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post #1 of 65 Old 10-05-2013, 02:55 PM - Thread Starter
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I am planning to setup my first HT in my basement for around $8000 budget excluding tv/projector.

 

Want to go for a high end system - Thinking of Pioneer Elite SC 75, polk 75 Ts.

I have zero experience with this kind of equipment but I am a techie and I have a kind of good ears.

Multi zone not required as the house is not cabled. 

 

For Movies and Music.

 

Basement of a townhouse 20 ft X 14 ft, with one side open to stairs, bathroom and a laundry room.

 

Experts appreciate your advise..


Denon 4520 CI
JTR 228 x 3
JTR Slanted 8 x 2
PSA XS30 x 2
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post #2 of 65 Old 10-05-2013, 03:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avgorder View Post

I am planning to setup my first HT in my basement for around $5000 - $6000 budget excluding tv/projector.

Want to go for a high end system - Thinking of Pioneer Elite SC 75, polk 75 Ts.
I have zero experience with this kind of equipment but I am a techie and I have a kind of good ears.
Multi zone not required as the house is not cabled. 

For Movies and Music.

Basement of a townhouse 20 ft X 14 ft, with one side open to stairs, bathroom and a laundry room.

Experts appreciate your advise..

Any sort of listening or aesthetic preferences?
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post #3 of 65 Old 10-05-2013, 03:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avgorder View Post

I am planning to setup my first HT in my basement for around $5000 - $6000 budget excluding tv/projector.

Want to go for a high end system - Thinking of Pioneer Elite SC 75, polk 75 Ts.
I have zero experience with this kind of equipment but I am a techie and I have a kind of good ears.
Multi zone not required as the house is not cabled. 

For Movies and Music.

Basement of a townhouse 20 ft X 14 ft, with one side open to stairs, bathroom and a laundry room.

Experts appreciate your advise..

Highly recommend going with Vapor Audio Stiff Breeze with RAAL tweeters for the front (MTM design), Breeze (TM) for the back. And get a HSU or SVS sub.

RAAL is prabably the best tweeter there is. Also, the cabinets are made with real Birch Ply wood multi-layered instead of MDF boxes (like most manufacturers) which will bring down resonance to 20%.

Best bang for the buck right now.

www.vaporsound.com

I highly highly recommend spending the money leftover on your room treatment.

GIK Acoustics offers packages starting at $500.00.

www.GIKAcoustics.com
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post #4 of 65 Old 10-05-2013, 04:23 PM - Thread Starter
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My purpose is for movies and I listen to 80 classics like gunsnroses, need more bass.


Denon 4520 CI
JTR 228 x 3
JTR Slanted 8 x 2
PSA XS30 x 2
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post #5 of 65 Old 10-05-2013, 04:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for your recommendation I will definitely look into these, any specific models to consider ?


Denon 4520 CI
JTR 228 x 3
JTR Slanted 8 x 2
PSA XS30 x 2
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post #6 of 65 Old 10-05-2013, 05:59 PM
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For your room size I'd go with the Hsu VTF-3 MK-4.
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post #7 of 65 Old 10-05-2013, 06:26 PM - Thread Starter
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thank you, this sub has nothing but positive reviews..


Denon 4520 CI
JTR 228 x 3
JTR Slanted 8 x 2
PSA XS30 x 2
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post #8 of 65 Old 10-05-2013, 07:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avgorder View Post

I am planning to setup my first HT in my basement for around $5000 - $6000 budget excluding tv/projector.

Want to go for a high end system - Thinking of Pioneer Elite SC 75, polk 75 Ts.
I have zero experience with this kind of equipment but I am a techie and I have a kind of good ears.
Multi zone not required as the house is not cabled. 

For Movies and Music.

Basement of a townhouse 20 ft X 14 ft, with one side open to stairs, bathroom and a laundry room.

If you don't want to wait for speakers to be built - then look at Focal Chorus - good prices
http://www.musicdirect.com/search.aspx?searchterm=focal%20chorus

http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/brand/focal/results/1.html


And look for good subs from the likes of HSU, SVS and Power Sound Audio
http://www.svsound.com/subwoofers

http://www.powersoundaudio.com/collections/power-x

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Subwoofer > Mordaunt Short Aviano 7
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post #9 of 65 Old 10-05-2013, 07:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NAIM101 View Post

Highly recommend going with Vapor Audio Stiff Breeze with RAAL tweeters for the front (MTM design), Breeze (TM) for the back. And get a HSU or SVS sub.

