series) will sound good with your current amp. Although, as with any particular brand of loudspeaker, you have to like the sound. Personally, I prefer the sound of Dynaudio (and general build quality) over Elac.

If you want to check out Dynaudio, try finding a used pair of Audience 52's, 122's or similar from the current DM and/or Excite series. They can be had for good prices. If you want to sell your current Elac's later on, you might be able to break even in the end. More likely so when you choose Audience series.

Best of luck!

James.
Hi
Great to hear from you. Thanks for the inputs. I guess i will take a look at these Dynaudio you mentioned.
Do you think T752 is one notch above T748 on sound quality? I know you have not tried the T748 probably, but just a perspective.
Also i guess the reason why my mini NAD C715 sounds sweet with Elac is that the Elac is quite up front and dry, so they might turn sweeter with subtler/underpowering amplifier.
Anyway, thanks again and it's good to know that you 're happy with T752. I have always been a fan of NAD sound but it's just that this experience with NAD t748 set me back a little.
Peace out
TA
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Old 12-04-2014, 10:34 AM
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With my old, trusty Dynaudio Audience 122's, I really liked my NAD T752. But I like my current (but old) Rotel RSX1067 even better, especially with my Dynaudio Special Twenty Fives and Dynaudio Sub500 (:

I doubt that swapping your 748 for a 752 will help you very much. The T752 is by now at least ten years old, if not more. These amps aren't even very good. They deliver good bang for your buck, but it gets really interesting with the M series separates and Master Series. Expensive, though... The 748 has newer features and specs than the 752, though lower power output. If you only use it for two channel duties, you'd be better off getting a good (used)integrated amp, or a (surround) pre/pro and a separate power amp.

Usually, loudspeakers "grow" with your amplifier. If your amp improves, so will the sound from your speakers. This goes up to a certain point. The better your speakers, the more they will grow with the amplifier. So, assuming you have good quality speakers that you like, it's often best to first upgrade the amplifier to one that is one or two notches above what you have now. The speakers can be the next candidates. The rest of the chain also has it's influence on the sound, but that's not nearly as big as amp and speakers.

This is not unlike the synergy between engine and gearbox on the one hand and tyres and suspension on the other.

Last edited by jamesblond; 12-04-2014 at 10:37 AM.
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