RAAL is prabably the best tweeter there is. Also, the cabinets are made with real Birch Ply wood multi-layered instead of MDF boxes (like most manufacturers) which will bring down resonance to 20%.

Best bang for the buck right now.

www.vaporsound.com

I highly highly recommend spending the money leftover on your room treatment.

GIK Acoustics offers packages starting at $500.00.

www.GIKAcoustics.com

Since the OP will be using them system for movies and 80's rock music he would be better off getting something with a compression driver tweeter over anything with a RAAL tweeter.

My Gear:

JTR Noesis 228HT (LCR)
Axiom Audio QS8 surrounds
Sherbourn PA 7-350
Pioneer VSX-21TXH
JVC RS45
Falcon Screens FVHD105
Dual PSA XS30's (gone but not forgotten)
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post #10 of 65 Old 10-05-2013, 07:19 PM
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RAAL can handle HT fine. The Stiff Breeze line is a MTM design so it wouldnt lack dynamics at all and the soundstage would be just as good as compression drivers.

for HT specifically, JTR,Tekton and Seaton would also be good choices.
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post #11 of 65 Old 10-05-2013, 07:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NAIM101 View Post

RAAL can handle HT fine. The Stiff Breeze line is a MTM design so it wouldnt lack dynamics at all and the soundstage would be just as good as compression drivers.

for HT specifically, JTR,Tekton and Seaton would also be good choices.

I would bet if you started to push a RAAL tweeter towards reference it would start to not sound so great. It's the exact reason why I went with the new JTR 228HT's over the Ascend Sierra towers it's RAAL tweeter upgrade for my HT room

My Gear:

JTR Noesis 228HT (LCR)
Axiom Audio QS8 surrounds
Sherbourn PA 7-350
Pioneer VSX-21TXH
JVC RS45
Falcon Screens FVHD105
Dual PSA XS30's (gone but not forgotten)
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post #12 of 65 Old 10-05-2013, 07:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NAIM101 View Post

RAAL can handle HT fine. The Stiff Breeze line is a MTM design so it wouldnt lack dynamics at all and the soundstage would be just as good as compression drivers.

for HT specifically, JTR,Tekton and Seaton would also be good choices.

I would bet if you started to push a RAAL tweeter towards reference it would start to not sound so great. It's the exact reason why I went with the new JTR 228HT's over the Ascend Sierra towers it's RAAL tweeter upgrade for my HT room

If music was the deciding factor I would agree, but for HT use and 80's rock, a CD speaker IMO would be superior.

My Gear:

JTR Noesis 228HT (LCR)
Axiom Audio QS8 surrounds
Sherbourn PA 7-350
Pioneer VSX-21TXH
JVC RS45
Falcon Screens FVHD105
Dual PSA XS30's (gone but not forgotten)
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post #13 of 65 Old 10-05-2013, 07:44 PM
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Will you have an acoustically transparent screen? How far is your seating going to be from the speakers? How loud do you want this system to get? THX Imax levels? The best speakers to get will depend on the answers to those questions.

You front stage speakers will depend on the above questions, but for surrounds, I would go for some JBL 8320 speakers. You can get a set of four for $1k. Those are THX certified, and are easy to mount. They can be driven easily by most AVRs as well. They are high performance and inexpensive.

I would normally recommend some beefy subs with that kind of budget, but, you probably wouldn't be able to take advantage of bigtime bass dynamics in a townhouse. A couple Hsu VTF3s would have very good sound quality and more than enough bass for a townhouse, you can get a discount for a pair here. Another sub that would be good this Dayton dual woofer sub, that will have a decent amount of output and very good sound quality, again in that budget I would get two. You can save $150 on that sub by buying it in kit form, it only takes a little bit of assembly with a screwdriver and some glue. Another killer Dayton sub would be this Titanic 4, but the kit form of that is not in stock right now. Again, I would get two subs regardless of what sub you choose.

A terrific receiver which will automatically calibrate two subs independently is the Denon AVR-X4000. It has a ton of features and enough amplification for just about any speaker you pick. It has Audyssey multiEQ XT32 which is a very sophisticated but easy-to-use calibration system.
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post #14 of 65 Old 10-05-2013, 07:47 PM
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Originally Posted by shadyJ View Post

Will you have an acoustically transparent screen? How far is your seating going to be from the speakers? How loud do you want this system to get? THX Imax levels? The best speakers to get will depend on the answers to those questions.

You front stage speakers will depend on the above questions, but for surrounds, I would go for some JBL 8320 speakers. You can get a set of four for $1k. Those are THX certified, and are easy to mount. They can be driven easily by most AVRs as well. They are high performance and inexpensive.

I would normally recommend some beefy subs with that kind of budget, but, you probably wouldn't be able to take advantage of bigtime bass dynamics in a townhouse. A couple Hsu VTF3s would have very good sound quality and more than enough bass for a townhouse, you can get a discount for a pair here. Another sub that would be good this Dayton dual woofer sub, that will have a decent amount of output and very good sound quality, again in that budget I would get two. You can save $150 on that sub by buying it in kit form, it only takes a little bit of assembly with a screwdriver and some glue. Another killer Dayton sub would be this Titanic 4, but the kit form of that is not in stock right now. Again, I would get two subs regardless of what sub you choose.

A terrific receiver which will automatically calibrate two subs independently is the Denon AVR-X4000. It has a ton of features and enough amplification for just about any speaker you pick. It has Audyssey multiEQ XT32 which is a very sophisticated but easy-to-use calibration system.

That's strange shady, you're not pushing your Pi speakers recommendation again. What gives?.....lol

My Gear:

JTR Noesis 228HT (LCR)
Axiom Audio QS8 surrounds
Sherbourn PA 7-350
Pioneer VSX-21TXH
JVC RS45
Falcon Screens FVHD105
Dual PSA XS30's (gone but not forgotten)
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post #15 of 65 Old 10-05-2013, 08:05 PM
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Originally Posted by jbrown15 View Post

I would bet if you started to push a RAAL tweeter towards reference it would start to not sound so great. It's the exact reason why I went with the new JTR 228HT's over the Ascend Sierra towers it's RAAL tweeter upgrade for my HT room

If music was the deciding factor I would agree, but for HT use and 80's rock, a CD speaker IMO would be superior.










biggrin.gif:eek:
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post #16 of 65 Old 10-06-2013, 02:50 AM - Thread Starter
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Denon 4520 CI
JTR 228 x 3
JTR Slanted 8 x 2
PSA XS30 x 2
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post #17 of 65 Old 10-06-2013, 02:52 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by shadyJ View Post

Will you have an acoustically transparent screen? How far is your seating going to be from the speakers? How loud do you want this system to get? THX Imax levels? The best speakers to get will depend on the answers to those questions.

You front stage speakers will depend on the above questions, but for surrounds, I would go for some JBL 8320 speakers. You can get a set of four for $1k. Those are THX certified, and are easy to mount. They can be driven easily by most AVRs as well. They are high performance and inexpensive.

I would normally recommend some beefy subs with that kind of budget, but, you probably wouldn't be able to take advantage of bigtime bass dynamics in a townhouse. A couple Hsu VTF3s would have very good sound quality and more than enough bass for a townhouse, you can get a discount for a pair here. Another sub that would be good this Dayton dual woofer sub, that will have a decent amount of output and very good sound quality, again in that budget I would get two. You can save $150 on that sub by buying it in kit form, it only takes a little bit of assembly with a screwdriver and some glue. Another killer Dayton sub would be this Titanic 4, but the kit form of that is not in stock right now. Again, I would get two subs regardless of what sub you choose.

A terrific receiver which will automatically calibrate two subs independently is the Denon AVR-X4000. It has a ton of features and enough amplification for just about any speaker you pick. It has Audyssey multiEQ XT32 which is a very sophisticated but easy-to-use calibration system.

 

To answer your question about screen, not yet decided between a projector or a big tv. 

Seating distance will be around 16-18 ft, I am not planning to play too loud but more concerned about the clarity at low volume.

 

About the subs Daytons are like $1000 while HSU are 50% more at $1500 including shipping, is that cost diff worth it.

I was considering Pioneer Elite SC75, how does this Denon compares.

 

I am fulfilling my 20 year old dream of  building a quality HT, I am willing to spend a grand or more to get that oomph.


Denon 4520 CI
JTR 228 x 3
JTR Slanted 8 x 2
PSA XS30 x 2
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post #18 of 65 Old 10-06-2013, 07:31 AM
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I'd recommend Monitor Audio RX-8 and RX-2's. For subwoofer I'd go Rythmik FV15HP (not sure if this would cause problems with townhouse neighbors; however, they have many sealed options too. Then something like the Denon X4000 to power it all.

That puts the total at $5173.00. The rest can be added to the television fund or to add another Rythmik sub cool.gif

I'd imagine you couldn't get better sound/bass for the money.
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post #19 of 65 Old 10-06-2013, 08:16 AM - Thread Starter
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I'd recommend Monitor Audio RX-8 and RX-2's. For subwoofer I'd go Rythmik FV15HP (not sure if this would cause problems with townhouse neighbors; however, they have many sealed options too. Then something like the Denon X4000 to power it all.

That puts the total at $5173.00. The rest can be added to the television fund or to add another Rythmik sub cool.gif

I'd imagine you couldn't get better sound/bass for the money.

 

Thanks for your advise, I definitely don't want to bother my neighbors. As I see the diff between this Denon and Pioneer elites is the class AB vs D amplifiers, not sure how difference that makes.


Denon 4520 CI
JTR 228 x 3
JTR Slanted 8 x 2
PSA XS30 x 2
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Originally Posted by zieglj01 View Post


If you don't want to wait for speakers to be built - then look at Focal Chorus - good prices
http://www.musicdirect.com/search.aspx?searchterm=focal%20chorus

http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/brand/focal/results/1.html


And look for good subs from the likes of HSU, SVS and Power Sound Audio
http://www.svsound.com/subwoofers

http://www.powersoundaudio.com/collections/power-x

 

Thank you, I am not in a hurry. Can wait for the speakers to be built..


Denon 4520 CI
JTR 228 x 3
JTR Slanted 8 x 2
PSA XS30 x 2
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post #21 of 65 Old 10-06-2013, 08:56 AM
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Electronic Expo sold the Denon 4311 for $1225 brand new shipped to some members. But they are probably out of stock.

Call Onecall and ask if they would sell for $1200 shipped. They are listing at $1399.

Then get 2 subs from Outlaw, HSU, Rythmik, SVS, PSA for about another $1200-$1500.
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post #22 of 65 Old 10-06-2013, 09:57 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by AcuDefTechGuy View Post

Electronic Expo sold the Denon 4311 for $1225 brand new shipped to some members. But they are probably out of stock.

Call Onecall and ask if they would sell for $1200 shipped. They are listing at $1399.

Then get 2 subs from Outlaw, HSU, Rythmik, SVS, PSA for about another $1200-$1500.

 

Thank you for the info, how does this Denon compares to Pioneer Elite sc75 ?


Denon 4520 CI
JTR 228 x 3
JTR Slanted 8 x 2
PSA XS30 x 2
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post #23 of 65 Old 10-06-2013, 12:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avgorder View Post

To answer your question about screen, not yet decided between a projector or a big tv. 
Seating distance will be around 16-18 ft, I am not planning to play too loud but more concerned about the clarity at low volume.
In that case, you could probably get away with non compression driver speakers. Some speakers I would look at are the Ascend Sierras, KEF Q300s, Philharmonic Philharmonitors. All are highly regarded speakers. Another great speaker which would push your budget but sound great and give you unlimited headroom is the Pi Three. It will also only need maybe a tenth of the power from your AVR's amp that the other speakers would need to achieve the same volume. One speaker which I think might be very good for home theater is the Emotiva Stealth 8s. They have terrific measurements and promise to have a healthy amount of headroom. What's also nice is they are active speakers therefore will not draw on the receiver's amplifier. This makes more efficient use of their energy draw and also will extend the life of your receiver. If you are willing to do a tiny bit of assembly yourself, you can save money and get some good value kit speakers like these Dayton UA721 kits (gloss black and curved maple). Those will sound great and ought to have enough power for your home theater and are also inexpensive. Assembly is very easy and would only take maybe an hour or so and would only need a screwdriver and some glue.

There are a few options to consider, each has their own strength. With any of these speakers, you would want an identical model for the center speaker, if you can accommodate it. The Ascend, KEF, and Phils have dedicated horizontal centers, in case you need something like that, but in general horizontal speakers do not perform quite as well. The same exact speaker as the left and right is the ideal, and it also tends to be cheaper.
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Originally Posted by avgorder View Post

About the subs Daytons are like $1000 while HSU are 50% more at $1500 including shipping, is that cost diff worth it.
I was considering Pioneer Elite SC75, how does this Denon compares.

The Daytons may have a bit better sound quality. The Hsu's will have an advantage with deep frequency bass, and they also allow you to adjust the bass sound to your taste. Either will be good. I would get two of either the Hsus or Daytons, for reasons of sound quality rather than loudness, but you will get a bit extra oomph as well. I am sure you would like either system.

As for the Denon vs the Pioneer, they would both be good, but the room correction equalization on the Denon may be a bit better, especially regarding the bass. The Pioneer doesn't really do too much to help the subs. The Denon does a lot more to help the bass, and can also calibrate two subs as opposed to only one. For this reason I would go with the Denon.
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post #24 of 65 Old 10-06-2013, 12:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avgorder View Post

I am planning to setup my first HT in my basement for around $5000 - $6000 budget excluding tv/projector.

Want to go for a high end system - Thinking of Pioneer Elite SC 75, polk 75 Ts.
I have zero experience with this kind of equipment but I am a techie and I have a kind of good ears.
Multi zone not required as the house is not cabled. 

For Movies and Music.

Basement of a townhouse 20 ft X 14 ft, with one side open to stairs, bathroom and a laundry room.

Experts appreciate your advise..
Quote:
Originally Posted by avgorder View Post

I am planning to setup my first HT in my basement for around $5000 - $6000 budget excluding tv/projector.

Want to go for a high end system - Thinking of Pioneer Elite SC 75, polk 75 Ts.
I have zero experience with this kind of equipment but I am a techie and I have a kind of good ears.
Multi zone not required as the house is not cabled. 

For Movies and Music.

Basement of a townhouse 20 ft X 14 ft, with one side open to stairs, bathroom and a laundry room.

Experts appreciate your advise..


I'm going to go against the grain here......

I would get a Complete Emptek steup(5.2) on black friday for $1500 e55ti x2, e56ci, e5bi and two es1010i subs, I would then get a marantz 7007 for $1100

http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/MARSR7007/MARANTZ-SR7007-7.2-Channel-4K-3D-Pass-Through-Networking-Receiver/1.html

http://emptek.com/impseries.php

Not only does this setup look fantastic the speakers and the reciever.

The sound quality is down right amazing the e55ti's hold their own with much more expensive speakers in the 2k-3k range.

Not only would you be happy, you would save a lot of money........why spend more than you need to?



Here's a speaker comparison from this site, that compares the emptek speakers to much more expensive brands

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1437010/2-000-3-000-tower-speaker-comparison-need-help-picking-the-contenders-for-a-shootout/120
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post #25 of 65 Old 10-06-2013, 04:13 PM
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I like what I hear about the EMPtek Impression series, but the Hsu subs have an entire octave worth of extension over them. I would skip the EMP subwoofers.
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post #26 of 65 Old 10-06-2013, 06:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shadyJ View Post

I like what I hear about the EMPtek Impression series, but the Hsu subs have an entire octave worth of extension over them. I would skip the EMP subwoofers.


I wouldn't the emptek subs on sale are $600 and offer awesome output and they blend with the emptek speakers better than anything else(this has been confirmed in the emptek impressions thread) For the room size he is stating that he has, this will be more than enough IMO

Shady he is getting the entire impression setup(5.2) for $1500 the same price as the HSU subs LOL, I mean to be honest I notice alot you guys recommending guys to spend ALOT on subs.......I guess it's what ever the guys are after, alot of these subs for the spaces being recommended are serious overkill, unless the person is a serious bass head............lol
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post #27 of 65 Old 10-06-2013, 08:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Murderousone View Post

I wouldn't the emptek subs on sale are $600 and offer awesome output and they blend with the emptek speakers better than anything else(this has been confirmed in the emptek impressions thread) For the room size he is stating that he has, this will be more than enough IMO

Shady he is getting the entire impression setup(5.2) for $1500 the same price as the HSU subs LOL, I mean to be honest I notice alot you guys recommending guys to spend ALOT on subs.......I guess it's what ever the guys are after, alot of these subs for the spaces being recommended are serious overkill, unless the person is a serious bass head............lol

If a certain sub truly blends better with certain speakers, that would be indicative of something wrong. Accurate sound reproduction should be blind to any particular speaker brand. However I don't believe that EMP subs do actually blend better than their speakers, I doubt they make products that poor.
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post #28 of 65 Old 10-06-2013, 09:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Murderousone View Post

I wouldn't the emptek subs on sale are $600 and offer awesome output and they blend with the emptek speakers better than anything else(this has been confirmed in the emptek impressions thread) For the room size he is stating that he has, this will be more than enough IMO

Sorry but I don't believe that for a second, there's plenty of more capable subs that would blend just as well as the Emptek sub. Every time I hear a comment like this I begin to wonder how incapable the person saying that is at properly setting up a sub.

Next thing we're going to hear is that the Emptek sub timber matches better with the Emptek speakers.....LOL

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post #29 of 65 Old 10-06-2013, 09:19 PM
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It is ture that HT specifically, JTR,Tekton and Seaton would be good choices.

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post #30 of 65 Old 10-07-2013, 06:04 AM
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My purpose is for movies and I listen to 80 classics like gunsnroses, need more bass.

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